No NFC in Next-Generation iPhone

[tigress666]

I trust real money more than this kind of solution. Think about when you lost your phone or it is stolen. You life is messed.

HRm, I don't know about phone but..

Credit cards/debit cards stolen:
1. Have to keep an eye on bank account/Credit card account in case number is grabbed.
2. have to call the banks and report it and deal with hassling with them
3. have to report it to the police (because if nothing else the banks are going to want it).
4. You aren't liable for the charges (or only some in case of some debit cards).

Cash:
1. You'll know your cash is gone when you go to use it.
2. DOn't have to call banks.
3. Can file a report if you wish (but no banks to want the report).
4. That money is gone gone gone.

I'll take the card. It's more hassle but at least I'm not out the money (or at least all of it in case of some debit cards <- your mileage may vary here, that's why some people say just use credit over debit. Credit cards by law are subject to giving you some protections, debit cards only do so if they feel like they need to to get you to use it).

 

[divinox]

NFC would be a waste of space. Why would you need NFC on a smartphone that is also equipped with Bluetooth and wifi, especially in iOS, a mobile OS that lacks direct device-to-device sharing capability in general and instead focuses on syncing to iCloud or a PC.

NFC would enable me to:
a) get into the apt building
b) get on the metro
c) access various things at work

In 48 months there will certainly be that many more applications, especially if Apple stopped playing safe taking the back seat role.

 

[lazard]

I trust real money more than this kind of solution. Think about when you lost your phone or it is stolen. You life is messed.

no different that losing or getting your wallet stolen. At least with a smartphone, they have to go through your passcode before they can access your info. And who actually uses cash they days?

 

[thewitt]

But Google patented NFC...

Apple holds 26 NFC patents....

 

[DimpleVerma]

i love this website.

 

[thewitt]

Question: If Apple chose to use Bluetooth instead of NFC, would the bluetooth chip work with existing technology? Meaning, if store A has NFC terminals, would bluetooth somehow work with those terminals?

I'm just wondering, since NFC hasn't really caught on in the US yet, and it'd be odd to see 2 systems competing - sort of like HD-DVD and BluRay in the beginning, I guess.

No. These are competing technologies.

 

[thewitt]

Too bad Apple didn't patent the NFC concept.
It would have been accepted with great praise for being such an innovation!
Now that someone else owns the rights, its meh & not innovative...

Apple holds 26 NFC patents. I suspect they will use them soon.

 

[divinox]

Even if the new iPhone HAD NFC capabilities, it's years and years away from becoming a mainstream form of payment. Considering that everyone and their gramma uses a debit card for everything, what are the chances of something else replacing that?

Chances are high, if it is simple enough. Naturally, there will be an adoption curve - per usual - but people will certainly use it for a wide variety of things (picking up a street bike, paying the metro etc.)

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exactly, that's why they acquired that fingerprint recognition company

Why is it less secure than your credit/debit card?

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Nothing to do with your comments about NFC, but I just have to tell you there will not be an iPhone '5S', and likely never another iPhone 'XS' again. The iPhone 4S has an S because of Siri, Tim Cook made this known to people when he said it.

Sure there will.

"With iPhone 5 we brought you Passbook, which made all of our lives that much easier. Now, introducing the best phone we have ever made: iPhone 5S...... And yes, you guessed it! S stands for Seamless - the Apple patented Super-NFC capability, which will truly revolutionize your everyday life! With this exciting innovation we are taking a huge leap, going beyond the unthinkable in mobile technology! Yada yada. Cue ****** video with white background."

 

[divinox]

Doesn't matter to me. While I'd have used NFC a bit, I doubt I'd use it much due to privacy/theft issues or worries. That's my personal opinion.

I figure Apple will lead consumers into this by using the Passbook app for a bit, then introduce NFC or something like it with the AuthenTec hardware, probably in iOS 7 and the iPhone 5s/6/whatever they call it.

Just my .02

Do you use a credit/debit card?

 

[samcraig]

Apple holds 26 NFC patents. I suspect they will use them soon.

Funny how USE and SUE have the same letters

 

[divinox]

Even so, it simply isn't here yet, like once you can walk into any Walmart and pay easily and securely with it, it will be great. Because when Walmart has it, everyone will be getting it. The thing is, businesses have to upgrade equipment, security measures, and also train employees to be knowledgable about the technology, before it becomes really main stream.

Chicken and egg problem that tech developers need to push, rather than expecting the other side to pull. NFC have clear potential to speed up payments. Speeding up payments is top priority in any large store (for various reasons).

In essence, build it and they will come. As for training, none needed. Its really no different than the user paying with a credit card. The system will let the teller know if the transaction went through or not. All that matters.

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I just have to let everyone on here know: 98-99% of Smartphone users do not know what NFC is, and probably haven't even heard of it. NFC is still a few years off being something you can expect people to be using (and don't quote this post saying you use it, you aren't the other 99%).

98-99% of smartphone users doesnt know what CPU, ARM, SSD or CMOS mean/is/does either. Doesn't stop them from using it on a daily basis.

 

[samcraig]

Not just payments - there are lots of other uses. It could be used for sales/promotion information when you walk into a store or down an aisle. You could tap a billboard and see a movie trailer. You could use it with a profile to automatically set the thermostat in your home or hotel room. Just a tip of the iceberg.

Chicken and egg problem that tech developers need to push, rather than expecting the other side to pull. NFC have clear potential to speed up payments. Speeding up payments is top priority in any large store (for various reasons).

In essence, build it and they will come. As for training, none needed. Its really no different than the user paying with a credit card. The system will let the teller know if the transaction went through or not. All that matters.

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98-99% of smartphone users doesnt know what CPU, ARM, SSD or CMOS mean/is/does either. Doesn't stop them from using it on a daily basis.

 

[divinox]

Not just payments - there are lots of other uses. It could be used for sales/promotion information when you walk into a store or down an aisle. You could tap a billboard and see a movie trailer. You could use it with a profile to automatically set the thermostat in your home or hotel room. Just a tip of the iceberg.

Of course. It could also be paired with self-scanning and self-service checkouts. Which could then be used to build new services, and so on and so forth. But if Apple doesnt include it, it certainly must be useless.

 

[D.T.]

Just had a little chat with a friend that linked me to the various NCF chatter, then said something to the effect of "If Jim D. gives a rumor a 'yep', it's pretty much fact".

I pointed out that while he's in the loop with Apple (pun +intended+), he may still be wrong. Plus, his position is easily defended: if he's right, he's right; if he's wrong, he can just come back and say his Apple contacts wanted some misinformation circulated or that he just wanted to throw the dogs off the scent for a change.

The most interesting information in this thread is the post linking out to the various Apple NFC patents, showing what looks to be almost identical implementation (position, size, etc.)

 

[Geckotek]

Chicken and egg problem that tech developers need to push, rather than expecting the other side to pull. NFC have clear potential to speed up payments. Speeding up payments is top priority in any large store (for various reasons).

not 100% true. The longer you sit in line, the more likely you are to buy the crap sitting around the register. They actually want you to stand in line to a certain degree.

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Just had a little chat with a friend that linked me to the various NCF chatter, then said something to the effect of "If Jim D. gives a rumor a 'yep', it's pretty much fact".

I pointed out that while he's in the loop with Apple (pun +intended+), he may still be wrong. Plus, his position is easily defended: if he's right, he's right; if he's wrong, he can just come back and say his Apple contacts wanted some misinformation circulated or that he just wanted to throw the dogs off the scent for a change.

The most interesting information in this thread is the post linking out to the various Apple NFC patents, showing what looks to be almost identical implementation (position, size, etc.)

Sure, but can you point out the last time he was wrong? There's a reason we listen to and trust him.

 

[Mago]

This prototypes don't need NFC coz arent iPhones, are just leaked parts on the next iPod Touch Engeneering prototypes disguised as iPhones.

1- has no sense to Apple to axe good LTE/NFC antenna just to insist on MacBook Unibody theme.
2- most trusted developers don't need phone features so they're good on iPod Touches.

At this point the only reliable leaks I see are the new Dock and the 16:9 screen.

 

[D.T.]

Sure, but can you point out the last time he was wrong? There's a reason we listen to and trust him.

No, I get it, hell, I've been following Jim for quite a while, and I wouldn't even say he would be "wrong" so much as "tactically untruthful" though I realize he hasn't ever done that in the past either.

I just thought those NFC patents/drawings were very compelling, especially when compared to the module/position/size in the leaked images (not to mention the potentially increased value of the Passbook system if paired with NFC). Maybe it's an NFC-like technology[?] so by saying "no NFC" that's technically correct!

Mostly this is just a fun exercise in wild ass speculation

 

[Geckotek]

Completely forgot that the beard had confirmed no NFC. Thanks for that reminder.

 

[ChrisWard1994]

It looks like only time will tell. 9to5 mac reckon they found code for NFC back in may but it could since of been scraped. Unfortunately Jim is pretty much always right. So unless theres another leak that gives us an insight we wont know until september 12th

 

[dv8r]

Good lord.

Is that typical?

Yes. Apple partnered with TomTom - and TomTom has some of the worst data of them all. Some have suggested that You just download the IOS version of Google maps, but in that case it would be better to just switch to Android altogether (if you can live with the build quality)... with the added bonus that Voice Search works better than Siri.

 

[Geckotek]

Yes. Apple partnered with TomTom - and TomTom has some of the worst data of them all. Some have suggested that You just download the IOS version of Google maps, but in that case it would be better to just switch to Android altogether (if you can live with the build quality)... with the added bonus that Voice Search works better than Siri.

Not familiar with the quality of TomTom. What do you base this on? (besides what you've seen in the iOS 6 betas).

Apple also bought some map companies in the past. Wondering what their contributions were.

I prefer to use Waze, really enjoy the social reporting features....such as where the cops and red light cameras are.

 

[dv8r]

not 100% true. The longer you sit in line, the more likely you are to buy the crap sitting around the register. They actually want you to stand in line to a certain degree.

Agree. But this behavior is changing fast because of smartphones and online alternatives - notice how people tend to take out their phone and start calling or messaging people when they're waiting in line - lost attention. The figures for "impulse buying" are dropping rapidly. A good article covering it:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/19/opinion/sunday/why-waiting-in-line-is-torture.html?_r=1

 

[dv8r]

Not familiar with the quality of TomTom. What do you base this on? (besides what you've seen in the iOS 6 betas).

I have a TomTom based GPS integrated in my car - it's rarely updated, quite frequently wrong... it just sucks... There might be some extra detail when IOS 6 hits production, but again - Google have spent years gathering this kind of data and Apple have not, it will be a giant step backwards.

Apple also bought some map companies in the past. Wondering what their contributions were.

Isn't that the 3D fly-over thing and the crowd-sourcing of information? If they had proper map-data then why partner with TomTom?

I prefer to use Waze, really enjoy the social reporting features....such as where the cops and red light cameras are.

I think crowd-sourcing is also the big thing in the IOS Maps app - but I would prefer to have useful maps and transit-data before that.

 

[Geckotek]

Isn't that the 3D fly-over thing and the crowd-sourcing of information? If they had proper map-data then why partner with TomTom?

That was only one of the purchases.

I have faith that Apple will do what they need to get the maps app in shape. *crosses fingers*

 

[NT1440]

So turns out its probably apple's new speakerphone:

http://www.patentlyapple.com/patent...ents-speakerphone-system-for-ios-devices.html