Microsoft Launches New Surface RT vs. iPad Ad Highlighting iPad Shortcomings

[Black Magic]

Nobody's copying the iPhone and iPad anymore. Back when they blew open those markets everyone was, but since then, they've been all about incremental improvements. I'd make an exception for SIRI, which is a strong piece of AI, but since then, Google has managed to take their own version, stick it on dedicated chips and allow you to use it from across the room. With the 5S's leaked specs, the only thing remotely innovative about it is the biometric sensor and who knows if that'll be game changing.

Looking at the other 5S rumored features... Dual LED flash (something the 920 and 925 have and the 928, 1020, and the Honami have moved past). High speed video (something the Galaxy already had). Larger screen? Taken from Android.

In the tablet market, the Android OEM's pioneered the 7" space. Apple's best selling tablets are now 7"

Who's following who here?

In the 7" space Apple definitely followed but Apple created the entire market in the first place 3 years ago. Yes feature wise there are incremental not so dazzling updates every year since but I would argue Android or MS has done anything better in that 3 year period as well. Google Now is a "me too" version of SIRI. Is it better? Maybe but innovative no. Google followed. I wouldn't comment on the iPhone 5S because rumors are exactly that, rumors.

Innovating every year is hard to do. You also have to milk that cow once you create a new market. Realistically, does it make sense to redesign a device every year from a business perspective? No, you need to get your R&D money's worth.

Android, Samsung and Microsoft are all incrementally improving their products as well. Heck, other companies react based on Apple rumors. Look how everyone is making a watch now. I'm really surprised anyone is questioning Apple's creativity and innovative chops.

 

[Michael Goff]

In the 7" space Apple definitely followed but Apple created the entire market in the first place 3 years ago. Yes feature wise there are incremental not so dazzling updates every year since but I would argue Android or MS has done anything better in that 3 year period as well. Google Now is a "me too" version of SIRI. Is it better? Maybe but innovative no. Google followed. I wouldn't comment on the iPhone 5S because rumors are exactly that, rumors.

Innovating every year is hard to do. You also have to milk that cow once you create a new market. Realistically, does it make sense to redesign a device every year from a business perspective? No, you need to get your R&D money's worth.

Android, Samsung and Microsoft are all incrementally improving their products as well. Heck, other companies react based on Apple rumors. Look how everyone is making a watch now. I'm really surprised anyone is questioning Apple's creativity and innovative chops.

I like how there is this bizarre assumption that the whole watch thing is because of Apple. Couldn't be anything else. I mean, the pebble went forward in time to when watch rumors started and then back in time to make their product.

 

[APlotdevice]

In the tablet market, the Android OEM's pioneered the 7" space. Apple's best selling tablets are now 7"

No, they're a point short of 8-inches.

 

[spinedoc77]

I like how there is this bizarre assumption that the whole watch thing is because of Apple. Couldn't be anything else. I mean, the pebble went forward in time to when watch rumors started and then back in time to make their product.

Didn't you know, Apple invents everything. They invented the music player, the smartphone, the tablet, and... they invented the entire internet too.

 

[Black Magic]

Didn't you know, Apple invents everything. They invented the music player, the smartphone, the tablet, and... they invented the entire internet too.

Surely you didn't hear anything out of MS or Google camp about watches and TVs until a big buzz started with Apple.

Look I get that you two love all things Microsoft and will scour internet forums high and low defending Microsoft's honor. What I don't get is why not do this on a Microsoft forum? Why congregate to an Apple forum to spew this Anti-Apple venom? Maybe Apple forums and fan-made forums are just better too.

 

[Michael Goff]

Surely you didn't hear anything out of MS or Google camp about watches and TVs until a big buzz started with Apple.

Look I get that you two love all things Microsoft and will scour internet forums high and low defending Microsoft's honor. What I don't get is why not do this on a Microsoft forum? Why congregate to an Apple forum to spew this Anti-Apple venom? Maybe Apple forums and fan-made forums are just better too.

I'm anti Apple simply because I don't think they raise the sun and the moon and they're not perfect and they don't invent everything ever?

Weird definition.

 

[psimac]

These Comparisons Leave So Much Out...

I'm sure someone said this already, but why does Microsoft continue to tout a keyboard that doesn't come with the Surface RT?

The Surface Touch Cover (aka Keyboard) is another $119

The effective price of the Surface (that works as advertised) is $468, which is still cheaper than a 16GB iPad. It's false advertising, because MSFT states there's "no keyboard" on the iPad, but there are probably 500 iPad-Specific 3rd Party keyboards and Apple's Bluetooth Keyboard available. As Surface's keyboard is an option, how do they get away with saying there's no keyboard on the iPad?

 

[Black Magic]

I'm anti Apple simply because I don't think they raise the sun and the moon and they're not perfect and they don't invent everything ever?

Weird definition.

You imply others here stated that Apple raised the sun and moon when absolutely no one in this thread said as such. You are judgmental and pretentious when others opinion don't align with yours. Most of your venom is towards Apple friendly forum participants on an Apple friendly site.

Weird behavior.

 

[greenmeanie]

I have both and prefer the Surface.
The IPAD runs/feels like a toy/gadget the surface can actually get stuff done with it's dual OS.

 

[Michael Goff]

You imply others here stated that Apple raised the sun and moon when absolutely no one in this thread said as such. You are judgmental and pretentious when others opinion don't align with yours. Most of your venom is towards Apple friendly forum participants on an Apple friendly site.

Weird behavior.

Venom?

No venom here, friend. Nor do I have a problem with Apple friendly people. The people I have a problem with, from any company, are the ones that try to say their company invented everything. This is made even more ridiculous when the company that is claimed to have pushed others into a market is one that isn't even in the market at all.

Is it possible to like Apple products while also seeing that they might not be a the center of the tech universe?

 

[greenmeanie]

Try using one the surface is better in all areas except maybe the screen resolution.

Seriously Microsoft, stop touting that awful kickstand. Especially if you're not even going to show the iPad's Smart Cover in the comparison.

 

[Michael Goff]

I'm sure someone said this already, but why does Microsoft continue to tout a keyboard that doesn't come with the Surface RT?

Image

The Surface Touch Cover (aka Keyboard) is another $119

Image

The effective price of the Surface (that works as advertised) is $468, which is still cheaper than a 16GB iPad. It's false advertising, because MSFT states there's "no keyboard" on the iPad, but there are probably 500 iPad-Specific 3rd Party keyboards and Apple's Bluetooth Keyboard available. As Surface's keyboard is an option, how do they get away with saying there's no keyboard on the iPad?

They didn't say, they implied. They ere still wrong to do so, but advertisers always take liberties with facts. Well, mostly they do. The recent Apple ads have been pretty factual.

 

[shandyman]

Try using one the surface is better in all areas except maybe the screen resolution.

I used it and I hated it. The pro is a different story. Personally I prefer windows 7 on my laptop to 8.

They didn't say, they implied. They ere still wrong to do so, but advertisers always take liberties with facts. Well, mostly they do. The recent Apple ads have been pretty factual.

The video says out rightly that the iPad has no keyboard, but the surface does. It's not implied at all....

 

[Black Magic]

Venom?

No venom here, friend. Nor do I have a problem with Apple friendly people. The people I have a problem with, from any company, are the ones that try to say their company invented everything. This is made even more ridiculous when the company that is claimed to have pushed others into a market is one that isn't even in the market at all.

Is it possible to like Apple products while also seeing that they might not be a the center of the tech universe?

No one in this thread mentioned the words "Apple created...." anything outside of maybe the market. It's like you are being disruptive and negative by creating content that others never said so you can try and make a point. I never even made a comment at you or towards you and I found myself wondering where this imaginary content originated from?

 

[Michael Goff]

No one in this thread mentioned the words "Apple created...." anything outside of maybe the market. It's like you are being disruptive and negative by creating content that others never said so you can try and make a point. I never even made a comment at you or towards you and I found myself wondering where this imaginary content originated from?

And they created the market HOW?

Nobody has pointed out how they could have created a market without even being IN the market. And it isn't even like they're the first ones who have had an idea for a smart watch.

 

[Black Magic]

And they created the market HOW?

Nobody has pointed out how they could have created a market without even being IN the market. And it isn't even like they're the first ones who have had an idea for a smart watch.

So are we really gonna dispute this? Apple wasnt the first to create a tablet but the iPad created a healthy market where people are buying tablets like hot cakes. Are you really gonna dispute this? Are you gonna get all technical about how the the first tablets were made back in 1960 and 5 of them sold which the market nowadays is based on? Please don't take us down rabbit holes.

In regards to the watch, unless you have had your head in the sand, you know that there was no major buzz about any major tech company making a watch or TV for that matter until you started hearing about Apple possibly doing so. You can post links to articles from yesteryear if you think that would boost your argument.

In the grand scheme of things, I really don't care one way or another but it seems like you really do.

 

[spinedoc77]

Surely you didn't hear anything out of MS or Google camp about watches and TVs until a big buzz started with Apple.

Look I get that you two love all things Microsoft and will scour internet forums high and low defending Microsoft's honor. What I don't get is why not do this on a Microsoft forum? Why congregate to an Apple forum to spew this Anti-Apple venom? Maybe Apple forums and fan-made forums are just better too.

Stop it dude, you are like a broken record. I have an iphone that I love, I use Android on a regular basis, I use OSx occasionally at home. You don't sound like the sharpest tool in the shed when your only come back is that I'm a "MS lover". It's not that I'm a MS lover, it's that I'm open minded about things and choose not to stick my head in the sand. If anything it's quite clear YOU are the Apple lover, seriously.

As for your last question, why are you still in this thread if you don't like it? Get out, go to another thread, start your own. But if you don't like my opinion sorry, tough crap. I don't spew any anti Apple venom (lol?), but I do state my reasons why I don't like certain things. There are people on here who like to hear more than one opinion, more than one take on a company and their products, and then there are those who just like to hear one thing. Sorry if it pisses you off that Apple did not create a single one of those things, no I'm not sorry actually.

 

[Liquorpuki]

In the 7" space Apple definitely followed but Apple created the entire market in the first place 3 years ago. Yes feature wise there are incremental not so dazzling updates every year since but I would argue Android or MS has done anything better in that 3 year period as well. Google Now is a "me too" version of SIRI. Is it better? Maybe but innovative no. Google followed. I wouldn't comment on the iPhone 5S because rumors are exactly that, rumors.

Innovating every year is hard to do. You also have to milk that cow once you create a new market. Realistically, does it make sense to redesign a device every year from a business perspective? No, you need to get your R&D money's worth.

Android, Samsung and Microsoft are all incrementally improving their products as well. Heck, other companies react based on Apple rumors. Look how everyone is making a watch now. I'm really surprised anyone is questioning Apple's creativity and innovative chops.

I guess we'll see what happens over the next couple years. Part of me is still holding out that Apple will disrupt TV or that the iWatch will do something unprecedented the Pebble and all the wearable tech pioneers didn't think of, but more and more I'm starting to think the brand is slowly eroding. From staggering their product cycle to marginal improvements that are more for playing catch up, they're starting to look like a complacent incumbent.

No, they're a point short of 8-inches.

Despite that difference of 9 inches it's pretty obvious what space they compete in with the mini, and why they entered it (market pressure)

 

[Black Magic]

I guess we'll see what happens over the next couple years. Part of me is still holding out that Apple will disrupt TV or that the iWatch will do something unprecedented the Pebble and all the wearable tech pioneers didn't think of, but more and more I'm starting to think the brand is slowly eroding. From staggering their product cycle to marginal improvements that are more for playing catch up, they're starting to look like a complacent incumbent.

I see the TV market being disrupted especially if Apple comes at it with an App store approach. To be honest, if they went with the App Store approach with the current Apple TV product it could be really disruptive as well.

I think Apple is in a very healthy place right now. Microsoft on the other hand is in a healthy spot but not in an Apple like spot. Heck, there are rumors of layoffs floating around Microsoft right now.

 

[Liquorpuki]

I see the TV market being disrupted especially if Apple comes at it with an App store approach. To be honest, if they went with the App Store approach with the current Apple TV product it could be really disruptive as well.

I think Apple is in a very healthy place right now. Microsoft on the other hand is in a healthy spot but not in an Apple like spot. Heck, there are rumors of layoffs floating around Microsoft right now.

I was hoping Apple was gonna change TV distribution by using the internet to kill cable. I don't know any other company that has the clout to do this and TV is one of the last forms of media that relies on an antiquated form of distribution. I wanted them to do the same thing to TV that they did to music - just totally uproot the distribution at benefit to the consumer.

Except for consoles and office, MS is playing from behind but what I like about them is they're gambling bigtime and if any one of their gambles pay off, they get big rewards. IE with Win8 and their tablet approach they're trying to blur the line between tablets and PC's by leveraging the x86 ecosystem. If it pays off, it pretty much solves their shrinking PC problem by offsetting lost revenue through the tablets. It also disrupts tablet incumbents because they need tablets to be ARM based and silo'd from PC's. They're also taking a page out of Apple and Google's book and combining all their assets - W8, WP8, Xbox, Skype, Skydrive, Azure, Office, Bing into a single ecosystem.

 

[Black Magic]

I was hoping Apple was gonna change TV distribution by using the internet to kill cable. I don't know any other company that has the clout to do this and TV is one of the last forms of media that relies on an antiquated form of distribution. I wanted them to do the same thing to TV that they did to music - just totally uproot the distribution at benefit to the consumer.

Except for consoles and office, MS is playing from behind but what I like about them is they're gambling bigtime and if any one of their gambles pay off, they get big rewards. IE with Win8 and their tablet approach they're trying to blur the line between tablets and PC's by leveraging the x86 ecosystem. If it pays off, it pretty much solves their shrinking PC problem by offsetting lost revenue through the tablets. It also disrupts tablet incumbents because they need tablets to be ARM based and silo'd from PC's. They're also taking a page out of Apple and Google's book and combining all their assets - W8, WP8, Xbox, Skype, Skydrive, Azure, Office, Bing into a single ecosystem.

Microsoft does have some fantastic offerings. I really like the current cloud push and apps as a service focus. Office 365 and Azure are really good products. The only problem I have with MS is that they don't let their ideas/products bake long enough so when they come out the oven it's half way done. If they could just leave it in the oven just a little longer and apply a little more TLC some of the products you mentioned could be home runs.

 

[spinedoc77]

I was hoping Apple was gonna change TV distribution by using the internet to kill cable. I don't know any other company that has the clout to do this and TV is one of the last forms of media that relies on an antiquated form of distribution. I wanted them to do the same thing to TV that they did to music - just totally uproot the distribution at benefit to the consumer.

Except for consoles and office, MS is playing from behind but what I like about them is they're gambling bigtime and if any one of their gambles pay off, they get big rewards. IE with Win8 and their tablet approach they're trying to blur the line between tablets and PC's by leveraging the x86 ecosystem. If it pays off, it pretty much solves their shrinking PC problem by offsetting lost revenue through the tablets. It also disrupts tablet incumbents because they need tablets to be ARM based and silo'd from PC's. They're also taking a page out of Apple and Google's book and combining all their assets - W8, WP8, Xbox, Skype, Skydrive, Azure, Office, Bing into a single ecosystem.

Apple TV has 2 interesting premises IMO. One is if Apple can pull of providing content like they do with music and make it a subscription service, or maybe they will do like the xbox one and provide a channel guide and all the goodies like netflix, but then again their current Apple TV already does this. The other premise is apps on the tv screen, although I'm not convinced people want apps like this in the living room, maybe games for the younger crowd.

 

[Michael Goff]

So are we really gonna dispute this? Apple wasnt the first to create a tablet but the iPad created a healthy market where people are buying tablets like hot cakes. Are you really gonna dispute this? Are you gonna get all technical about how the the first tablets were made back in 1960 and 5 of them sold which the market nowadays is based on? Please don't take us down rabbit holes.

In regards to the watch, unless you have had your head in the sand, you know that there was no major buzz about any major tech company making a watch or TV for that matter until you started hearing about Apple possibly doing so. You can post links to articles from yesteryear if you think that would boost your argument.

In the grand scheme of things, I really don't care one way or another but it seems like you really do.

I'd say the Pebble got a decent amount of press. The TV thing you have an argument for, the tablet market you have an argument for, but the Pebble actually created the smartwatch market.

 

[shandyman]

I'd say the Pebble got a decent amount of press. The TV thing you have an argument for, the tablet market you have an argument for, but the Pebble actually created the smartwatch market.

Actually, rumours of an apple smart watch began in 2011, pebble were just quicker to get theirs made and released, with bringing then attention to a more mainstream audience. Once Apple and others bring theirs out, it will fully bring the mainstream attention and demand. Pebble is just a precursor to that market. Apple will do the same they did with the tablet market.

 

[Michael Goff]

Actually, rumours of an apple smart watch began in 2011, pebble were just quicker to get theirs made and released, with bringing then attention to a more mainstream audience. Once Apple and others bring theirs out, it will fully bring the mainstream attention and demand. Pebble is just a precursor to that market. Apple will do the same they did with the tablet market.

IF the market only explodes after Apple makes theirs... I'll take it back and say I was wrong. But saying right now that they definitely made the market because of a rumor is a bit... weird.

Edit: To put it into perspective, I wouldn't have said that Apple created the tablet market if it had just been a rumor. But they made the iPad and that kick-started a market that we're all benefitting from.