Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Microsoft Surface Estimated to Have Sold Only 1.7 Million Units Since Launch
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Yes, and when you die 72 virgins will be escort you to heaven. :roll eyes:
You are funny. You chastise a poster for using anecdotal evidence then you proceed to supply your own. What a funny guy you are. Great parody!
It's all about the user experience, and knowing what your users want.
MS has spent the last 25 years working from the premise of centralized computing, forcing whatever the IT admins want onto the sheep. The Surface was designed for some IT admin, not for the average person.
Remember the Apple 1984 Super Bowl commercial? Apple did it--they broke through this mess and are in the process of tearing down this whole structure. The end user is your boss. You work for them. It made Apple billions, and hopefully will continue to do so.
I said this about RIM 2 years ago on Macrumors (check the archives): short the stock.
Short your MS stock now as well. This is the beginning of the end.
Inertia can only take you so far.
MS has spent the last 25 years working from the premise of centralized computing, forcing whatever the IT admins want onto the sheep. The Surface was designed for some IT admin, not for the average person.
Remember the Apple 1984 Super Bowl commercial? Apple did it--they broke through this mess and are in the process of tearing down this whole structure. The end user is your boss. You work for them. It made Apple billions, and hopefully will continue to do so.
I said this about RIM 2 years ago on Macrumors (check the archives): short the stock.
Short your MS stock now as well. This is the beginning of the end.
Inertia can only take you so far.
I don't know if something is getting lost in translation here, but it does do it all. My friend uses it for 3D modelling on the go, Photoshop/Paint Tool Sai with the stylus and for games. That's the biggest feature it has going for it = it does everything.
My only issue with it would be the weight and reliance on Windows 8 (which makes sense as it's a touchscreen focused OS).
And of course Microsoft did their research, things always go wrong no matter who you are (Pipin, iPod boombox style speakers, Ping, Apple Maps).
The one thing that put me off the Surface is the bloat of the software. Why all the bloat? Why does the OS take up so much space, why office take up so much space, recovery tools on there too?!
"On a 32GB Surface model, 29GB is initially available after partitioning.
Take away 5GB for Windows recovery tools, and another 8GB for Windows RT, Microsoft Office, as well as other built-in apps, it leaves 16GB of free space."
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Surface-32GB-Storage-Space-Microsoft,18941.html
It is a pleasure using Numbers, Pages and Keynote on the iPad and takes up a fraction of the device storage space. I do like the keyboard integrated in the case, that is a winner.
In terms of productive software, games and compatibility the iOS ecosystem beats all for diversity and cost.
Also for branding, it's the iPad, that's it, no Pro or RT, simple, use it for play, use it for work, do what fits your needs. Microsoft still don't get that, everything is split into work/play, business/home, fun/no fun.
"On a 32GB Surface model, 29GB is initially available after partitioning.
Take away 5GB for Windows recovery tools, and another 8GB for Windows RT, Microsoft Office, as well as other built-in apps, it leaves 16GB of free space."
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Surface-32GB-Storage-Space-Microsoft,18941.html
It is a pleasure using Numbers, Pages and Keynote on the iPad and takes up a fraction of the device storage space. I do like the keyboard integrated in the case, that is a winner.
In terms of productive software, games and compatibility the iOS ecosystem beats all for diversity and cost.
Also for branding, it's the iPad, that's it, no Pro or RT, simple, use it for play, use it for work, do what fits your needs. Microsoft still don't get that, everything is split into work/play, business/home, fun/no fun.
Apple is perfect, Who said that, ever?
Apple often do its homework more than Microsoft.
Microsoft often sucks because it want to please heavens and earth at once. It is Microsoft strategy.
It is impossible.
I love Apple because of it biz strategy, not because of its products, even if i could afford any of them, i would have not buy them all.
I never said Appe are perfect! Yes, ocasionally I have had problems, however nothing close to the problems I had when I used windows PC. And it all goes back to my original point, MS reputation is not really at it's best, as you were saying that the surface, being MS should be a major sell point. I don't think that is true. It may apply to a fraction of people who are into office use and that kind of stuff but not to the majority. And people like me who are left with a bad taste of it would not even dream of paying that much money for something that runs windows.
Wait until work puts Windows 8 on your computer. Yesterday I was raging at it.
Anyway, Microsoft needs to try again because we are entering the post PC world. Tablets are the future and they will be the growth area, that and smartphones. For PCs, folks are holding onto computers longer and longer since they are generally just using them to surf the web and send email and computers from 5 years ago do that just about as well as modestly priced ones made today. And when Google/Samsung can produce a competent laptop and sell it for $250, then you know the writing is on the wall. Microsoft should just focus on Windows, Office, and paying dividends to its shareholders. But then senior management would be reduced to s skeleton crew. So if senior management is going to remain relevant, they need to get into tablets and smartphones. Hence they have to push on no matter what the setbacks.
There are better portable computers out there for 3D work, which i also do.
Cannot do anything, if it tries to do it all and cannot do it better.
Perhaps that is what you didnt read in between the lines. It was just too obvious.
So, in this "post PC world" full of small screened tablets, who will be creating the operating systems for those machines? The games for those machines? Who will create and maintain the servers that those cloud machines run on?
I understand this is an Apple site so obviously there is a bias in most users, but you represent part of a market and not the whole. PC gaming is gaining year on year, more graphic and game design studios are opening up.
If anything we're just seeing a polarising group and the rise of the "non-user"; the people who would never have bothered with a PC and now rely on simpler devices, instead of the death of computers.
What are these better machines for portable 3D?
It's quite difficult to understand what you're trying to say, sorry! Because you keep saying a machine that does everything (Win 8 apps, backwards compatible with other Windows apps, touchscreen specific apps) can't do those things.
When the Surface was first released i wanted one but thought nah I will wait for the fire sale.
£99 Surface £149 with that flippy flappy keyboard
£99 Surface £149 with that flippy flappy keyboard
Work gave me a surface pro. Gotta say it does more than my iPad. My iPad is great for fart apps and such. Some things the iPad does better... Still don't know if I would have paid the $1,000 price for it though...
Why not buy a HP portable PC for example, a Cintiq?
For professional work, only a MacBook do better than those PC. Just try ZBrush on Windows 8 natively on a MacBook Pro.
Did you ever use those touchscreen apps. yourself for a long stretch of time?
Do you think i am not surrounded by people who use surface.
Developers have shown little interest in rewriting apps to work within a new and rather incomplete Windows RT development framework, from what I have read, for a market that did not yet exist with Microsoft demanding 30% of profits.
Hmm, why didn't that catch on?
iOS was more mature as a development environment in its first release and was updated quickly within a few months with all sorts of new features. Microsoft has a recent history of abandoning new technologies that it finds unprofitable which does not inspire developer confidence.
The thing is that's already the majority of consumers, even if they haven't switched yet. And as tablet software and hardware continues to improve the audience for them will grow even more. PCs certainly will not die, but they will likely decline into niche markets. The desktop especially.
The very first thing I think of when searching for a tablet is the echo system and support. If Apple's developer base is so large that they hold WWDCs, why would a company enter that market segment w/o having at least, the same type of support or close to it? That's like entering the Indy 500 with Buick.
Ballmer is such an idiot
looking at all the stupid decisions he made as CEO of MS...
it is totally insane to predict and produce more products than the company could sell
even Apple, who knows that its products would be successful would not take such a risk...
Microsoft could be doing very well without a failure like him
now that Xbox One is right under his command, let's see how he will handle this...
looking at all the stupid decisions he made as CEO of MS...
it is totally insane to predict and produce more products than the company could sell
even Apple, who knows that its products would be successful would not take such a risk...
Microsoft could be doing very well without a failure like him
now that Xbox One is right under his command, let's see how he will handle this...
Here is the problem.
IT IS WINDOWS.
Every single person I know has at least one major horror story using a windows computer. Why would they ever want to spend that much on a tablet version of it?
The reputation to windows with consumers is.. well a crappy experience.
Does not matter how many BILLIONS of dollars is spent by microsoft, that reputation of Windows is forever it's legacy.
That is why I and many others, will never go back.
FYI, I still have to use windows on a daily basis, and it is has not gotten better since I switched
keep believing that
Let's not forget there are Windows 8 Tablets from many other manufacturers
Microsoft is just reporting their own numbers. Windows 8 tablets from all manufacturers are doing a bit better, especially since the low cost ATOM-based full Windows 8 tablets came to market.
I've owned a Windows 8 tablet for almost a month. I originally purchased it to explore the possibilities that using a full copy of Windows might open up in the tablet arena. I own iOS and Android tablets and both require a certain level of compromise depending on what you're trying to accomplish.
The first thing I will mention are items that have been reported ad nauseam with regard to this particular Windows Tablet (Lenovo K3011 $399 (and $350 on sale). Better to get these nits out of the way so the reader can focus on actual use of the device.
1. I never tried and do not care about the optional keyboard docking charging accessory. It's generally considered to be crap so why bother, besides I use it as a tablet -- no physical keyboard.
2. It's lightweight for a reason (lighter than my Verizon iPad 3). It's all plastic with minimal ports and average battery life. I don't care if it creaks on occasion or if I can bend it. (Nothing really compares to Apple build quality)
3. It's not a high resolution display. I have an iPad 3 and HTC One. I understand the desire for super sharp and crisp displays, however, there's something to be said for having something just work. In showing this to friends, co-workers and colleagues it was universally praised for having a great screen (as long as I didn't mention what I see as slightly fuzzy text, no one noticed). Not everyone cares about super-resolution, battery hog displays. I personally prefer my hi-res Apple and Android screens but for the price it's a decent screen.
OK, now that that is done, let's talk about the computer. I say computer because that's exactly what this is. It's a super-thin, lightweight, fully functioning Windows 8 Computer that runs most any Windows application. It might take some getting used to press and hold instead of right click or some tiny buttons that are too small to easily select without an optional stylus but this is a real computer.
This is a blessing and a curse. The blessing of a full Windows 8 Tablet is that you can run Office 365 (2013) etc and it will function just like your desktop right down to the fancy macros. This is great for applications that don't have an iOS or Android App. Also, almost any website you visit just works. No compromises at all.
However, that brings us to the curse of having a full Windows 8 tablet. There is little to no incentive for app developers to create Windows Apps for Windows Tablet devices that run a full copy of Windows. Why should FedEx create a Fedex Windows App if you can just surf to the website and get the full PC experience? This is particularly true on an 11" tablet like the Lenovo K3011. Had Microsoft developed Windows RT as a cross platform mobile OS for Tablets and Smartphones that was optimized for the smaller display and memory footprints associated with such devices and offered no full Windows version, developers and content providers would have waited to see if Microsoft sales warranted development but they would have at least considered it. With a full featured tablet PC in the $350-$400 range that weighs 1.5lbs and can provide a true desktop web experience the incentive to develop and support Windows Apps beyond the Windows Smartphone versions is limited. This is true even though these inexpensive tablets have weaker processors and only 2GB of RAM. The advent of inexpensive RAM has seen the RAM requirements of some Windows Applications to skyrocket so you will see fairly regular warnings about memory running low, please close some applications. I just dismiss the warning dialogue and keep working. I believe this "App" issue will continue to plague Windows tablets but in many cases it just doesn't matter because you can almost always visit the full website.
I've found this to be a great device for mobile computing, especially for Internet and e-mail and editing the occasional office document. Also, watching youtube, movies or TV episodes works well, even on websites that don't allow Android or iOS devices to stream.
You also cannot underestimate the value of being able to use an Micro SD Card to easily transfer files to my tablet PC. It's even easier than doing so on my Android devices. You can even trick Windows Applications that refuse to use removable storage to use the SD Card for installations. Use Disk Manager and mount the drive as a directory under C:\ and you're all set. No other tablet comes close to the full functionality available on this inexpensive device. However, on this particular tablet the Micro SD Card slot is difficult to access (Lenovo includes a tool - I manage w/o it but just sayin). I am regularly frustrated by the hoops I have to jump through to move files in bulk to my iOS device.
Don't get me wrong. There are times I miss applications that are only available in the Apple ecosystem (particularly their mobile apps) iMessage and the Automatic App (BETA) but for the average person who already knows Windows you couldn't find a better device for the price. There's a certain simplicity to using the iOS version of Fedex or Bank of America vs. going to their respective websites.
Microsoft's biggest mistake was trying to sell at Apple's price points. A full i5 Tablet is just too expensive for a Windows tablet device. Your average Windows user who isn't a gamer usually is not willing and in many cases not able to pay $800-$900 for a computer. These really inexpensive Windows tablets can do almost everything a full size machine can do (except gaming) especially when paired with a keyboard and mouse. I've taken to using it for all the proprietary work apps that don't work on my Mac, iPad or Android devices.
If someone builds a Windows Tablet with better quality construction/design, 4GB of RAM and a slightly faster CPU at the same $399 price point you might see this sort of device take off. Sell a $500 bundle that includes the tablet and a keyboard/trackpad combo and a HDMI cable to connect to an external display and many cost conscious consumers might just consider one of these as their primary system.
Cheers,
Microsoft is just reporting their own numbers. Windows 8 tablets from all manufacturers are doing a bit better, especially since the low cost ATOM-based full Windows 8 tablets came to market.
I've owned a Windows 8 tablet for almost a month. I originally purchased it to explore the possibilities that using a full copy of Windows might open up in the tablet arena. I own iOS and Android tablets and both require a certain level of compromise depending on what you're trying to accomplish.
The first thing I will mention are items that have been reported ad nauseam with regard to this particular Windows Tablet (Lenovo K3011 $399 (and $350 on sale). Better to get these nits out of the way so the reader can focus on actual use of the device.
1. I never tried and do not care about the optional keyboard docking charging accessory. It's generally considered to be crap so why bother, besides I use it as a tablet -- no physical keyboard.
2. It's lightweight for a reason (lighter than my Verizon iPad 3). It's all plastic with minimal ports and average battery life. I don't care if it creaks on occasion or if I can bend it. (Nothing really compares to Apple build quality)
3. It's not a high resolution display. I have an iPad 3 and HTC One. I understand the desire for super sharp and crisp displays, however, there's something to be said for having something just work. In showing this to friends, co-workers and colleagues it was universally praised for having a great screen (as long as I didn't mention what I see as slightly fuzzy text, no one noticed). Not everyone cares about super-resolution, battery hog displays. I personally prefer my hi-res Apple and Android screens but for the price it's a decent screen.
OK, now that that is done, let's talk about the computer. I say computer because that's exactly what this is. It's a super-thin, lightweight, fully functioning Windows 8 Computer that runs most any Windows application. It might take some getting used to press and hold instead of right click or some tiny buttons that are too small to easily select without an optional stylus but this is a real computer.
This is a blessing and a curse. The blessing of a full Windows 8 Tablet is that you can run Office 365 (2013) etc and it will function just like your desktop right down to the fancy macros. This is great for applications that don't have an iOS or Android App. Also, almost any website you visit just works. No compromises at all.
However, that brings us to the curse of having a full Windows 8 tablet. There is little to no incentive for app developers to create Windows Apps for Windows Tablet devices that run a full copy of Windows. Why should FedEx create a Fedex Windows App if you can just surf to the website and get the full PC experience? This is particularly true on an 11" tablet like the Lenovo K3011. Had Microsoft developed Windows RT as a cross platform mobile OS for Tablets and Smartphones that was optimized for the smaller display and memory footprints associated with such devices and offered no full Windows version, developers and content providers would have waited to see if Microsoft sales warranted development but they would have at least considered it. With a full featured tablet PC in the $350-$400 range that weighs 1.5lbs and can provide a true desktop web experience the incentive to develop and support Windows Apps beyond the Windows Smartphone versions is limited. This is true even though these inexpensive tablets have weaker processors and only 2GB of RAM. The advent of inexpensive RAM has seen the RAM requirements of some Windows Applications to skyrocket so you will see fairly regular warnings about memory running low, please close some applications. I just dismiss the warning dialogue and keep working. I believe this "App" issue will continue to plague Windows tablets but in many cases it just doesn't matter because you can almost always visit the full website.
I've found this to be a great device for mobile computing, especially for Internet and e-mail and editing the occasional office document. Also, watching youtube, movies or TV episodes works well, even on websites that don't allow Android or iOS devices to stream.
You also cannot underestimate the value of being able to use an Micro SD Card to easily transfer files to my tablet PC. It's even easier than doing so on my Android devices. You can even trick Windows Applications that refuse to use removable storage to use the SD Card for installations. Use Disk Manager and mount the drive as a directory under C:\ and you're all set. No other tablet comes close to the full functionality available on this inexpensive device. However, on this particular tablet the Micro SD Card slot is difficult to access (Lenovo includes a tool - I manage w/o it but just sayin). I am regularly frustrated by the hoops I have to jump through to move files in bulk to my iOS device.
Don't get me wrong. There are times I miss applications that are only available in the Apple ecosystem (particularly their mobile apps) iMessage and the Automatic App (BETA) but for the average person who already knows Windows you couldn't find a better device for the price. There's a certain simplicity to using the iOS version of Fedex or Bank of America vs. going to their respective websites.
Microsoft's biggest mistake was trying to sell at Apple's price points. A full i5 Tablet is just too expensive for a Windows tablet device. Your average Windows user who isn't a gamer usually is not willing and in many cases not able to pay $800-$900 for a computer. These really inexpensive Windows tablets can do almost everything a full size machine can do (except gaming) especially when paired with a keyboard and mouse. I've taken to using it for all the proprietary work apps that don't work on my Mac, iPad or Android devices.
If someone builds a Windows Tablet with better quality construction/design, 4GB of RAM and a slightly faster CPU at the same $399 price point you might see this sort of device take off. Sell a $500 bundle that includes the tablet and a keyboard/trackpad combo and a HDMI cable to connect to an external display and many cost conscious consumers might just consider one of these as their primary system.
Cheers,