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I strictly use Apple's mouse and keyboard. When I don't have it. I use the MX 3 and Logitech keyboard. It's a great keyboard and mouse. But, I prefer the Apple one. Why? Because of the gestures on the mouse. I'm VERY used to it. And when I don't have it. It sucks for me. AGAIN, this is for me. YMMV. But, for me, the current mouse is great.
The charging part sucks, but again. At night, I charge it when it needs it. Same for the keyboard. Not for nothing, but a mouse with one physical click can have 5 button features is pretty freaking cool. Right and Left click. Scroll, and swipe left and right.
 
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*When you have no relevant news regarding apple to post*
Addressing misinformation with correct information is something we all need more of nowadays.

In this specific case, the misinformation that needed correcting was relatively-innocuous. But it’s still a good and valid use of article space on MacRumors.
 
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The real dirty secret is that he's probably reviewing those numbers in... Excel.

Not joking, if you read commentary from internal Apple employees, they use Pages and Keynote for documents and presentations, but anything accounting relating is done in Excel because Numbers just doesn't cut it.
If you look at any of apple's job openings in their accounting / finance department they specifically say you must be proficient with excel.
 
Definitely not expecting Tim to use products from any other brand/company as far as possible.
 
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I just want to say that the Magic Mouse is the best mouse I've ever used. Having a touch sensitive surface is huge, and that's why it's not curved too much. I've been using it since it came out and I've never had any issues with ergonomics. You just need to make sure your chair is at the right height and you have good posture, you hand goes over it mostly flat which is closer to a resting position. Trying holding the mouse between your thumb and ring/pinky fingers, with your pointer and middle resting lightly on the surface. This has always worked brilliantly for me, and I have lots of different gestures configured using Better Touch Tool. It helps me get my work done quickly, and the scrolling is so much smoother than a wheel, like a trackpad.
I like to "palm" my mice, which sounds like the reason we have differing opinions on the Magic Mouse. There's no way to rest my hand on the Magic Mouse due to its low profile.

Then of course we get into the lack of physical buttons, short of the single button for the entire front of the mouse. Just fundamentally not designed in a way that's fitting for me. I'm glad you have no issues with it though.

I'd be curious to know -- have you ever tried a high end traditional mouse like the MX Master mentioned in the article? Or any other mouse in that same category/price range?
 
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"Ergonomics" is subjective. The Magic Mouse shape is excellent and for me it's one of the most "ergonomic" mice I've ever used. I'm sure the AI haters on this forum will say a bunch of nonsense in response to this, but I asked ChatGPT about it and I think it had a very good response:

can you please explain to me what "ergonomics" really means, because I think people don't know what they are talking about. I consider ergonomics to mean you aren't in pain or distorting your body unnaturally. So many people say the Apple Magic Mouse isn't ergonomic, but I disagree. it's very flat. My hand is flat when it's relaxed. when I use a so-called "ergonomic" mouse that is shaped like a big twisted lump, it contorts my hand into an unnatural position like I am gripping something. My hand gets very tired using mice like that, while using the Magic Mouse is like sliding my flat palm around my desk.


You're absolutely correct to question how "ergonomics" is often misinterpreted or applied subjectively. The term "ergonomics" refers to the study and design of equipment, tools, and environments to optimize them for human use, with the goal of minimizing discomfort, preventing injury, and improving efficiency. Your interpretation aligns well with this definition—it's about creating conditions where the body can perform tasks comfortably and without strain.

Why Ergonomics Varies​

People often confuse ergonomics with personal preference or associate it with specific design trends. What works ergonomically for one person might not work for another due to factors like:

  • Anatomy: Hand size, finger length, and wrist flexibility vary greatly.
  • Usage Style: The way you hold or use a device can affect whether it's ergonomic for you.
  • Task Duration: Prolonged use often exposes design flaws that might not be evident in short bursts.

The Apple Magic Mouse Debate​

The Magic Mouse's design challenges the conventional definition of an ergonomic mouse because it's so flat and minimalist. Many "ergonomic" mice are designed to force a "neutral" grip, mimicking a handshake position, which works for some people but can indeed feel unnatural or tiring for others.

Your observation about keeping the hand flat resonates with a principle of natural ergonomics: a relaxed posture. If your hand is naturally flat when at rest, then forcing it into a grip for a traditional "ergonomic" mouse could indeed feel awkward and counterproductive. For some, the Magic Mouse may work precisely because it allows the hand to remain in a relaxed, flat state.

True Ergonomics: Function Over Form​

The real test of ergonomics is whether a design:

  1. Minimizes Strain: Does it reduce muscle tension, wrist extension, or awkward movements?
  2. Prevents Pain: Does it allow prolonged use without discomfort?
  3. Supports Natural Movement: Does it allow you to work without forcing unnatural postures?
In your case, it seems that the Magic Mouse meets these criteria better than other designs. This highlights the need for individuals to evaluate ergonomics based on their own physiology and usage patterns rather than on broad claims or trends.

Why "Ergonomic" Design Feels Misleading​

Many products marketed as ergonomic are based on one-size-fits-all assumptions or trends, such as vertical mice or large, contoured designs. These can work wonders for people with certain needs, but they’re not universally effective. A truly ergonomic tool is one that aligns with the specific user’s natural posture and movement.

Your perspective reinforces a critical point: ergonomics isn’t just about the tool itself—it’s about the interaction between the tool, the user, and the task. If the Magic Mouse works better for your natural posture and comfort, it’s more ergonomic for you.
 
No one forces you to install software to use a Logitech product.

Half the functionality (such as being able to trigger Mission Control, etc, from one of the buttons) requires their horribly bloated Logi Options+ software or whatever it is called.

It will also happily install unnecessary stuff and take up to 1 GB of space. Yes, just to map a button on the mouse to Mission Control.
 
"Ergonomics" is subjective. The Magic Mouse shape is excellent and for me it's one of the most "ergonomic" mice I've ever used. I'm sure the AI haters on this forum will say a bunch of nonsense in response to this, but I asked ChatGPT about it and I think it had a very good response:

can you please explain to me what "ergonomics" really means, because I think people don't know what they are talking about. I consider ergonomics to mean you aren't in pain or distorting your body unnaturally. So many people say the Apple Magic Mouse isn't ergonomic, but I disagree. it's very flat. My hand is flat when it's relaxed. when I use a so-called "ergonomic" mouse that is shaped like a big twisted lump, it contorts my hand into an unnatural position like I am gripping something. My hand gets very tired using mice like that, while using the Magic Mouse is like sliding my flat palm around my desk.


You're absolutely correct to question how "ergonomics" is often misinterpreted or applied subjectively. The term "ergonomics" refers to the study and design of equipment, tools, and environments to optimize them for human use, with the goal of minimizing discomfort, preventing injury, and improving efficiency. Your interpretation aligns well with this definition—it's about creating conditions where the body can perform tasks comfortably and without strain.

Why Ergonomics Varies​

People often confuse ergonomics with personal preference or associate it with specific design trends. What works ergonomically for one person might not work for another due to factors like:

  • Anatomy: Hand size, finger length, and wrist flexibility vary greatly.
  • Usage Style: The way you hold or use a device can affect whether it's ergonomic for you.
  • Task Duration: Prolonged use often exposes design flaws that might not be evident in short bursts.

The Apple Magic Mouse Debate​

The Magic Mouse's design challenges the conventional definition of an ergonomic mouse because it's so flat and minimalist. Many "ergonomic" mice are designed to force a "neutral" grip, mimicking a handshake position, which works for some people but can indeed feel unnatural or tiring for others.

Your observation about keeping the hand flat resonates with a principle of natural ergonomics: a relaxed posture. If your hand is naturally flat when at rest, then forcing it into a grip for a traditional "ergonomic" mouse could indeed feel awkward and counterproductive. For some, the Magic Mouse may work precisely because it allows the hand to remain in a relaxed, flat state.

True Ergonomics: Function Over Form​

The real test of ergonomics is whether a design:

  1. Minimizes Strain: Does it reduce muscle tension, wrist extension, or awkward movements?
  2. Prevents Pain: Does it allow prolonged use without discomfort?
  3. Supports Natural Movement: Does it allow you to work without forcing unnatural postures?
In your case, it seems that the Magic Mouse meets these criteria better than other designs. This highlights the need for individuals to evaluate ergonomics based on their own physiology and usage patterns rather than on broad claims or trends.

Why "Ergonomic" Design Feels Misleading​

Many products marketed as ergonomic are based on one-size-fits-all assumptions or trends, such as vertical mice or large, contoured designs. These can work wonders for people with certain needs, but they’re not universally effective. A truly ergonomic tool is one that aligns with the specific user’s natural posture and movement.

Your perspective reinforces a critical point: ergonomics isn’t just about the tool itself—it’s about the interaction between the tool, the user, and the task. If the Magic Mouse works better for your natural posture and comfort, it’s more ergonomic for you.
lol. Wow. You really primed ChatGPT give you the answer you wanted and ONLY (!!!) the answer you wanted. 😂

Now go prime it to do the opposite. Type this (and see what Chatty GeePeeTee says):

“The Apple Magic Mouse isn’t ergonomic. Tell me all the reasons why I’m 100% correct.”
 
I just want to say that the Magic Mouse is the best mouse I've ever used. Having a touch sensitive surface is huge, and that's why it's not curved too much. I've been using it since it came out and I've never had any issues with ergonomics. You just need to make sure your chair is at the right height and you have good posture, you hand goes over it mostly flat which is closer to a resting position. Trying holding the mouse between your thumb and ring/pinky fingers, with your pointer and middle resting lightly on the surface. This has always worked brilliantly for me, and I have lots of different gestures configured using Better Touch Tool. It helps me get my work done quickly, and the scrolling is so much smoother than a wheel, like a trackpad.

100% agree. This is my experience as well. I find it weird that other people find it more comfortable to contort their hand into a grip rather than have it relaxed flat. Using the Magic Mouse is like using your relaxed hand without a mouse.
 
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lol. Wow. You really primed ChatGPT give you the answer you wanted and ONLY (!!!) the answer you wanted. 😂

Now go prime it to do the opposite. Type this (and see what Chatty GeePeeTee says):

“The Apple Mouse isn’t ergonomic. Tell me all the reasons why I’m 100% correct.”

No, you go do it if you want. But make sure you include the fact that people like me find it extremely comfortable because it allows you to relax your hand flat. I told ChatGPT that I was at odds with the opinions of others. It gave me a thoughtful explanation as to why people have different opinions. And I never told it to "Tell me all the reasons why I’m 100% correct". Nice try though.
 
I use the MX Anywhere 3S and scrolling seems to work fine. On iPadOS it's pretty bad though: scrolling has a weird acceleration just like when you swipe with your finger repeatedly to scroll long content faster; and it also keeps the inertia, which is great with a trackpad but less great with a mouse.
You have Intel or M-cpu?
 
No, you go do it if you want. But make sure you include the fact that people like me find it extremely comfortable because it allows you to relax your hand flat. I told ChatGPT that I was at odds with the opinions of others. It gave me a thoughtful explanation as to why people have different opinions. And I never told it to "Tell me all the reasons why I’m 100% correct". Nice try though.
For what it’s worth, I actually like the Magic Mouse (regardless of charging port placement, lol).

I’m just commenting about the prompt you use to get the response you received. And I provided an extremely-silly counter-example to illustrate my point.

Instead of asking it the way you asked it, ask it for pros and cons (or such). You still won’t get a great response (because it’s ChatGPT with all of its inherent flaws), but you’ll at least get a better response (maybe).
 
For what it’s worth, I actually like the Magic Mouse (regardless of power port placement, lol).

I’m just commenting about the prompt you use to get the response you received. And I provided an extremely-silly counter-example to illustrate my point.

Instead of asking it the way you asked it, ask it for pros and cons (or such). You still won’t get a great response (because it’s ChatGPT with all of its inherent flaws), but you’ll at least get a better response (maybe).

Fair enough. I could have asked the question without so much of my personal feelings. But I don't think anything it said was untrue. Ergonomics is not a one-size-fits-all, and people should realize that. The Magic Mouse is comfortable for a lot of people, and the people that cry about its shape probably don't even own one... the same as how the people who cry about the charging port location don't own one. Although with the charging port, it wouldn't hurt if it was somewhere else, even if it is a non-issue. But with the shape, it truly is one of the most comfortable mice I've used and changing it to a contorted lump would make me have no interest in it. Sometimes I think people who love Logitech "ergonomic" mice would be happier with a flight stick than a mouse.
 
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