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Your saying “typically a S release includes things like a new camera, and we see none of that in the XS”.

But the iPhone XS does a have a new camera system from the iPhone X.

Am I miss reading your comment?
It isn’t a new camera system. It’s the same dual 12mp camera setup with F1.8 aperture on one and F2.4 on the other with 2XL zoom.
The only thing that changed is in the software.
 
Interms of bang for the buck, the XR is the best value proposition.
You get the internals of the XS/XS max (single camera though).
The screen may not be OLED, but it's larger than the XS.
The big value is the price is $250 cheaper that the other two.
The XR comes in more colors.

So a 256GB XR costs $899 and a 64GB XS costs $999 with 256GB it costs $1149.
I have an Essential PH-1 and the only phone that I see buying in the next year is another Essential, if they make and update (I said if). or an XR. The dual-SIM capability has me interested. I have a work iPhone and my personal Essential.
One phone with both numbers is appealing.

More than $1000 for a phone isn't going to happen if I'm paying.

Well said. An Android phone is not an option for me anymore as I had a S8 before and it’s cumbersome to transfer files between my MacBook, apps like AirDroid and Smart Switch are good but sometimes crash and are laggy for some unknown reason. Sold it and went back to my SE, works like a dream with Airdrop. Also I use notes quite often and the continuity between my iPhone and MacBook is second to none. That’s what it is all about IMO, nothing comes close to the Apple’s ecosystem.
 
I don't play games on a iPhone, use iPad Pro if I ever play any games but rarely. Again, safari on landscape is unusable for me due to the display not being to wide. Always on portrait. The only time I would find use for Touch ID to work landscape is for when I connect my iPhone to DJI mavic air remote. It the screen goes to sleep while on remote I have to rotate it. But that is quite rare. So yeah, it doesn't bother me. But it would, if it was on iPad and it only worked on portrait. By default I always use iPad Pro on landscape.

that's fine, i'm just saying that's why people are asking for landscape face ID since it's needed in common use cases.
 
It isn’t a new camera system. It’s the same dual 12mp camera setup with F1.8 aperture on one and F2.4 on the other with 2XL zoom.
The only thing that changed is in the software.
It’s new camera hardware on the wide angle camera with larger pixels (1.4µm versus 1.22µm on the X) to match the Pixel 2. That alone should make a big difference in low light photos even before the software enters into the equation.
 
Apple has said countless time they're not unifying iOS / macOS

So what? Did anyone really believe they'd ever switch to Intel chips? I certainly would expect them to deny it at this point. They clearly aren't there yet. I also don't believe that iOS and MacOS will be unified. So perhaps they're being truthful. I think iOS will replace MacOS on the desktop, but with a desktop UI. Marzipan is the first step. It's still years away but I have no doubt in my mind that we'll see iOS on the desktop running on hardware powered by A-series chips.
 
When the "replacement" of the SE which is a 4" "small" phone has to be compared to a S9, you know the argument is going nowhere.
If you are not trying to defend the argument of the XR is a replacement for SE, I am not even sure what are you trying to point out anymore.
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Touch ID alone is a huge change already.
Additionally, the change from 32bit to 64bit is another.

That doesn’t make any sense.

Your claim that Apple is releasing overpriced phones is false.

Market dictates whether a product is overpriced or underpriced based on demand, not some arbitrary metrics imposed by random posters on the internet.

At 5% of total active iPhones, the se hasn’t been replaced by anything, it’s just been discontinued due to lack of demand.

Xr replaces the 8 series of devices.

Se is a moniker Apple used in the past to give a product line one final send off, such as the iMac se.

don’t expect a replacement.
 
No argument that Apple pioneered many concepts that was brought to the masses, but I consider the 80's a failed decade for them. That was all because of the internal fighting going on between Sculley, the board, Woz and Jobs IMO. There was no clear direction for any of the departments, and it just got worse after Jobs was fired. In fact, there was zero innovation (again IMO) after 1986, until Jobs was brought back.

I wouldn't go so far as to call it failed, but I can appreciate why you'd feel that way. I also wouldn't say there was zero innovation before Jobs returned. When the PowerBook launched, it was quite an impressive laptop design compared to the PC competition. OpenDoc was quite innovative, even if it never quite worked right. But yes, Jobs took the innovation with him when he left. NeXT was very innovative. Never financially successful, but highly innovative.
 
Touch ID alone is a huge change already.
Additionally, the change from 32bit to 64bit is another.
TouchID is the only change that makes the 5s upgrade really different from the Xs upgrade. The most important new feature of the 3GS was speed, Siri for the 4s, 3D Touch for the 6s, and the 7 got waterproofing and the 8 got inductive charging.

The Xs lucks out because it just happens to have only improved features but no new ones. But it has, for example, for the first time since the iPhone 5s a larger (main) camera sensor. And overall I counted about 15 improvements which compares well with previous 's' cycles.
 
Apple is playing catch up as in better software and hardware than the competition? They basically been a step in front of the competition since 2013. I guess it’s the way it’s viewed but I’m staying because of the software and hardware.
What? Which universe do you live in? The features that the iPhone keeps getting last couple of years have always lagged 6 months to 1 year behind the competition. Don't get me started on OLED screens and wireless charging because those two are just the tip of the icerberg sadly.
 
In this case it is a shame that mainly China and India markets have determined that "cheaper" big screened iPhones have become so important. Otherwise I am sure apple would have released a high end 5.2 inch oled iPhone x with single cam for 750 us, together with the regular 5.8 for 950 and the new 6.5 max for 1050, and , for the Chinese people on a budget, reduce the 7/8 and 7/8 plus a little more on price.

That line up would have made a lot more sense.(for me, it is a personal preference, of course)
 
What? Which universe do you live in? The features that the iPhone keeps getting last couple of years have always lagged 6 months to 1 year behind the competition. Don't get me started on OLED screens and wireless charging because those two are just the tip of the icerberg sadly.

7nm soc with an 8core npu, nvme storage, 3d facial biometrics.

That’s the universe he lives in.

Apple adopted oled technology as the tech matured and capacity can finally keep up with apples demands.

They had to license the same oled technology that Samsung licenses.
 
I have the X and I’m upgrading to the Xs Max, however if I was to buy the smaller form factor I’d go for the Xr over the Xs.

If you can elaborate:
  • What functions on the new phone makes you want to upgrade?
  • How do you expect to carry the phone? Pocket? Inner jacket?
I am sincerely interested.
 
In this case it is a shame that mainly China and India markets have determined that "cheaper" big screened iPhones have become so important. Otherwise I am sure apple would have released a high end 5.2 inch oled iPhone x with single cam for 750 us, together with the regular 5.8 for 950 and the new 6.5 max for 1050, and , for the Chinese people on a budget, reduce the 7/8 and 7/8 plus a little more on price.

That line up would have made a lot more sense.(for me, it is a personal preference, of course)

Apple is not targeting India for sure with XR. XR 64 GB costs very close to Note 9 512 GB with bigger, better screen and with bigger RAM etc....India is NOT at all a market for Apple as far as iPhones are concerned.
 
What? Which universe do you live in? The features that the iPhone keeps getting last couple of years have always lagged 6 months to 1 year behind the competition. Don't get me started on OLED screens and wireless charging because those two are just the tip of the icerberg sadly.
Apple designs the best hardware. So it depends on what your considerations for is the best. Apple calibrated lcds best out oled for color accuracy. A lot of this type of thinking is one dimensional, as the people who really believe this think oled must be the best.
 
That doesn’t make any sense.

Your claim that Apple is releasing overpriced phones is false.

Market dictates whether a product is overpriced or underpriced based on demand, not some arbitrary metrics imposed by random posters on the internet.

At 5% of total active iPhones, the se hasn’t been replaced by anything, it’s just been discontinued due to lack of demand.

Xr replaces the 8 series of devices.

Se is a moniker Apple used in the past to give a product line one final send off, such as the iMac se.

don’t expect a replacement.
Where did you get the 5% number?
 
Not only does it have a new camera sensor and image signal processor, it also has a new 4x4 MIMO LTE gigabit class radio. Recent tests on US carriers show XS download speeds are doubled and upload speeds are increased by 50% over last year’s X. It’s a great S year improvement; this alone makes the XS worth the upgrade, even if you already have a X.

View attachment 783085

Why is this useful? I’ve never once found myself with an LTE connection and thought “gee, this connection is so slow. How will i ever download this multi gigabyte file to my phone.” What are people doing with their phones that they would even tell the difference other than by launching a speedtest app?
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Your saying “typically a S release includes things like a new camera, and we see none of that in the XS”.

But the iPhone XS does a have a new camera system from the iPhone X.

Am I miss reading your comment?

The only difference is the wide angle lens has a bigger sensor. While this is nice, it’s a minor change compared to prior S-year camera changes, for sure.
 
I'm temped to upgrade my Series 3 to 4. But for the iPhone, I'll keep my 7+ for another year and then wait a bit longer when carriers bring the BOGO program. Honestly, I can't justify paying the price of an Apple laptop for an iPhone. Just too much.
Updating iPhones every 3 years seems to be the right move. I used to do every two years but with prices going up and up it's too much.


This is where I’m at too.
 
Why is this useful? I’ve never once found myself with an LTE connection and thought “gee, this connection is so slow. How will i ever download this multi gigabyte file to my phone.” What are people doing with their phones that they would even tell the difference other than by launching a speedtest app?
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The only difference is the wide angle lens has a bigger sensor. While this is nice, it’s a minor change compared to prior S-year camera changes, for sure.

To brag that they have the latest. It’s only certain people though. In another thread, a poster said the main reason to upgrade is to not be on year old tech. There are probably a lot of people like them and also a lot of people unlike them.

To each their own.

Studies have shown most people hold onto their iPhones for more than a year and don’t care about things that don’t add practical value
 
It isn’t a new camera system. It’s the same dual 12mp camera setup with F1.8 aperture on one and F2.4 on the other with 2XL zoom.
The only thing that changed is in the software.

Not true, the Xs and Xs Max have new sensors, processors, and new algorithms(software). It still has the same F stops, but with new larger sensors, that makes it a new camera. https://www.apple.com/iphone-xs/cameras/ its in the first paragraph on that page. Its also mentioned in the keynote at 1:07
 
So what? Did anyone really believe they'd ever switch to Intel chips? I certainly would expect them to deny it at this point. They clearly aren't there yet. I also don't believe that iOS and MacOS will be unified. So perhaps they're being truthful. I think iOS will replace MacOS on the desktop, but with a desktop UI. Marzipan is the first step. It's still years away but I have no doubt in my mind that we'll see iOS on the desktop running on hardware powered by A-series chips.

Well, only time will tell but if you're right it'll make the old Mac guard really uncomfortable
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Apple is not targeting India for sure with XR. XR 64 GB costs very close to Note 9 512 GB with bigger, better screen and with bigger RAM etc....India is NOT at all a market for Apple as far as iPhones are concerned.

Not yet but Tim Cook has said many times they're taking the long view with respect to India so it definitely is an important market for them especially if Apple wants to grow unit shares and their user base.
 
How many people do you know that upgrade yearly and how many do you know that upgrade on a longer cycle?

There is also this overview that estimates the average lifespan of all Apple devices (incl. Macs) to be almost four years. The average lifespan of Macs will naturally be longer than that of iOS devices but since iOS devices sell in the order of ten times more than Macs, the average lifespan of iOS devices will be relatively close to to that number. Of course, this includes devices resold or gifted on the used market and thus doesn't prove anything but I think it is an indicator that the vast majority doesn't upgrade yearly.

90% of my circle upgrades once a year. Some switch back and forth with Samsung. Some own both. That is not a good link to support the previous opinion.
 
On T-Mobiles site, the iPhones were still really available to ship by the 21st as of yesterday. Haven't checked since then.
I’ve seen more Apple watches being sold than the XS through my T-Mobile stores. The XS Max is selling really well though.

While this is a microcosm of all sales, it’s still really telling that the analysts are correct... the XS is not selling well. Until Apple pulls the X from sales channels, the XS won’t sell well. If you all of a sudden see the X completely dropped from sales channels within the next month or two, you know the XS is doing really bad.
 
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