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Leaked EU Document Could Spell Major Changes for App Store, Messages, FaceTime, Browsers, and Siri

Stunning_Sense4712 said:
I doubt they will make a serperate operating systems just for the EU since that would cost Apple more money and could delay critcal security updates if a zero day vulnerability is discovered in the wild.
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Not separate per se, but one stripped of all but the most basic OS services. Basically, it comes with the Phone app, and a time-limited browser app for installing other apps. It would be up to the user in the EU to install apps for each service they wish to use.

In other markets, Apple would continue to bundle their built-in apps, along with the App Store.
 
I don’t think Apple can withdraw from the EU, as Apple still serves services to existing iPhone users and that may fall under the law if they push out any update to EU iPhones. Kind of like how Disney cannot just move an entire 4 parks elsewhere.
 
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Appleman3546 said:
I don’t think Apple can withdraw from the EU, as Apple still serves services to existing iPhone users and that may fall under the law if they push out any update to EU iPhones. Kind of like how Disney cannot just move an entire 4 parks elsewhere.
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You’re probably not wrong.

But if Apple could pursue every legal avenue to vacate the EU, they should do it. The legality behind making a transition away from such a large entity, isn’t that easy. Apple has my full support and backing to leave as soon as possible to avoid such unnecessary drama.
 
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jakey rolling said:
That certainly is a difference. Too bad that there aren't any industry-standard encryption algorithms that the brilliant minds in Apple, Google, and Microsoft's software development departments could use as a starting point for solving that seemingly impossible puzzle.
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Why should they? There are several different apps that offer end-to-end encryption that run on multiple platforms. It would be simpler to disable iMessage in the EU and have the built-in app just use SMS. Users can then install WhatsApp, Signal, or any of the other available messaging apps.
 
Appleman3546 said:
I don’t think Apple can withdraw from the EU, as Apple still serves services to existing iPhone users and that may fall under the law if they push out any update to EU iPhones. Kind of like how Disney cannot just move an entire 4 parks elsewhere.
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They couldn’t, and if they try they would get fined to hell. US and EU has agreements which allows to be sued cross continent and also to confiscate, just like with Dieselgate.
 
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russell_314 said:
No if a product is it for you then you should not be able to force the company to design that product for you. I like the Ford Mustang but it’s not four wheel drive. Should I force Ford to make a four wheel drive version? Buy the product that suits your needs. If you want a phone that’s a wall garden then that’s the iPhone but if you want an open operating system then that’s android.

Forcing Apple to change iOS to make it like android with all of its problems and downsides is only hurting people that use iOS. Of course there are a lot of people that really dislike Apple products here and they would love to see that happen. It’s unfortunate to see that level of negativity.
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Governments force automakers to install features all the time, from ABS to three-point seatbelts, airbags, child-proof door locks, emissions standards, etc; drivers are required to use snow-tires or install chains in many jurisdictions, others require safety-kits, spare tires, high-vis vests, etc. Considering four-wheel drive is a safety advantage, it’s pretty far from outlandish to imagine a government requiring it on new cars sold sometime in the future, just like anti-lock brakes went from an add-on feature to requirement in many jurisdictions. We already live in the world you so fear, and it seems automakers have survived just fine.
 
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bcortens said:
I just wish they had reined in some of the crazy parts, it makes them look silly when they want to require (for example) third party voice assistants because that will require a fundamental rethink in the way Apps are allowed to communicate on iOS and/or require Apple to build some sort of universal voice assistant API.
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I don't need Facebook and Instagram listening to my phone conversations without my permission.
 
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AdonisSMU said:
they didn't do this with the auto industry because that would mean EU companies would be negatively impacted.
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Yeah sure, dream on…
We might see Tim Cook jailed if they continue trying to bend the law like this.

amp.dw.com

US to extradite ex-VW executive to Germany – DW – 07/17/2020

Oliver Schmidt was sentenced to seven years in prison for his role in VW's emissions cheating scandal. Germany will now be responsible for enforcing the remainder of his sentence.
amp.dw.com amp.dw.com
 
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robco74 said:
Safety and public health are quite different from convenience.
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Your argument basically is the government can not regulate unless it is a safety and public health issue. I am sure corporations would love those limits so they can do everything they want without any limits by arguing that it is not a safety or public health issue.
 
dan.jones said:
The problem with the overreaching EU laws is that it actually hurts the user in the long run. Apps get built with malicious code, user gets tricked into installing them, complains about Apple.

The other thing that baffles me is Apple created the OS and the EU are expecting it to be a free and open house for anyone to do what they want with. You wouldn’t expect the company that owns a shopping mall to allow other businesses to set up in there for free. Because this is what the expectation is here for software.
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Or just cancel iPhone in the EU for the time being or create something separate for them. Then when it ultimately doesn't work out as well as everyone thought they'll be back.
 
Stunning_Sense4712 said:
Your argument basically is the government can not regulate unless it is a safety and public health issue. I am sure corporations would love those limits so they can do everything they want without any limits by arguing that it is not a safety or public health issue.
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There are other reasons for regulation. The fact that some people think a company charges too much for their product isn't one of them. Sure, there are exceptions, such as private utilities, but I don't see a compelling reason to regulate in this instance. If people are unhappy with Apple's products and services, there are alternatives. There is no harm to redress.

I will add that there are safety regulations that Apple, and other OEMs do follow to ensure devices can be operated safely.
 
Realityck said:
Valid point, I just like for the tech industry to me less vulnerable to whims of the EU, so that you could do precisely what you mentioned, but not have Apple and Google having to placate government servants of other countries seeking ownership of technology they had no role in its creation. That was the basis of using computers over phones when you start to see this EU activity happen.
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The unfortunate part of being a global conglomerate is that you have varying diverse countries with different political systems and legal frameworks in which to navigate. There is certainly a simple solution to this problem - Apple and Google can easily just decide to exit that market. Nobody is forcing them to sell phones or services in the EU. If they choose to continue to sell into that market, they will have to respect the rules put in place by that market. Just as every other international corporation has to.

Also, don't kid yourself. There is a lot of technology that originated in the EU that made its way into what eventually became Smartphones. Neither Apple nor Google invented these things out of thin air.
 
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"Ladies and Gentleman, I present to you: Europhone."

Whatever people thought they wanted from Apple, they'll need to be prepared to wait while Apple redirects engineering resources toward gratifying the crazed musings of Government.
 
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Quu said:
Again I have to bring up the hugely successful macOS which allows third party stores and sideloading. Weirdly the earth is still here as is the Mac in perfect working order.

Your analogy about Ford is very flawed. The government does mandate cars have seatbelts and companies like Ford fought against those kind of regulations based on all kinds of reasons from cost to design and appearance.

The government of the EU also has laws about how the front bonnets of vehicles are shaped again for public safety. They also have rules about size and weight, emissions, the materials the vehicle can use (for instance the banning of lead based paints).

The car is probably the most regulated consumer product you can purchase with literally thousands of rules that automakers must adhere to and not just for public safety but also for competition reasons.
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The iPhone knows everywhere you've been and what banks you use and what you've said to friends and family etc... I imagine if you use Siri it knows most of your conversations. Be careful what you wish for. I think the EU regulators are well intentioned but woefully misinformed of the risks involved in what they are proposing.
 
Wildkraut said:
Yeah sure, dream on…
We might see Tim Cook jailed if they continue trying to bend the law like this.

amp.dw.com

US to extradite ex-VW executive to Germany – DW – 07/17/2020

Oliver Schmidt was sentenced to seven years in prison for his role in VW's emissions cheating scandal. Germany will now be responsible for enforcing the remainder of his sentence.
amp.dw.com amp.dw.com
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What does the VW lying to the public about safety have to do with being overregulated? Absolutely nothing at all. Try again.

EU is not making VW use the same parts as Ford and Toyota "because competition". Keep in mind that such regulations further stifle innovation especially when a better tech than USB-C comes along. EU is also not regulating that the apis for the vehicle need to be compatible so 3rd parties can install software on the vehicle operating system. The phone knows more about you than any other computer and should be locked down as such.
 
jjpiv said:
If GDPR serves as an indication, this is going to turn into a horrible mess. I have no doubt the EU is well-intentioned, but that doesn’t make what they’re planning a good idea. The change to browser engine requirements is a good move, but everything else seems half-baked. Are they of the position that no company should have a competitive advantage with the products and services they offer?
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Even the browser move us flawed. Apple requires this for a reason. Security is broken as soon as google is allowed to put a server on your phone. Safari support will become non existent and then we will be at a new Explorer crossroad.

Apple being dependent on 3rd party browsers to access most features on the internet but those 3rd parties holding back development on Apple devices for competitive advantage.
 
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AdonisSMU said:
The iPhone knows everywhere you've been and what banks you use and what you've said to friends and family etc... I imagine if you use Siri it knows most of your conversations. Be careful what you wish for. I think the EU regulators are well intentioned but woefully misinformed of the risks involved in what they are proposing.
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Every assistant does the same, Apple does less the Amazon or Google. But hey go ahead and download joes assistant app and see how well that works out
 
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