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New Mac Pro Nearing Release as Apple Advises Technicians How to Place Computer in DFU Mode

brofkand said:
I'm interested as to how many people will buy these. They seem laser focused on the hollywood/pro video markets, especially considering the new display. Relatively limited market, even for Apple.
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The exact amount of people they're targeted at, and then some. Again, it has been stated before but seemingly with no complete fruition: If you're of the misinformed mindset that this is too much for a machine, then a machine of this calibre isn't for you.

Seriously. People who think this is too overpriced probably wouldn't even max out a Mac mini w/ their daily workloads.
 
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Tucom said:
The exact amount of people they're targeted at, and then some. Again, it has been stated before but seemingly with no complete fruition: If you're of the misinformed mindset that this is too much for a machine, then a machine of this calibre isn't for you.

Seriously. People who think this is too overpriced probably wouldn't even max out a Mac mini w/ their daily workloads.
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Agreed.
If you’re wondering how Office runs - it’s probably not for you. It’s certainly aimed at a specific demographic.

It’s like people complaining about the SSD. The people who are the target of this machine are probably not concerned about it at all.
 
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Glockworkorange said:
100% correct. My office pays several thousands of dollars a year on specialized software. We make millions and would have a hard time doing it without that software

These aren’t toys for Apple bloggers and hobbyists. These are machines people use to make a living. If you can’t afford it, you probably don’t NEED IT. Need being the operative word. Need, not want.

Apple has other products for hobbyists and Apple bloggers.
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I agree, there is a machine for everyone. if you are a poor college student in school you can get a refurbished Macbook air for $930 dollars all the way up to a full loaded Mac Pro for professionals. $930 today is like $400 in 1984 that was the cost of a good HP calculator, now you can get a whole computer today :)
 
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cwkoller5 said:
Ain't it usually the way that you buy a pro Mac (remembering the cheese grater days) with as little in it as possible and then populate it yourself? Apple is historically the WORST price/performance supplier of storage, RAM and components. That's what raised the ire of pros when Apple tried to shove us all into iMacs and trash cans. They were harder to upgrade so the most cynical of us thought it was an attempt to corral upgraders into ponying up more up front.
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But for all of their SSD products they have used non-standard parts, so you probably won't be able to swap in your own SSD unfortunately.
 
Metrosey said:
There's always a market :)
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I honestly cannot tell if this is serious?
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If you cant judge the seriousness, you probably dont know enough about the hardware. The base 8 core xeon is basically a consumer i9 9900k but with AVX512 and ECC memory support, with no tangible performance benefit over the consumer chip when it comes to clock speed and IPC. The 580X is a rebrand RX580 from AMD that you can buy for $200 and has good for the price compute power but hardly up to snuff for professionals. 256gb SSD regardless of brand/speed is a joke for any computer over $800 today, let alone a $6000 "workstation".
 
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Glockworkorange said:
100% correct. My office pays several thousands of dollars a year on specialized software. We make millions and would have a hard time doing it without that software

These aren’t toys for Apple bloggers and hobbyists. These are machines people use to make a living. If you can’t afford it, you probably don’t NEED IT. Need being the operative word. Need, not want.

Apple has other products for hobbyists and Apple bloggers.
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exactly right. My software costs per year at least $5k and I could easily increase that cost too.
when I specified workstations a few years back I allowed $12k per person to get what we needed.

some people don’t seem to realise what professionals need and do with computers.
for me this macpro is well priced and a great machine. It is very tempting indeed and will be giving it a good look at for my next desktop.
 
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Glockworkorange said:
100% correct. My office pays several thousands of dollars a year on specialized software. We make millions and would have a hard time doing it without that software

These aren’t toys for Apple bloggers and hobbyists. These are machines people use to make a living. If you can’t afford it, you probably don’t NEED IT. Need being the operative word. Need, not want.

Apple has other products for hobbyists and Apple bloggers.
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Most of the vitriol regarding pricing is from users who genuinely believe that their is no PC or Mac in the modern age that should be priced outside of their reach, which is complete fallacy, but is their firm belief.

Remember how much mud was slung at Apple for pricing the iMac Pro at $4,999 and then it topped out at $13,199? Those same people were apoplectic that Apple would dare price a mere iMac at that sort of price.

And so there are now at least one or two Macs that are outside of their reach and I think they are simply pissed that they cannot really afford one without just cause as you stated.

IIRC, the same thing also happened when the 2013 Mac Pro was released.

I don’t need one, don’t really have the extra amperage in my studio to support 1.4Kw PSU without getting a dedicated circuit put in, regardless. Anyways, First World Problems.
 
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Baymowe335 said:
Sure it does. The biggest complaint is the expense. If you want it, you may not be able to afford it.
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Want is not the same as need. If you need a Mac Pro and can’t afford it, that’s a bind. If you don’t need it, then who is anyone to suggest anything about what you can or cannot afford?
 
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Jessejh said:
If you cant judge the seriousness, you probably dont know enough about the hardware. The base 8 core xeon is basically a consumer i9 9900k but with AVX512 and ECC memory support, with no tangible performance benefit over the consumer chip when it comes to clock speed and IPC. The 580X is a rebrand RX580 from AMD that you can buy for $200 and has good for the price compute power but hardly up to snuff for professionals. 256gb SSD regardless of brand/speed is a joke for any computer over $800 today, let alone a $6000 "workstation".
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Yep the i9 is just like the Xeon processor, not, and FYI i built my computer in 1976 with a ocliyscope, soldiering iron, resisters, capacitors and chips not a system that you stick stuff together.
  • Higher core-count design (up to 28 cores vs 18 in Core processors)
  • Higher memory capabilities (up to 512GBs of RAM memory vs 128GB in Core processors)
  • Supports ECC (error-correcting memory), Core Processors do not
  • Supports multi-processor environments (Core motherboards only support one processor)
  • Built for longevity, Xeon processors are qualified to operate under constant heavier workloads, 24 hours a day. Consumer-focused Core processors definitely do not fall under this same category.
 
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Metrosey said:
There's always a market :)
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I honestly cannot tell if this is serious?
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Oh, they’re serious as a heart attack...to some users here a PC (or Mac) is nothing more than a parts list. Imagine if Apple actually tried to cater to that market...thankfully, Apple said no back around 2003-2004.

If Windows OEMs had any brains or guts, they would do the same thing and shift away from tower and gaming PC...it’s simply a never-ending pit of misery, complaints and my GPU is better than yours.
 
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Jessejh said:
If you cant judge the seriousness, you probably dont know enough about the hardware. The base 8 core xeon is basically a consumer i9 9900k but with AVX512 and ECC memory support, with no tangible performance benefit over the consumer chip when it comes to clock speed and IPC. The 580X is a rebrand RX580 from AMD that you can buy for $200 and has good for the price compute power but hardly up to snuff for professionals. 256gb SSD regardless of brand/speed is a joke for any computer over $800 today, let alone a $6000 "workstation".
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This is basically the whole “why buy a Mac when you can build your own PC off newegg for less” argument all over again. To which my answer is and always will be the same - with a Mac, you are paying for design, and for an integrated solution which just works out of the box.

First off, the Mac Pro design is a beauty. This is clear evidence of Apple industrial design, along with the engineering and product design teams, coming up with a long-term solution for the Mac Pro instead of some quick band-aid fix. It’s clear they wanted to redeem themselves after the whole fiasco with the previous Mac Pro and the infamous thermal corner issue.

This is not just Apple throwing components into a big box and ship it ASAP to shut a few people up. They gave it the full attention they would any Apple product, replete with a custom-designed monitor which they felt would truly showcase its capabilities.

I think it’s safe to say that most Mac Pro sales will likely exceed the $8,000 to $10,000 range, excluding the display, once upgrades are factored in. In this context, the premium you pay “for that fancy case” is really a fraction of the final price tag, and I feel it’s not unreasonable for something you will hang on (and upgrade) for many years to come.
 
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Jessejh said:
If you cant judge the seriousness, you probably dont know enough about the hardware. The base 8 core xeon is basically a consumer i9 9900k but with AVX512 and ECC memory support, with no tangible performance benefit over the consumer chip when it comes to clock speed and IPC. The 580X is a rebrand RX580 from AMD that you can buy for $200 and has good for the price compute power but hardly up to snuff for professionals. 256gb SSD regardless of brand/speed is a joke for any computer over $800 today, let alone a $6000 "workstation".
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You seem to underestimate both AVX512 and ECC memory support. Nor do you seem to fully understand that there are multiple SSD features which can enhance the quality/reliability of the device, which would in turn increase price. It seems you weren't being serious then, as "you probably dont know enough about the hardware." is rather rude, considering the bold accusations one is throwing around with a lack of understanding. There are different markets that need different requirements, such as ECC, high FP64/FP32, Single Level Cell (SLC). If Apple or any other developer used SLC instead of MLC and charged an extra £800 (just an example price) would it be worth it? Well to a market that needs SLC (due to higher reliability), yes, with the same applying for other higher-end features.
 
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Jessejh said:
If you cant judge the seriousness, you probably dont know enough about the hardware. The base 8 core xeon is basically a consumer i9 9900k but with AVX512 and ECC memory support, with no tangible performance benefit over the consumer chip when it comes to clock speed and IPC. The 580X is a rebrand RX580 from AMD that you can buy for $200 and has good for the price compute power but hardly up to snuff for professionals. 256gb SSD regardless of brand/speed is a joke for any computer over $800 today, let alone a $6000 "workstation".
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Every single CPU in the Xeon W-32xxx Series is derived from the 2nd Generation Scalable Xeon Processors (Cascade Lake) and have little to nothing in common with the Core i-Series.

From Socket to PCIe lanes to memory-addressing and core count, the Core Series is pushed about as far as it can. Comet Lake-S at 10c/20t is pushing it to the limit and it will still be stuck at x16 lanes of PCIe 3 versus x64 lanes of PCIe 3 on the Xeon W.

The Core i-Series is running up against practical limits of the architecture while the Xeon W simply has a much wider wingspan and power envelope to work with for intensive professional tasks.
 
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dredlew said:
They really could have included WiFi6 with this thing, it’s expensive enough already. Hope there will be some minor updates to the spec on release. 🤞
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Why? Any major studio or boutique shop working for a major studio, will have to pass annual security audits which require wifi to be disabled anyway.
 
Marvelous Patric said:
i was always a pro user before the trash can. i thought i could get by with an i7 iMac... boy do I regret that 7 years later. In 7 years, as an artist I find myself doing a lot more video. I have to believe that's going to be more and more true for not just me, but a lot of people.
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As a non-professional video editor myself, I do agree that everyone and their mother are creating videos now.

I was set on using Final Cut Pro but have decided to go with DaVinci Resolve instead to hedge against being priced out of Apple hardware.
 
StellarVixen said:
Your “teenager” cannot sustain heavy CPU workload for too long before throttling.
i9 in that form factor is a scam.
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As long as my “teenager” can maintain 3.6GHz under sustained load, there is no throttling and I have yet to see a benchmark or real world test show that happening.

The 9900K is not a scam and by all accounts runs better than the 7700K with half the cores.
 
nilk said:
I'm guessing they discontinue it. iMac Pro always seemed like a stop-gap for people who desperately wanted a powerful updated Mac while waiting for a new Mac Pro to come out.

Would be nice to see it at a lower-price point, but considering it doesn't have user-serviceable RAM, and both the regular 27" iMac and the upcoming Mac Pro do, it sits in a weird place. If you are going to get a more powerful machine and you have the money to configure it with as much RAM as you think you'll need in the future, why not just get a Mac Pro since you're already end up in that price range? (and you can buy only how much RAM you need today, and upgrade it later if you need to)

(maybe iMac Pro users are fine bringing/sending their machine to Apple or Apple authorized service provider and paying them to do a RAM upgrade, so my point might not make sense since that is an option)

Personally, my 2017 27" iMac was originally a stopgap for me after my 2006 Mac Pro no longer cut it, but neither the iMac Pro nor the Mac Pro are in my price range, and even at a lower price point iMac Pro's lack of user-serviceable RAM makes me not want it.
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Then there has to be a cheaper version of Mac Pro around $3000 like they did before. But iMac Pro didnt updated for almost 2 years with the same price is a joke.
 
Pro7913 said:
Then there has to be a cheaper version of Mac Pro around $3000 like they did before. But iMac Pro didnt updated for almost 2 years with the same price is a joke.
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Apple doesn’t lower prices of products as they get older simply because they are aging.
 
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iMac and Mac mini shipping dates for the standard configs (usually next day arrival or shipping here in Australia) have dropped back to Thu 07/11/2019. Is this a good sign on imminent updates?
 
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