New Mac Pros and Mac Minis Launching in August

[Bear]

Not really, Apple needs to spend money on designs and development to be competitive. That can mean new case designs, but it also means frequent upgrades. 6-8 month upgrades of the Pro machines would be far more appropriate than 17+ months. .. if Apple was serious about pro-users.
...

Let's take your comment in two parts.

The first case design... The case design works. they have room inside to do updates as needed. A professional doesn't care if the outside of his new machine looks the same as the old machine. Heck in truth, that professional is relieved that he doesn't need to get new furniture to use a new computer.

And secondly update interval... I hate updates just so a company can say they did an update. Apple should do small silent updates that reflect disk capacity changes and pricing changes every 3 to 6 months as appropriate. Oh and if Intel releases a slightly faster processor, add that with the other minor changes. Apple can't release real changes faster than Intel gets them the new processors. And as someone that had to deal with hardware maintenance, I like the idea that I don't need to maintain more and more spares for constantly updated hardware. In some cases a spare is an identical system that you can pop the disks into and then get Apple to repair the broken system. (And then the repaired system becomes the spare. You can't do that if the machines vary too much due to office politics.)

Getting back to the rumor that started this thread... I could see Apple getting the processors for the Mac Pro about a month early from Intel. Remember an August announcement could mean September shipments for the Pro. And I can see Apple doing something to make the Pro rack friendly. So in this case some sort of case change could be in order.

 

[tigress666]

That's the current track record, Macs on maintenance upgrades (i.e. uninspired and minimal), but I for one always live in the hope that Apple wakes up from this iOS disaster (from the POV of a Mac user) and start treating the Macintosh like a tier one platform, worthy of all their attention.

Actually I'm just expecting minis and Mac Pros with T-bolts, and that's it. Nothing interesting, just maintenance.

You know, from the POV of a mac user, this iOS "disaster" is what has gotten Macs more popular which also means they get more software and more attention from developers.

I've heard so many stories of people switching cause they liked their little iOS device so this iOS "disaster" is doing a good job of marketing the Macintosh. I'm seeing a lot more macintoshes these days, including some from my college friends who used to make fun of my Mac. And even my mom who used to snub her nose at my Mac and was a windows person (she likes her iOS devices so much she says her next computer might just be a Mac).

And from some one who had Macs through when no one made software for it and the Mac almost went the way of the dodo, having good marketing is a good thing for a computer. I was so annoyed at Apple at the time for not being able to market well enough to keep the computer alive. It does not matter how good a product you have if you can't convince anyone to buy it.

So, yeah, as a Mac user and lover since the very first one and who was skeptical at first about Apple making something other than macintoshes, these ipods and iphones and iOS devices are actually good for the Mac. And as people pointed out, you gotta have a Mac to develop for the devices so they can't completely abandon the computer.

 

[sbb155]

There are still no Sandy Bridge CPUs suitable for Mac Pro. Unless Apple is looking for a significant change (drop DP models, basically a headless iMac), there is nothing to update.

yeah right, there are plenty of processors that arr available - the 3.2 hex for instance. saying there are no processors just isn;t correct...

 

[Bear]

I hope they change the case design of the Mac Pro. My 2003 PowerMac G5 has the same case.

Why do you care so much about the case design? It works. Also if Apple changes the case, they have to change various processes to handle the changed case shape. Never mind the cost involved.

Also, what would you like the case to look like? Right now the Pro case still fits as a modern system.

 

[JohnDoe98]

I must have: high def blu ray authoring

Forgive my ignorance but why is authoring of optical media still needed nowadays? I know you mentioned earlier it is unacceptable to provide content online since the speeds are too slow or the quality will be too low. However, couldn't have simply distribute the media through usb drives rather than optical media?

 

[cirus]

Tons? Western Digital added USB 3.0 supported external disks couple months ago only.

There really can't be tons of USB 3.0 devices anyway because not everything that uses USB will benefit from USB 3.0.

Same reason that there won't be tons of TB devices.

Dude seriously, get up and look around.

Look at newegg, they have 150 external hardrives that use usb 3.0 out of a total of 500. Many of these 500 hardrives are old models and so the actual percentage of new harddrives using USB 3.0 is much higher than 150/500
http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.aspx?SubCategory=414&name=External-Hard-Drives

3.0 is backward compatable to 2.0 except it will run at 2.0 speeds. How many manufactures are willing to pay an extra 25 cents to say that their product runs 10x the speed? A lot.

 

[Bear]

yeah right, there are plenty of processors that arr available - the 3.2 hex for instance. saying there are no processors just isn;t correct...

Can that 3.2 hex be used in a dual processor system? I did a quick look and it looks like the answer is no. That would make for either a split Pro line or a dropping of the 12 core systems. I think Apple is doing almost the right thing. They should've had some quiet updates for memory, graphics and disks.

 

[iBug2]

Dude seriously, get up and look around.

Look at newegg, they have 150 external hardrives that use usb 3.0 out of a total of 500. Many of these 500 hardrives are old models and so the actual percentage of new harddrives using USB 3.0 is much higher than 150/500
http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.aspx?SubCategory=414&name=External-Hard-Drives

3.0 is backward compatable to 2.0 except it will run at 2.0 speeds. How many manufactures are willing to pay an extra 25 cents to say that their product runs 10x the speed? A lot.

150 devices are "tons"? I'd say USB 2.0 devices are "tons" but 150 is a few.

Many external drives continue using USB 2.0 because 3.0 doesn't add anything to the functionality. Not to mention USB isn't just a bus for external drives. There are literally tons of USB gadgets, which will never see an upgrade to USB 3.0.

 

[strausd]

If you actually listened to the story you linked, which I have, you'd see that all Larry Jordan said was the dot zero release wouldn't be ready for prime time use, which isn't surprising for a completely rewritten software. It doesn't say the software isn't for professional use. Maybe try get to understand what you are talking about first.

Maybe if you knew how to read you would have noticed I said "at first." And if you knew how to read and were to continue reading without it hurting your brain you would have also noticed that I go on to mention how multiple people think it won't be for the type of professional use as the current version is.

Maybe try reading first

 

[zephonic]

I bought my iMac in 2007 because I thought by then it was powerful enough for most of my audio needs.

It is not. In fact, our old G5 acquitted itself much more efficiently of many tasks, God knows why.

My next machine is gonna have to be a MacPro or otherwise a Windows workstation.

I wish it was not so, but no matter how you spin it, an iMac (or laptop, ftm) falls a few inches short of being a substitute for a true workstation-class machine. I have learned that much.

 

[iBug2]

Maybe if you knew how to read you would have noticed I said "at first." And if you knew how to read and were to continue reading without it hurting your brain you would have also noticed that I go on to mention how multiple people think it won't be for the type of professional use as the current version is.

Maybe try reading first

It's irrelevant what "multiple people think". Especially considering none of those people actually saw or used the app in discussion. Maybe you should also check the article called "seventeen hundred jaws dropping", concerning FCP X.

I not only have read that article you linked, I also listened to the 1.5 hour broadcast, which is linked in the article. And there hasn't been a single indication in the Larry Jordan interview implying that Final Cut won't be a professional app.

 

[Obi Wan Kenobi]

MBAs not happening anytime soon?

Does this mean an updated MBA isn't due any time soon?

 

[Keebler]

Forgive my ignorance but why is authoring of optical media still needed nowadays? I know you mentioned earlier it is unacceptable to provide content online since the speeds are too slow or the quality will be too low. However, couldn't have simply distribute the media through usb drives rather than optical media?

There's a definite need for DVD / BRay. i transfer videos for ppl and they don't understand nor care about digital media. Most of my clients are +40 and while there are some who understand streaming or digital files, most just want discs. It's easy for them to put in their player and press play. They are light years from using digital streaming etc..

That said, there will be some who won't want discs, but that % is currently small imho. At least for what I do.

As for the original thread, I'm wondering what the price structure will be or should I say, I hope a 6 core or more is within my purchasing budget. I need some serious speed to crunch m2vs for DVDs.

 

[Bear]

Tons? Western Digital added USB 3.0 supported external disks couple months ago only.

There really can't be tons of USB 3.0 devices anyway because not everything that uses USB will benefit from USB 3.0.

Same reason that there won't be tons of TB devices.

It doesn't matter how many USB 3.0 devices that are available. What matters is there are enough affordable ones. You can plug USB 2.0 and 1.1 devices into a USB 3.0 port on a system.

Heck if I was buying a new external disk, I'd look for a 3.0 one on the presumption I'd still be using it on my next system which should have USB 3.0.

The problem with Thunderbolt is that when it came out there were no devices available (other than minidisplay port cables) that could plug in to it. Not very useful as a port. Yes there will be devices soon, but guess what? I don't have a system that can take Thunderbolt devices. I'm back to looking at USB 3.0 devices until I get a new system and then I need to look at what systems I need compatibility with.

Yes Thunderbolt may be the better technology however there are two issues... compatibility with existing devices and Sony is talking about using USB connectors for Thunderbolt. That split is going to hurt Thunderbolt. Mind you the people who license USB don't want that to happen, so we'll have to see if they try to force Sony to do the right thing with Thunderbolt.

In summary USB 3.0 has many advantages from a marketing and compatibility standpoint. Thunderbolt has an uphill battle. FireWire was and is better than USB, yet FireWire is all but gone.

 

[OllyW]

Now there will be more computers with a TB port than actual TB enabled peripherals.

There are already more computers with Thunderbolt ports than actual Thunderbolt enabled peripherals seeing there are no actual Thunderbolt enabled peripherals available to buy.

 

[iBug2]

Forgive my ignorance but why is authoring of optical media still needed nowadays? I know you mentioned earlier it is unacceptable to provide content online since the speeds are too slow or the quality will be too low. However, couldn't have simply distribute the media through usb drives rather than optical media?

You can't. People have blu ray players at home, not USB players. The whole player technology needs to make a change for what you suggest. Not to mention pressing blu rays is cheaper than 50GB USB sticks. Flash drives are cheap only on low amounts of size, but 50GB flash isn't cheap at all.

 

[42streetsdown]

You know, from the POV of a mac user, this iOS "disaster" is what has gotten Macs more popular which also means they get more software and more attention from developers.

I've heard so many stories of people switching cause they liked their little iOS device so this iOS "disaster" is doing a good job of marketing the Macintosh. I'm seeing a lot more macintoshes these days, including some from my college friends who used to make fun of my Mac. And even my mom who used to snub her nose at my Mac and was a windows person (she likes her iOS devices so much she says her next computer might just be a Mac).

And from some one who had Macs through when no one made software for it and the Mac almost went the way of the dodo, having good marketing is a good thing for a computer. I was so annoyed at Apple at the time for not being able to market well enough to keep the computer alive. It does not matter how good a product you have if you can't convince anyone to buy it.

So, yeah, as a Mac user and lover since the very first one and who was skeptical at first about Apple making something other than macintoshes, these ipods and iphones and iOS devices are actually good for the Mac. And as people pointed out, you gotta have a Mac to develop for the devices so they can't completely abandon the computer.

I completely agree! iOS is good for that Mac platform. I understand the concerns of people that Apple will forget the Mac users, but in the end even if iOS devices are vastly more profitable than the Mac a Mac market will still exist.

 

[iBug2]

It doesn't matter how many USB 3.0 devices that are available. What matters is there are enough affordable ones. You can plug USB 2.0 and 1.1 devices into a USB 3.0 port on a system.

Heck if I was buying a new external disk, I'd look for a 3.0 one on the presumption I'd still be using it on my next system which should have USB 3.0.

The problem with Thunderbolt is that when it came out there were no devices available (other than minidisplay port cables) that could plug in to it. Not very useful as a port. Yes there will be devices soon, but guess what? I don't have a system that can take Thunderbolt devices. I'm back to looking at USB 3.0 devices until I get a new system and then I need to look at what systems I need compatibility with.

Yes Thunderbolt may be the better technology however there are two issues... compatibility with existing devices and Sony is talking about using USB connectors for Thunderbolt. That split is going to hurt Thunderbolt. Mind you the people who license USB don't want that to happen, so we'll have to see if they try to force Sony to do the right thing with Thunderbolt.

In summary USB 3.0 has many advantages from a marketing and compatibility standpoint. Thunderbolt has an uphill battle. FireWire was and is better than USB, yet FireWire is all but gone.

I have been using eSata as my external drive connector for years, on my Mac Pro. And none of the external hard drives I own do have bandwidth faster than SATA II. USB 3.0 is faster than SATA II, and slower than SATA III, but I don't need anything faster than SATA II atm, so I don't care if my next external drive has USB 3.0. If it has for the same price I won't mind, but I won't pay for it. But if you are upgrading from USB 2.0, then surely USB 3.0 will bring a lot of throughput for external drives.

 

[iBug2]

Does this mean an updated MBA isn't due any time soon?

I really don't think this effects MBA's at all. We'll see a new one very soon.

 

[cirus]

150 devices are "tons"? I'd say USB 2.0 devices are "tons" but 150 is a few.

Many external drives continue using USB 2.0 because 3.0 doesn't add anything to the functionality. Not to mention USB isn't just a bus for external drives. There are literally tons of USB gadgets, which will never see an upgrade to USB 3.0.

I'm talking about external hard drives ding-dong. Read the whole post and you won't put your foot in your mouth. 150 external hard drives out of 500 support USB 3.0. After USB 2.0 (264 USB 2.0 only), USB 3.0 is the second most popular interface (esata has around 70, some of these drives work with usb 2.0, some with firewire, etc.)

150 is not a few. 150/500 = 30% USB 3.0 That is a lot, if you exclude older drive (for the sake of simplicity, 320GB or less) the percentage is 35% (150/430).

Like I said, this is only going to go up. The benefits of having "high speed 10x as fast" outweigh the drawbacks of a fifty cent controller and interface.

 

[iBug2]

I'm talking about external hard drives ding-dong. Read the whole post and you won't put your foot in your mouth. 150 external hard drives out of 500 support USB 3.0. After USB 2.0 (264 USB 2.0 only), USB 3.0 is the second most popular interface (esata has around 70, some of these drives work with usb 2.0, some with firewire, etc.)

150 is not a few. 150/500 = 30% USB 3.0 That is a lot, if you exclude older drive (for the sake of simplicity, 320GB or less) the percentage is 35% (150/430).

Like I said, this is only going to go up. The benefits of having "high speed 10x as fast" outweigh the drawbacks of a fifty cent controller and interface.

Maybe you were talking about hard drives, but the original post about the amount of USB 3.0 devices did not mention anything specific, and my reply was to that post. So maybe if you read you won't have to put your foot in your mouth.

That being said 150 out of 500 isn't a few, obviously.

 

[derbothaus]

Exactly.

15 years ago a professional needed the fastest and the brightest of Macs to do his work. Today a graphic designer can get away with a cheap iMac, or even Mac Mini if he wishes so.

People who need a Mac Pro are a minority now. And they will keep needing it so Mac Pro's will be made, but they will only be maintained like Apple has been doing lately.

More than anything Adobe is responsible for this shift. If their old code could scale appropriately like their own After Effects and Mathmatica you would see the gains of dual procs and designers would again get the Pro's. Right now clock and single thread execution keeps the consumer models right up there with the Xeon workstations in performance. The real market for Pro's are audio and video only atm.

 

[Atlantico]

More important to you, maybe not. But more important for software developers. Or at least as important. Again, context. I specifically said "for software developers".

If we were talking about their usage by general public, post PC devices are much more important than PC's. People can spend some time without their PC's, but not without their phones, and this has been so for a long time now.

I'm sure the pads and tablets are a fine source for revenue for developers, but so are PCs, not surprisingly - but that means that we're not in a "post-PC" world, we're in a world of tablets and PCs. Which is why the claim of "post-PC" is premature at best, though many futurists would like to claim otherwise.

Point being, it's a pointless effort to claim that we live now in a "post-PC" world, for we do not.

As for users spending time with their tablets, well that's why I asked whether you were perhaps thinking of "post-TV" era rather than the "post-PC" era, since until now the device most used and ubiquitous has been the TV, not the PC. The question seems to be; what device do people prefer to use to waste their time with?

There's a lot of money in diversion, I'm not putting that down - but tablets aren't replacing PCs, they are complementing them - if anything tablets and other iDevices are replacing TV/radio and cell-phones.

 

[iBug2]

More than anything Adobe is responsible for this shift. If their old code could scale appropriately like their own After Effects and Mathmatica you would see the gains of dual procs and designers would again get the Pro's. Right now clock and single thread execution keeps the consumer models right up there with the Xeon workstations in performance. The real market for Pro's are audio and video only atm.

I don't think it's Adobe's code that is at fault. Using Illustrator, even a single core is basically enough to finish every operation instantly on a modern CPU. Desktop publishing hasn't really changed drastically so desktop publishing apps didn't change either. How many cores can you ever need to typeset a book?

 

[derbothaus]

They are nice machines, but I have seen the EXACT same specs (better video card as well) for $1,350. It was on sale though of course.

Um an X5670 is 1200.00 EACH on sale. A W3680 is, by itself, around $1000.00. I am assuming you are talking on the low end only. Also don't confuse Xeon with i7. Better binning and thermal headroom on the Xeons.