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The Surface Book is still a bug ridden experiment - the hinge, the detachable tablet with limited apps and capabilities, sleep issues all Windows computers actually have, the HiDPI and lack of touch optimisation, screen issues that plague the whole Surface lineup, not to mention the failure rate of these devices - a dead device is not such a rare occurence.
My friend's law firm has a bulk of Surface Pro 4s they intended to switch over to as their main devices - they have 30 and only a few haven't yet been exchanged for new ones due to either one or a combination of the aforementioned issues.
 
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Well, it isn't surprising. As long as Apple had a clear and dramatic advantage in terms of software reliability, usability, UI design, and stability it didn't matter all that much if Apple hardware was bleeding-edge. The software experience absolutely made-up for any hardware downsides (unless we are talking dedicated gaming rigs of course). But that's all gone away. Both the Mac OS and iOS UIs are now a kludge of random inconsistent garbage (which is also, sometimes, difficult to see due to the "greying" of everything that used to stand-out nicely). Apple's once stellar applications have been feature-usability-and reliability-downgraded as well. The Apple ecosystem is now fundamentally broken. During that time Microsoft has made some missteps, but unlike Apple they have been willing to reverse-course and fix what they have broken. Is it as good as Apple yet? No, but the difference, which used to be vast, is now relatively small. (We used to have Apple at good solid "A" and Microsoft way down at, maybe a "D+" if we were being nice about it until the release of Win 7. Now it's more like Apple is barely holding out at "B-" and Microsoft is at a solid "C+" and rising.) At the same time, many of the manufacturing techniques we saw only (or nearly only) in Apple products have filtered down to the rest of the computing market. It used to be you would pick up a Windows laptop and it would clearly be a piece of total crap even if it looked reasonably decent on the outside. Pick up an Apple laptop though, and the quality was immediately apparent. Again, the gap has closed and that one probably can't be rectified (there are only so many ways, and so many materials, to make computers out of). Can it be fixed? Yes. Apple needs to do a Microsoft. They need to reverse course and recreate good, usable UIs. They need to get their QA back up and doing, well, anything! They need to go and put back the features, usability, and reliability they have been removing from their software. And they need to do it quickly. I think time is running out...
 
I use the vi editor. Lacking a physical "Esc" key on the keyboard is a 100% deal-breaker for me. I am eyeing the new Dell XPS 15 laptops.


Why does it have to be physical? The digital esc on the touch bar is just as good and its always there too.
 
There are so many great PC options right now. I just switched from a 13 inch MBP to a HP spectre X360. There has been no looking back for me. I will probably get a surface pro 5 for work when they're released.

There's definitely room for improvement with win 10 but the case to pay the apple premium is getting harder and harder to make. Apple's traded in their Vision for Profit Margin.
 
Do a significant number of people really switch from Mac OS to Windows 10? Seems like a bit of a red herring to me even if Apple's current lineup is unimpressive...

... The new Macbooks are Meh at best and very overpriced. ...

I got the latest Intel CPU, a 4k screen, touch + pen, 16GB, Discrete graphics, 512GB SSD machine for $1499. A comparable 15" MBP was $2799 and no pen/touch input. ...

Interesting question ... I like to go by the data.
  • Mac quarterly sales are continually trending upwards (US sales were <3% in the past, now it's trending over 12%). Worldwide sales are of course different.
  • PC global sales quarterly are overall stagnant going down from over 95M to below 75M since 2010.
  • Mac global sales quarterly went from over 2M to around 5M in the same time frame.
I think it's what time period you measure (ie, mult-year trend vs last few quarters) and, also how you interpret/spin the data.

For example, if the SB is a 2-in-1 (Windows 10 based) and you include this in PC/laptop sales figures, should you also include iPad sales in the same figures (it's not MacOS). That is Windows 10 is used in tablet and PC, while Apple has a separate OS for tablet and PC... it's a bit subject to interpretation of data.
 
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Do a significant number of people really switch from Mac OS to Windows 10? Seems like a bit of a red herring to me even if Apple's current lineup is unimpressive. I can see power users, maybe, who's revenue depends on fast output changing. But is that a big number? I can't see the avg. consumer switching and also Mac seems to remain the preference of kids and college students.
 
I picked up a nTB MBP 13 and I love it. Light and sturdy, beautiful screen, and speedy. I'm a windows to mac convert so it'll be a while before I move back to windows. I had a windows home server set up that I replaced with a Mac server. I just have 1 windows gaming machine left and the rest are Macs.

Since moving to Macs, I've spent a lot less time maintaining all my computers. I've converted my family members too and I spend less time maintainging their machines as well.
 
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I'm not crazy about my MacBook per se (although MagSafe and the touchpad are sweet), but about the OS. Development is just so much easier and convenient on OS X (a native ZSH-shell, homebrew, Bash-scripts, better virtualization, Automator etc). Plus there is things like a tabbed finder, tags, TimeMachine, Messages, Facetime, that new cross-device copy-paste-stuff, AirDrop etc.

But Windows has evolved so incredibly much over the past years, a statement I cannot really make for Apple. Windows machines now offer touch (it works great with W10, try it!), a much more advanced Shell (PowerShell and that cygwin-clone), much better security defaults, a imo hugely improved Office suite and simply much more power and connectivity than any Mac I could buy for a "reasonable" price. My current work laptop has USB-A, USB-C, DisplayPort, an IPS touchscreen, comes with an i7 and can be easily upgraded.

So if my MBP would break, I could choose between paying something around $1,000 extra for less connectivity, less features (compared to older Macs as well as Windows, e.g. MagSafe or touch), much slower hardware (to a point where yes, it becomes noticeable and this old "but it's well-optimized"-statement doesn't help anymore) but a lot of convenient features. And honestly, I am not sure if I would be willing to pay this premium again.
 
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Yes, over 90% ownership of the computing market is a "small base." Seriously?

Are you serious? In the premium PC market Apple dominates. Most of Microsoft's market share is in software, and most of that is in sub-$500 PCs.

As for hardware, it is Microsoft who is the upstart. Surface is only a small part of Microsoft's revenue.
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Apple doesn't release the numbers of units sold either.
They release total Macs sold.
 
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20+ year IT career having seen tons of computers tells me Dell is garbage. Always has been. You don't have to believe me but the Spectre lineup is on most reviewer's "Best Windows Laptops" lists for 1-2 years now.

I as well have over 20 years in IT and I can tell you you are so wrong on this. Yes, Dell used to be junk, we used to use them when they were junk and they were. Ever since Dell went private and everybody started to compete with Apple at the higher end - Dell has improved a lot. I know because we are using them again and I can honestly say it is a 180 degree difference from what they used to be like. Sure, maybe your mileage may very but to say they are "garbage" is totally inaccurate and a totally biased opinion. Sounds like you have a grudge towards Dell if you ask me.
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I don't care what you buy but calling Dell anything but garbage is a stretch. For the same $$ you could buy an HP that has the Mac's build quality (it is very well built) and, IIRC at a cheaper price than a Dell XPS 13 2-in-1....

Asus is also making some compelling designs and relative newcomer Razer's blade series looks great as well.

Dell is the bottom of the barrel and you'd do yourself a favor to look elsewhere.

And there you go again with Dell. We get it! You hate Dell. Do yourself a favor and let others buy what they want.

I remember back in the day Dell was crap compared to our HP computers. Everything on the Dells went bad, I mean everything. Today, Dell's quality is higher or comparable to HP now. Acer is more bottom of the barrel than Dell. But we get it, you don't like Dell. Enough said!
 
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I've been a Mac user for well over 25 years, but am looking a lot at the Microsoft Surface since Apple hasn't developed a new desktop in the past year and a half. I am almost ready to switch, but just haven't pulled the trigger yet.
 
I'm more familiar with Macs, plus I feel Apple has really good service. However, MS definitely showed up Apple with the Surface, IMO. I like the style of the Surface Studio, plus PCs often have better hardware & software for games. With Apple's obsession with thin will probably never truly bring it to parity with gaming computers.

Like many people on this forum, I want the power of macOS, but still touch enabled. I like have file system access, more granular printer options, multiple users, etc. I also like working with my fingers or a stylus as it feels more natural than a keyboard and mouse/trackpad in some situations. We'll see what iOS 11 and macOS 10.13 are like. Hopefully, it'll solve some issues.

It's not thin that will keep Apple from parity with gaming computers - it's the lack of a
I've been a Mac user for well over 25 years, but am looking a lot at the Microsoft Surface since Apple hasn't developed a new desktop in the past year and a half. I am almost ready to switch, but just haven't pulled the trigger yet.

No one is expecting Apple to drop the iMac, though. Suitable chips for it are finally out. It'll be more powerful/expandable than the Surface Studio and a better computer for the price if you don't need the kneeling touch screen.
 
I don't buy this story. I'm sure some flawed data was used, and I say that as a huge Microsoft fan.
 
Do a significant number of people really switch from Mac OS to Windows 10? Seems like a bit of a red herring to me even if Apple's current lineup is unimpressive. I can see power users, maybe, who's revenue depends on fast output changing. But is that a big number? I can't see the avg. consumer switching and also Mac seems to remain the preference of kids and college students.
I think most Mac users are just hanging onto their current Macs as long as they can. My 2011 MacBook Pro is still going strong, and I’m going to stick with it until it breaks. Hopefully, Apple will have started making practical computers again. If not, I’ll probably buy a Windows PC and dual-boot Ubuntu and Windows.
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Microsoft also said that each version of Windows was "faster and safer than the previous version".
That’s good to hear, but Windows still has a long way to go before I’ll use it as my primary operating system. In particular, there are a lot of backdoors which need to be removed.
 
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Imagine a Surface hardware setup running macOS. How flippin' sweet would that be?

Not really, crappy dual core across the board.
I as well have over 20 years in IT and I can tell you you are so wrong on this. Yes, Dell used to be junk, we used to use them when they were junk and they were. Ever since Dell went private and everybody started to compete with Apple at the higher end - Dell has improved a lot. I know because we are using them again and I can honestly say it is a 180 degree difference from what they used to be like. Sure, maybe your mileage may very but to say they are "garbage" is totally inaccurate and a totally biased opinion. Sounds like you have a grudge towards Dell if you ask me.
[doublepost=1485557752][/doublepost]

And there you go again with Dell. We get it! You hate Dell. Do yourself a favor and let others buy what they want.

I remember back in the day Dell was crap compared to our HP computers. Everything on the Dells went bad, I mean everything. Today, Dell's quality is higher or comparable to HP now. Acer is more bottom of the barrel than Dell. But we get it, you don't like Dell. Enough said!

Dell kit is pish, they use cheap components and the driver support is garbage. Especially display drivers on the new 4k laptops. We moved a client from Dell due to a 56% failure rate on desktops and that was with dell providing us with 100 'spare' desktops because of the number of failures. Moved to HP and haven't looked back, dell lost out on a 10k unit supply deal. They seem to think that if they replace their ****ed units quick enough they can get away with shipping *****.
 
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Well, it isn't surprising. As long as Apple had a clear and dramatic advantage in terms of software reliability, usability, UI design, and stability it didn't matter all that much if Apple hardware was bleeding-edge. The software experience absolutely made-up for any hardware downsides (unless we are talking dedicated gaming rigs of course). But that's all gone away. Both the Mac OS and iOS UIs are now a kludge of random inconsistent garbage (which is also, sometimes, difficult to see due to the "greying" of everything that used to stand-out nicely). Apple's once stellar applications have been feature-usability-and reliability-downgraded as well. The Apple ecosystem is now fundamentally broken. During that time Microsoft has made some missteps, but unlike Apple they have been willing to reverse-course and fix what they have broken. Is it as good as Apple yet? No, but the difference, which used to be vast, is now relatively small. (We used to have Apple at good solid "A" and Microsoft way down at, maybe a "D+" if we were being nice about it until the release of Win 7. Now it's more like Apple is barely holding out at "B-" and Microsoft is at a solid "C+" and rising.) At the same time, many of the manufacturing techniques we saw only (or nearly only) in Apple products have filtered down to the rest of the computing market. It used to be you would pick up a Windows laptop and it would clearly be a piece of total crap even if it looked reasonably decent on the outside. Pick up an Apple laptop though, and the quality was immediately apparent. Again, the gap has closed and that one probably can't be rectified (there are only so many ways, and so many materials, to make computers out of). Can it be fixed? Yes. Apple needs to do a Microsoft. They need to reverse course and recreate good, usable UIs. They need to get their QA back up and doing, well, anything! They need to go and put back the features, usability, and reliability they have been removing from their software. And they need to do it quickly. I think time is running out...
In addition to the software, there’s also the hardware. It used to be possible to repair and upgrade Macs, but now that is impossible because everything is soldered in, with the exception of the battery, which is glued in.

Then there’s the removal of Magsafe, which is a fantastic connector that doubtlessly saved many Macs.

Another issue is storage. With MacBooks like my 2011 MacBook Pro, you can have a Solid State Drive in hard drive bay and you can swap out the optical drive for a 2 terabyte hard drive, which is an awesome upgrade as it allows you to have the speed of a Solid State Drive as well as the capacity and cost-effectiveness of a hard drive. Unfortunately, modern MacBooks don’t offer this kind of cost-effective storage solution. I don’t expect the return of the optical drive, but it would be nice if Apple put a hard drive bay in the MacBook Pros so you can have a high-capacity hard drive in your laptop instead of the nuisance of having to carry and plug in an external hard drive.

Let’s not forget the iPhone 7. The removal of the headphone jack is a huge step in functionality. The 3.5mm headphone jack has been in use for decades, as consequently is the best way to connect headphones. The removal of the headphone jack forces users to either use Bluetooth headphones or an adapter, neither of which are good. With Bluetooth headphones, you have to worry about battery life, and with non-Apple Bluetooth headphones, you have to deal with pairing issues. The Lighting-to-3.5mm adapter is a nuisance and it’s just one more thing to lose.

Another issue is Ethernet. I realize that a lot of folks don’t use Ethernet anymore due to the near-ubiquity of Wi-Fi, but it’s still necessary in some situations, and it would be really nice if Ethernet could be part of the laptop instead of requiring the user to plug in a Thunderbolt-Ethernet or a USB-C to Ethernet adapter, or even worse, a USB-C to USB-A adapter and a USB-A to Ethernet adapter.

Users of dedicated cameras would benefit from having an SD card slot in their laptop as it allows them to avoid cable clutter. The SD card is arguably the best way to transfer photos from a digital camera. With today’s USB-C-equipped MacBook Pros, you’ll likely have to use a USB-C to USB-A adapter in conjunction with a USB-A to micro USB adapter.

Finally, there’s the issue of USB-C. USB-C is neat, but most peripherals don’t use it, so you’ll end up having to use a number of adapters to be able to plug in your peripherals. Sure, Windows PC manufacturers are putting USB-C in their computers, but only as one of a few other interfaces (i.e. USB-A, Ethernet, SDHC). USB-C might be nice, but its implementation as the only external data interface on a computer should be reserved until such a time as all USB peripherals use it.
 
there was a time when we could trust that apple's marketing and new product development were leading us to innovation.
they were skating to where the puck would be.
but its clear they have lost their way and we can no longer sense they have the same internal mechanisms that achieve results.
product after product is just full of contradictions, trade offs, and destruction of the reasons to stay within apple's sphere of influence.
maybe the epitaph is that apple knew how to make its own sign posts to get there, but didnt realize they were at the top and just kept on till its clear they were already well down the far side of the mountain, on the way down.
they knew the importance of ecosystem when they were fighting against a windows world, but didnt realize the importance of that same ecosystem once they hit market-driving share.
its sheer hubris.
 
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Tim Cook is killing Mac and killing Apple. Updates to Mac lines are few and far between and many lines (like MacPro) and not updated at all.

What's shocking is that Apple still sells MacPro at an unbelievably high price and NONE of the Macs are even VR ready.

That's why creatives are leaving in droves and why Mac sales dropped 10% last year.

Solution is simple: fire Time Cook. Replace him with someone who gets tech.
 
Apple,add at least 1 extra USB port to the 12 Inch Macbook and Replace at least 1 of the USB-C ports of the new MBP with standard USB.

or indeed MANY will ditch Macbooks and swith to Surface.

It's just stupid and no one can defend these wrong design decisions.

Good riddance to them then.
 
True. I've just never understood that argument. Past pressing a physical key its still 1s and 0s sending a command, and is ultimately up to the operating system to decide whether or not to execute. A system failure still requires a restart.

Confusion on the possession of a physical key will continue.
The difference is that a physical key is always there. The escape key the touch bar isn’t always there. Physical keys are also preferable for touch typists.
 
Do a significant number of people really switch from Mac OS to Windows 10? Seems like a bit of a red herring to me even if Apple's current lineup is unimpressive. I can see power users, maybe, who's revenue depends on fast output changing. But is that a big number? I can't see the avg. consumer switching and also Mac seems to remain the preference of kids and college students.

I consider myself an average consumer and I switched from Mac OS back to Windows 10. Not because of Windows 10, but because of Apple's lack of product offering that would have met my needs.

I moved from a 2011 Mac mini to an HP ProDesk 600, and a MacBook to an HP Spectre.
 
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