iPhone X Should Push Apple Ahead of Samsung as World's Largest Smartphone Maker

[ChrisChaval]

That last line is the difference between Apple and all the other companies on your death-list. (don't forget Palm)

So do you think Palm would still be around today if they were making 10 billion dollars in profit from 50 billion in revenue? Every three months?

I know what you're trying to say: "If Nokia and Blackberry can fail... so could Apple..."

But come on... Apple is in a whole other league. There haven't been many companies that post these kinds of numbers... especially an electronics company.

Even if Apple majorly screwed up with their "one product"... they've got 260 billion safety nets.

That's something Palm didn't have. Their only option was to be acquired... and ultimately gutted.

Look... I can't predict the future. But I do know that you shouldn't look at other companies' failures and automatically assume the same could happen to Apple.

Oh it's possible... but not very probable.

Apple seems to be playing a different game. I think Apple could be around for another 40 years.

We used to think the same of blackberry too, Nokia ..

Rim had huge reserves and nonetheless ...

The way I see it all tech companies’ downfall is just the next killer product away, whatever it is going to be

When it shows up it changes entirely how we do certain thing

Just like the iPhone was , just like the iPhone did

This is what I was trying to say

 

[alien3dx]

iPhones are cheap. In fact, every iPHONE except the iPhone X is cheaper than nearly every other companies flagship phones. Don't pretend like iPhones are some extravagant thing that only the wealthy can afford. What makes the iPhone unique is the profit margin Apple gets out of the majority of their phones.

Android has huge shares because it is OPEN to anyone willing to pay to lease the OS. iOS is closed. Same can be said for Mac's vs PC's. But last I checked, Mac sales haven't grown and in 10 years, iOS has plateaued and stayed realitively steady.

Next time you decide to make a generic statement like 'Android has huge share because it is cheap and people can't afford an iPhone', let's back that up with some facts. Otherwise, you just sound like an ignorant snob.

between 30 dollar lenovo and 300 dollar.. dam different.

 

[FFR]

And come the S9, Samsung will be back on top. Unless you own Apple shares and are ready to sell, there is no reason to gloat. Another day another story.

And yes .. I'm one of them that thinks Tim Cook is effin up Apple, and I stand by that.

Right because the s8 and note 8 did so well.
I don’t think the s 9 will make any difference.
More like a me too product and no headphone jack.

But I hopethey change the dated look of the back. At least Apple changes up the look of the back of thier devices every 1-2 years.

 

[Michael Scrip]

We used to think the same of blackberry too, Nokia ..

Rim had huge reserves and nonetheless ...

Correct. But like I said... Apple is in an entirely different league.

The most revenue Blackberry ever made in a single year was $20 billion. And that was 5 years ago.

At that time... Apple was making $125 billion a year in revenue... and now they're over $200 billion a year in revenue.

Big difference.

The way I see it all tech companies’ downfall is just the next killer product away, whatever it is going to be

When it shows up it changes entirely how we do certain thing

Just like the iPhone was , just like the iPhone did

This is what I was trying to say

Sure... but people still enjoy Apple's products... while they have abandoned Blackberry's products.

I realize Apple is only as good at its latest product... but Apple has a pretty good track-record, huh?

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

Right because the s8 and note 8 did so well.
I don’t think the s 9 will make any difference.
More like a me too product and no headphone jack.

But I hopethey change the dated look of the back. At least Apple changes up the look of the back of thier devices every 1-2 years.

Post a source that the Note 8 didn't sell well?

 

[KingslayerG5]

The very nature of how saturated the Android world is with so many different models and competitors is why no Android OEM could ever really outsell an iPhone since Apple has iOS all to itself.

In the United States, we are under mostly postpaid / installment plans. We get iPhones the cheapest here. In other poorer countries, they are under a prepaid plan and usually forced to buy outright.

China and India, the two most populated countries with over 1B people, have very different taste than us. China is fickle as seen with their different market leaders. India is very price conscious since it is a poorer nation.

That's why Indians look at the Chinese favorably since many Chinese phones are catered to their budget while some other Asian nationalities might prefer the Japanese and South Koreans over the Chinese when it comes to cleanliness and quality control.

The iPhone 6 is the best-selling smartphone ever. The X will help overtake Samsung but only temporary will Apple be #1. I believe Huawei is going to catch them both in about 3-4 years. This X thing is special because it's an anniversary edition. Its next few successors won't sell as many.

^ Outdated as iPhone 6 / 6 Plus has reached 220M combined.

 

[FFR]

Post a source that the Note 8 didn't sell well?

Seriously .

Why do you think they are selling well?
How well do you think they are selling?

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

Seriously .

Why do you think they are selling well?
How well do you think they are selling?

You stated the Note 8 isn't doing well. Where is your source?

 

[sebastian...]

Wow, you didn’t even trade in for the iPhone SE? My 5s got like yours toward the end of a year and even my kid couldn’t use it so we got the SE for her. Even I got an SE I used for a year and still have it. Well anyway I’m happy for you getting the X. I hope it serves you well.

I don't get how the batteries break so fast in most people devices. My iphone 4s (bought new when it was released) still last at least 10 hours on a charge. And even my ipod touch 1st generation still has a working battery even if it doesn't last more than a few hours. I'm using them sometimes as mp3 players.
My ipad 1 battery is visibly reduced but it's still very usable. The same for my ipad 2.
I don't get what's different with my devices. Maybe because they are all on old ios versions ?

 

[5105973]

I don't get how the batteries break so fast in most people devices. My iphone 4s (bought new when it was released) still last at least 10 hours on a charge. And even my ipod touch 1st generation still has a working battery even if it doesn't last more than a few hours. I'm using them sometimes as mp3 players.
My ipad 1 battery is visibly reduced but it's still very usable. The same for my ipad 2.
I don't get what's different with my devices. Maybe because they are all on old ios versions ?

That’s a very good question. I think it’s because you’re using them as music players or supplemental devices now. Using an iPhone as a music player never taxes my idevice batteries very much. It’s using the screen and using texting that killed battery for me. Emails, too.

 

[convergent]

Right because the s8 and note 8 did so well.
I don’t think the s 9 will make any difference.
More like a me too product and no headphone jack.

But I hopethey change the dated look of the back. At least Apple changes up the look of the back of thier devices every 1-2 years.

LOL... yeh, they change the back to something that is extremely fragile with a price tag of $459 to replace if you break it. And because its so fragile, it is most likely to be hidden away behind a case. Personally, the look of the back of a phone is not really high on my list of selection criteria. I take my phone out of its case about once a quarter ... brush off any dust and grit... admire it for a few minutes... and then replace the case.

Correct. But like I said... Apple is in an entirely different league.

The most revenue Blackberry ever made in a single year was $20 billion. And that was 5 years ago.

At that time... Apple was making $125 billion a year in revenue... and now they're over $200 billion a year in revenue.

Big difference.

Sure... but people still enjoy Apple's products... while they have abandoned Blackberry's products.

I realize Apple is only as good at its latest product... but Apple has a pretty good track-record, huh?

No one is too big to fail, especially in a market that depends on continuous progress. The big reserve Apple has just means they could survive making stuff that is either mediocre or misaligned with the market for a long time. I don't expect them to go anywhere. In the US they have a pretty good lock on a big share of the market and many of their customers are going to just keep buying what they bought before. I hope we don't live to see a day when any one vendor becomes a monopoly because without competition the products would not be very good.

Why do you think they are selling well?
How well do you think they are selling?

The Note 8 is a very niche product. Unless someone on here works for Samsung, you have no idea what their sales targets are so how could anyone know if its doing well or not. Given the Note 7 disaster, the objectives for volume could have been very low and restoring brand could have been pretty high. Whatever their objective was, as far as the device itself, they hit it out of the park in my opinion. To go from a device that was globally banned it had such problems, to one that is this good... quite an accomplishment.

 

[bopajuice]

After reading the title to this thread I thought it had already been established by the gaggles of forum members here that Samsung is not the world leader, is a jealous corporation, and desperate to compete with the X. Did I miss something?

 

[I7guy]

LOL... yeh, they change the back to something that is extremely fragile with a price tag of $459 to replace if you break it. And because its so fragile, it is most likely to be hidden away behind a case. Personally, the look of the back of a phone is not really high on my list of selection criteria. I take my phone out of its case about once a quarter ... brush off any dust and grit... admire it for a few minutes... and then replace the case.



No one is too big to fail, especially in a market that depends on continuous progress. The big reserve Apple has just means they could survive making stuff that is either mediocre or misaligned with the market for a long time. I don't expect them to go anywhere. In the US they have a pretty good lock on a big share of the market and many of their customers are going to just keep buying what they bought before. I hope we don't live to see a day when any one vendor becomes a monopoly because without competition the products would not be very good.



The Note 8 is a very niche product. Unless someone on here works for Samsung, you have no idea what their sales targets are so how could anyone know if its doing well or not. Given the Note 7 disaster, the objectives for volume could have been very low and restoring brand could have been pretty high. Whatever their objective was, as far as the device itself, they hit it out of the park in my opinion. To go from a device that was globally banned it had such problems, to one that is this good... quite an accomplishment.

No one is too big to fail applies equally to Samsung as well as Apple. The reason customers are repeat Apple consumers is that Apple produces products that people want. In addition, the management of Apple makes sure it is not a faceless corporation; how many people that makes a difference for I dont know.

 

[Baymowe335]

iPhones are cheap. In fact, every iPHONE except the iPhone X is cheaper than nearly every other companies flagship phones. Don't pretend like iPhones are some extravagant thing that only the wealthy can afford. What makes the iPhone unique is the profit margin Apple gets out of the majority of their phones.

Android has huge shares because it is OPEN to anyone willing to pay to lease the OS. iOS is closed. Same can be said for Mac's vs PC's. But last I checked, Mac sales haven't grown and in 10 years, iOS has plateaued and stayed realitively steady.

Next time you decide to make a generic statement like 'Android has huge share because it is cheap and people can't afford an iPhone', let's back that up with some facts. Otherwise, you just sound like an ignorant snob.

You're misinformed. Try to have a world view. iPhones and even other flagship Androids ARE expensive for much of the world. People in India aren't using iPhones, Note 8s and Galaxy S8s and it's not because they don't want them. They can't afford them. The REASON Android has huge market share is because there are dozens of models and phones that cost around $100. The fact it's open just means it's fragmented and any trash manufacturer can use it for its OS. The underlying reason for the end user to buy the phone isn't because it's open, it's because it's CHEAP and that's all they can afford.

Also, Apple doesn't make more margin on their flagships than Samsung does on their Note 8 and Galaxy S series. Their GM is very similar. The reason Apple is more profitable is because they sell SO MANY MORE premium phones than Samsung. Samsung leads in smartphone shipments because they sell a lot of cheap phones too for which they make almost no margin. Look at Samsung's total profitability as a company. The company that sells dishwashers, refrigerators and everything else. When the Note 7 starting exploding, it cost Samsung A LOT ($5.4B) because a ton of their profit for the whole company was it the mobile division and in the Note in particular. Their operating profit dropped something like 95% over the previous year because of the loss of their most profitable phone. They make more money on the Note than all their other phones combined.

So saying "iPhones are cheap" is probably the dumbest thing you could say and Apple is NOT unique in the profit margin on flagship phones. They are unique in that they sell SO MANY more flagship phones and their ASP is so much higher because they ONLY sell flagship phones. Android has FEW flagships relative to their $100 phones, contributing to their high market share worldwide. Notice that in the US the market share for iPhone is so much higher? It's because money.
[doublepost=1510327523][/doublepost]

And come the S9, Samsung will be back on top. Unless you own Apple shares and are ready to sell, there is no reason to gloat. Another day another story.

And yes .. I'm one of them that thinks Tim Cook is effin up Apple, and I stand by that.

Anyone who can watch Apple's performance since Jobs left and say Cook is "effing up Apple" is either a hater, short AAPL, in denial, completely misinformed, or all of those.

No one can sit there and objectively say he's doing a bad job. YOU might not like the products as much now (or whatever your reason) but millions and millions voting with their wallets disagree with you. AAPL is firing on all cylinders and have sold more hardware and services than ever before in ALL product categories under Tim Cook.

Cook has sold more than triple the iPhones of Jobs and more than doubled the company's value since Jobs left. Jobs was a true genius, visionary, and one of the greats, but Cook is less stubborn and has his own strengths like supply chain.

And by the way, the S9 sells well, but it's not the best selling Samsung phone in all likelihood. They don't break out mix, but Samsung's ASP is something like $230, indicating most of their phones are cheap. So the S9 won't be the reason Samsung will be back on top. Apple makes 94% of mobile profits for a reason.

 

[convergent]

No one is too big to fail applies equally to Samsung as well as Apple. The reason customers are repeat Apple consumers is that Apple produces products that people want. In addition, the management of Apple makes sure it is not a faceless corporation; how many people that makes a difference for I dont know.

Correct, but Samsung is a very diversified company, so if they exited the smartphone business entirely, it would have a small impact on their bottom line. Apple, on the other hand, has turned themselves into a smartphone company. Without iPhone, they pretty much don't exist in their current state. Every other product in their portfolio today exists in support of the iPhone.

I disagree that a lot of Apple's customers buy Apple because they "produce what they want", at least beyond the macro level of they produce an iPhone. That may sound odd, but hear me out before disagreeing. A lot of Apple's consumers go back because its the path of least resistance. Everyone in my family uses iPhones. My wife, for example, wouldn't have a clue how to switch to another phone OS, nor have the desire or patience to do it. If her phone dies, she will buy another iPhone. There is no other option for her. There are a lot of Apple customers that fall into this category. There are also enthusiasts like the people on this forum that do take the time to look at features and such. In their case, if Apple takes a big turn they don't like, and they really don't like Android, they might be inclined to just keep using their old device. I've certainly heard a lot of of folks on here say that. Because iPhones do age well, there is a huge inventory in the used market. That can whittle at Apples short term sales... people choosing not to buy anything new.

As far as Apple not being a faceless corporation, in my case at least that has worked against them. I don't like their face, and it leads me to not want to support them. If Tim Cook shut up and just did his job, its one less nail in their coffin for me. Every time he goes on a political activist binge, I'm further away from Apple. In contrast, have you heard Satya Nadella, CEO of Microsoft, talking about politics or mixing it up with the Hollywood elite? I don't think so. When a corporation's senior leaders start putting their nose into things like this publicly, it rubs a lot of people the wrong way... in the US, its very polarizing today.

 

[I7guy]

Correct, but Samsung is a very diversified company, so if they exited the smartphone business entirely, it would have a small impact on their bottom line. Apple, on the other hand, has turned themselves into a smartphone company. Without iPhone, they pretty much don't exist in their current state. Every other product in their portfolio today exists in support of the iPhone.

I disagree that a lot of Apple's customers buy Apple because they "produce what they want", at least beyond the macro level of they produce an iPhone. That may sound odd, but hear me out before disagreeing. A lot of Apple's consumers go back because its the path of least resistance. Everyone in my family uses iPhones. My wife, for example, wouldn't have a clue how to switch to another phone OS, nor have the desire or patience to do it. If her phone dies, she will buy another iPhone. There is no other option for her. There are a lot of Apple customers that fall into this category. There are also enthusiasts like the people on this forum that do take the time to look at features and such. In their case, if Apple takes a big turn they don't like, and they really don't like Android, they might be inclined to just keep using their old device. I've certainly heard a lot of of folks on here say that. Because iPhones do age well, there is a huge inventory in the used market. That can whittle at Apples short term sales... people choosing not to buy anything new.

As far as Apple not being a faceless corporation, in my case at least that has worked against them. I don't like their face, and it leads me to not want to support them. If Tim Cook shut up and just did his job, its one less nail in their coffin for me. Every time he goes on a political activist binge, I'm further away from Apple. In contrast, have you heard Satya Nadella, CEO of Microsoft, talking about politics or mixing it up with the Hollywood elite? I don't think so. When a corporation's senior leaders start putting their nose into things like this publicly, it rubs a lot of people the wrong way... in the US, its very polarizing today.

Ok. You may not be interested in being an Apple customer.

I disagree that Apple has a “better chance” at failing than Samsung. Exploding smartphones and appliances. Their foundry business is what is keeping the company afloat.

I personally enjoy seeing Apple management as our household is slowly becoming more of an Apple shop.

To each their own.

 

[convergent]

Ok. You may not be interested in being an Apple customer.

I disagree that Apple has a “better chance” at failing than Samsung. Exploding smartphones and appliances. Their foundry business is what is keeping the company afloat.

I personally enjoy seeing Apple management as our household is slowly becoming more of an Apple shop.

To each their own.

I am an Apple customer... never said I wasn't. Looking at buying an iPad Pro for my daughter soon. We have a lot of Apple products, I've just personally gone in a different direction and its somewhat freeing to be more heterogeneous. We'll see if that lasts.

I never said Apple has a better chance of failing than Samsung. I said Samsung was very diversified and Apple is not. They used to be, but not any more.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

Anyone who can watch Apple's performance since Jobs left and say Cook is "effing up Apple" is either a hater, short AAPL, in denial, completely misinformed, or all of those.

No one can sit there and objectively say he's doing a bad job. YOU might not like the products as much now (or whatever your reason) but millions and millions voting with their wallets disagree with you. AAPL is firing on all cylinders and have sold more hardware and services than ever before in ALL product categories under Tim Cook.

Cook has sold more than triple the iPhones of Jobs and more than doubled the company's value since Jobs left. Jobs was a true genius, visionary, and one of the greats, but Cook is less stubborn and has his own strengths like supply chain.

And by the way, the S9 sells well, but it's not the best selling Samsung phone in all likelihood. They don't break out mix, but Samsung's ASP is something like $230, indicating most of their phones are cheap. So the S9 won't be the reason Samsung will be back on top. Apple makes 94% of mobile profits for a reason.

Screw sales as an indicator. Apple and the iPhone already had a God like reputation before Cook was in charge, and that doesn't just go away overnight. So of course the iPhone is still going to sell like hotcakes for x amount of years to come. But that momentum is slowing down, and might only have seen a spike this year due to the drastic hardware change.

But while Android and Samsung is progressing at a fast rate, iOS has basically become stagnant in progress. Apple simply can't stay afloat forever by slapping new limited changes here and there. iOS needs to be completely revamped. Even most of the reviewers that praise the iPhone X have stated, it's still the same old iOS.

 

[Baymowe335]

Screw sales as an indicator. Apple and the iPhone already had a God like reputation before Cook was in charge, and that doesn't just go away overnight. So of course the iPhone is still going to sell like hotcakes for x amount of years to come. But that momentum is slowing down, and might only have seen a spike this year due to the drastic hardware change.

But while Android and Samsung is progressing at a fast rate, iOS has basically become stagnant in progress. Apple simply can't stay afloat forever by slapping new limited changes here and there. iOS needs to be completely revamped. Even most of the reviewers that praise the iPhone X have stated, it's still the same old iOS.

Where are your numbers that show iPhone is slowing down? Apple sold more iPhones this year than last year.

They just sold 217M iPhones without the iPhone X even in that number. They sold 211M the year before. The 2013 year, before iPhone 6, Apple sold 169M iPhones. They sold 72M iPhones the last year Jobs was alive.

The iPhone is not slowing down and the X is going to produce record sales for F2018.

So I just gave you numbers...are you surprised? Facts are completely different than your opinion.

The spike you talk about isn’t even announced because exactly zero iPhone X sales and only 2 weeks of iPhone 8 sales were in Apple’s earnings.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

Where are your numbers that show iPhone is slowing down? Apple sold more iPhones this year than last year.

They just sold 217M iPhones without the iPhone X even in that number. They sold 211M the year before. Take out the outlier of 233M from iPhone 6 when people bought due to pent up demand for larger screens and you see a nice steady increase. The year before iPhone 6, Apple sold 169M iPhones.

The iPhone is not slowing down and the X is going to produce record sales for F2018.

Reread my post again. Notice some keywords.

 

[Baymowe335]

Reread my post again. Notice some keywords.

You’re wrong. Apple isn’t stagnant and I just proved it. You also said they spiked bc of hardware change and no numbers have been posted for X. Wrong again.

Any “spiking” was with their old iPhone 7 lineup.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

You’re wrong. Apple isn’t stagnant and I just proved it. You also said they spiked bc of hardware change and no numbers have been posted for X. Wrong again.

Any “spiking” was with their old iPhone 7 lineup.

Reread my post once again. Try to take the context of it all as a whole, instead of nitpicking. If you still don't know what I mean, then we just disagree.

 

[I7guy]

Reread my post once again. Try to take the context of it all as a whole, instead of nitpicking. If you still don't know what I mean, then we just disagree.

I disagree with your post. Android and Samsung aren’t on the fast lane anymore than iOS is stagnating.

As far as the momentum iphone has been slowing down since Tim Cook took office. That’s about all that is “slowing” down if one could even prove or document such a thing.

 

[dk001]

Is this prediction for one quarter or more?
I wonder if they will be able to do this (Apple) and I don't expect them to hold it for long.

Note: I looked at the X and didn't care for it. Sticking with my 7+.

 

[NewdestinyX]

Screw sales as an indicator. Apple and the iPhone already had a God like reputation before Cook was in charge, and that doesn't just go away overnight. So of course the iPhone is still going to sell like hotcakes for x amount of years to come. But that momentum is slowing down, and might only have seen a spike this year due to the drastic hardware change.

But while Android and Samsung is progressing at a fast rate, iOS has basically become stagnant in progress. Apple simply can't stay afloat forever by slapping new limited changes here and there. iOS needs to be completely revamped. Even most of the reviewers that praise the iPhone X have stated, it's still the same old iOS.

And android OS is the same old android OS, too… I used it 2 years ago tried one on for a couple weeks about a month ago same old same old. No changes in 2 years -- really.

I've never really understood what people mean by "more in an OS"… What more do you want? Be specific… Name 5 to 10 things that iOS could "revamp".