Leopard Previewed

[bwanac]

Nothing impressive really... top secrets should be good.

Time Machine is ok. It looks awful for an Apple product, what is up with that background? Ugly. And I really want to know how much disk space it will be taking backing everything up constantly. I would most likely turn it off.

 

[Zmmyt]

Nothing impressive really... top secrets should be good.

Time Machine is ok. It looks awful for an Apple product, what is up with that background? Ugly.

I totally agree, it looked quite ugly.

 

[Renegate]

I don't know what there is to be underwhelmed about; the rumor has basically been that the main things being covered here would be the Mac Pro (which exceeded my expectations) and the first real glimpse at Leopard (which looks very cool from what I've seen). I didn't find either the Mac Pro or Leopard to be underwhelming, so I don't see anything that would make me feel underwhelmed.

I guess I would be underwhelmed if I had mistaken WWDC for Macworld or something, and expected a bunch of major new product announcements.

And don't forget they said : More things to be announced next week

 

[Jimmieboy]

Yahoo! Leopard looks awesome! Time machine looks like a lifesaver for me and spaces makes life so much easier. THANKS STEVE!

 

[hansen]

WOW, leopard looks so promising

Time machine and mail enhancements with notes and to-do's would make it all worthwhile for me. I was actually working on to-do's from mail myself as I needed it so bad. Time machine looks like the best solution to the backup/versioning problem I've ever seen. Wow, again! Can't wait.

 

[bigwig]

I wonder if Time Machine will work correctly with FileVault? Saving file alterations to an unencrypted backup defeats the purpose of using FileVault in the first place.

 

[rayz]

From the Apple website...

Backup Disk: Change the drive or volume you’re backing up to. Or back up to a Mac OS X server computer.

Ouch .... 😱

 

[ZoomZoomZoom]

Time Machine looks to be one of those things you never use, but then one day you'll need to use it and you'll be really glad it's here. I don't like the stars and stuff in the background, though. So tacky.

I'm really interested about Spaces. I constantly have loads of windows/applications running around, and having something to manage it all would be awesome.

The new iChat features look very promising. Can't really say the same for Mail/Dashboard/iCal/Spotlight, though - not too impressed with those. Whatever is top secret had better blow all of this stuff out of the water, or else I wouldn't call Leopard "Vista 2.0".

 

[rayz]

Time Machine: the attempts to say this was done before with VMS, System Restore or Shadow Copy are pathetic, and those who made the comparison should be ashamed of themselves. Of course it isn't a completely new idea: it's been something that people have wanted to do for years. As far as I can see, Apple is the company that first demonstrated a practical version of this feature that an ordinary person could use. I predict that Microsoft's implementation will be a complicated mess that regular users find opaque and will not use (just like System Restore is).

Er ... you right click on the file, select properties, and then just click on the previous versions tab.

MS has actually put it where most people expect to find it; I thought they might put it on the actual right-click menu, but I honestly don't think that it's going to get used enough for folk to want to have it in their face all the time.

Oh, and MS doesn't need a separate drive for it to work. If the Apple Time Machine ( 🙄 ) really does need a separate drive, then it sounds as if Apple has probably just skinned a version control system it pulled from the open source world.

 

[rayz]

Well I for one was kind of disappointed. Leopard is sort of Apple's chance to prove they can out-Vista Vista, and I'm not really sure what we saw today does it. I've been following Vista somewhat closely, and it really does catch Windows up to OS X in terms of features and prettiness.

I really think most of the features shown off today are already present in Windows (I've definitely heard about all of them before) or will be in Vista, and it's too bad Apple didn't have anything truly innovative to show us. Hopefully those secret features are something good...

The other thing that has me a little concerned is the huge amount of Vista-bashing that went on. I feel like if Leopard at this point were truly better than Vista, they'd be silent about Vista entirely and let the new system speak for itself. That would be really slick. That's not what happened however, and instead there was a lot of "look what Vista copied from us" and "check out how much better Leopard is." What I saw today, though, makes the former statement sound whiney and the latter sound foolish, since in my eyes, in terms of features, they're about on-par with each other.

I really hope Apple pulls it together. They've got to do this right, because come next year, most of the myriad reasons for switching to a Mac will be nullified by Vista.

BTW: whoever this "Platform Experience" guy is, get him off the stage and go back to Steve.

Have to agree with you on just about everything. If MS tried to release something like this, as anything other than a service pack, their user base would (quite rightly) crucify them.

The TimeMachine mirrors the same functionality that was announced for Vista about a week ago, and everything else is an upgrade rather than anything really new. I was expecting more from the desktop switching, but I have a feeling that will look much different when it's actually released.

But since there is some other stuff planned, then it's best to wait and see what they come up with, before declaring it a dud.

Looks like a nice solid revision so far, but not much else.

.. and given the universal unpopularity of Microsoft's Flip3D interface, I was surprised to see it showing up in the UI for TimeMachine.

 

[Bern]

Well I'm excited about Leopard and look forward to it's release. Rightly so should Apple keep hushed about what ever new features are to be added. Those nay sayers out there to Leopard should wait until they use it before they begin crucifying it, after all what hand did they have in the development of OS X??

Only thing that plays on my mind is whether some new features will be limited to Pro line Macs. I recall when Dashboard first came about iBooks couldn't display the ripple effect for example whereas Powerbooks could. I certainly hope we MacBook owners won't suffer the same fate with things like the new iChat, Mail or what ever.

 

[joseph2166]

I cant see how leopard has NOT out vista-ed vista: OSX was allready better than vista will be and these new and updated features merely underline it. I would go on about how great it all is but im using a french keyboard and all the letters are in the wrong place - its not a qwerty keyboard but a azerty... crazy...

 

[Dunepilot]

I'm glad that Leopard will be completely (that's what they say, at least) 64-bit. I'm not sure why it's important to go on about the applications as if they were important to the operating system itself. Increased integration like what was displayed would cause the anti-trust machine to whip into action, if it was Microsoft instead of Apple.

Time Machine is not exactly revolutionary, considering that there were a few 3rd party products available--Rewind comes to mind--that journaled changes and allowed them to be restored. Still, it should stop the various threads "I accidentally deleted..." 🙂

Hopefully, the features not mentioned will include a better kernel that actually performs well. It would be nice to see operating system benchmarks that don't make me cringe when I look at the Mac OS X results.

Xcode version 3.0 looks good but they still haven't provided many details.

Yeah, my first thought was - oh yeah, that's just like Rewind. However, the poweronsoftware.com website now forwards to http://www.nowsoftware.com/, so maybe Rewind has been bought out by Apple to use as Time Machine. Anyone know any more about this?

Dune

 

[JFreak]

Looks like this will be a significant upgrade. Tiger was not what it was promised to be, in my eyes at least, so now I'm thinking they have finally made it better than Panther.

Let's see...

 

[JonD25]

This may have already been discussed somewhere, but the vast amount of threads on all the new Leopard stuff and the 10 pages of this thread are a bit to search through, so just ignore me if someone already brought it up.

Did anyone notice the new iChat got rid of the brushed metal? One of the things I was dissapointed to not see was the talk about an improved/different UI, particularly the banishment of brushed metal. Could this be a preview of that fact? Perhaps part of the "top secret" features to come?

 

[weg]

heh... they give MS so much crap for photocopying, but if anything, this is more or less taking a page out of MS's book with System Restore. Granted, it looks like it will be better, but still, MS had this kind of thing first.

Not trolling, just pointing it out 🙂

This is in line with their other "innovations":

Spaces? Wow. A blatant Desktop Manager rip-off, and Linux supports virtual desktops since 20 years.

Multiuser support for iCal? I'm sure Microsoft will copy that immediately.. oh, wait... Outlook supports that since years.

Time Machine? This feature is overly complicated.. nothing but a fancy undo option. Lots of eye candy.

 

[BGil]

Have to agree with you on just about everything. If MS tried to release something like this, as anything other than a service pack, their user base would (quite rightly) crucify them.

The TimeMachine mirrors the same functionality that was announced for Vista about a week ago,

It's kinda unfair to say Microsoft just announced PreviousDocs/Shadow Copy "about a week ago" because it's been in every build for the last year.
Winsupersite on build 5219:
Windows Vista build 5219 also includes an integrated Shadow Copy client, which you manage from the Shadow Copies tab of the Properties dialog for your hard drive (Figure). This feature, which first originated in Windows Server 2003, lets you cache older versions of data files so that you can recover information in the event of an error. So if you overwrite a critical file, or inadvertently change part of a document, you can "go back in time" and access older versions.

Let's see how this works. First, you need to enable Shadow Copies from the aforementioned dialog. Then, after you've mucked up a file, you can access its Properties dialog in Explorer and navigate to the Previous Versions pane (Figure). Here, you can select between various different versions of the document (and your time travel experience is complete). This is a great feature, and I'm glad to see it being added to the Windows client.

http://www.winsupersite.com/images/reviews/vista-5219-review-26.jpg
http://www.winsupersite.com/images/reviews/vista-5219-review-25.jpg

That build was released in September of 2005.
http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/winvista_5219.asp

Even before that Bob Muglia, who head the Longhorn Server project, said it would be integrated into NTFS.
MS also ships a shadow copy client for XP.

If anything, Apple has known about Previous Docs for over a year now.

 

[nostrum]

Pretty underwhelmed by Leopard to be honest. Time Machine looks like the best new feature, but i doubt that I'll even use it that much. But does it really matter? OS X is the best OS out there, its still a significantly better than anything MS can produce. Its stable, doesn't crash, freeze, lock up. Its secure. It does everything you want without the hassle you get from XP. In truth it doesn't even need to be updated. It works and thats the most important thing to me as a user.

I'm happy with Tiger and unless there's something significant that will be in Leopard, i doubt that I'll upgrade unless I get a new Intel Mac.

 

[rolandf]

Vista out Apple

I just went through my older posts, concerning Apple's strategy and future, e.g. the role of Vista. I still think, what I said several month ago is still an issue. Having seen Leopard as it stands is not very promising for Apple's future.

Let me remember you, that some of the key people at Apple left the company! In the posts there has been "monolithic kernel" and "NEXT" bashing.


Question: Did they improve the kernel?
Question: How much will the integration / interoperability be with Unix / Linux?
Question: Is there still a future for the Open Source community, or is Leopard just making OS X more proprietary?
Question: Are they continuing to water down their PRO Apps, intermingling it with the OS and making everything more childish?
Question: Is this OS 10.5 usable for a tablet PC? How strong are features like handwriting and speech recognition? (Remember, we are approaching 2010!)
Question: Will they still continue to make the UI more heterogeneous and disorganised, this mix of unmotivated 3D, lack of resolution independence, for every single task a separate application etc.
Question: Virtualisation is a standard for many OS's in the Unix world. A company that sells servers, should be comfortable with that.
Question: How efficient will the OS be, given the arrival of multi-core processors, e.g. quad etc.?

But as it seems, OS X still lives from the legacy, from the NEXT computer that quantum leap in computer history and meanwhile MS with Vista just improved a lot the feel and look, so as others also remarked it, the need to switch to Mac is not given for an everyday user.

Apple conveys to me the image of a company working on too many things at the same time, loosing focus, innovation and good people. Further since the Intel switch even the motivation to further push the design of the hardware did not happen, and the "products we wanted to build, but could not" did not appear.

Will at least the Playstation 3 be the highlight of the year and the direction for the future?

 

[jackc]

I hope there's been a significant overhaul in Spotlight, beyond what Steve hinted at already. There was no video demo on the website, so hopefully that's the case. It was a really underdeveloped feature in Tiger.

 

[Squire]

Okay, after reading the ten pages, here are my thoughts:

I think one of the biggest things is the iChat remote desktop functionality. I have long been wanting very basic Apple Remote Desktop abilities in OS X. It is the perfect way to help a friend or family member troubleshoot a computer problem or teach them how to do a particular task.

Now, it seems, in iChat, all they have to do is share their screen, and you can take over! (If I am reading the description correctly!)

This is huge, in my opinion. I even considered buying Remote Desktop last year to help my computer-challenged family members with certain issues. Excellent-- yet totally unexpected-- development. (Strange that they didn't demo this feature during the keynote, though.)

Oh yeah, Time Machine is cool.

And this is the other biggie for me. Idiot proof and, in my opinion, truly necessary. Sure, you hope you'll never need it but it's the same with insurance. (And to those whining about the space theme, don't worry. Someone-- either Apple or a 3rd party developer-- will make it so the theme can be changed. Personally, I like it.)

http://www.apple.com/macosx/leopard/accessibility.html

From this site:

Closed captioning
QuickTime currently supports closed captioning by including a text track alongside audio and video content. But improved QuickTime support will automatically display the CEA-608 closed captioning text standard in analog broadcasts in the U.S.

-----

Anyone think this means support for Closed Captioning in iTunes video downloads? As a hearing-impaired Mac-User, the lack of subtitles/captions in the TV shows is the one thing keeping me from buying a bunch of them. I hope they address this issue soon...

Good point. I would love that if they ever decided to make TV shows available to those outside the US.

* Mail: The advancements are welcome. I, also, send emails to myself all the time. Good idea.

* Spaces: Well, not a huge feature for me. I think Expose does a good enough job.

* Dashboard: I like the web clip thing.

* Spotlight: Not much new there for my use.

* iCal: I never use it but now that the To Do list option is there, I might.

* Accessibility: I think the new voice is more important than some may think. Having an OS voice that sounds, well, real, might have some interesting applications.

* 64-bit: Depends on apps, doesn't it?

* Core Animation: Now, is this something the average Joe can utilize or is it for pros? Looks cool, nonetheless.

Enhanced iChat: Nifty new features, but here's the deal: Apple needs to look beyond Cupertino and survey the IM landscape that exists outside of the US, because it's huge. Most PC-using kids and twenty-somethings overseas live and breath and depend on two kinds of software, an internet browser and an IM client. Overseas, Yahoo and MS Messenger are all that's used and the features that are provided by those clients are heavily depended upon by the overseas youth culture because they were born and raised on that stuff. If iChat (or any other client) at a minimum can't provide support for Yahoo and MS Messenger protocols with absolute one for one feature parity with PC's, you can forget about selling a Mac (or at least the Mac OS) to these kids, because it's just an absolute deal-killer without IM support that they are used to. The IM culture overseas is just that big, that integrated, and they (along with their IM friends) don't use AOL and they don't use .Mac and they aren't going to. The IM scene overseas and it's dependence on MS Messenger and Yahoo is practically a youth culture in and of itself now and ignoring that is simply bad business for Apple at this point.

Of all the iChat comments on these 10 pages, this one is the most significant. Apple has to get together with Microsoft and Yahoo! to work this out. I know, like, 3 people who use AOL. and I don't want a 3rd party patch job. (I know some of you swear by Adium but I really like iChat.)

Finally, it appears that some of these make features included in the .mac service redundant. Specifically, Backup (displaced by Time Machine) and, to a lesser extent, iCards (now challenged by the stationery features in Mail). This is in direct contrast to MWSF '06 where it seemed that .Mac would take on a larger role.

-Squire

 

[CellarDoor]

In nine months or less......... we'll have those
Top Secret features in our machines - too bad
for Redmond they won't be revealed until then.
Core graphics and Quartz Extreme will be amazing.
Love Time Machine, Spaces, etc.

Is this a poem? Lovely.

 

[zooniverse]

love the new features so far. Hopefully a UI refresh will be one of the top secret features to finally get rid of the dated brushed-metal finder etc...

 

[eMagius]

hmmm, most of the features are already in windows? what version of windows do you have?

2003.

 

[playaj82]

I know a lot of people are excited about Time Machine, but I was kind of worried last night when I showed it to one of my friends.

Unlike Expose, Fast User Switching, iTunes, Dashboard, etc... that have immediate impact and understanding as to why the features are so neat, Time Machine is actually rather complicated.

I explained and showed it to my friend, and she said, "so what, when I delete something it stays on the hard drive anyways"

All of us here obviously understand the significance of this program, but does anybody else think this will be difficult to market to the "average" user.