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DrumApple

macrumors 6502a
Jan 30, 2009
546
1,417
Well now I feel this validates all my b*tching about the keyboard. They knew it wasn't a good keyboard, loud as hell, unsatisfying to use, prone to malfunction. Many of us stuck with a piss poor design, thanks Apple.
 

Abazigal

Contributor
Jul 18, 2011
19,576
22,045
Singapore
2 USB-c ports.

Yes, you can dongle your way out of that limitation.

The cheaper “pro” has 2 ports, the Touchbar has 4. This is a smaller amount than its brother. This is a limitation.

In reality, you really need only one dongle (with a custom selection of ports geared towards your specific use case).

Then at your desk, use one usb c port for a monitor dock and another for the external GPU. Seems this is really what Apple’s vision of modularity entails. You have a thin and light laptop for productivity on the move outside, yet still be able to turn it into a desktop replacement at home with the right accessories.
 
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DrumApple

macrumors 6502a
Jan 30, 2009
546
1,417
Can I just say that USB-C only ports are STILL a huge pain in the arse even in 2018. That was and still is a terrible idea. Still waiting for the rest of the world to catch up Apple? Oh wait, no one wants to. They are all smarter, and gradually added it ALONG with the ports people actually use today.
 

avkills

macrumors 65816
Jun 14, 2002
1,172
976
In reality, you really need only one dongle (with a custom selection of ports geared towards your specific use case).

Then at your desk, use one usb c port for a monitor dock and another for the external GPU. Seems this is really what Apple’s vision of modularity entails. You have a thin and light laptop for productivity on the move outside, yet still be able to turn it into a desktop replacement at home with the right accessories.

However, what needs to be proven is if the 6-core can keep the speed up while all those cores are churning; otherwise it isn't a suitable desktop replacement if the CPU keeps getting throttled down whenever you decide to compute something.
 

TobyR

macrumors member
Jun 19, 2006
44
116
Why is Apple refusing to concede its mistake with the removing of the Mag-Safe port? It is their own invention, and literally the most convenient feature on an expensive portable.

Whether you accept it or not, while Mag-Safe was the best implementation of its kind … it only did one thing.

The TB3 is many things while, perhaps, not the best at all.

Mag-Safe, while as great as it was, had limited tangible benefit in the overall package.

~~ Queue the guy who almost got his rMPB slaughtered at Starbucks and was saved by the Magsafe.
 

MrUNIMOG

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2014
654
424
Hamburg, Germany
Could anyone tell me if I can upgrade the RAM and/or SDD of a 15inch macbook pro AFTER being purchased? like, in an official Apple way (?)

If the non-official (user based) upgrade is possible I would like to know too.

Anybody? Please = )

As for the RAM, certainly no.

As for the flash, probably not, but we'll see. For 2016/2017 MBP, only the 13" base model without Touch Bar had the flash chips on a removable board, but who knows.
 

Mydel

macrumors 6502a
Apr 8, 2006
804
664
Sometimes here mostly there
i have no problem with Touch Bar. I find it mildly useful. Even the USB C are not a huge issue for me. What really pisses me off is lack of Mag Safe. That is something I have major issues with. If not that I am basically for the last 25 years committed to the OSX i would change the computer because of that. Also whats with horrible FaceTime camera with horrid low light performance. These days you can get 10x better for 1USD. Why cant they fix it for 7 years is beyond me.
 
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Abazigal

Contributor
Jul 18, 2011
19,576
22,045
Singapore
Why is Apple refusing to concede its mistake with the removing of the Mag-Safe port? It is their own invention, and literally the most convenient feature on an expensive portable.

I think removing MagSafe is one of those “mistakes” which has to be made. The whole point is that usb C is so versatile that it can be used for anything. MagSafe can only be used for charging. Why not replace MagSafe with another port which can be used for other purposes when not charging?
 
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TobyR

macrumors member
Jun 19, 2006
44
116
So the whole excuse of not being able to do more than 16GB when the 2016 MBP came out due to battery issues was simply solved by adding 10% battery capacity? What a load of bs.

This may come as a shock, but not all technology and efficiencies just exist off-the-shelf in order to match your expectations.
 
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TobyR

macrumors member
Jun 19, 2006
44
116
This update is making PCs look better and better to replace my 2013 15 inch MBP. The Touch Bar is simply something I do not want.

I just tried this over an 18month window that included a $4000 Threadripper.

Aside from the long renders/encoding I am still far more productive on my 2013 rMBP15
 

MrUNIMOG

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2014
654
424
Hamburg, Germany
Why is Apple refusing to concede its mistake with the removing of the Mag-Safe port? It is their own invention, and literally the most convenient feature on an expensive portable.

Mistake? You see it as mistake, I don't and Apple obviously doesn't. So why would they "concede" anything?

The ability to charge from any USB outlet, even a 5W iPhone brick if you have the time (like overnight) or an external battery, and to plug the charging cable in on either side or any of the 4 ports, adds great convenience and flexibility that certainly outweighs the advantages of MagSafe.

If you had one of these devices, you'd know that the power cable slips out very easy if you pull on it (which already saved my MBP twice just like MagSafe would've done), while any other cable or dongle sits firmly of course.

And if that's not enough, there's even a MagSafe-like adapter for USB-C so you can still have "MagSafe" if you want to. The same adapter is available for Lightning, so with that you can even use the same charging cable for Mac and iOS devices.

Basically your complaining comes down to not knowing what you're talking about... Remember, Apple usually knows better than the customer, they do things for a reason.
 

mrzz

Suspended
Mar 25, 2017
290
507
It's funny how a lot of individuals are complaining about the newly released MBP... guess the complaining will never stop - just like their debts.
they again released annoyingly limited overpriced laptop with nothing else than a regular specs bump and people shoud be screaming in joy? They screwed the great laptop in 2016 and it is not getting any better. They are even ashamed to call it new which is totally understandable.
 
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smirking

macrumors 68040
Aug 31, 2003
3,744
3,718
Silicon Valley
Whether you accept it or not, while Mag-Safe was the best implementation of its kind … it only did one thing.

I thought I'd really really miss Magsafe, but I only miss it for one reason and not for a reason I would have been able to predict. I like to sit cross legged on the floor with my laptop sometimes. You can't do that with a spike sticking out on one side so I need to use a lapdesk or only use my laptop unplugged.

I've accidentally caught my USB-C cable on something once and yanked it hard. I came out very easily, which is both a good thing and a bad thing. The ease at which the USB-C cable disconnects mitigates Magsafe as an important safety feature, but of course you now have a cable that's not as secure as you want it to be at other times.
 

notabadname

macrumors 68000
Jan 4, 2010
1,568
736
Detroit Suburbs
It's not like those of us complaining about price lack the basic understanding of how a business works...

Not every complaint about price is some expectation that the precious Apple give us **** for free. It's pretty simple. The old 13" MBP used to start around $1300, now it starts at $1800 for a current model. The old 15" started at $2000 (mine cost that in 2015). An equivalent model costs $2400. There's been a huge markup on these models compared to Apple's own pricing of the past for what many view as less functionality and usability.
Word for the day boys and girls is:

I N F L A T I O N

Can you say “inflation”.
 
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Mydel

macrumors 6502a
Apr 8, 2006
804
664
Sometimes here mostly there
Mistake? You see it as mistake, I don't and Apple obviously doesn't. So why would they "concede" anything?

The ability to charge from any USB outlet, even a 5W iPhone brick if you have the time (like overnight) or an external battery, and to plug the charging cable in on either side or any of the 4 ports, adds great convenience and flexibility that certainly outweighs the advantages of MagSafe.

If you had one of these devices, you'd know that the power cable slips out very easy if you pull on it (which already saved my MBP twice just like MagSafe would've done), while any other cable or dongle sits firmly of course.

And if that's not enough, there's even a MagSafe-like adapter for USB-C so you can still have "MagSafe" if you want to. The same adapter is available for Lightning, so with that you can even use the same charging cable for Mac and iOS devices.

Basically your complaining comes down to not knowing what you're talking about... Remember, Apple usually knows better than the customer, they do things for a reason.

Haha. Funny you....Clearly you just writing for writing
 
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MrUNIMOG

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2014
654
424
Hamburg, Germany
Two things:

1. The lack of a refresh on the non-touchbar model of 13" MacBook Pro (when there's most definitely an 8th Gen Intel Core i series part that would otherwise be appropriate for it) is definitely telling. I would imagine that probably means that Apple is going to do something else to merge this machine and the current MacBook Air into something else that otherwise serves the same target market audience rather than continuing this model as the true successor to the MacBook Air as they had heavily implied they would during the October 2016 keynote where the body redesign was first unveiled.

No. There's definitely no appropriate 8th gen chip available for it. All new 15W chips have GT2 graphics only (think 12" MacBook), which would be a huge downgrade from the GT3e Iris 640.

Otherwise, I agree with your conclusion that the non-tauchbar model might be replaced entirely this fall together with the MacBook Air, maybe by some 13" MacBook-ish device. Still there first need to be appropriate chips available, because same goes for the 12" MacBook, no 8th gen Y-series chips yet..
 
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TobyR

macrumors member
Jun 19, 2006
44
116
Can I just say that USB-C only ports are STILL a huge pain in the arse even in 2018. That was and still is a terrible idea. Still waiting for the rest of the world to catch up Apple? Oh wait, no one wants to. They are all smarter, and gradually added it ALONG with the ports people actually use today.

When you are involved with technology long enough you start to see this was always the case.

The spasms and hysteria that occurred when the iMac was released without a floppy drive and no serial port was unmeasurable. There was only 1 printer, the Epson 740. Cataclysmic.

9 months later you were either perpetually bitter or moved on and realized it really was better without.

Apple never looked back. Me, lesson learned.
 

trifid

macrumors 68020
May 10, 2011
2,070
4,945
This may come as a shock, but not all technology and efficiencies just exist off-the-shelf in order to match your expectations.

All I’m saying is Apple’s excuse back in 2016 was BS and we now see all it needed was 10% more battery. If there’s anything specific that I’m missing please state facts, I’d like to know.
 

ocnitsa

macrumors 6502a
Jan 24, 2011
504
949
It's not like people are complaining the new model isn't thin enough or that the battery life with the 32GB RAM version is too crappy. A lot of the complaints here people have been making all along...I think Apple's responded to those that it is willing to respond to (for example, the 32GB RAM issue) and ignored those it's decided it's moved past (magsafe, legacy ports, etc.).

I think the upgrade is a good compromise but would have been more competitive a few months ago (pricewise)...

Dell's XPS 15 offers what I assume is the same i9, with 32GB of RAM and a 1 TB SSD (better graphics and screen) at 2899 vs Apple at 3899. That's quite a premium...I tend to agree that Apple has better build quality, but that's questionable if the keyboard is not adequately addressed (hopefully, it is). Dell was pushing 3000 for that build when it came out, but it's gone down since. I imagine Apple will knock a couple of hundred off the price in several months when the refurbs are available. I know the Dell has a thermal issue, but I'm more confident I could address that via repasting and adding thermal pads per user guides online than the same issue, if it's present, in the MBP.

I think this refresh is clarifying...like I said above, it's made it crystal clear what Apple is willing to compromise on and not...I think it offers a better picture to some whether or not to stick in the Apple camp.

Personally, I'm going to wait a few months and see how the keyboard does in the wild...Maybe wait till next early next year and see what the next gen line of PC gaming laptops looks like...MSI, Dell, Gigabyte, and ASUS have all made some interesting machines at reasonable prices. Apple's refresh is right on the cusp for me...which I guess is good news, considering that I was pretty sure I was jumping ship based on what I presumed the new update to be.

Oh well...Just read on CNET that Apple told them the 3rd gen keyboard doesn't do anything to address the sticky/stuck key issue.
 
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