iPhone SE is Again Available From Apple's Clearance Site for $249

[jgdeschamps]

Again, avoiding my point.
Did they put in the top spec in the small phone?
Even the SE is still lacking the 2nd gen touch ID from the 6S.
A number of people get a new phone every 2 year but the are no smaller phones with the latest spec, so they had to get what is available. Had the SE launched with the 6S together, Apple would have to pay me to get the 6S over the SE.

SAMSUNG: Hey Apple, do you want millions of screens available quickly with relatively good QCs for your devices? We are manufacturing sizes 5.8" and up due to demand we forced/fabricated here in Asia. Not smaller because we'll get a ROI faster with bigger screens that cost more and have larger revenue margins than what you are currently using. Are you game?
APPLE: Ok... we trust your manufacturing capabilities to get millions of screens... er, iPhones, out for the public to consume. And regarding our original idea (iPhone 4/5/SE design) we'll send it to India and see how fast they can keep up production, so that won't be our "flagship" product anymore and our heads won't depend on it. Marketing, come up with a story/campaign flashy enough (emojis, animojis, selfie filters, etc) that will make enough noise that people won't remember Steve's explanation regarding perfect size for one handed phone use.

Is it clearer to you? That's the data these companies handle. They don't care what you want. You just fell for their marketing that's made to move products. All companies are like that, so wake up. That's why iPhones are not innovative anymore. They follow asian manufacturing templates.

 

[Baymowe335]

Again, avoiding my point.
Did they put in the top spec in the small phone?
Even the SE is still lacking the 2nd gen touch ID from the 6S.
A number of people get a new phone every 2 year but the are no smaller phones with the latest spec, so they had to get what is available. Had the SE launched with the 6S together, Apple would have to pay me to get the 6S over the SE.

No, because no one wants top specs in a small phone because the screen is one of the tops specs.

Again, stop making this hard. It would exist if people wanted it.

 

[Aston441]

They are just too big; people look like clows in the 1980s holding a brick next to their ears its pathetic looking; and then in their pockets looks horrible especially females in thein 5 cm haha long jeans back pocket almost complete phone is hanging out of their ass its ridiculous...but infortunately this trend is holdng for too long as these companies have stopped innovating and cant seem to make anything smallish which maybe unfolds or extends when needed for viewing something on larger screen and otherwise should be tiny and small enough to ext and talk on phone...

You're ideas are fine. Your punctuation is awful. Punctuation exists for a reason.
[doublepost=1548392990][/doublepost]They could stretch the screen to the side and put touch ID and home button on the flat edge. That would be amazing.

 

[Baymowe335]

SAMSUNG: Hey Apple, do you want millions of screens available quickly with relatively good QCs for your devices? We are manufacturing sizes 5.8" and up due to demand we forced/fabricated here in Asia. Not smaller because we'll get a ROI faster with bigger screens that cost more and have larger revenue margins than what you are currently using. Are you game?
APPLE: Ok... we trust your manufacturing capabilities to get millions of screens... er, iPhones, out for the public to consume. And regarding our original idea (iPhone 4/5/SE design) we'll send it to India and see how fast they can keep up production, so that won't be our "flagship" product anymore and our heads won't depend on. Marketing, come up with a story/campaign flashy enough (emojis, animojis, selfie filters, etc) that will make enough noise that people won't remember Steve's explanation regarding perfect size for one handed phone use.

Is it clearer to you? That's the data these companies handle. They don't care what you want. You just fell for their marketing that's made to move products. All companies are like that, so wake up. That's why iPhones are not innovative anymore. They follow asian manufacturing templates.

Nice speculation, but it’s wrong. People demanded bigger screens and have bought 1B iPhones with bigger screens. All those people aren’t stupid and didn’t “fall” for marketing. Bigger screens are better.

And you failing to recognize the innovation at Apple doesn’t mean it’s not there. The newest iPhones are the best iPhones ever made and a huge upgrade over even the iPhone 7.

 

[jgdeschamps]

Nice speculation, but it’s wrong. People demanded bigger screens and have bought 1B iPhones with bigger screens. All those people aren’t stupid and didn’t “fall” for marketing. Bigger screens are better.

And you failing to recognize the innovation at Apple doesn’t mean it’s not there. The newest iPhones are the best iPhones ever made and a huge upgrade over even the iPhone 7.

You are speculating too. Only thing that probably differentiates you and me is that I've actually been in industrial project meetings and it's exactly like what I just described. I used to admire Apple's innovation and that's why I began using Macs back in the nineties. They don't have it now.

 

[Mac 128]

My argument is much stronger. Companies deliver what people will buy and they have all the data possible on the subject.

People buy what companies offer. My argument is there is obviously a passionate group outside of these forums who value the SE, and SE-sized phones, however small. The fact that Apple is not catering to them does not change that, nor does it prove that there are no customers for the phone. All it proves is that customers must chose another option since Apple is not offering them any other choice. Apple certainly has plenty of data about what customers will and won’t buy, but you have no idea what it is, nor how Apple is using that data. It’s entirely specious to conclude that Apple is not making an SE-sized phone because their data suggests no one will buy it, despite clear evidence, however anecdotal, that there is a a market for it.

It’s just as specious for me to conclude that Apple’s data suggests they will make more money from customers who prefer a smaller SE-sized phone, but who will buy a larger phone given no other choice, and there are enough of those customers to offset those who will not buy a larger phone, or who will reluctantly buy a larger phone rather than switch to a different platform.

 

[mark081990]

I know this is completely off topic but this thread has helped me realize the one iPhone that I want over all others.

iPhone 8. Does anyone know where a deal is to be found on a 256GB one? I find it hard to believe $750 is the best price.

 

[Baymowe335]

You are speculating too. Only thing that probably differentiates you and me is that I've actually been in industrial project meetings and it's exactly like what I just described. I used to admire Apple's innovation and that's why I began using Macs back in the nineties. They don't have it now.

Your anecdotal experience doesn't matter. Again, Apple is the biggest company in the world with more data than you can imagine on the subject. It doesn't exist because people wouldn't buy them as much as the current lineup.

iPhone sales have been insane the last 5 years. The fact that China struggled in one quarter is not an indictment on the Apple strategy. The entire smartphone industry is becoming saturated. Selling a product with a 4 inch screen would, in Apple's estimation, be a losing strategy in a market that is dominated by larger screens, particularly in the segment Apple plays. Otherwise, it would exist.
[doublepost=1548429998][/doublepost]

People buy what companies offer. My argument is there is obviously a passionate group outside of these forums who value the SE, and SE-sized phones, however small. The fact that Apple is not catering to them does not change that, nor does it prove that there are no customers for the phone. All it proves is that customers must chose another option since Apple is not offering them any other choice. Apple certainly has plenty of data about what customers will and won’t buy, but you have no idea what it is, nor how Apple is using that data. It’s entirely specious to conclude that Apple is not making an SE-sized phone because their data suggests no one will buy it, despite clear evidence, however anecdotal, that there is a a market for it.

It’s just as specious for me to conclude that Apple’s data suggests they will make more money from customers who prefer a smaller SE-sized phone, but who will buy a larger phone given no other choice, and there are enough of those customers to offset those who will not buy a larger phone, or who will reluctantly buy a larger phone rather than switch to a different platform.

No, they don't. They buy what they want and will go elsewhere to get it if it's not offered. People want the larger screens, period. That's why every manufacturer makes them and don't make a 4 inch version. Apple used to make 3.5" and 4" iPhones and sold less than half what they do now.

Of course there is a market for *anything* if you're talking about 215M iPhones sold annually. It has to be WORTH it to create its own category. If 50,000 people buy an SE, that "market" doesn't support an entirely new product line.

Apple's data suggests more people want larger screens AND that even those who want smaller screens will be perfectly fine with the iPhone 7 or iPhone 8 at 4.7 inches. You don't need ANOTHER 4" option, particularly to be launched during a 3 iPhone launch in September.

You still MAY get a release of a tiny phone at another time. Keep hoping. For the big announcements, it's larger screens all day.

 

[Mac 128]

Your anecdotal experience doesn't matter. Again, Apple is the biggest company in the world with more data than you can imagine on the subject. It doesn't exist because people wouldn't buy them as much as the current lineup.

iPhone sales have been insane the last 5 years. The fact that China struggled in one quarter is not an indictment on the Apple strategy. The entire smartphone industry is becoming saturated. Selling a product with a 4 inch screen would, in Apple's estimation, be a losing strategy in a market that is dominated by larger screens, particularly in the segment Apple plays. Otherwise, it would exist.
[doublepost=1548429998][/doublepost]
No, they don't. They buy what they want and will go elsewhere to get it if it's not offered. People want the larger screens, period. That's why every manufacturer makes them and don't make a 4 inch version. Apple used to make 3.5" and 4" iPhones and sold less than half what they do now.

Of course there is a market for *anything* if you're talking about 215M iPhones sold annually. It has to be WORTH it to create its own category. If 50,000 people buy an SE, that "market" doesn't support an entirely new product line.

Apple's data suggests more people want larger screens AND that even those who want smaller screens will be perfectly fine with the iPhone 7 or iPhone 8 at 4.7 inches. You don't need ANOTHER 4" option, particularly to be launched during a 3 iPhone launch in September.

You still MAY get a release of a tiny phone at another time. Keep hoping. For the big announcements, it's larger screens all day.

You have no idea what data Apple has or how they’re using it. That’s why your posts amount to opinion and specious reasoning. So I think we’ve exhausted this line of debate.

 

[Baymowe335]

You have no idea what data Apple has or how they’re using it. That’s why your posts amount to opinion and specious reasoning. So I think we’ve exhausted this line of debate.

All I need are the results.

If you think a company Apple's size doesn't understand their market and hasn't made decisions based on data, you would be wrong.

 

[Mac 128]

All I need are the results.

If you think a company Apple's size doesn't understand their market and hasn't made decisions based on data, you would be wrong.

I never stated that. But without knowing what the goal is, or what the data says, your analysis of the results are specious.

 

[jgdeschamps]

Your anecdotal experience doesn't matter.

Neither does yours.
If you can't see past certain info, it's your problem, not mine. I'm not paying for huge screens because they are not what I need, and I'm not willing to pay for a cell phone the same amount I pay for a mid-range laptop. A LOT of people think like that, but we are subject to what Asia wants to manufacture. Again, Apple lost its balls and brains when Steve died.

 

[Baymowe335]

Neither does yours.
If you can't see past certain info, it's your problem, not mine. I'm not paying for huge screens because they are not what I need, and I'm not willing to pay for a cell phone the same amount I pay for a mid-range laptop. A LOT of people think like that, but we are subject to what Asia wants to manufacture. Again, Apple lost its balls and brains when Steve died.

That's not what the numbers say. Consumers buy more Apple than ever, because they want it. Consumer electronics is tough and Apple is delivering what people will buy.

$266B in sales in 2018, up from $232B in 2017.

 

[jgdeschamps]

That's not what the numbers say. Consumers buy more Apple than ever, because they want it. Consumer electronics is tough and Apple is delivering what people will buy.

$266B in sales in 2018, up from $232B in 2017.

Dude, the problem is that we are not arguing wether Apple makes money or not. We are talking about why they are not catering to the market they created for 4" phones, which are their original iPhones. It's there and they know it. But you go by the tangent and start spewing how much money they earn and all that BS of huge screen iPhones and not wasting time and money on smaller iPhones. How does that add something to the conversation?
Remember, they were holding on to the original 4" size until Samsung literally FLOODED the market with bigger screens because it's more money for them by square inch included in a single manufactured piece, and got ahold of most of the screen production worldwide. They have Apple and many others by the balls and got them to switch to their production templates. That's why the iPhone 6 and later look like most Android phones.
But stick to your idea that people suddenly said "I want a 42 inch TV in my pocket as my phone's screen and I want it now because bigger is better!" and please, read that with a heavy Texas accent.
Have a nice day...

 

[Baymowe335]

Dude, the problem is that we are not arguing wether Apple makes money or not. We are talking about why they are not catering to the market they created for 4" phones, which are their original iPhones. It's there and they know it. But you go by the tangent and start spewing how much money they earn and all that BS of huge screen iPhones and not wasting time and money on smaller iPhones. How does that add something to the conversation?
Remember, they were holding on to the original 4" size until Samsung literally FLOODED the market with bigger screens because it's more money for them by square inch included in a single manufactured piece, and got ahold of most of the screen production worldwide. They have Apple and many others by the balls and got them to switch to their production templates. That's why the iPhone 6 and later look like most Android phones.
But stick to your idea that people suddenly said "I want a 42 inch TV in my pocket as my phone's screen and I want it now because bigger is better!" and please, read that with a heavy Texas accent.
Have a nice day...

And I’m telling you that market is no longer big enough to be viable.

 

[B4U]

No, because no one wants top specs in a small phone because the screen is one of the tops specs.

Again, stop making this hard. It would exist if people wanted it.

Then please explain why does Sony Xperia XZ2 compact exist?
Stop justifying that no one wanted smaller phones, it is simply because there is no supply!
[doublepost=1548460362][/doublepost]

And I’m telling you that market is no longer big enough to be viable.

The same marketing spin that the automaker are spitting out to avoid making cars instead of a whale-like SUV.
All because of greed, and don't give a damn about consumers' wants/needs.

 

[KPandian1]

No, because no one wants top specs in a small phone because the screen is one of the tops specs.

Again, stop making this hard. It would exist if people wanted it.

There was no famine in Ireland for the lack of potatoes - if the Irish wanted it, it would've been available in plenty. There was no demand from the Irish for potato, so there was no supply!

They wanted cabbage - so they got abundant cabbage.

Not many people on this planet want diamonds - that is why they are rare. Same with gold, wealth, health, etc.!

This is how supply and demand works.

 

[Baymowe335]

Then please explain why does Sony Xperia XZ2 compact exist?
Stop justifying that no one wanted smaller phones, it is simply because there is no supply!
[doublepost=1548460362][/doublepost]
The same marketing spin that the automaker are spitting out to avoid making cars instead of a whale-like SUV.
All because of greed, and don't give a damn about consumers' wants/needs.

No one buys the Xperia?

 

[Narrator Jack]

I would be fine with even this low concept re-introduction:

REMOVE:
headphone jack (space, water)
moving part home button
older LCD screen
3D Touch (XR doesn't even have it)

ADD:
capacitive home button
earpiece speaker
oleophobic screen coating
upgraded glass
6/7/8 quality LCD screen (laminated)
best camera in same flat housing
600MHz signal reception

 

[ghanwani]

The same marketing spin that the automaker are spitting out to avoid making cars instead of a whale-like SUV.
All because of greed, and don't give a damn about consumers' wants/needs.

I like small phones and I prefer cars too.

But I know that I'm in a minority in both cases.

For cars, I know manufacturers prefer to build bigger cars because CAFE allows them to have much lower mpg rating. If they build small cars that are unable to meet the more stringent ratings, they end up having to pay hefty fines. That's why manufacturers prefer to size up their cars -- say from compact to midsize -- to allow them more slack. Unintended consequences of poorly written legislation. And with the poor road quality nowadays, the bigger wheels of SUVs offer an advantage.

If you try running a poll here on "your ideal phone/display size", my guess is that people that prefer the iPhone SE size would be in a minority. And this is an enthusiasts forum! A good number of friends and coworkers are offer their unsolicited advice that I "should upgrade my phone because its small and outdated".

 

[B4U]

No one buys the Xperia?

Sony is not a major player to begin with, but they continue to offer flagship specs to smaller size phone.
[doublepost=1548516051][/doublepost]

I like small phones and I prefer cars too.

But I know that I'm in a minority in both cases.

For cars, I know manufacturers prefer to build bigger cars because CAFE allows them to have much lower mpg rating. If they build small cars that are unable to meet the more stringent ratings, they end up having to pay hefty fines. That's why manufacturers prefer to size up their cars -- say from compact to midsize -- to allow them more slack. Unintended consequences of poorly written legislation. And with the poor road quality nowadays, the bigger wheels of SUVs offer an advantage.

If you try running a poll here on "your ideal phone/display size", my guess is that people that prefer the iPhone SE size would be in a minority. And this is an enthusiasts forum! A good number of friends and coworkers are offer their unsolicited advice that I "should upgrade my phone because its small and outdated".

That is an example of the sheeple mindset.
Follow the crowd without thinking for oneself. The marketing folks are notoriously known for making that happen.

 

[Baymowe335]

Sony is not a major player to begin with, but they continue to offer flagship specs to smaller size phone.
[doublepost=1548516051][/doublepost]
That is an example of the sheeple mindset.
Follow the crowd without thinking for oneself. The marketing folks are notoriously known for making that happen.

Which is probably one of the reasons they have a losing strategy in mobile.

 

[nshads]

That's not what the numbers say. Consumers buy more Apple than ever, because they want it. Consumer electronics is tough and Apple is delivering what people will buy.

$266B in sales in 2018, up from $232B in 2017.

Nothing wrong with data. But what people will buy based on numbers and what people want are two different things. The less separate a company keeps them, the smarter the company, IMO.

 

[Baymowe335]

Nothing wrong with data. But what people will buy based on numbers and what people want are two different things. The less separate a company keeps them, the smarter the company, IMO.

What company is smarter than Apple? Seriously. You like data, but nothing you say is supported by anything other than generalities.

Apple is the most profitable company in the world and almost 3X more profitable than the #2 American company, Google.

Sure, you can say this doesn’t matter, but it shows consumers have CHOSEN to spend their dollars on Apple products so much that this is a fact.

Apple designs, produces, markets, and executes the sale of its products better than any company in the world. They understand their market and people will buy what they like. The consumer has spoken, quite loudly that Apple is making the right stuff.

 

[I7guy]

...
That is an example of the sheeple mindset.
Follow the crowd without thinking for oneself. The marketing folks are notoriously known for making that happen.

Can’t wrap my arms around why you care how others spend their money.