New Mac Pros and Mac Minis Launching in August

[Bear]

...
I don't think I'm asking for the sky here, since Dell can manage to do more or less exactly that and for the same reasons. That would effectively make the upgrade intervals between Mac Pros zero days, because you could always order the Mac Pro with the latest motherboard and CPU.

And Dell has one heck of a support nightmare. And as I said there should be more incremental (silent) updates. But we'll only see big updates when Intel has chips for big updates.

Of course the issue with the small updates is how soon will the big update be and should I buy now or wait for the next big update? This indicates that silent updates more often than 3 to 6 months would just make things worse from multiple perspectives.

While I agree that Pros always want more power, most are not going to replace their machines every 3 to 6 months, so the silent updates would only help to entice people who are close to needing a new system anyway.

 

[cirus]

No one is buying a Mac Pro to rent movies. And the point about USB is if internet connections are too slow, then you can just use a USB to upload the film to a computer. From there it is pretty darn easy to stream it to a TV or to just watch it on the computer screen. So, to sum up, the idea is there are pretty simple alternatives for people to use if they want a Mac Pro. Having BR Authoring doesn't seem especially important.

Very true, yet it will not kill apple to add it. Regardless of whether most will need it, it should still be supported. And there is no excuse that itunes is still 720p and not 1080p (yes it will take longer to download so make it optional).

 

[ctucci]

I love how the word "professional" gets thrown around here. I really do.

Q: What do call the person graduating med school with a C minus?

A: Doctor.

Guess I'm saying if you get paid (and can live on that pay) for what you do on a Mac, you're a pro. But like the doctor analogy, it's up to the customer to choose the level of performance they seek.

 

[iBug2]

Can we have some real graphics card options? I want to see some nvidia options in addition to the regular ATI crap on the MacPro. GTX580 anyone?

ATI Crap? 6870 is about 15% slower than GTX580.

And ATI drivers have been better on Mac than Nvidia, so slower ATI cards (on win side) have been performing better than faster Nvidia cards on mac. At least when gaming is concerned.

If you are concerned about CUDA, you are right. But then just get Quadro.

 

[zephonic]

I remember seeing an interview with Steve Jobs last year (I think it was with Mossberg, but not sure) and the two things I clearly remember from that are

"A century ago, America was essentially an agrigultural nation and 9 out of 10 vehicles were trucks. As urbanization spread, we moved to vehicles more suitable to those conditions. That does not mean that the truck became obsolete, it's still here. But it is a much smaller portion of the market. Desktop PC's are like those trucks. They're not gonna go away, but the majority of people will no longer need them."

and

"What we have learned is to price things aggressively and go for volume. That has really worked well for Apple in the recent past."

Both those statements are nothing to make me optimistic concerning the future of the MacPro.

disclaimer: those are not the exact words, but as close as I can remember.

 

[FroMann]

Hopefully the Minis get cheaper. They were originally meant to be an affordable Mac, but ended up getting more expensive over the years.

 

[iBug2]

Very true, yet it will not kill apple to add it. Regardless of whether most will need it, it should still be supported. And there is no excuse that itunes is still 720p and not 1080p (yes it will take longer to download so make it optional).

Amazon Video On Demand is 720p as well. So industry standard is still 720p. I don't know if that's only up to Apple or the movie studios.

 

[Atlantico]

I am saying, again, that Post PC does not mean that PC is dead, it means that PC is not the single most important thing for software industry anymore.

Post-PC means "after-PC", as in after PCs are gone and done with. PCs and tablets co-existing (like they are) can't possibly mean "post-PC".

Consoles are and were at least as important as tablets are today, if not more, yet that didn't make a "post-PC" world. Perhaps you're just using the term wrong.

I'm not defining it any particular way, I just understand what the words mean in "post-PC" device. Perhaps you think it is some sort of mail-order PC? It has a very obvious definition, and I did in fact listen to the Steve when he was explaining this term and stooped so low as to use car analogies (like we stopped doing in the 90s because they were stupid)

I agree that one would have to be an idiot to claim that PCs are dead in 2011, but then, that's what the term "post-PC" indicates. That PCs are for all intents and purposes yesterday's news, they are the steamboats, the blimps and the telegraph of today.

Funny thing that your mother was advised by yourself (a big believer in the iDevices apparently) to buy an iPad. A shocker, just as much a shocker as it would be for you to know that I would have advised my own mother to buy an iMac. The way I see it, you just limited your mother to her current computer options, for indeed she can do the most basic things on an iPad, but if she ever wanted to do something else - such as use a computer to design weaving patterns - she's SOL.

Giving people tools that only cater to the lowest common denominator isn't what I call good advice. If they know exactly about the limitations of the device and accept it, because they can get to a PC should they need one, then fine. That's my advice. Stick to what gives the best options in case things change, because they do. But heck, it's your mother.

 

[iBug2]

I remember seeing an interview with Steve Jobs last year (I think it was with Mossberg, but not sure) and the two things I clearly remember from that are


and


Both those statements are nothing to make me optimistic concerning the future of the MacPro.

disclaimer: those are not the exact words, but as close as I can remember.

Those statements are correct and they mean that the Mac Pro isn't going anywhere. How is that not optimistic?

 

[Psychomacuser]

Sorry, but I call 300 percent BS here.

But no new mac pro is coming in August.. The chips for it won't be available for it until Q4 2011 or 2012.. I suspect March-April 2012 the latest.

Brian Tong is a phoney... he doesn't know what he is talking about.. I have ties to Intel since a friend of mine works there and this is what he told me about the 2011 pin sandy bridge chips + hundreds on here from macrumors in the mac pro forums validated the arrival of the mac pro to be done sometime in 2012, and not in 2011.

 

[Atlantico]

How would that work? Are you going to rent the movie or the player copies the USB into an internal HD?

I don't think optical media is on its way out. I think the next big thing after Blu Ray, in terms of home theater, will be again an optical media. But Apple is right about one thing. Optical media is best watched on a large screen TV anyway, not on a computer. So if you are only focusing on viewing media on computers, yes optical media is on its way out.

You know, I almost agree with you there, but then you tow the Apple line all of a sudden to the end. I'm using this fine 27" HD+ iMac and it is capable of displaying higher resolution than BD offers and I would maintain it has quite a large screen. Even the smallest MacBookAir has 1366 by 768 native resolution, some 30% higher resolution than a DVD.

A downsampled BD is much sharper and better than an upsampled DVD any time. And my iMac has quite a large monitor.

Large enough for BD movies. So yeah I agree with you, but then I completely disagree that BD is somehow "bad" or not good enough or even not completely fantastic on a computer like the 27" iMac! To each his own I guess, but I think it is a waste that the iMac doesn't support BD playback.

 

[iBug2]

Post-PC means "after-PC", as in after PCs are gone and done with. PCs and tablets co-existing (like they are) can't possibly mean "post-PC".


Consoles are and were at least as important as tablets are today, if not more, yet that didn't make a "post-PC" world. Perhaps you're just using the term wrong.

Because consoles did not browse web, or check email. Consoles did not replace PC, tablets do. There's a huge difference.

Funny thing that your mother was advised by yourself (a big believer in the iDevices apparently) to buy an iPad. A shocker, just as much a shocker as it would be for you to know that I would have advised my own mother to buy an iMac. The way I see it, you just limited your mother to her current computer options, for indeed she can do the most basic things on an iPad, but if she ever wanted to do something else - such as use a computer to design weaving patterns - she's SOL.

I'm not a believer in iDevices. I'd never buy an iPad, I hate those things. They are not for me, but seeing my mother hasn't done a single "productive" thing on that iMac, which has been sitting in the house since 2004, I don't see her suddenly taking up designing weaving patterns next month. And remember, I asked her what she does, I didn't decide it myself.

Giving people tools that only cater to the lowest common denominator isn't what I call good advice. If they know exactly about the limitations of the device and accept it, because they can get to a PC should they need one, then fine. That's my advice. Stick to what gives the best options in case things change, because they do. But heck, it's your mother.

Obviously she knows the limitations of the tablet devices, I explained that to her many times. When she first saw the iPad and wanted one, I told her "that's not a computer, you wouldn't like it", but after discussing with her several times and understanding that all she does can be done on an iPad, why bother buying a full fledged computer? It's more expensive, and also harder to use than an iPad.

Best options don't necessarily come with bigger packages. You need to realize that PC's are much harder to use than tablets. So someone like my mother, actually, could do more with a tablet, than she does with a PC. That's the whole idea behind the "post PC". If you listened to that Gates/Jobs interview, they said over and over that PC's are not as easy to use as they want them to be. They really aren't. Just look around yourself and see what most people do with their PC's and tell me that all that can't be done on a tablet. And obviously I don't mean professionals, which are a very small group compared to the total PC users.

 

[Atlantico]

I hope Steve and Apple do NOT see the Mac as a nuisance. I understand your comment and as a long time, finally fed up iMac owner, I want as many desktop Macs to survive as possible. There is a need for the Mac Pros for many design/video etc. professionals.

I may be returning to design after a four year absence. This 2010 iMac is NOT what I want as my design machine. Despite my attempts to portable, I can't and really don't want to (beyond an iPad).

I want the Mac Pro to continue...I've always held it in very high regard for it's power, flexibility and design.

Amen! Completely agreed. Completely.

 

[cirus]

Amazon Video On Demand is 720p as well. So industry standard is still 720p. I don't know if that's only up to Apple or the movie studios.

Very true, but blu ray has been gaining more and more ground. Amazon also sells blu ray movies. The feature "unbox" allows users to download a full defination film (works only with windows).

This is mainly because of slow download times. These slow download times will be what keeps physical media around.

 

[iBug2]

You know, I almost agree with you there, but then you tow the Apple line all of a sudden to the end. I'm using this fine 27" HD+ iMac and it is capable of displaying higher resolution than BD offers and I would maintain it has quite a large screen. Even the smallest MacBookAir has 1366 by 768 native resolution, some 30% higher resolution than a DVD.

A downsampled BD is much sharper and better than an upsampled DVD any time. And my iMac has quite a large monitor.

Large enough for BD movies. So yeah I agree with you, but then I completely disagree that BD is somehow "bad" or not good enough or even not completely fantastic on a computer like the 27" iMac! To each his own I guess, but I think it is a waste that the iMac doesn't support BD playback.

Yes, but a 27" doesn't even compare to actual home theater offerings, which basically start around 50".

Trust me, I'd love if my Mac Pro could do BR, but I'm not gonna cry my eyes out because it doesn't. I agree that they look fantastic on my 30" Cinema display, but still that's not why Blu Rays are pressed for. Soon we'll have 1080p digital downloads, and then hopefully we can put this whole BR nightmare behind us.

 

[mdriftmeyer]

Do not buy? Wait until late July or early August?

Wake me up when this author has a lawsuit pending.

 

[mdriftmeyer]

ATI Crap? 6870 is about 15% slower than GTX580.

And ATI drivers have been better on Mac than Nvidia, so slower ATI cards (on win side) have been performing better than faster Nvidia cards on mac. At least when gaming is concerned.

If you are concerned about CUDA, you are right. But then just get Quadro.

You don't develop with CUDA on the platform that gave you OpenCL and also when the AMD Platform has gone all in on OpenCL.

 

[Atlantico]

Which happened once, and was again about Intel, not Apple.

Of course it wasn't. Wintels saw nice improvements in those 511 days while Mac Pros saw only the one CPU addition, which was not a necessary situation and not the fault of Intel. There's more to a computer than the CPU of course, the motherboard and the GPU for instance.

You've claimed that iMacs can replace Mac Pros before in this thread, which shows that you're pretty good at reading superficial MHz stats and don't really understand why people would pay premium for a Mac Pro. It's that much more powerful. Worth every cent.

 

[mac9000]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)



How else would you see what you're doing?

VNC for the win
I have a Mac Mini Server that I just VNC to, it has no mouse, screen, or keyboard.

 

[tech3475]

I wonder how much the minis will be this time considering they're already quite expensive (at least in the uk)?

 

[mac9000]

Hopefully the Minis get cheaper. They were originally meant to be an affordable Mac, but ended up getting more expensive over the years.

I wish there was a Mini with 3.5" hard drives and faster specs available. I want a tower, but I want it to have the power of an iMac. The Mac Pro is too expensive for me
And yeah, what happened to the $500 Minis? They need to be more flexible overall with a $500 to $1500 range.

 

[Atlantico]

Read my post again, especially when those "multiple people" never saw or used the application in discussion.

Multiple people, meaning "more than one" people, did post about their "fears and guesses" about the new FCP X. That's the gist of it.

I never said "multiple people" think we're in a post PC era. It's a fact that we are in a post PC era. Look around and you see more computers than PC's in people's hands. That's not an opinion of someone that we are in a post PC era, we just are. Same as we were in a post automobile era when people invented airplanes. I'm not comparing tablets to airplanes, it was just an analogy.

So anecdotally from your personal experience, we're living in a "post-PC" era (defined in some quite arbitrary way, meaning tablets co-exist with PCs and are now very important to developers)

Great. Thanks, now I'm convinced, because some guy on the intarwebs told me so. Are the same intarwebs powered by iOS? Anything designed on iOS, programmed and compiled on iOS?

I did see the waiter at one of the cafés here use an iPad to jot down the order. Clearly I was in a Post-PC era!

 

[iBug2]

Very true, but blu ray has been gaining more and more ground. Amazon also sells blu ray movies. The feature "unbox" allows users to download a full defination film (works only with windows).

This is mainly because of slow download times. These slow download times will be what keeps physical media around.

And they will keep physical media around for quite some time. Because if you think 50GB is too much (standard for BR), then you'll be shocked when they come up with the next home theater standard, which will be either 2K or 4K, and will probably be around 200-300GB per movie.

Bandwidth is not improving as fast as we'd like to. But when they do come up with 2K or 4K releases, a computer screen will be the last thing you'd want to view that.

4K resolution on a computer screen is basically impossible. After 130-140 ppi, the screen becomes "supra retina", so you can't see the added pixels anyway. So you'll still be watching a 1.5K picture even if the display is viewing a 4K one.

So to watch a 4K movie, people would either have to buy ultra large TV's, or projectors. It wouldn't make sense at all on a computer.

 

[mac9000]

I wonder how much the minis will be this time considering they're already quite expensive (at least in the uk)?

I got a Mini off eBay right after the new one came out. It was half-price, and the new ones had the same specs per $ ratio as the old ones but with a better design. I don't care about the design because I stuck the Mini in the basement since it's a server that I VNC to.

 

[iBug2]

So anecdotally from your personal experience, we're living in a "post-PC" era (defined in some quite arbitrary way, meaning tablets co-exist with PCs and are now very important to developers)

Great. Thanks, now I'm convinced, because some guy on the intarwebs told me so. Are the same intarwebs powered by iOS? Anything designed on iOS, programmed and compiled on iOS?

I did see the waiter at one of the cafés here use an iPad to jot down the order. Clearly I was in a Post-PC era!

And there were no anecdotal in my post. You just look at statistics, sales, usage percentage and you can see that these toys are gaining tremendous marketshare.

Don't forget, phones are Post PC devices as well. Not just tablets. So basically most people around you already own a Post PC device.

Also, I didn't coin the term, I have heard it from multiple Silicon Valley CEO's, and it makes sense to call this era Post PC, in terms of software development, because the revenue just is too big, as big as PC development. And, yes, these devices are going to replace PC's for the majority of PC users, that's also not an opinion.