New MacBook Pro and 13-Inch 'MacBook' Coming Next Week, iMac and Display Not Ready Yet

[Accipiter]

You can take them, but what can you do with them?

Unless you make a living on Apple's software (and you never know what they'll dump next) you may be left hung out to dry.

What third party pro-app developers will want to put any effort into a platform that has shown little or no concern for its flagship product since it's release, and treats pro users with disdain.

Sure, there could be more frequent updates to the Mac line, in all likelihood, they'll be more disappointing as well (if that's possible).

As one of those pro users, I agree. But I think if Apple says "Look folks, we've been busting our ass to reinvent the Mac and it's been so long since we've done anything with it because we're doing another architecture change. But here are the amazing things we can do with the new CPUs! And for you x86 users transitioning, we have <insert compatibility layer here>!"

If they introduce an ARM Mac that is so incredible it totally explains the lag and apparent disdain for their computer market, I will absolutely be on board. But if they come out with the odd x86 Mac every 3 years or so or some gimped ARM box that's mostly iOS, I may have to move back to Linux. It really depends on how they handle it.

 

[smulji]

What am I repeating? Why am I repeating it?

I don't believe I said anything in my post that isn't accurate.

If the rumours are true and the refresh for what I think we can all agree are dated systems by today's standards does in fact reflect Skylake come Thursday's keynote, both statements still hold true...

a) Kaby Lake is out now and available on systems through a number of vendors already...
http://www.ultrabookreview.com/11638-intel-kabylake/

b) Apple comes up short in this regards rolling out their "refresh" with Skylake while everyone else is planning or has already done so with Kaby Lake. They would therefore trail the rest of the industry and their systems are not able to take advantage of the new processors features and optimizations. Disappointing regardless of the reasons.

What you don't seem to be understanding is that not ALL Kaby Lake processors are shipping at the moment: Only the low-power 4.5W & 15W versions designed to go into thin and light ultrabooks like the MB / MBA are shipping. If you look at the other PC makers, all of their PCs shipping with Kaby Lake are thin / light systems using low-power Kaby Lake parts.

The high-performance Kaby Lake processors (ie: 28W & 45W versions) that are designed for 13" / 15" MBP are not shipping just yet. You won't see these in ANY systems until next year. Research carefully and do your homework.

 

[CelestialToys]

What am I repeating? Why am I repeating it?

I don't believe I said anything in my post that isn't accurate.

If the rumours are true and the refresh for what I think we can all agree are dated systems by today's standards does in fact reflect Skylake come Thursday's keynote, both statements still hold true...

a) Kaby Lake is out now and available on systems through a number of vendors already...
http://www.ultrabookreview.com/11638-intel-kabylake/

b) Apple comes up short in this regards rolling out their "refresh" with Skylake while everyone else is planning or has already done so with Kaby Lake. They would therefore trail the rest of the industry and their systems are not able to take advantage of the new processors features and optimizations. Disappointing regardless of the reasons.

Could you point out which of those machines has a core H series Kaby lake CPU? Because that is the series that will be going into a MBP, and as your article points out these won't be available until Q1 2017 at the earliest.

You would do well to read the thread as this has been pointed out numerous times and it is getting tiresome to read the same nonsense over and over again.

 

[Feenician]

What am I repeating? Why am I repeating it?

I don't believe I said anything in my post that isn't accurate.

If the rumours are true and the refresh for what I think we can all agree are dated systems by today's standards does in fact reflect Skylake come Thursday's keynote, both statements still hold true...

a) Kaby Lake is out now and available on systems through a number of vendors already...
http://www.ultrabookreview.com/11638-intel-kabylake/

b) Apple comes up short in this regards rolling out their "refresh" with Skylake while everyone else is planning or has already done so with Kaby Lake. They would therefore trail the rest of the industry and their systems are not able to take advantage of the new processors features and optimizations. Disappointing regardless of the reasons.

Read and understand. 45w Skylake came out only a few months ago and is only available on a few laptops so far. Apple will be in the first few to ship it. It is not, in any way, "out of date". 28w Kaby lake is not available to anyone, not even Intel, to ship in anything until January, and only in volume some time after. The 45w HQ chips that go in the 15mbp will not ship until June 2017 at the earliest.

Putting the 15w Kaby Lake chips that are shipping now in an mbp would be MUCH slower than even the 45w Haswell that ships now. It would be putting a scooter engine in a truck.

By all means buy an ultrabook with Kaby Lake in it now but know that it will be slower than a current rMBP.

This is not, by any definition, out of date.

 

[finchna]

Apologies if this information is in posts, but is it clear if the 16Gb of RAM will remain or will it be possible to order the new MBP with 32Gb? (so that there is less swapping)

 

[Feenician]

Apologies if this information is in posts, but is it clear if the 16Gb of RAM will remain or will it be possible to order the new MBP with 32Gb? (so that there is less swapping)

As far as I know that hasn't leaked. It'd be nice to see 32gb as an option.

 

[jigzaw]

You know, I'm going to take this one with a grain of salt because I just feel like having a whole event to announce one laptop would be underwhelming even for current-day Apple. I've been planning on getting my first iMac in 2016 for a couple years now (I'm an TV editor on Avid, a Mac convert since I started working on the old Pro towers at work and a MBP owner since 2013) and I am chomping at the bit for it so I can set up a home editing bay (hopefully with a new 5K Cinema Display). If it becomes clear on Thursday that there will be no new iMacs until "sometime next year", then I'm going to call up my PC-building brother and order me a Hackintosh. I have a big home project coming up in the next couple months and I just refuse to buy a year-old iMac at full price on principle. Getting bummed out by Apple's pivot away from the pro world. Fashion accessories are cool and all, but I need me an adult computer.

 

[cerberusss]

I'm buying 2 laptops - one for my 13 YO Girl - she has a decent Nikon DSLR with multiple lenses. She currently uses my wife's 27 5K IMAC for her photo/video editing. (...) The other laptop is for my 14 YO boy..he is pretty simple - 80% school work, 5% Minecraft game and 15% videos from his GOPro Camera

I agree the base model is fine for your boy. For the girl, it depends a bit if she simply shoots to JPEG then the photos won't be too big and she'll be fine with the base model as well.

However if she shoots to RAW then she'll get big files. It depends on the camera used, of course. If it's around 12 megapixels then it won't be a problem. However some cameras dump 30 MB photos in RAW format. Ask her, she'll know whether she shoots to RAW or not. If so, get the top model if you have the budget. If not, base model is fine.

By the way, have you thought about how you're going to back up all those machines?

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

I hope that, if the iMac gets a redesign, it also gets rebranded simply 'Mac'. That would be as good an opportunity as any!

 

[brentsg]

With regard to the Mac Pro:

Whether they are going to kill it or not, I could see Apple silently lowering the price this Thursday.

That could set the stage for an update around WWDC 2017—along with a price re-increase. It could also set the stage for discontinuing the Mac Pro altogether this spring.

The price is the spot where I really criticize Apple. Fine, the industry hasn't moved forward at the pace that people want. At least don't sell 3-4 year old technology at the same price you did the day it released. I would have picked up a MP trashcan if not for the price.

 

[Jax44]

Kaby Lake is out now and available on systems through a number of vendors already. Skylake would be disappointing and an Apple fail.

Wrong. Read up on it.

 

[brentsg]

What if, instead of a new MP, Apple introduces an "iMac Pro" - with a 6 / 8 Core Xeon CPU and dual professional-grade GPUs?

I already have a 21:9 34" display that I won't part with. I'll never own an all-in-one.

 

[Larry-K]

I agree completely. That keyboard is an abomination. Why include it? To make it thinner which is really indicative of Apple's choices lately. To me suggests they've lost their way. They don't know what works and what doesn't and they're too arrogant to admit when a design doesn't work. When nearly everyone blasted this keyboard in reviews, why didn't they abandon this? Courage?

Is that the same as the little toy thing they give you with an iMac now?

A friend of mine got one, and I almost threw it out, I still might.

 

[brentsg]

What am I repeating? Why am I repeating it?

I don't believe I said anything in my post that isn't accurate.

If the rumours are true and the refresh for what I think we can all agree are dated systems by today's standards does in fact reflect Skylake come Thursday's keynote, both statements still hold true...

a) Kaby Lake is out now and available on systems through a number of vendors already...
http://www.ultrabookreview.com/11638-intel-kabylake/

b) Apple comes up short in this regards rolling out their "refresh" with Skylake while everyone else is planning or has already done so with Kaby Lake. They would therefore trail the rest of the industry and their systems are not able to take advantage of the new processors features and optimizations. Disappointing regardless of the reasons.

Of course you don't believe that you said anything that's not accurate, but it doesn't make it true. The Skylake parts suitable for a Macbook Pro are only just available, let alone KL parts. You obviously didn't read this thread because it's been pointed out dozens of times.

 

[tentales]

You can be pissed, but mobile at the center of the industry is the new reality, like it or not. The truth is, even though most of the Mac line hasn't been properly updated in too long, there is very little that would have changed had they updated it earlier. You would have gotten moderately faster internals and moderately better battery life. I think Apple saw this and decided that rather than bothering with a proper redesign at a stage when they'd have comparatively little to offer, they'd wait it out until enough things had come in line to make a refresh of this fully mature product platform actually feel like something worth waiting for. Hopefully we won't be disappointed.

So MacBooks aren't part of mobile? Huh?

Few people were asking for a "proper redesign", keeping up with Intel's chip releases and newer GPUs would've been well received.

Yes, the platform is mature and why break things like MagSafe, best keyboard in the industry sd card slot and optical out headphone jack for the sake of thinness and no post-purchase upgrade options.

Apple used to push things and be the first to integrate new tech, like OLED, now they're dead last.

I'm still hoping to be surprised, but the rumours have my expectations at a new low.

 

[Larry-K]

As one of those pro users, I agree. But I think if Apple says "Look folks, we've been busting our ass to reinvent the Mac and it's been so long since we've done anything with it because we're doing another architecture change. But here are the amazing things we can do with the new CPUs! And for you x86 users transitioning, we have <insert compatibility layer here>!"

If they introduce an ARM Mac that is so incredible it totally explains the lag and apparent disdain for their computer market, I will absolutely be on board. But if they come out with the odd x86 Mac every 3 years or so or some gimped ARM box that's mostly iOS, I may have to move back to Linux. It really depends on how they handle it.

All recent indications would point to poorly.

And who's to say that Apple might employ their own processors, and then lose interest in a couple of years (like they do with everything), and switch again.

It's Apple Attention Deficit Disorder at work.

 

[MyopicPaideia]

*Sigh* Repeat after me, "There are no Kaby Lake SKUs for iMac or rMBP until 2017", "There are no Kaby Lake SKUs for iMac or rMBP until 2017", "There are no Kaby Lake SKUs for iMac or rMBP until 2017"

All that's available is the ultra-mobile chips at 15w or less. Putting these in an rMBP would make it the slowest MBP for many, many years.
[doublepost=1477327888][/doublepost]

It's not going to be out of date. 45w Skylake was released in June this year. Only Intel and Razer have 6700HQ machines available. "Out of date" =/= "I don't know what I'm talking about"

I've learned the hard way not to engage in discussion with anyone who has only joined the forums on the same day as they spout utter nonsense, spreading fud, and in essence tr*||ïńg their way through their first day. Applause to you for taking the time to combat these bot-like interlopers
[doublepost=1477335312][/doublepost]

All recent indications would point to poorly.

And who's to say that Apple might employ their own processors, and then lose interest in a couple of years (like they do with everything), and switch again.

It's Apple Attention Deficit Disorder at work.

I guess I just have to disagree...define a couple of years. Architecture change is a pretty big deal, at the same time, if it is done for a good reason, (i.e. x86 development is actually slowing to a crawl compared ARM development...I'd really like to see how the latest ARM and x86 parts compare watt for watt...what kind of performance could you get out of a 10W ARM part, for example, when you are currently getting performance comparable to a current 15W x86 part from a 4W ARM part.) and they have a 10 year road map, I'd be more than game. Let's be honest, all they really need to do to get 99% of everyone on board and not feeling compatibility nerves would be the Microsoft Office Suite and the full Adobe Creative Cloud suite. That would be a lot easier to secure today than it would have been even just a a year or two ago. You get those two on board at launch and you will get all the rest developing immediately for macOS ARM. Heck, Microsoft would probably be in to make a proper ARM version of Windows, just so they could sell the licenses to Mac users!

I think there is more to IBM coming out with their statements saving millions using Macs, and Apple's strategic partnerships in enterprise - I think they are aiming to switch architectures and do it in a big way, and one that won't rely on Rosetta mark 2 as a bridge, (although they will have a compatibility layer I think will be active for a limited time) rather offering automated alternate binaries through the MAS. Distribute your app through the MAS and you don't have to deal with it, Apple will for you, and people on x86 machines get their version and people on the ARM machines get theirs...

The 2017 iPad Pro line-up will probably out benchmark the current top end MBA in both CPU and GPU performance. Imagine a line-up where you have the MB running the same fusion quad core chip as the iPad Pro, and the MBP running a true full quad core 10W version with a 16 core GPU that outperforms anything up to 45W that Intel could throw at it.

The more I think about it, the more I think it is more than feasible, and only a matter of time until it happens. After having written this, I want one, I hope it happens sooner rather than later!

The ONLY thing that actually gives me pause is I/O compatibility. If getting USB 3.1 gen 2 and TB3 is not an issue, then I would have no reservations.

 

[Mac 128]

You know, I'm going to take this one with a grain of salt because I just feel like having a whole event to announce one laptop would be underwhelming even for current-day Apple. I've been planning on getting my first iMac in 2016 for a couple years now (I'm an TV editor on Avid, a Mac convert since I started working on the old Pro towers at work and a MBP owner since 2013) and I am chomping at the bit for it so I can set up a home editing bay (hopefully with a new 5K Cinema Display). If it becomes clear on Thursday that there will be no new iMacs until "sometime next year", then I'm going to call up my PC-building brother and order me a Hackintosh. I have a big home project coming up in the next couple months and I just refuse to buy a year-old iMac at full price on principle. Getting bummed out by Apple's pivot away from the pro world. Fashion accessories are cool and all, but I need me an adult computer.

Nah. They had an event just to announce a 9" version of the iPad Pro, an upgraded 5s, and some new watch bands.

3 MacBooks is plenty, especially once they take us through all the possibilities of the MagicToolbar with several software vendors ... and there might even be some new watch bands ...

 

[Talkingtoaster]

I'd expect a pile of "new" Mac portables will drop when the power cord gets tripped over with no MagSafe.

I dont get this magsafe obsession, its a pain in the arse for me. Who is tripping over these cables? Why dont people be careful or use common sense? Im sick of moving my mac on my lap and it falling off, having to baby it while I move my mac. Ill be glad to see it go!

 

[MyopicPaideia]

So MacBooks aren't part of mobile? Huh?

Few people were asking for a "proper redesign", keeping up with Intel's chip releases and newer GPUs would've been well received.

Yes, the platform is mature and why break things like MagSafe, best keyboard in the industry sd card slot and optical out headphone jack for the sake of thinness and no post-purchase upgrade options.

Apple used to push things and be the first to integrate new tech, like OLED, now they're dead last.

I'm still hoping to be surprised, but the rumours have my expectations at a new low.

Hmmm...USB-C is new tech, it replaces all of those ports you mentioned and more. You could have 4 SD cards at once, or 3 HDMI's out. The keyboard is going to be awesome. Think MBr keyboard but with twice the travel. It seems you don't actually want new tech, just some other tech, mostly older as well. What post purchase upgrade options are you referring to? Can't really upgrade the current line up as it is, right?

 

[deany]

What are you basing this all on? There has not been a single report that any particular Apple department has issues with their housing.

Actually my personal experience of improving innovation cultures in multinational companies (I work as a consultant in innovation management) is that tightly packed communities increase their output due to better collaboration through more effective interfacing.

My current client just moved a large part of their base R&D facility to a new building that is much larger. We are now having to organize process definition workshops because the scientists are complaining that distances have increased and approachability has decreased due to labs being more spacious and people being harder to find.

Where do you get your knowledge?

http://www.cultofmac.com/105627/app...-1300-employees-near-future-spaceship-campus/

"Apple’s main 1 Infinite Loop campus (6 buildings) can no longer handle the company’s “remarkable growth.”

and that was 5 years ago.

Your clients problem with 'approachability' should never be a problem because of the large circular shape of the 'mothership' giving the feeling staff are never to far from a colleague.

 

[jigzaw]

Hmmm...USB-C is new tech, it replaces all of those ports you mentioned and more. You could have 4 SD cards at once, or 3 HDMI's out. The keyboard is going to be awesome. Think MBr keyboard but with twice the travel. It seems you don't actually want new tech, just some other tech, mostly older as well. What post purchase upgrade options are you referring to? Can't really upgrade the current line up as it is, right?

I think a machine called "Pro" should also have some flexibility. Making the new MBP incompatible with not just all existing external drives/license dongles/thumb drives/peripherals but it's also incompatible with the iPhone! You cannot plug your iPhone out of the box into a USB-C-only machine out of the box. In order to do you know, pro, things, you'll need a series of docks and adapters. Whatever happened to "it just works"? I'm not opposed to INCLUDING USB-C as that port becomes more useful, but to exclude compatibility with all other ports? "Courage", lol.

 

[tentales]

The issue with making thinner / lighter is now the inability to add RAM, replace SSD. If Apple could make the machines thinner and lighter and still accommodate replacable storage and RAM, there would be far less complaints.

I should have added battery too. If my battery dies, I shouldn't have to give up my laptop for a week to the AppleStore while its replaced.

The Dell XPS 13, comes with Kaby Lake, 1080p IPS display with a QHD option, removable standard M.2 NVMe SSD, repairable battery and in a form factor and weight similar the MacBook Air 11" !

Thin, small and light doesn't have to mean you loose user modifiable options, it's just what Apple chooses to do these days.

I used to defend the walled garden, but it's starting to feel like a prison now.

 

[peterdevries]

http://www.cultofmac.com/105627/app...-1300-employees-near-future-spaceship-campus/

"Apple’s main 1 Infinite Loop campus (6 buildings) can no longer handle the company’s “remarkable growth.”

and that was 5 years ago.

Sigh, again.. You read a lot into generic statements and make assumptions about things you cannot substantiate. This article doesn´t say anything about their design and innovation capability. Apple´s R&D investment increases by 35% year over year, but that still does not mean that their current building restricts them in innovating. Please show me an article or any evidence that specifically states that.

 

[tentales]

I could see that too but I believe Intel is in the middle of the current Xeon release. In other words, if Apple was going to use the current Xeons they would have already. It's in dire need of a GPU update too.

What is unconscionable is Apple continuing to sell it at its December 2013 price. Kill it, update it, or drop the price. But please do not continue to ignore it and sell it at its current price.

They're protecting their margins at the cost of volume sales. Since the entire Mac line up is less than 10% of total revenue, they don't see a reason to drop prices on a low revenue operating segment.