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I second that! Here in Sweden companies are not allowed to make commercials like the ones Apple does - your are not allowed to bad-mouth competitors.

And - the PC guy is actually quite charming...after seeing these commercials I relate more to him than the other guy - even if I'm a Mac-head since along time. Apple - please be more creative, fun, different...

It has been a long time since the last one, sort of hoped they had stopped them.

I would prefer it if they would just advertise the good points about Leopard rather than bash Vista.
 
Is it just me, or is Apple the only one throwing blows in the Mac VS PC battle?
I've read posts saying the same things about 10.5 as the commercial states about vista. Is vista really so bad that apple can say so with such confidence?
I think the timing was perfect with the first (and most excellent) anti-Vista ad, the one with a secret service-type guy representing Vista's UAC. That ad was so right. UAC is truly awful and a perfect example of just how bad committee decisions can get over at Microsoft.

However, now that most of the creases have been ironed out and most third party drivers and software works with Vista, it's a little misguided to introduce an ad like this -- the worst part is already over.

Most of the troubles with Vista relate to A) the introduction of a brand new hardware driver model, and B) a brand new desktop graphics engine. These two things have been the same since Windows 95. It's a major overhaul and one that cannot be done without speedbumps.

The question is, is Apple really in a position to slag competitors who are in a temporary transitional limbo? In case somebody forgot, it took ages before OS X was livable. The first release was slow and buggy as hell, and little to no software worked on it. It wasn't until the fall of 2002 when Jaguar came out that OS X became a serious alternative to OS 9 or Windows in terms of software availability and stability -- a year and a half after the release of Cheetah. 18 months where "nothing worked", and now they're publically belly laughing at Vista over the same thing...

Oh well. Leopard isn't all that buggy, really. I've had a couple of crashes and freezes and a few peculiar graphic bugs, but nothing that stops me from working. Still, you gotta wonder why Leopard isn't virtually flawless -- it was built to work on a few hundred different hardware combinations hand picked by Apple themselves. Vista was built to work on millions of hardware combinations that Microsoft has no control over. It would be a miracle if Vista was virtually bug free, and it's shameful that Leopard isn't.
 
I applaud Apple for producing such a relatively flawless software release.

Anyone with experience on a team developing a large software package knows what a daunting task this is!

Even with the best, most dedicated minds at work, there will always be program errors (bugs). The vast majority of the Apple customer base seems to understand this and expect that suitable corrections will be issued over the next few updates.

That being said, the Leopard launch seems to be more successful than the Vista launch. We are comparing apples to oranges just a bit, since Vista is much larger and more complex. Yet annecdotally I see far fewer complaints against Leopard. Just about every Windows user seems to regret Vista or have some kind of serious complaint.
 
I have Vista and I have Leopard. The only OS I had to downgrade from was Apple's piece of crap OS. Keyboard freezing all the time, poor performance. Awful. Back to Tiger until Apple fixes their crap. The irony of them ripping on Vista is just too funny considering how bad their new OS is. As far as touting "intuitive" software, that's a joke. The included multimedia software packages included in Vista blow iLife's crappy suite of software away. I like my Mac, but it's clearly the Wii of computing. Made for babies, grandmothers, and people that don't know a damn thing about computing.
Oh, come on now. The included multimedia software (I'm assuming you're talking about Vista's DVD Maker, Movie Maker, Photo Gallery and Media Center) does not blow *anything* away. While Media Center spanks Front Row in terms of features (Front Row doesn't record TV, for one), Front Row still has a slicker and more intuitive front end. In choosing between PC and Mac to plug in to my TV, I went for the Mac. Most of the software included with Vista Ultimate is underwhelming to say the least (some things, like Backup and Defrag are actually worse than in XP). And while it's nice to have a shiny new desktop graphics engine in Vista, they could at least have spent 3 minutes optimizing it. Graphics run smoother on my Mac Mini w/ Leopard and a puny 64 MB video card than it does on my Dell notebook with a 256 MB video card. And for the love of God, why haven't they done anything about Font management yet? It hasn't changed since Windows 3.1! It's primitive beyond belief. This is an area where OS X spanks Vista till it bleeds...

But there are areas where Apple could learn from Microsoft. For instance the "Previous Versions" feature that lets you roll back to older versions of files and folders without attaching an external drive (with Time Machine, Apple somehow confused rollback with backup, so now you have to drag an external drive around with your laptop... 'time machine' indeed, that is so 2002!).

Or, they could learn from Windows Update. The one in Vista updates silently and doesn't call for your attention unless it's about to install something major. "Software Update" in OSX is more like the rudimentary crap Microsoft introduced in Windows 2000... Leopard still throws a big ol' dialog box in your face and you have to click through ridiculous license agreements for updates to software you've already agreed to install... sigh.

Apple might also wanna think about looking at how the Windows Media Player library works, i.e. that it monitors selected folders so that your music library is always 'live'. In iTunes you have to add to the library manually which feels a bit 1997.

While Leopard certainly wasn't made for babies and grandmothers, I think that people who don't know **** about computers should definitely have Macs because PC is only suitable for power users. Newbies only screw the machines up horribly and attract viruses and malware like manure attracts flies, it's like giving and 16-year old the keys to a Ferrari. They'll spin off the road or run smack into a concrete wall in less than a mile. Power users should have both Mac and PC, IMHO.
 
Has everyone missed the point? The point of the "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" ads is to make people just stop for a minute and think about checking out a Mac and they do so by making us laugh at the same time. Yes we all know that PCs are capable of a lot more than the ads would make us believe but the whole point is to highlight how wonderfully easy things are to do on a Mac that maybe are not so easy to do on a PC.

When Apple first started running this ad campaigh, I was a 20+ year PC and Microsoft Windows user and had never used a Mac in my life. Even as a die hard PC user the ads still made me laugh, especially when they ironically pointed out real flaws with PCs running Windows. I am now a 100% Mac user and I have to say it was partially due to these commericials that I wanted to check out Mac's and see if they really were as awesome as "Mac" made them out to be in the ads. I did a lot of research before I made the switch but definatley these ads were the starting point to me even thinking about a Mac and I think that is the whole point.
 
I really don't mean to be obstinate about this, but just because it's not offensive to you doesn't mean one is simply being "politically correct" for pointing out that it is offensive to others. Try to think about things from someone else's perspective for a change.

Obviously the pot is calling the kettle black because it's considered an insult to be called black - get it?

:apple:

Hey Jetson, here's the origin of that phrase.

Both the pot and the kettle are black...see? Thus, while the pot is trying to point out the kettle's difference from itself, it's actually highlighting and emphasizing their similarity. This is what is known as 'hypocrisy', along with 'irony' in this situation. The color has nothing to do with it. You might as well say it's like "the spoon calling the fork silver" with the same effect.
 
Hmm. Considering there are a good number of people who want to go back to Tiger... sounds like a case of the pot calling the kettle black. :rolleyes:

Not that many people... and they're just the same ones who complain every time a new OS comes out.

Have you seen/heard all the people fleeing Vista... Leopard and Vista wannabee turncoats are two completely different animals, so to speak.

MacRumors should post a poll asking this question.

It's the same thing... complainers would absolutely jump at the opportunity to complain, while those who like Leopard would click past it.
 
Hey Jetson, here's the origin of that phrase.

Both the pot and the kettle are black...see? Thus, while the pot is trying to point out the kettle's difference from itself, it's actually highlighting and emphasizing their similarity. This is what is known as 'hypocrisy', along with 'irony' in this situation. The color has nothing to do with it. You might as well say it's like "the spoon calling the fork silver" with the same effect.

Don't you love people who try to twist any reference to "black" into a racist thing? It reminds me of that old thing about how the "white man's" language is racist because black and dark are synonymous with evil and bad. That all sounds really convincing unless you're like me and have studied indigenous African poetry and notice that the good-bad/white-black dichotomy exists there too (hmm... I guess that means indigenous Africans must be racist against dark-skinned people, huh? :rolleyes:) Turns out it comes from the archetypcal experience of day and night, the latter being associated with danger and evil as that was when predators were likely to be prowling. Nothing to do with race, just like the "pot and kettle" thing. Anyone saying otherwise is either ignorant or looking to start an argument.
 
Most of the troubles with Vista relate to A) the introduction of a brand new hardware driver model, and B) a brand new desktop graphics engine. These two things have been the same since Windows 95. It's a major overhaul and one that cannot be done without speedbumps.

MS destroyed what competition they had through illegal means. They don't deserve anyone's sympathy.
Apple may have a bit of playful fun and engage in friendly banter, but they have never resorted to the underhand tactics that MS have engaged in behind closed doors.
 
Have you seen/heard all the people fleeing Vista... Leopard and Vista wannabee turncoats are two completely different animals, so to speak.
They're not all that different, really. Vista turncoats fall into a few different categories:

1) Those who tried to install it on old hardware that can't handle it.
This is true of Leopard as well. It runs like absolute crap on my Mini G4. I had to switch off all bells & whistles (dock magnification etc) and it was still slow as hell. Not too smooth on my Mac Mini Core 2 Duo 2.0GHz either. You need at least a 128 MB video card and 2 GB RAM (if you plan to run any software...) to get a nice user experience out of Leopard, and those requirements are Vista territory.

2) Those who rely on software that won't run on Vista. There was some software that had compatibility issues (it ran, but poorly), such as Adobe's applications. This is true of Leopard as well. Lots of incompatibility lists floating around out there... including parts of Adobe CS3. Adobe says this will be addressed in December.

3) Those who can't let go of stinky old peripherals which manufacturers can't be arsed to write new drivers for. Well, you can't say M$ didn't try; Vista ships with 19,500 drivers. This is less of an issue on OS X, but still true of anything that requires third party drivers, such as external audio and MIDI peripherals that won't be supported in Leopard. My Firewire audio device/mixer, Yamaha 01X, doesn't work with the Tiger drivers. Yamaha says they'll address it in January '08, but I'm not holding my breath, seeing as the Tiger drivers were released only 2 months ago...

4) Hardcore gamers. Guys who demand max performance out of all components. Due to lots of issues with Vista drivers, particularly NVidia's, Vista sucked as a gaming platform initially. Most of these issues are resolved now. But I can't stress enough how badly NVidia has handled this. They're the only company whose Vista drivers are actually getting worse with every release... Obviously this isn't much of an issue on Mac, as hardcore gamers tend to look, um, elsewhere...

As for myself, I installed Vista on the release day and I had plenty of issues with drivers (wireless, graphics and audio) and some software. By late April, everything was resolved -- new software was out and decent drivers had been released. So I've been running a stable Vista setup for 7 months now and I wouldn't want to go back to XP anymore than you'd want to revert to OS9...
 
Its kind of ironic. Considering the multitude of problems and money I had to spend by upgrading to Leopard, apple should follow suit andget a PR person of their own.
 
Its kind of ironic. Considering the multitude of problems and money I had to spend by upgrading to Leopard, apple should follow suit andget a PR person of their own.
The question is whether you feel it was worth it...many PC users don't...
 
MS destroyed what competition they had through illegal means. They don't deserve anyone's sympathy.
Apple may have a bit of playful fun and engage in friendly banter, but they have never resorted to the underhand tactics that MS have engaged in behind closed doors.
I can't for the life of me understand how that comment relates to what I wrote (the part you quoted), but anyway, it's not quite as black and white as you try to make it.

These days, Apple is the monopoly crazy one, but they fly under the radar because A) they're small, and B) their fanclub of yes-men will applaud anything they do and defend it to death. Apple isn't quite as cute as you think.

Not so many years ago there were Mac clones, and lots of third party partnerships when it came to software (Netscape, IE and Outlook Express all shipped with MacOS at some point). Today they have monopoly on the hardware again, the OS is exclusive to that hardware, and they're trying their darndest to hog the entire Mac software business for themselves. They're including a shamelessly Firefox-resembling web browser with the system (the same thing MS got lynched for), plus iTunes, Front Row, QuickTime, iDVD, iMovie, iChat, GarageBand and Mail. No openings for third parties there. They challenged Adobe with their Premiere and After Effects killers Final Cut and Shake. Adobe got really miffed and stopped developing Premiere + AE for MacOS (they recently started again). Then they went ahead and bought Emagic and turned Logic into an Apple product and immediately discontinued the Windows version of Logic, forcing Logic users to go Mac. And with Logic 8 they've dropped the price to a ridiculously low point in order to erase the competition (Cubase, Ableton Live, Digital Performer etc). I'm sure they will challenge ProTools soon enough. But there's still one more to push out of the nest -- they're working hard on getting rid of MS Office from the Mac scene with iWork (featuring Word, Excel and PowerPoint equivalents so far). After that they've pretty much killed all third parties, except maybe Adobe... but who knows, maybe Apple has a Photoshop killer up their sleeve. And then of course there's the iPods which will only work with iTunes, no opening for third parties there either (IIRC, they're getting sued in the EU over this). They're getting away with being ten times worse than Microsoft on their own territory, because their territory is small. Had the positions been reversed, Steve Jobs would have so many anti-trust papers on his desk he would probably be hiding on a remote island or the moon.

Meanwhile, Microsoft is scared sh*tless of getting entangled in more lawsuits and bending over backwards in order to not step on any third party toes. They even have special Vista editions for the EU where Media Player and Movie Maker are not included. A lot of the software that ships with Vista (Backup, Defrag etc) is suspiciously rudimentary, and I wondered why, until I stumbled upon this sentence in the blurb about Vista's "Sync Center": "Though it unifies your various sync activities, please note that Sync Center does not replace third-party sync tools or functionality. So that's why they don't dare do the Apple thing and include everything you need with the OS, just good enough to get you interested in such a product but you'll have to turn to a third party to get all the functionality you want.

Its kind of ironic. Considering the multitude of problems and money I had to spend by upgrading to Leopard, apple should follow suit andget a PR person of their own.
That can't be... you joined in 2002! According to various zealots earlier in this thread, anyone posting negative remarks about Leopard is a PC user who joined three days ago to spread FUD and pretend to be a Mac user. :p
nvbrit said:
Has everyone missed the point? The point of the "I'm a Mac, I'm a PC" ads is to make people just stop for a minute and think about checking out a Mac and they do so by making us laugh at the same time. Yes we all know that PCs are capable of a lot more than the ads would make us believe but the whole point is to highlight how wonderfully easy things are to do on a Mac that maybe are not so easy to do on a PC.
I'd love it if the ads would "highlight how wonderfully easy things are to do on a Mac" but they never show that, they just show a smug jerk claiming so. These ads don't seem to address potential switchers at all, it's more as if they've been custom written to please the diehard Macheads who love to wallow in FUD, myths and half-truths about PC (you know, the guys who maintain that PCs are "beige boxes" that contract viruses and malware before you plug them in... oh and the "blue screen of death" of course).
I liked the ones about the myriad of Vista editions and the one about UAC, because those were very true. Touché. But the rest is just dumb. Like the one about PCs shipping bloated with trialware. Any PC I ever bought was stripped to the bone, not a single byte on there except the OS. My old Mac Mini on the other hand came with a crapload of preinstalled trial versions and whatnot; iWork, Office 2004 trial, and a couple of lame games (something with dinosaurs I think). Or the "genius" who says she can help with "going wireless" (as if PCs don't do that... then again I guess some Macheads actually think that, I remember one who claimed that PCs need 'weird stuff sticking out of them' in order to get wireless functionality).
 
Maybe the reason Apple is still running this PC vs. Mac series of ads is because they are working ;)

I know we'd all like to see something new. But face it, Apple has just posted the most profitable quarter ever (I think). When these ads get stale for the demographic they are aimed toward, Apple will change them.
 
Maybe the reason Apple is still running this PC vs. Mac series of ads is because they are working ;)

I know we'd all like to see something new. But face it, Apple has just posted the most profitable quarter ever (I think). When these ads get stale for the demographic they are aimed toward, Apple will change them.

wow, someone who actually stated facts and makes sense. Seems there are a lot of whiners on here, very odd given that this is a Mac fan site.
 
I'm guessing that has more to do with iPod, iTunes, iPhone and Safari for Windows than the "Hi, I'm a Mac" ads.

I think iPod, iTunes, iPhone and Safari are there to present PC users with the real evidence of Apple's quality. However, when it gets right down to it, those things are not making people pause and say, "Hey, Apple also makes computers." It's these ads that are doing that. These other things support that, can make a user take the idea seriously of owning a computer made by Apple.

But it's still wrong on so many levels. If you look in any ol' "Business Practices for Dummies" book, page 1, chapter 1, you'll find a passage about the golden rule of focusing on your own strengths and never belittling your competition. It's the lowliest and most vulgar form

First, Apple has never followed anyone else's rule book when it comes to business and their advertising so I'm not sure how that would matter. No "Business Practices for Dummies" book would ever advise you to spend an obscene amount of cash on a single ad, run it once during the Superbowl and never again, and yet Apple did exactly that and that ad has become a well-known part of computing and advertising history.

Secondly, I would agree with you if there weren't so many other examples of companies taking shots at each other in advertising in both outright and subtle ways. I think it's just part of the way things are done. I'm puzzled why other companies can take shots at competitors and nobody gives it a second thought but when Apple does it, it starts up this whole debate about the propriety of it all. Seems like a double-standard.
 
I can't for the life of me understand how that comment relates to what I wrote (the part you quoted), but anyway, it's not quite as black and white as you try to make it.

You seem to be weeping for poor-old Microsoft, which is why I quoted your post citing how “hard” it was for them with all their billions of dollars to deliver technologies competitors had produced years before and make them work.

These days, Apple is the monopoly crazy one, but they fly under the radar because A) they're small, and B) their fanclub of yes-men will applaud anything they do and defend it to death. Apple isn't quite as cute as you think.

I said they did not engage in under hand tactics.

Not so many years ago there were Mac clones

That lost Apple money. Bad business, so they got out.

lots of third party partnerships when it came to software (Netscape, IE and Outlook Express all shipped with MacOS at some point)

Microsoft offer Entourage Mail and could include Outlook Express, but choose not to. Microsoft also chose to stop developing IE for the Mac (see later when we get onto Safari). "Netscape" still exists on the platform. People just choose not to use it in great numbers.

Today they have monopoly on the hardware again

Just an Canon, Sony, Dell and any other company has a “monopoly” on their hardware.

The OS is exclusive to that hardware

Yes, this is the case with most devices. When one buys a washing machine, you get the hardware and software, same with a car, a camera, television etc.

One of the only places where the hardware-software is sold separately is the PC platform and much of the success was due to the signing of exclusive OEM contracts with vendors.

The same strategy was applied by Microsoft to digital music and they failed dismally (plays for sure™).

and they're trying their darndest to hog the entire Mac software business for themselves.

Evidence please? Good Mac software companies have always existed and will always exist. I use stuff from Omni, MacroMates, Panic, MacRabbit, VMWare, Microsoft AND have paid money for them. I know many people who have done the same.

Apple needed to get healthy, and that meant having good software to run on their OS. If that software did not exist, they built it themselves (you may remember that not all of the software developers were initially leaping for joy at the prospect of doing Mac OS X software).

They're including a shamelessly Firefox-resembling web browser with the system (the same thing MS got lynched for)

This is where you need to get your facts in order
[1] IE had been discontinued by Microsoft. Apple didn't tell/bride/request MS do this.
[2] Firefox was still in beta when Safari was released.

Apple has two options:
[1] "Wait and see" if anyone created a Web Browser, and ship an "internet ready" OS without a good Web Browser for however long it takes for a third party to possibly produce one.
[2] Make one yourself.

Unlike IE 7, Apple choose the KHTML engine to make WebKit, which is open source. It is being used by Google on their Android mobile platform.



You now go on and list a load of software which does not demostrate your point very well.

Apple released these because there was nothing on the market for the Mac like it. That is very different to seeing someone has a good idea worth a bit of money and copying it.

QuickTime

QuickTime was a really innovative product when it launched in 1991.

QuickTime isn't the little media player that sits in the Dock! It's a key framework used by the OS used for all multimedia playback. Although the Framework is proprietary, notice how Apple always chooses standard codes, from AAC audio to H.264 video.


Another very innovative product in 2001.

Front Row

Again, no one had anything like it on the Mac.


Launched in 2001. How many easy-to-use DVD production tools were there then?


Launched in 1999, when there where very few good consumer video editors.


Again, Apple needed a Mail client, others are available. Many people use web mail. Apple has never tried to kill off the competition using underhand tactics.

No openings for third parties there

Mail has “Default email reader” option where you can pick a third party app.
Mail and Safari have “Default RSS reader” option where you can pick a third party app.
Safari has “Default Web Browser” option where you can pick a third party app.
iChat has “Default IM Application” option where you can pick a third party app.
Image Capture has option where you can pick a third party app when inserting a camera.

So in reality there are plenty of openings for third parties. Some of the third party apps just aren't as good as Apple's.

They challenged Adobe with their Premiere and After Effects killers Final Cut and Shake. Adobe got really miffed and stopped developing Premiere + AE for MacOS (they recently started again).

This is quite a nice re-writing of history to look favourable towards Adobe and less than favourably towards Apple.

[1] Why should Adobe be challenged? I guess competition is ok for some and not for others?
[2] Apple wanted a good pro video editor for OS X and Premiere wasn't delivering the goods at the time.
[3] The reason they are developing for the Mac is because there is money in it for them, because the Mac platform is strong again, but it wouldn't be the case if Apple hadn't delivered the good apps that made the OS attractive.

Then they went ahead and bought Emagic and turned Logic into an Apple product and immediately discontinued the Windows version of Logic, forcing Logic users to go Mac.

Not the smartest move. I'll give you that one.

But there's still one more to push out of the nest -- they're working hard on getting rid of MS Office from the Mac scene with iWork (featuring Word, Excel and PowerPoint equivalents so far).

Those are consumer apps, much like the old AppleWorks, which lived side-by-side Office.

Microsoft gave up on the Mac in 1994. They did come back a few years later, but whose to say they won't do the same again. iWork is an insurance policy.

After that they've pretty much killed all third parties

Plainly not true, see above point. And there are more apps coming, like the just released pixelmator and flow.

I have no idea how long you have had a Mac, but you seem to be very disrespectful of the platform and all the developers using it. It's a thriving environment. If Apple were so keen on eradicating third parties, why is WWDC getting bigger every year and why do they make developer tools which help third parties integrate with to the address book, time machine, quicklook etc.

except maybe Adobe... but who knows, maybe Apple has a Photoshop killer up their sleeve.

So what if they did? Adobe has to keep delivering with improvements to Photoshop. They have no reason to be complacent. If Apple does something better, then it is up to Adobe to raise their game. That is how competition works.

And then of course there's the iPods which will only work with iTunes, no opening for third parties there either (IIRC, they're getting sued in the EU over this).

This is the case with most players. Most recently the Zune only works with Zune software.

You have two choices with iPod. Take it or leave it. There are commercial players from Sony, Samsung, Creative, SanDisk, iRiver, Microsoft etc. Apple has beaten these to number one in a fair and free fight. No dirty tricks, no rigged ballot boxes.

The EU has an issue with iTunes songs being priced different across Europe.


They're getting away with being ten times worse than Microsoft on their own territory, because their territory is small.

Not true. Example: MS actively plotted to bring down Netscape. Apple thought “Oh, looks like we don't have a good Web Browser on the platform, let's make one ourselves and release the source for the rendering engine so everyone can look at it and improve upon it”. Furthermore, we can let all our developers use a WebKit view in their own Applications.

Two very different approaches see?

Meanwhile, Microsoft is scared sh*tless of getting entangled in more lawsuits and bending over backwards in order to not step on any third party toes.

This is there own making. If they hadn't abused their power to begin with they would not be in this position. The issue is not with their monopoly, the issue is abuse of power.

So that's why they don't dare do the Apple thing and include everything you need with the OS, just good enough to get you interested in such a product but you'll have to turn to a third party to get all the functionality you want.

Which is why many Windows users browse the web with Internet Explorer, check their email with Outlook, write documents in Microsoft Word, manage spreadsheets in Excel, view movies in Windows Media Player, use Windows Live! Instant Messenger, develop applications using .NET and stay protected with Windows Live One Care.

All because Microsoft is so interested in protecting their third parties.

To paint a picture of "poor-old unfortunate" Microsoft against "halfway between the devil and Hitler" Apple is damn right misleading.
 
Anuba said:
Then they went ahead and bought Emagic and turned Logic into an Apple product and immediately discontinued the Windows version of Logic, forcing Logic users to go Mac.
Not the smartest move. I'll give you that one.


Not the smartest move. I'll give you that one.
It was the smartest move.

1) Apple needed the audio production technology for Garageband and other Apple-based audio apps.

2) MOST IMPORTANTLY: tying Logic to the Mac enabled (enables) Apple to wed core services of their operating system with audio recording in a way that they could never achieve in the ocean of windows. A DAW is not like a browser. From an engineering perspective and from a what's-best-for-the-customer perspective, making Logic a mac-only application is by far the best choice. Logic Studio is proof of that, and future versions of Logic will leverage the operating system even more and allow Apple to deliver increasingly powerful, flexible, delightful, and affordable recording studios.

3) The combined price of the software plus a mac is not prohibitive to any musician/engineer considering a serious DAW. If someone has a PC and cannot afford a Mac, then there are more than enough DAWs for the PC. But if someone really wants Logic, then the cost of a Mac does not drive them away.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/26/b...59&ei=5124&partner=permalink&exprod=permalink

Business / Media & Advertising
Student’s Ad Gets a Remake, and Makes the Big Time
By STUART ELLIOTT
Published: October 26, 2007
In a trend known as consumer-generated content, an 18-year-old student and Apple devotee was hired to make a television commercial for Apple’s new iPod Touch.

“I was sitting on the bus and I got this e-mail on my phone,” Mr. Haley, a native of Warwick, England, said in an interview yesterday from the University of Leeds, where he is a “fresher,” or first-year student.

I cannot believe you got caught up in this viral marketing coup! Nick Haley is the LonelyGirl of Madison Avenue, and the initial YouTube video was only phase 1 of a multi-staged artfully-executed professional campaign from start to finish. Brilliant, but staged. Who do you think prepared the quote "I was sitting on the bus and I got this e-mail on my phone" subtly perpetuating the talking points of the iPhone marketing campaign? Nothing off-the-cuff about that.

Incidentally, do you think it's just a coincidence that Nick Haley also plays the Mac guy in the "Hi. I'm a Mac. I'm a PC" ad campaign, or that Nick Haley is the guy who describes eating dinner with his girlfriend and girlfriend's boss in the latest iPhone ad, and also happens to be the guy who describes Leopard's latest features in the informative video posted to Apple's site? Do you still think Nick Haley is just a regular guy who posted his own little video to YouTube and got a call from C/D? Please tell me you're not that gullible!
 
It was the smartest move.

1) Apple needed the audio production technology for Garageband and other Apple-based audio apps.

2) MOST IMPORTANTLY: tying Logic to the Mac enabled (enables) Apple to wed core services of their operating system with audio recording in a way that they could never achieve in the ocean of windows. A DAW is not like a browser. From an engineering perspective and from a what's-best-for-the-customer perspective, making Logic a mac-only application is by far the best choice. Logic Studio is proof of that, and future versions of Logic will leverage the operating system even more and allow Apple to deliver increasingly powerful, flexible, delightful, and affordable recording studios.

3) The combined price of the software plus a mac is not prohibitive to any musician/engineer considering a serious DAW. If someone has a PC and cannot afford a Mac, then there are more than enough DAWs for the PC. But if someone really wants Logic, then the cost of a Mac does not drive them away!

All valid points from a technical perspective. From a PR perspective it looks bad, but any negative press is quickly forgotten, while the benefits you outlined stay for the duration of the product. That said, I could understand a Windows user being frustrated with the decision if they had existing hardware in place.

Apple have been able to deliver some of their core services to Windows. Bonjour, QuickTime, WebKit and their text rendering engine.
 
I don't care much for these ads.

It's so difficult choosing between a PC and a Mac these days.

A friend of mine is looking for a laptop (PC/Mac) and yesterday we went to Best Buy to check em out.

I felt like I was thrown into the corner, I really had nothing to say when I saw aisle after aisle of pc laptops.

All of them had great hardware inside, 2 gigs of ram standard, 250 gig hard drives inside the laptops, I felt like **** sitting there.

Then of course, you got the same ole' white MacBook, with an 80 gig drive and no superdrive.

Hopefully my friend ends up with a Mac when this is all settled, because I told him if he buys a Vista laptop, I'm not helping his sorry ass if things start going downhill for him.

Also, I have to say, the Leopard bashing is a bit ridiculous right now. Leopard was a beta only a month ago and just got released. We are on 10.5.0. ZERO updates right now. There are lots of updates to come and Apple sure as hell knows it. They are working on it as we speak.

If you are a Professional, why the hell would you upgrade to Leopard so fast?

Ok that's enough talkin for me.
 
with the larger than number of unacceptable problems with Leopard I dont think APPLE should get too smug in bashing VISTA.

Imagine my embarrassment, when I finally convinced a PC friend to buy a Mac only to have to make excuses as to why this didnt work properly and that caused kernal panics, crashes etc,

The final insult-Boot Camp telling me that it "cannot be used with this version of OS X please-upgrade"-WTF?! It CAME with the OS, which was a wiped HD, and a fresh install with nothing else added save the 2-3 Software updates. Something is seriously the f*ck wrong here,
And now we read that the firewall isnt up to snuff-in fact-easy to get through
And there is serious memory bug
which make one think that APPLE said "Oh, the hell with it! Lets push it out Oct 26, and we'll finish it later-letting our customers become beta testers."
Try buying a new SUV which wasnt quite finished, and you had to take it in every so aften as the parts became available.
Id drive the damn thing through the showroom window. This borders on APPLE telling its loyal customers that they consider us, the lowly consumer, usless piles of-----with wallets.
 
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