May 18th? G5 Updates?

[wdlove]

I fully expect an update at WWDC -- the issue is it an update worth writing home about? Just as Apple has "refreshed" its laptop lines, they are not going to wait forever to update the PowerMac. For one thing, they can put in new optical drives, update the FW and Power Supply. These may seem minor, but they are definitely worth doing in an update.

(Forget about any announcements for Macworld Boston, of course.)

I not yet ready to give up on a Steve Jobs appearance at MacWorld Boston in July. Still believe in never say never, at least no definitive message has come from Steve that I'm aware.

 

[FFTT]

G5 Update

I can't imagine any serious G5 update without use of the IBM970FX processor.
All the major G5 problems I hear of currently are related to heat.
The reports I've read indicate that this new improved processor runs not only much cooler, but also uses about half the power.

We can only hope that Apple will continue it's ability to boast
"The Fastest Computer " ratings.

3 GHz Processor speed AND the highest quality in graphics cards will surely be a major consideration if Apple wants to provide the best system available.

Anything less would be a major disappointment.


Personally, I still hope to see major improvements in A/V as well.

Both CPU's and displays should be updated to include HDTV/CPU I/O and picture in picture capabilties.

I would also hope for any A/V model to include at least a 2 channel A/D interface to support audio recording applications.



"Never Hurts To Dream"

 

[thatwendigo]

I can't imagine any serious G5 update without use of the IBM970FX processor.

You're not trying too hard, then. 😉

By that, I mean that there are all kinds of things that could happen under the "G5" name. It's just a marketing label, after all, and the G4 used in different models just this year isn't the same chip, let alone when compared to past processors. I'm hoping for the debut of 975/980s (whatever they call the Power5-derived chip).

All the major G5 problems I hear of currently are related to heat.
The reports I've read indicate that this new improved processor runs not only much cooler, but also uses about half the power.

In consumer electronics, the heat/power figures are roughly the same. A 60 watt lighbulb puts out a certain amount of displaced heat and draws that many watts, as does a 60 watt computer processor. The original 970 at 2.0ghz drew 50w or thereabouts, and has been cut in half by the die shrink to 90nm.

We can only hope that Apple will continue it's ability to boast
"The Fastest Computer " ratings.

These have been removed because of lawsuits.

[quote[3 GHz Processor speed AND the highest quality in graphics cards will surely be a major consideration if Apple wants to provide the best system available.[/quote]

Did you read the thread before posting? I'm starting to get the impression you didn't.

Both CPU's and displays should be updated to include HDTV/CPU I/O and picture in picture capabilties.

I would also hope for any A/V model to include at least a 2 channel A/D interface to support audio recording applications.

Actually, there is no A/V-specific macintosh computer, though one could probably argue that the PowerMac towers are intended for the creative space. However, I'm not really sure what you think that you're talking about... Monitors are already more than capable of HDTV resolutions, and the CPUs can manipulate it. That's what the releases at NAB were all about, really, new HD content codecs and tools, like FinalCut HD.

 

[FFTT]

I suppose that my views may differ from some users and what I posted here was more of a wish list based on the best technology available.

After spending more than $3500 on the original purchase and upgrades
to my G3/300 A/V tower, I'm going to be damn careful about my next purchase.
There is no question that my new system will be Apple, but only
WHEN I feel that the system they offer will meet my needs for a very long time.

I can't complain about overall quality, since this old machine has never failed me,
but I still see room for improvement in the G5's configuration.

I'm not at all comfortable with a system that requires 9 cooling fans.
What I have read about the 970FX makes me feel that there will be a
better alternative soon.

I'm also hopeful that available choices for graphic and sound cards will improve in the near future.

Displays are a matter of the users needs.

Personally, I will prefer a display that can handle both my CPU input
as well as the signal from my satellite dish. AND allow me to view both
at the same time if I so choose.

These displays are already available, so I can't imagine buying one without these features.

I'm sure all of us hope that Apple will announce something new and exciting in the G5 lineup.

To most of us, it's only a matter of when.

 

[windowsblowsass]

might not be g5 but im expecting something from freescale at e3 their newsletter is hintin g at something and e3 is the 11-14. so maybe an announcment by freescale there at then an apple anouncement latter that week.

 

[thatwendigo]

After spending more than $3500 on the original purchase and upgrades to my G3/300 A/V tower, I'm going to be damn careful about my next purchase. There is no question that my new system will be Apple, but only WHEN I feel that the system they offer will meet my needs for a very long time.

I can't complain about overall quality, since this old machine has never failed me, but I still see room for improvement in the G5's configuration.

You spent $3,500 around, what, 6 or 7 year years ago? Adjusting for inflation, you'd probably spend around $4,000-4,200 today, and yet even $3,500 gets you more than ten times the machine. I'm sorry, but what you're about to experience is the effect that a more serious chip design firm can have on update cycle.

I'm not at all comfortable with a system that requires 9 cooling fans. What I have read about the 970FX makes me feel that there will be a
better alternative soon.

I guess it's a good thing that there are nine fans in order to make the machine quiet, rather than out of necessity. I don't know who your sources are or what their agenda is, but the simple fact of the matter is that Apple puts two processors under the hood and equals or beats the PC heat budgets.

I'm also hopeful that available choices for graphic and sound cards will improve in the near future.

Graphics will almost certainly be bumped, but I doubt that you're going to see much of a change in audio. The onboard system for Apple's machines offers more options than most add-on cards for PCs.

Personally, I will prefer a display that can handle both my CPU input
as well as the signal from my satellite dish. AND allow me to view both
at the same time if I so choose.

These displays are already available, so I can't imagine buying one without these features.

So buy one already. There are a million consumer electronics devices, and many of them would make one user or another's life easier, but that doesn't mean Apple could, would, or even should pursue their manufacture. They are a software and computing company before they're anything else. Even when people piss and moan about the iPod being the focus, it doesn't and almost certainly won't, equal the mac in revenue.

If the device exists, then buy it from someone who makes it. If it doesn't, start lobbying companies that build similar ones. It's not like Apple controls the graphics and audio add-on market, nor does it rule the display arena, so your hopes are better aimed at people who spend most of their budget on doing such things.

 

[FFTT]

The idea of an open forum is to allow people to express their opinion.
I hope you will forgive me for wishing that Apple continues to offer
the finest products available.

 

[thatwendigo]

The idea of an open forum is to allow people to express their opinion.
I hope you will forgive me for wishing that Apple continues to offer
the finest products available.

Um. Right.

You see, my whole goal was to stop you from commenting, rather than offering competing opinions and logical replies. It had nothing at all to do with pointing out that other companies exist solely to manufacture displays and that they're more likely to do what you want... 🙄

 

[invaLPsion]

The idea of an open forum is to allow people to express their opinion.
I hope you will forgive me for wishing that Apple continues to offer
the finest products available.

Some people come down on others too much in these forums... 🙁

 

[FFTT]

I never intended to cause such a stir with my comments.
I'm also perfectly fine with a good old fashioned heated debate. 🙂

It may have been better for me to post my comments to the wish list thread.

I will however stand my ground hoping that Apple does make improvements to the G5 series before I make such a serious investment.

In all fairness, I did a bit of research on the specifications of some
of the available HDTV/CPU displays and did note that the Apple 23"
display far exceeds anything in it's price range for resolution quality.

Even so, I can't ignore the very cool feature of being able to monitor
what's going on in your CPU on a 23" wide screen display,
while watching a big game or your favorite show. And being able to do so for nearly $600.00 less.

I must also keep in mind that Apple hardware is NOT purely Apple.
New improved products will continue to rely on the technology provided
by other manufacturers such as IBM, Motorola, Sony, Pioneer, ATI and so on.

Our loyalty to Apple is for what they provide in the sum of all parts
in a very attractive package.

 

[Composer]

News from France...

2004-05-10 - Prochains G5: PPC975

La gamme de G5 prévue initialement prévue pour Janvier sera tout simplement sauté, effacée des roadmaps. On se dirige tout droit vers des G5 bi-3.2 GHz (PPC975 - dont la production en chaîne débute bientôt - + DDR400) pour la WWDC.

IBM a décidé également de changer de fournisseur de waffers pour palier aux problèmes d'impuretés trouvés dans ceux utilisés en gravure à 0.13 um qui ne pardonneront pas à 0.09 um.


original posted on http://croquer.free.fr

altavista translate:

2004-05-10 - Next G5: PPC975 The range of G5 envisaged initially scheduled for January quite simply will be jumped, erased roadmaps. One moves straight towards of G5 Bi-3.2 GHz (PPC975 - whose production in chain begins soon - + DDR400) for the WWDC. IBM also decided to change supplier of waffers for stage to the d'impuretés problems found in those used in engraving with 0.13 um which will not forgive with 0.09 um.

 

[uzombie]

but will it still be a mac

....
3 GHz Processor speed AND the highest quality in graphics cards will surely be a major consideration if Apple wants to provide the best system available.
...
Anything less would be a major disappointment.
...
"Never Hurts To Dream"

I hope its only been "rumors" of what the real reason for the delay in an updated G5. I tried contacts at IBM and nobody is peepn.

I must ask though, after reading about a possible OSX on Intel/AMD rumor, and since NeXTstep used to run fairly well...what is the line that a G5 is made up of more "PC" parts than it used to? You have SATA, DVR-IDE, PC2100~PC3200, bluetooth, 802.11g, USB2.0, (ok IEEE1394 is Apple), Gigabit ethernet, ... Other than board level management and the G5, its almost (gasp) a PC!

So we have to wait some more, huh?

Cars & Computers are (generally) not an investment item.

/fire away gridly!

 

[thatwendigo]

I must ask though, after reading about a possible OSX on Intel/AMD rumor, and since NeXTstep used to run fairly well...what is the line that a G5 is made up of more "PC" parts than it used to? You have SATA, DVR-IDE, PC2100~PC3200, bluetooth, 802.11g, USB2.0, (ok IEEE1394 is Apple), Gigabit ethernet, ... Other than board level management and the G5, its almost (gasp) a PC!

The biggest difference in any system is the part that you're downlplaying, otherwise thought of as the "brain" of the computer - processor and motherboard. The rest is just cost saving and standardization, and nothing more. To have expended what Apple has on the PowerPC, only to jump to Intel as the OS is warming to the hardware... Suicide. Pure and simple.

If Apple went to x86, they would be crushed by Microsoft and the combined force of piracy and inability to compete in the budget market.

 

[numediaman]

2004-05-10 - Prochains G5: PPC975

La gamme de G5 prévue initialement prévue pour Janvier sera tout simplement sauté, effacée des roadmaps. On se dirige tout droit vers des G5 bi-3.2 GHz (PPC975 - dont la production en chaîne débute bientôt - + DDR400) pour la WWDC.

IBM a décidé également de changer de fournisseur de waffers pour palier aux problèmes d'impuretés trouvés dans ceux utilisés en gravure à 0.13 um qui ne pardonneront pas à 0.09 um.


original posted on http://croquer.free.fr

altavista translate:

2004-05-10 - Next G5: PPC975 The range of G5 envisaged initially scheduled for January quite simply will be jumped, erased roadmaps. One moves straight towards of G5 Bi-3.2 GHz (PPC975 - whose production in chain begins soon - + DDR400) for the WWDC. IBM also decided to change supplier of waffers for stage to the d'impuretés problems found in those used in engraving with 0.13 um which will not forgive with 0.09 um.

I was just about to post this myself -- glad I checked to see if anyone else would beat me to it.

This site has a mixed record. But they have managed correct "rumors" in other areas -- maybe they are right here, as well.

 

[seasley]

Gave Up

I am a newbie lurker who gave up waiting for the G5, and got the new 1.5 Mhz Powerbook instead - sweet machine (and my first mac)! I will probably also get a G5 - but now the need is not so urgent. I wanted to thank the posters here for information, so the first person that emails me at easleystephen@yahoo.com with their dot.mac address will be my "referring member" to .mac, and save 20% when they renew - I am currently in the process of signing up.
Thanks!
Steve

 

[numediaman]

Went to Best Buy this evening to pick up some printable CDs. Just for laughs I asked anybody I could find there what the bus speed was for the Sony Vaio I was looking at. The salespeople kept telling me the processor speed -- no one knew what bus speed meant. They directed me to a computer there that is hooked up to their web site. I checked that out as well -- no specs.

Oh well, let's hope the French site is spot on with their rumor of a 3.0+ G5 by WWDC.

 

[FFTT]

The only rumors I've heard about OSX and Wintel/AMD are those
wondering what would happen if Apple offered OSX as an alternative
operating system for existing Windows users.

Obviously there is a huge demand for " something " more secure and reliable than Windows.

The trend seems to focus on those frustrated users turning to Linux.

My personal view, is that Apple should take advantage of Microsoft's
blunders with an aggressive " Try it, you'll like it campaign" including
OSX bundled with Microsoft Office.

Many have mentioned that this might hurt Apple's hardware sales,
but I totally disagree.

In the long run, I think offering OSX ported for Wintel P/C's would create a huge support network of additional hardware and software made for OSX
and Apple would still benefit by offering the finest hardware available once those P/C users see how trouble free their existing system runs on OSX.

I could also see a logical progression to an agreement between Apple and IBM to licence a line of IBM desktops to run on OSX, considering that
the heart of both systems shares the same processor.

Just a thought

 

[AppleJustWorks]

SJ

I personally don't think that putting OS X on PCs would be a bright idea. One of the things that makes Apple special is that they make the hardware, and the software, which means they have all the solutions, there is no "Apple tells you to go to Dell, Dell tells you to go to Apple" type business.

Also, another thing that differenciates Apple is their hardware quality, if Apple just threw the OS at all the manufactures.....It just wouldn't be Apple...



Aside from my personal opinion, Steve made it very clear that he would stick with his own hardware.
Here's a quote from SJ: "It's perfectly technically feasible to port Panther to any processor...We're running it on the PowerPC and we're very happy with the PowerPC....We have all the options in the world, but the PowerPC raod map looks very strong so we don't have any plans to switch processor families at this point.
November 5, 2003 - Apple Analysys Meeting Conference Call

 

[FFTT]

I totally understand the Apple purist outlook, but also must be realistic by seeing that Apple hardware IS NOT purely Applese.

Personal computers are simply a selection of parts in a box.

While all the bells and whistles make them attractive for the general public,
the operating system is what makes one combination of parts better than the other.

My view looks at companies like ATI giving it's best and finest priority to the market that sells the most computers while Apple seems to be running
on table droppings.

IF ( and it's a big IF ) Apple found a way to lock it's OS only to run on very specific machines, like IBM or AMD. Then that expanded market might
convince companies like ATI to give OSX based machines first priority.

Apple has the copy protection answer right under their noses.
Fortunately for all the hackers and crackers, they haven't yet
taken advantage of what they " could " do.

Anyway, this subject is a bit off topic here, since another thread now
covers OSX on other systems.

Putting this is very simple terms.

Wouldn't it be great if you could walk into ANY computer store
and find everything you need, parts, software and upgrades
all compatible with OSX?

Apple may just be better off in the long run as part of the BIG THREE 64 bit companies
and leave the clones to run on Microsoft Longhorn,
The perfect OS name for users who think like sheep.

 

[mr_mac]

I can't wait to get new revisions of the G5 so i can change my old DP G5 2GHz!

Just kidding...

but a dualie 3GHz would fit well on my desk...

 

[wdlove]

I can't wait to get new revisions of the G5 so i can change my old DP G5 2GHz!

Just kidding...

but a dualie 3GHz would fit well on my desk...

I have a Power Mac G4 Dual 450 which will be about 4 years old by the time Rev. B arrives. Your dual 2GHz really can't be considered old.

 

[MacDaddie0]

If I order some dual 2.0 G5 today, will Apple upgrade my order to the new one if new macs do get released on 18th?

Not being optimisic, just want to know Apple's policy.

However, it would be great if they do release new ones on 18th. 🙂

 

[numediaman]

If I order some dual 2.0 G5 today, will Apple upgrade my order to the new one if new macs do get released on 18th?

Not being optimisic, just want to know Apple's policy.

However, it would be great if they do release new ones on 18th. 🙂

People ask this question all the time. The simple answer is this: if you order a product, and that product is still available, this is what you will receive.

The stories about Apple instantly upgrading people's orders are usually only true when a product has been discontinued and replaced with the currently available model.

Since there will be no G5 update on the 18th, I wouldn't worry about it (boy, I wish I would turn out to be wrong). Just order your G5 and enjoy.

 

[peaks]

bwaaaaa

You go ahead and do that!

Why would Mac OS work on a PC anyway? With so many users, it would become a target for malicous coders... Besides, Bill seems to be spending a fair amount on updating and upgrading his project. The nature of the beast is that if 95% of users are using it, that's the market.

New Macs coming out on the 18th? Really? What about all of the other countless reports containing actual "dates" of new G5 "speed bumps" and the like? Apple is missing the window(pun intended 🙂) and by doing so is removing itself further and further from the mainstream. There are those that prefer this, and if Apple can make ends meet doing it, then we have something special - and that's what seems to have happened.

If/when the new 3GHz macs come out, I will buy one. Unless it's two years from now...

Is processor speed coming to a plateau? Is Moore’s law becoming obsolete?

 

[MacDaddie0]

People ask this question all the time. The simple answer is this: if you order a product, and that product is still available, this is what you will receive.

The stories about Apple instantly upgrading people's orders are usually only true when a product has been discontinued and replaced with the currently available model.

Since there will be no G5 update on the 18th, I wouldn't worry about it (boy, I wish I would turn out to be wrong). Just order your G5 and enjoy.

In anyway, sooner the better to use any Macs then just sit here , dwell upon, and curse on Windows.

Hurry up Apple, ship my stuff 😛