I hope it seriously competes with MS Office and that is significantly cheaper than Office. I also needs to be compatible with office documents and have more than just a word processor and presentation software. I like the idea of this.
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iWork '05 Productivity Suite?
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wtmcgee said:
M$ has been producing Office for how long now. I do not expect an Apple Office at version 1 to knock M$ Office that has been in development for X amount of years, it is a gradual thing. Same as FCP, DVDSP, and many other Apple application(s).
Why do people think this will knock down M$ Office at version 1, its a great start for Apple to show interest in this area however expect Office for Mac to loose market share, that is all.
swissmann said:
I hope it is easier to use than Office. Office is so darn bloated and slow. The same ease of use and power of iTunes, but in word form. They could do for word processing like what they did with music. I don't know what yet, but I still feel word processors have a way to go.
Well there is no way that it will be 100% compatible. So I still need MS Office. Don't get me wrong: I hate it. I avoid whereever I can. But I am forced to use it. I actually write everything that does not have to be reviewed by other people with LaTeX. I take notes and organize my information with OmniOutliner.
"Please submit xyz in Word format."
"There is no time to change laptops. Please submit your talk in PowerPoint format."
"This device reads and wirtes data in Microsoft Excel..."
Does this sound familiar?
"Please submit xyz in Word format."
"There is no time to change laptops. Please submit your talk in PowerPoint format."
"This device reads and wirtes data in Microsoft Excel..."
Does this sound familiar?
Sir_Giggles said:
Oddly enough I was developing such a word processing application some years back it was in alpha stages and I never had the time to complete it, since it was only a hobby. I hope I have that code around on back-up Optical somewhere down be nice.
I was working with Dev Tools version 1, then Apple moved to Xcode with new version with all the busy elements that life brought at the time I was surprised it was in alpha build.
iWorks should be included free with the headless Mac. It will prompt windows users to dump their PCs, since the barrier to switching is offcourse compatibility with PC Office documents. I cant wait for the next version of iDVD btw!!
Why do people think this will knock down M$ Office at version 1, its a great start for Apple to show interest in this area however expect Office for Mac to loose market share, that is all...
very true. Apple fans (and yes, i'm one of the biggest) - don't get ahead of yourselves. iWork isn't going to destroy MS or Office. it will be a great, easy to use, clean and lovely piece of Apple software, and you will love it. it is not going to make people buy Macs or "switch", but it will be a great alternative to MS. enjoy the fact that you're getting a fantastic new Apple product that you love (see: Final Cut, Motion, iTunes, Keynote, etc.) and let Steve Jobs slowly work his magic on the rest of the planet... slowly, but surely...
very true. Apple fans (and yes, i'm one of the biggest) - don't get ahead of yourselves. iWork isn't going to destroy MS or Office. it will be a great, easy to use, clean and lovely piece of Apple software, and you will love it. it is not going to make people buy Macs or "switch", but it will be a great alternative to MS. enjoy the fact that you're getting a fantastic new Apple product that you love (see: Final Cut, Motion, iTunes, Keynote, etc.) and let Steve Jobs slowly work his magic on the rest of the planet... slowly, but surely...
i wonder
Hmmm...I'm not sure where this leaves me if it's true. I have no interest in an Apple word processor and only mild interest in a spreadsheet app. However, I use Keynote all the time for grad school, and would rather purchase that separately than pay more for it and other apps I wouldn't really use. I have to use Word because of its Endnote compatability for my dissertation and so don't see getting much value from Pages. It would sit on my hard drive like Appleworks does now. Now I know how those people who only wanted iPhoto from iLife felt, LOL. Here's hoping there's an ala carte option or that the price is so low I won't care.
Hmmm...I'm not sure where this leaves me if it's true. I have no interest in an Apple word processor and only mild interest in a spreadsheet app. However, I use Keynote all the time for grad school, and would rather purchase that separately than pay more for it and other apps I wouldn't really use. I have to use Word because of its Endnote compatability for my dissertation and so don't see getting much value from Pages. It would sit on my hard drive like Appleworks does now. Now I know how those people who only wanted iPhoto from iLife felt, LOL. Here's hoping there's an ala carte option or that the price is so low I won't care.
I remember my first time on a computer and it was a Mac Plus. The first time I used a word processor, I felt my world had changed. I imagined all the novels and stories I could write, and have it able to be printed out.
Of course the novelty wore off and today, I find myself just editing high definition movies on a dual G5 instead.
Of course the novelty wore off and today, I find myself just editing high definition movies on a dual G5 instead.
Price Issues?
Appleworks does need to be updated but I wonder about Apple's ability to price competitively on an office suite. A new and fully functional copy of MS Office goes for $125 on Amazon, so I kinda think that represents the upper limit on what Apple could charge. Unless iWork is a revolutionary piece of software (one can only hope), it will be tough to price much above the Keynote price of $99. It will be interesting to see if Apple attempts to preserve compatibility with MS Office documents, or goes in another direction such as using the same file format as OpenOffice (which I needn't mention is free!). So anyway you slice it, this isn't going to be a big moneymaker for Apple.
Appleworks does need to be updated but I wonder about Apple's ability to price competitively on an office suite. A new and fully functional copy of MS Office goes for $125 on Amazon, so I kinda think that represents the upper limit on what Apple could charge. Unless iWork is a revolutionary piece of software (one can only hope), it will be tough to price much above the Keynote price of $99. It will be interesting to see if Apple attempts to preserve compatibility with MS Office documents, or goes in another direction such as using the same file format as OpenOffice (which I needn't mention is free!). So anyway you slice it, this isn't going to be a big moneymaker for Apple.
step in the right direction
im guessing that this app will b like switching from WMP to iTunes: simpler interface, better integration (into tiger of course) and faster (Word is a RAM hog). im not sure if metadata supports .doc files so that (if it is not supported that is) would be great for finding files easer. im more thinking of a streamlined word with more features than a entirely different product. but of course this is apple, and we could get somthing that totally changes that. {sorry if im restating other posts i didnt have time to read 8 pages of posts}
im guessing that this app will b like switching from WMP to iTunes: simpler interface, better integration (into tiger of course) and faster (Word is a RAM hog). im not sure if metadata supports .doc files so that (if it is not supported that is) would be great for finding files easer. im more thinking of a streamlined word with more features than a entirely different product. but of course this is apple, and we could get somthing that totally changes that. {sorry if im restating other posts i didnt have time to read 8 pages of posts}
four quick points
1) a $499 desktop which is easy to use, free from viruses and spyware, and bundled with a productivity suite would be highly desirable not just for home users but also for small businesses
2) if maya's predictions about the size of the new machine are right, this could be a "portable" computer to be plugged into any monitor or TV -- great for traveling
3) perhaps the name "Pages" is meant to reflect an app designed to create web pages as well as printed pages -- this would be huge for home and business users (and might make .mac more desirable)
4) M$ still makes the best suite out there but it is bloated and has a gazillion random "features" most users don't want -- also, I consider myself fairly savvy and always have problems saving Excel and Word to mounted (network) servers -- never to local drives or never problems with non-M$ apps
Happy New Year!
1) a $499 desktop which is easy to use, free from viruses and spyware, and bundled with a productivity suite would be highly desirable not just for home users but also for small businesses
2) if maya's predictions about the size of the new machine are right, this could be a "portable" computer to be plugged into any monitor or TV -- great for traveling
3) perhaps the name "Pages" is meant to reflect an app designed to create web pages as well as printed pages -- this would be huge for home and business users (and might make .mac more desirable)
4) M$ still makes the best suite out there but it is bloated and has a gazillion random "features" most users don't want -- also, I consider myself fairly savvy and always have problems saving Excel and Word to mounted (network) servers -- never to local drives or never problems with non-M$ apps
Happy New Year!
Draw, gosh dern it
Word processing is one thing - let's face it - most word processing tasks for most people can be done just as easily on any platform in any app.
It's AW's Draw component that I would really want to see in an iWork suite. "Page" sounds like a promising name, but Word's clumsy attempt at sticking draw components on top of a word processor won't do it. We need a true page layout component with:
-AW's Draw ease of use, flexibility, and stability
-AW's mail merge capabilities
-Keynote's graphics handling capabilities
I don't know. If Apple would just fix up AW, I'd be happy. I just don't want to get an iWork only to find myself constantly reverting to AW 6.2.9 for quick projects. My hopes are up, but I'm also worried.
Word processing is one thing - let's face it - most word processing tasks for most people can be done just as easily on any platform in any app.
It's AW's Draw component that I would really want to see in an iWork suite. "Page" sounds like a promising name, but Word's clumsy attempt at sticking draw components on top of a word processor won't do it. We need a true page layout component with:
-AW's Draw ease of use, flexibility, and stability
-AW's mail merge capabilities
-Keynote's graphics handling capabilities
I don't know. If Apple would just fix up AW, I'd be happy. I just don't want to get an iWork only to find myself constantly reverting to AW 6.2.9 for quick projects. My hopes are up, but I'm also worried.
aldo said:
Its possible.....take the software out of the equation. It doesn't cost Apple a thing to pre-install their software on computers. Unlike hardware, they're simply just making a copy of it and installing it. The copies of the software they sell in store is almost pure profit for them minus the costs of duplicating the software, printing the box/manuals, ect, which isn't expensive, so they'll make plenty of cash off that. All Apple would need to do is stick the iWorks and iLife installers on the restore CD that would come with the cheap Mac and possibly provide a PDF of the manual for the software at no cost to them.
And if Apple does in fact bundle iWorks and iLife with a $500 Mac, I think it will sell very well. Find me a PC with all that software bundled for $500....the best you might find is some cheap eMachines with some Word knockoff and the usual crap pre-installed with XP. The headless Mac would be a great value.
Either way, I'm looking forward to iWorks. Its sad to say, but even though Office 2k4 for Mac is bloated, slow and not worth half of what M$ charges you for it, its the best option we have
jet3004 said:
Well, some would argue that Windows 95 was almost as good as Mac OS was ten years before it...
iWorks is not a competitor
I know that some of us, myself included, would like the idea of MS losing its stranglehold on the industry, but Apple is not (right now) in any position to compete directly with MS.
But they really don't have to. With iWorks, I think they want to create a really good home productivity suite that has *good* office compatibility. Pro users and business folks will still buy and use Office. But this app will create an amazing double-whammy for Apple in regard to the casual user. But the cross-platform compatiblity will have to be top shelf. At least as good as Office for Mac itself.
Not only will they have reduced the price to become a Mac user to 499, but also by offering a good, reliable Office alternative, they will have effectively reduced the price by *another* 150 or 399 bucks.
Here's why: in addition to the system itself, nearly every potential PC switcher absolutely has to buy Office which sets them back 150 or 399 bucks depending on the version.
So, to sum up...
Cost for a run of the mill Windows user to switch to a Mac right now:
799 for eMac
150 (minimum) Office
950 (before taxes)
Cost for the same Windows user to switch to a Mac after the expo (hopefully)
499 (new Mac plus iWorks)
Apple hasn't just lowered the cost of Mac ownership, they may well have actually *halved* it.
I know that some of us, myself included, would like the idea of MS losing its stranglehold on the industry, but Apple is not (right now) in any position to compete directly with MS.
But they really don't have to. With iWorks, I think they want to create a really good home productivity suite that has *good* office compatibility. Pro users and business folks will still buy and use Office. But this app will create an amazing double-whammy for Apple in regard to the casual user. But the cross-platform compatiblity will have to be top shelf. At least as good as Office for Mac itself.
Not only will they have reduced the price to become a Mac user to 499, but also by offering a good, reliable Office alternative, they will have effectively reduced the price by *another* 150 or 399 bucks.
Here's why: in addition to the system itself, nearly every potential PC switcher absolutely has to buy Office which sets them back 150 or 399 bucks depending on the version.
So, to sum up...
Cost for a run of the mill Windows user to switch to a Mac right now:
799 for eMac
150 (minimum) Office
950 (before taxes)
Cost for the same Windows user to switch to a Mac after the expo (hopefully)
499 (new Mac plus iWorks)
Apple hasn't just lowered the cost of Mac ownership, they may well have actually *halved* it.
Well, most people are fine with Word + some basic spreadsheet. Which is included in the Works 2005 suite, an upgrade around 40-50 bucks. Gateway is offering a system at $329 (after mail-in rebate) which totals with the Works- and a combo-drive-upgrade at about $415 including a 17" CRT. So a $499 is still not cheap, but indeed a much lowered threshold for switchers.
Exactly
You're exactly right and you actually made my point a little more clear than I did.
There is no Works equivalent on Mac side so potential switchers pretty much *had* to buy full-blown Office to use their older docs. So, yeah, still costlier than the cheapest of Windows systems, but only by a little.
Wuddel said:
You're exactly right and you actually made my point a little more clear than I did.
There is no Works equivalent on Mac side so potential switchers pretty much *had* to buy full-blown Office to use their older docs. So, yeah, still costlier than the cheapest of Windows systems, but only by a little.
I dunno. What does a 17" CRT cost? I think the price difference will still be around $200. Although most people on both "sides" will go for a TFT nowadays. I bet that Apple would release a 17" TFT matching the headless headlessMac-design.
Well I don't care about the headlessMac or iWork or not even Apple and Microsoft. I only want a computer which is powerful and easy to use and enables me to exchange documents with the rest of the world, hassle-free. An iWorks-induced pull out of MS out of the Mac market surely would cause me trouble. So Apple should better make the right deceisions.
Well I don't care about the headlessMac or iWork or not even Apple and Microsoft. I only want a computer which is powerful and easy to use and enables me to exchange documents with the rest of the world, hassle-free. An iWorks-induced pull out of MS out of the Mac market surely would cause me trouble.
So Apple should better make the right deceisions.