You need to learn how to use Windows Mobile because it works fine on my 6700. On another note, no flash on the iPhone?? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
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No Flash Support on the iPhone
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You need to learn how to use Windows Mobile because it works fine on my 6700. On another note, no flash on the iPhone?? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
;Same here
Yup same here when using Safari 2.0 - not Camino and interestingly now...not Safari 3.0 as evidenced by this unedited post.
Yup same here when using Safari 2.0 - not Camino and interestingly now...not Safari 3.0 as evidenced by this unedited post.
As others have pointed out already, there are plenty of VoIP apps for plenty of cellphones out there.
It's not entirely clear why Apple is locking up the phone except for some very basic applications, but at a guess I'd assume that Apple wants to spend the first year or two ensuring the UI is understood by end users and evolves the way Apple wants it. It's a shame because I suspect the target audience would be very keen on games for the thing, and that's just not going to be possible without either Java or a lower level API than AJAX.
The Flash PLUGIN is not part of the internet. Flash CONTENT is a LARGE part of the internet.
Flash content = SWF files.
The iPhone cannot display them.
Well I'm wondering, if this is true, just how important IS flash in viewing most of the internet? Am I likely to be surfing and seeing lots of web pages that won't load or have huge empty spots, or is this just going to be some advert boxes that won't be showing up? I think whether or not the not-having-flash hurting the iphone depends on what the user experience is like. If it seems like a crippled internet, people are going to regret the purchase and tell others, while if it's just some adverts not showing up, that won't be a big deal.
Thank you. Seriously, I hate flash on websites. It's either annoying ads with flashy graphics and (wtf?!) sound or home page intros for lifestyle websites. As soon as I see that a company website is 100% flash, where I can't bookmark anything but the home page, the company loses a lot of my respect, if not all of it.
Flash also eats up quite some system resources, as others here have mentioned. I don't like how my Macbook starts the fans when there are more than 2 big flash banners on a website. Imagine how that would drain your iPhone's battery!
PS: I'm using the beta of Safari 3 right now. Works great, never crashed, inquisitorX plugin works and it's damn fast compared to FF. Still, it's interesting that my Mac knows words like "Mac" and "iPod", but not "Macbook" or "iPhone"
It depends what sites you visit.
If your browser can't display Flash then you wont miss out on advert banners, they will spit out an animated gif one just for you! What you could easily miss out on is a sites main navigation bar, it's videos (Flash video is theeee video codec on the net by a billion miles), and maybe the entire site itself.
One thing that needs to be said: Flash is here to stay. That is indisputable. It's always being pushed and driven amazingly by developers. It's also the choice for deploying rich internet applications.
If Apple officially announced this, wouldn't there be an official announcement of some sorts or the people they "officially" announced this to be willing to use their names as a source?
Didn't just last week Sun CEO Jonathan Schwartz claim that ZFS was going to be the filesys for 10.5.
Talk about a rumor!
Until Apple says it so or I see that it doesn't work I won't believe the "no Flash" support rumor.
Didn't just last week Sun CEO Jonathan Schwartz claim that ZFS was going to be the filesys for 10.5.
Talk about a rumor!
Until Apple says it so or I see that it doesn't work I won't believe the "no Flash" support rumor.
Yes, but Nokia S60 3rd edition phones (eg N95) can view the real web *and* they have flash too, although it is flash *lite* so perhaps that's not quite the same thing...
Flash Lite no supported in iPhone
I believe that the "no Flash" support is actually referring to Flash Lite (if anything at all!).
For those who don't know what Flash Lite (alright I can't stop laughing when I say that now) here is a good description, read it and you will see why the iPhone wouldn't support this and why people who develop Flash for mobile devices would be upset (basically they would need to publish a new version of their work or rewrite it).
Adobe Flash Lite is a lightweight version of Adobe Flash Player optimized for mobile phones and other devices. Flash Lite 1.1 supports Flash 4 ActionScript. Flash Lite 2.0, based on Flash Player 7, supports Flash 7's more powerful ActionScript 2.0. Both versions also support the W3C Standard SVG Tiny[1] (a mobile profile of W3C's Scalable Vector Graphics recommendation). The advantage over SVG is the ability to add audio and interactive elements without the use of other technologies such as JavaScript. Among the disadvantages it can be mentioned that Flash Lite applications are not capable of communicating with Bluetooth, infrared, or the camera on a phone.
I believe that the "no Flash" support is actually referring to Flash Lite (if anything at all!).
For those who don't know what Flash Lite (alright I can't stop laughing when I say that now) here is a good description, read it and you will see why the iPhone wouldn't support this and why people who develop Flash for mobile devices would be upset (basically they would need to publish a new version of their work or rewrite it).
Adobe Flash Lite is a lightweight version of Adobe Flash Player optimized for mobile phones and other devices. Flash Lite 1.1 supports Flash 4 ActionScript. Flash Lite 2.0, based on Flash Player 7, supports Flash 7's more powerful ActionScript 2.0. Both versions also support the W3C Standard SVG Tiny[1] (a mobile profile of W3C's Scalable Vector Graphics recommendation). The advantage over SVG is the ability to add audio and interactive elements without the use of other technologies such as JavaScript. Among the disadvantages it can be mentioned that Flash Lite applications are not capable of communicating with Bluetooth, infrared, or the camera on a phone.
I mighe be wrong
I might be completely wrong about this, but it seems to me that Flash probably can't scale down. How would the iPhone's little screen handle a full flash site? You most likely couldn't see the whole page, or if you could it would look so distorted as to be unusable.
I know some of you think that this is a big negitive, but consider this. Flash is popular right now and Adobe has hopes of making it even more so with it's Flex inititive. But Apple is smoking hot and they will sell millions of iPhones. Any site owner who want's to reach this market will have to abandon Flash. I predict that the iPhone's popularity will make them do so.
Would car companies dump Flash so you can see their sites on the iPhone? Probably not. But then, the iPhone will most likely not be used to view a car site. Why would you? But you will use it to read news sites. If a news site uses Flash, I would bet money they will dump it in favor of a different technology. In this case H.264. I guess what I'm driving at is the iPhones popularity could influence which technologies web developers use.
So not supporting Flash is an initial negitive, but in the long term it could actually help Apple's Quicktime and hurt Flash. YouTube being a perfect example.
I might be completely wrong about this, but it seems to me that Flash probably can't scale down. How would the iPhone's little screen handle a full flash site? You most likely couldn't see the whole page, or if you could it would look so distorted as to be unusable.
I know some of you think that this is a big negitive, but consider this. Flash is popular right now and Adobe has hopes of making it even more so with it's Flex inititive. But Apple is smoking hot and they will sell millions of iPhones. Any site owner who want's to reach this market will have to abandon Flash. I predict that the iPhone's popularity will make them do so.
Would car companies dump Flash so you can see their sites on the iPhone? Probably not. But then, the iPhone will most likely not be used to view a car site. Why would you? But you will use it to read news sites. If a news site uses Flash, I would bet money they will dump it in favor of a different technology. In this case H.264. I guess what I'm driving at is the iPhones popularity could influence which technologies web developers use.
So not supporting Flash is an initial negitive, but in the long term it could actually help Apple's Quicktime and hurt Flash. YouTube being a perfect example.
Correction: Flash is COMPLETELY scalable. The SWF's are vector based, so they would work fine on the iPhone's small screen. This could be a big let down, or someone leaking this false info to drive the stock price down only to have it skyrocket after the phone is released with flash support
No, Apple.com uses Quicktime for the videos and everything else is javascript, but most is just static content. Makes sense for them to use Quicktime exclusively, since it's their software, but not for anybody else.
I think Flash has got to come to the iPhone at some stage. Maybe they just can't get it out in time.
Yeah, well, I doubt that. You may not like them, but the internet is not about what you or any other developer wants. It's what customers and clients want. It's what generates money, whether through sales or advertising or some other means.
From an academic standpoint, I agree for the most part. However, from a real-world standpoint you have to remember that a site exists to benefit the site owner (which usually trickles down to benefit the user) and if the site owner wants to provide visitors with flash-based content, then he/she/they will hire a designer willing to do that.
Furthermore, if a site happens to be heavily focused on multimedia, it should be designed to work consistently on as many platforms as possible. Flash is installed on a very high percentage of machines and has a huge developer community, therefore it really makes sense to use it if it will get the job done.
This is a good question to consider. Does anyone know if there's a way to (temporarily) disable Flash support in the browser (either Safari, Firefox or Camino)? I'd like to check out some of the sites that my wife and I read pretty regularly and see how (if) the lack of Flash support affects them.
On a side note, I'm not making a value judgment about whether the use of Flash in web sites is a Good Thing or a Bad Thing. I'm just saying that the fact of the matter is that a number of web sites do use it, and if those sites wouldn't work with the iPhone's version of Safari, that's an important thing to consider.
The problem here is that many many websites are built ENTIRELY around flash. This means that the iPhone safari browser will NOT be able to navigate to these sites. Again, how is the iPhone showing me the "real internet?" Still sounds like the "baby internet" to me.
w00master
actually apple does use flash occasionally. the the airport extreme page here has a large flash interactive piece.
In Camino's preferences you can tell it to block Flash animations. I am pretty sure most browsers support a similar option.
If you bulld it, they will come (hopefully?)
It sounds to me like Adobe is the one responsible for building a Flash plug-in to work with an iPhone, just as they've had to build custom versions of their plug-in for MacOS, OS X, Linux, and anything else they wanted to support.
Apple isn't going to write Flash into the iPhone themselves.... Since Jobs never said "Absolutely no Flash support", but rather, hinted that it was possible -- it seems to me like they've already had talks with Adobe about this. Quite likely, Adobe said "Hey, we're not taking our developers off more important projects right now to build this thing for your phone that's not even out yet .... but after we see how many units get sold, we'll release something for it, if it's justified."
It sounds to me like Adobe is the one responsible for building a Flash plug-in to work with an iPhone, just as they've had to build custom versions of their plug-in for MacOS, OS X, Linux, and anything else they wanted to support.
Apple isn't going to write Flash into the iPhone themselves.... Since Jobs never said "Absolutely no Flash support", but rather, hinted that it was possible -- it seems to me like they've already had talks with Adobe about this. Quite likely, Adobe said "Hey, we're not taking our developers off more important projects right now to build this thing for your phone that's not even out yet .... but after we see how many units get sold, we'll release something for it, if it's justified."
wow no flash, good 1 apple. i guess ill have to live without all things flash, so much for the baby internet advert. PFFT
Ahhh, so they couldn't possibly avoid it completely.
There's more sites than YouTube based around video now and Flash video is on them all and going nowhere. YouTube will always have that codec on their site. They're gonna go .h264 for AppleTV, but .flv will stay on the site.
Then there's the legions of rich internet applications created in Flash 7, 8, CS3, Flex that are published into the .swf format.
Then there's all the sites which use Flash for the main navigation, product walk throughs, slide shows, image galleries......the list is literally endless.
Apple need Flash on the iPhone if they want the iPhone to do the full internet. Simple as that.
I do find it astounding incredible that people are talking about the 'weakness' of a device that currently has no significant peers.
I wonder would all those who are not happy with it's 'release candidate feature set limitations' buy one if it were say only $300 ???
I wonder would all those who are not happy with it's 'release candidate feature set limitations' buy one if it were say only $300 ???
Adobe has two services available to OEMs which would enable the device manufacturers themselves to incorporate a Flash player in their products: Flash Lite and the Flash Player SDK.
Both products essentially involve the OEM paying a per-unit royalty to Adobe in exchange for access to standards, source code, reference implementations, trademark, and patent licenses. Then the OEM is free to customize the Flash player to work with whatever hardware and browser technology their device is set to employ.
I think the Flash Player SDK offers the full capabilities of the Flash Player 7 (not 9, so I guess ActionScript 3 / Flex 2 is out of the question). Flash Lite is limited to a subset of those capabilities, which might be better suited to small screen sizes, limited UI interaction, and low-resource CPUs.
I've already posted a link to Adobe's Flash SDK product page.
Here's the Flash Lite product page:
http://www.adobe.com/products/flashlite/