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New PowerMacs Released

weight

Has any one else noticed that the new macs are nearly 6kgs heaver than the old ones? That's one HEAVY machine. I guess it's down to the new heatsink.
 
What about the leaked photos???

Didn't the leaked photos clearly show only one processor on the motherboard? They were dead-accurate otherwise....I wonder why.

Also, the sudden appearance of holes all over the system and that huge cooling unit seem strange. The dual systems never needed it before, why now?

Could these changes maybe be a hint of the future, even though they are currently stuck in speed-bump hell?

p.s. - I'd have to see it in person...but the front panel has a nice composition from head-on. The back panel is kind of nice in a funky chewed-up way too.

p.p.s. - whoever said Univers is a child's font is a FOOL. Univers is one of the most beautiful, versatile fonts in existence. Look around you on T.V. and in print - it is everywhere. Although the Univers black and extra black do fall apart a bit, I will give you that much.
 
Which to choose 867 or 1 Ghz

I was about to switch from PC (it was for september) i guess i am lucky that i had to wait but now it kinda complicate my choices,

I was going for an 800 with superdrive or (less likely) the 933 also with superdrive. But now i have to choose between the dual 867 and dual 1Ghz , So i wanted to know if the 167 Mhz bus will do a lot of difference for a non-professional user. I intend to edit some personnal videos and burn dvd to send to my parents who are living on the other side of the ocean. There is a substancial price difference between the 2 configs (more than before +- 1000 $cad) with the taxes but i want to keep this computer for a long time. I will certainly see a big improvement on the speed of the computer (I have currently a 3 years old pentium 3 500Mhz, 100Mhz FSB)with either config, so do you think a dual 867 would be enough for the 3 years to come(about the time i keep a computer).

Thanks:)
 
Re: Re: Re: By the way...

Originally posted by gropo
Please tell me you're kidding... Univers is such a "Kindergarten Goofy Playtime" font! Look at the lower-case 'C' for god's sake! The stroke is so uneven! Myriad kicks its ass!

Oh lord, did I really instigate a font flamewar? ;D
Click to expand...

No flamewar........ designers don't have flamewars... we indulge in heated debates......

http://www.designbeef.com/

As for univers...... 55 and 65 bold, in capitals only.... is IMHO a great headline font, Myriads okay, but doesn't work at smaller point sizes, the same way as univers doesn't...... ultimately though it's down to personal opinion and taste, and my taste says that univers is rather nice...... ;) :p

Univers certainly isn't kiddy though..... clean and contemporary........ ;) :D

So what's you favourite font??? or maybe we should have a font thread before a mod comes and kicks are ar*e..... :p :p :p

So back to topic.......

I want to see performance specs for the 1.25Ghz...... especially in DV and Compositing work.....

Oh legacyb4 the prototype for the next generation Skyline is wild isn't it..... ;) :)
 
Originally posted by ConradG4
If you haven't already look at the school and government savings!
Click to expand...

am i missing something? isn't it pretty much the same as it's always been? about 100 on bottom, up to 200 on the top version?

or are you referring to the old 867 that's there for 1250...?
 
Re: Which to choose 867 or 1 Ghz

Originally posted by Porkepik
do you think a dual 867 would be enough for the 3 years to come(about the time i keep a computer).
Click to expand...

Si tu peux te le permettre, tu ferais mieux d'attendre 2 chèques de paie ou 3 et amasser le 1000$ de plus pour le nouveau bus et acheter le double 1GHZ.
 
Originally posted by Chaszmyr
The new dual 1ghz are faster than the old dual 1ghz... and the 1.25 ghz is atleast 6 weeks away... I am going dual 1ghz!
Click to expand...
My sentiments exactly. I'm not going to wait until October for the 1.25 GHz. The only thing that is making me think twice is the reduction to 1GB L3 cache/processor on the dual 1ghz. If you look at the Photoshop and Final Cut perfomance stats at the powermac pages you'll notice the 1.0GHz seems closer in speed to the 867MHz dual than the 1.25GHz dual. I would imagine that to be because 2GB vs 1GB L3 cache makes a bigger difference than 166MHz bus vs. 133MHz bus. Anyway, I figure I'll go with the dual 1GHz NOW and then can upgrade the processors when faster ones come out in a year or two.
 
DDR

All right guys, this DDR thing is really important to me.. can someone give me a straight answer ?

They say it took CUES from the Xserve, we dont know if it's the same chipset, and the wording seems to indicate that the DDR speed is throughout. There HAS to be a definate way to know this...
 
Originally posted by cyberfunk
From the Apple Architechture page :

The resulting throughput between main memory and the system controller is up to 2.7GBps, more than double the throughput from the previous dual 1GHz Power Mac G4. DDR-SDRAM also increases systemwide memory bandwidth to the processors and all other elements of the system

THAT sounds like true DDR, no ?
Click to expand...

No it doesn't! In the Specs it says:

"Up to 167MHz system bus supporting over 1.3GBps data throughput"

It's just the known hack from the Xserve, but using a bus with 167MHz instead of 133MHz. The little DP has probably exactly the same motherboard as the Xserve. That means it is even slower than an old DP1000 in real life performance. A dark day for the Apple users...

... guess I won't buy one! :( What a disappointment!

groovebuster

P.S.: But I am still curious about the real life performance, maybe it isn't as bad as I expect it...
 
Well, way 2 go Apple. Though I must say the prices on these suckers need to go down some, especially on the high-end. If I wanted a PowerMac (I'm more interested in an iMac) I wouldn't buy one of these suckers until I see some major price drops. 'Nuf said.
 
Could be worse

Okay so the new Power Macs are almost what we were expecting. No 1.4 Ghz, no FireWire 2, who knows which CPU model num.

Frankly Apple seems to be in one of its awkward hardware phases. The eMac intro'd after the iMac LCD for less $ and after saying the CRT was dead was really weird. If Apple had intro'd it before the iMac that'd prolly have lessened the blow.

Instead no one was buying the iMac AFTER the eMac came out. Frankly I think the eMac is a HUGE computer and proves why the iMac never went to 17" CRT - it would have been HUGE.

Now the iMac has a 17" wide screen (weird shape, even larger computer overall), the 15" still isn't selling against the much cheaper and larger screen eMac. Is anyone at Apple paying attention?

The new Power Mac is pretty good overall if not spectacular on any one detail other than PC2700 DDR RAM (which may be more of a crutch than speed boost).

No 8x AGP, no FireWire 2, no BlueTooth built in. No new AirPort (even tho it exists).

I would get the middle new G4 since I am coming up from a G4/450! Anything would be a boost to me. The eMac is simply way too large to be reasonable and the iMac is a bit over priced compared to the eMac but would be a better replacement for my Wife's iMac.

Don't even get me started on the 14" iBook. It looks larger than the TiBook, and is rather oddly bleak on top, just a silver panel with a keyboard plopped in the middle. Wintel laptops have all manner of details all over the place, the 14" iBook looks like a mockup in person.

We certainly are living in interesing times being a Mac user. At least we get Jaguar pre-loaded on the new G4s so you whiners can't complaign about the $20 surcharge to upgrade. New hardware also ships with upgrade CDs as well so neener neener neener you whiners.

Man, what a year this was for Apple.
 
Originally posted by groovebuster


No it doesn't! In the Specs it says:

"Up to 167MHz system bus supporting over 1.3GBps data throughput"

It's just the known hack from the Xserve, but using a bus with 167MHz instead of 133MHz. The little DP has probably exactly the same motherboard as the Xserve. That means it is even slower than an old DP1000 in real life performance. A dark day for the Apple users...
Click to expand...

I'm not sure about that, 1.3 Gbs Data thruput, but it DOESNT say that for memory, plus there are implications other places that it's DDR to chipset to CPU
 
This is that part that gives me hope:

DDR-SDRAM also increases systemwide memory bandwidth to the processors and all other elements of the system.
 
Re: server too busy...?

Originally posted by TheT
Did anyone else get a 'server too busy' error? I thought this site just moved to another server to prevent that? An dnow, at 6:35 AM, it is too busy? And the those pop-under-ads...please arn, get something else, I'll even buy one of those mugs and pay shipping to europe ;)
Click to expand...

Acutally, the server move was to a different provider.

The actual server upgrade will happen later this week (Thurs) and should be minimal downtime.

There will be a no-ad contributer version available shortly...

arn
 
Originally posted by cyberfunk
From the Apple Architechture page :

The resulting throughput between main memory and the system controller is up to 2.7GBps, more than double the throughput from the previous dual 1GHz Power Mac G4. DDR-SDRAM also increases systemwide memory bandwidth to the processors and all other elements of the system



THAT sounds like true DDR, no ?
Click to expand...

As much as I hate to flame you cyberfunk, you don't seem to know what you're talking about at ALL. All that crap that you posted is ONLY the memory bus! 333Mhz DDR produces 2.7GB/s throughput but 166Mhz SDR is half that! do the calculations. 100Mhz gives 800MB/s, 133Mhz gives 1.067MB/s, 166Mhz gives 1.328MB/s (ok, so I screwed up with the calcuations, but 1.4Gb/s is still closer to Apple's number than your claim of the memory bus as the fsb), etc. For proof check it out here
while Apple's proof of the 1.3GB/s throughput is here

" Up to 2MB DDR SRAM L3 cache per processor, with up to 4.6GBps throughput
Up to 167MHz system bus supporting over 1.3GBps data throughput
256MB or 512MB of PC2100 or PC2700 DDR SDRAM main memory supporting up to 2.7GBps throughput"

Maybe you should do some actual research before accusing people of speculating
 
Not too expensive, you are just too cheap

For people whininh about the price of the top end G4 well you are obviously not the targeted market. Get an eMac or iMac then.

The top end G4 has 512 meg. of RAM already installed. A 120 Gig HD, SuperDrive, and two of the fastest G4s running with 2 Meg. of L3 cache EACH.

That all adds up to a lot of $ when you are Apple. Watch out and don't buy more ram from Apple, many they stick it to you on price. Even CompUSA is more reasonable (esp. for DDR RAM).

For reference most Compaqs and DELL cheapy PeeCees come with 20 Gig HDs and 128 Meg SDRAM (no DDR for you). They don't have dual ATA channels, they generally don't have dual head graphics cards either. Even an iMac or eMac has better specs out of the box than many of the cheapy PeeCees (FireWire, high speed Ethernet built in, SuperDrives).

The new top end G4 is close to workstation levels and is priced for PROs who do real work all day on one, not play around with downloaded DVDs and FPS games and download illegal music on their parents cable modem.

If you have problems with the price, then its most definately not for YOU.
 
Re: What about the leaked photos???

Originally posted by lem0nayde
Also, the sudden appearance of holes all over the system and that huge cooling unit seem strange. The dual systems never needed it before, why now?
Click to expand...

I suspect it might have something to do with the fact you can put 2 optical drives and 4 hard drives in it now - if you fill it up it's going to generate quite a bit of heat, even ignoring the cpus themselves.
 
Originally posted by topicolo

As much as I hate to flame you cyberfunk, you don't seem to know what you're talking about at ALL.

Maybe you should do some actual research before accusing people of speculating
Click to expand...

Mac rumors readers are so nice, you keep responding to him saving me hours throughout the day. Thanks

InternatB JR
 
I ain't switching yet

Aloha,

I don't know about you you folks but I won't believe all this
"TRUE" DDR ram throughput bus voodoo from Apple's savy marketing staff. The proof is "in the putting" and I'm putting my money nowhere until I see some raw tests and actual results of performance from an independent party. Compare these new systems to the old G4's and let's see what happens ?? Until then all this talk is only "poopput" to me......

Regards,
Mark :cool:
 
Originally posted by topicolo


As much as I hate to flame you cyberfunk, you don't seem to know what you're talking about at ALL. All that crap that you posted is ONLY the memory bus! 333Mhz DDR produces 2.7GB/s throughput but 166Mhz SDR is half that! do the calculations. 100Mhz gives 800MB/s, 133Mhz gives 1.067MB/s, 166Mhz gives 1.328MB/s (ok, so I screwed up with the calcuations, but 1.4Gb/s is still closer to Apple's number than your claim of the memory bus as the fsb), etc. For proof check it out here
while Apple's proof of the 1.3GB/s throughput is here

" Up to 2MB DDR SRAM L3 cache per processor, with up to 4.6GBps throughput
Up to 167MHz system bus supporting over 1.3GBps data throughput
256MB or 512MB of PC2100 or PC2700 DDR SDRAM main memory supporting up to 2.7GBps throughput"

Maybe you should do some actual research before accusing people of speculating
Click to expand...





IF DDR is done right though, that high speed memory bus should EXTEND from the shipset to the CPU.

Another thing. Look at the size of the buses in this picture, the one from the chipset to CPU to DDR are all the same size, while others vary in size from the chipset... HMMMMMMMMMMM

http://www.apple.com/powermac/architecture.html (main picture)
 
Originally posted by Ibjr


Mac rumors readers are so nice, you keep responding to him saving me hours throughout the day. Thanks

InternatB JR
Click to expand...

Alright you pompus little prick, you explain it if your so smart.
 
let's keep the dialog focused... no personal attacks please.

arn
 
Originally posted by cyberfunk


Alright you pompus little prick, you explain it if your so smart.
Click to expand...

Apples marketing is very creative. There 150 new features are not all new, many were found in OS9. Faster than light? Ya, that’s great marketing. You can't juge a computer based on marketing speak. Remember the one gigaflop campaign? Now that was a laugh.

And please do leave the speculation on my anatomy off these boards.

thanks

InternatB JR
 
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