NTSB Criticizes Apple After Fatal Tesla Autopilot Crash for Not Banning Employee Smartphone Use While Driving

[coolfactor]

Can't get better than this...

Apple in a response provided to CNBC, said "We expect our employees to follow the law."

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Is this a joke? Blaming Apple because Teslas don't have attention detection and are marketed as "autopilot" when they are not that?

You actually make a very good point! Apple's existing attention awareness technology built into iPhones would be invaluable in cars! The car would make sure that the driver's posture and position is correct.

 

[bn-7bc]

Did tesla ever call the driver assusr (or whatever they calked the sysrem an auto pilot, btw calling it an auto pilot ie an automatic pikot mekes little sence since the oerson conrrolling a care is named a driver not a pilot, and it alkso mskes little sence because the person setting up an sut pilot in a plsne(the pilot) has recived a lot mor nandated traing on that system rhen the egvivalend treiniing for the driver of the car. To different opperatots in to very different situasions whit tottaly differen amounts of training and skills, why are we using the same name for the 2 system$. This makes no semce to me

 

[Will.O.Bie]

I've seen police officers drive by another car with the driver texting away, saw this driver texting, and they just continue on. If it's illegal to text and drive, then the law needs to be enforced. I see this as a discretionary traffic stop for police officers. Some let them go, some pull them over, but most times than not, they just ignore the offender.

Texting and driving penalties are not harsh enough to discourage these types of behaviors. California's law fines you $20/first offense, $50/thereafter, does not affect your insurance rates etc.

If anything happens after the fact, they just point the blame at the driver, the phone maker, the car maker, the sun being to bright, except the police department that's supposed to enforce these laws when they see drivers violating them.

Rather than blame others, if they see a clear violation of the law, enforce it.

 

[ozthegweat]

This just in: Tim Cook has been found guilty for a murder committed by a lowly Apple employee, because said employee was never told by Apple they shouldn't murder people.

 

[konqerror]

You actually make a very good point! Apple's existing attention awareness technology built into iPhones would be invaluable in cars! The car would make sure that the driver's posture and position is correct.

They already have that: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_Monitoring_System

 

[Nuno Lopes]

Every time a see or read something that it's so obvious that it does not make sense, like a dejavu ... they say its a glitch in the Matrix. Crop much?

 

[Boatboy24]

Can I correctly assume then, that no NTSB employee has ever been involved (at fault) in a distracted driving accident? If any were, were they strongly disciplined?

 

[Rogifan]

Was the employee on the job? If not, then Apple has zero responsibility.

 

[konqerror]

Was the employee on the job? If not, then Apple has zero responsibility.

Apple, like other companies and the government, can be held responsible if the phone itself was owned or reimbursed by Apple. That's a second dimension.

 

[Mojohanna32]

Yep, blame the company and not the person who actually ****ed up. So tired of misplaced blame and accountability.

 

[anthogag]

Using a smartphone while driving is a serious issue. People should lose their license sooner for driving while using the phone. A 1st time offence could include a 2 week licence suspension.

Was it worth it? Losing your life playing a video game while operating a vehicle?

How many people lost lives or had bad accidents while texting or watching a YouTube video...

 

[mikethemartian]

The United States National Transportation Safety Board today conducted a hearing dissecting the fatal 2018 crash of Apple engineer Walter Huang, who was using the autopilot feature of a Tesla Model X, reports CNBC.

The NTSB called Tesla's Autosteer feature "completely inadequate" and said that Tesla's forward collision warning system did not provide an alert, nor did the automatic emergency braking system activate, but the board also had some choice words for Apple.

At the time of the crash, Huang was playing a game on his company-issued development iPhone. He was not paying attention to the road and likely did not have his hands on the steering wheel as the Tesla was in Autopilot mode.In a statement, NTSB Chairman Robert Sumwalt criticized Apple for not having a policy that prevents employees from using their iPhones while driving.During the hearing, the NTSB said [PDF] that employers play an important role in preventing distracted driving. A strong policy is an effective strategy for cutting down on distracted driving, and Apple has no policy that prohibits cell phone use while driving.

Apple in a response provided to CNBC, said "We expect our employees to follow the law." In California, where the crash took place, there are distracted driving laws that prohibit the use of cell phones while driving, even in vehicles with an autopilot mode.

Apple has also implemented a Do Not Disturb While Driving feature that activates when a driver attempts to use a cellular phone while driving, though it can be disabled.

The NTSB's goal is to get all employers to implement and enforce policies that ban the use of personal electronic devices while driving.

Article Link: NTSB Criticizes Apple After Fatal Tesla Autopilot Crash for Not Banning Employee Smartphone Use While Driving

Was he even driving as part of the job?

 

[Eorlas]

Who the holy duck is running the NTSB? I've had 2 cars in the last 10 years that could have used some serious recall attention, yet they're spending time deliberating to conclusions thait essentially say....car and phone manufacturers are responsible for the misuse of their product?

This is like when negligent or malicious discharge of a firearm is blamed on the manufacturer. Or when a teacher is blamed by a parent for their child's poor grades.

We are definitely in an age where humans are not held accountable for their own actions.

I mean, this decision is genuinely, entirely stupid. Everyone who participated in it should be deeply ashamed.

 

[richard4339]

It would be one thing for Apple (or the NTSB) to prohibit distracted driving while clocked in but I’m not sure how far you get while off the clock. I know employers can encourage you to a point but I’m not sure how far they are allowed to take that. Doesn’t sound like something a business should be able to do.

 

[macduke]

It has nothing to do with the employer. The individual in question was the one possibly breaking the law (distracted driving, if that applies where the accident took place).

Should my employer have a policy on driving over the speed limit? Food delivery places would like a word with you lol

And I bet there have been more people killed by speeding delivery drivers than engineers playing video games. This case was singled out because it involved autopilot. The world will be much safer when more cars have tech like this. But for now it’s still up to people to not break the law.

This is yet another example of the government empowering a corporatocracy takeover. We are moving towards a world where our employers own us and the current powers in our government are helping it along. They will use this as a mandate to spy on us even more. They force us to use their devices and then track our every move and message.

 

[brucemr]

Apple, like other companies and the government, can be held responsible if the phone itself was owned or reimbursed by Apple. That's a second dimension.

Correct. Not just criminally, but often more importantly, civil (lawsuit). When,

1) Phone (or other similar device) is provided by company.
2) (Even if private phone), vehicle provided (including rental) by company. This can also include private vehicle used on company busines (ie mileage being reimbursed to employee).

My company has very clear rules, world wide, against both cases above for all employees. These rules were in place long before the first iPhone. Later, were expanded to include even fully hands free use (even in countries and jurisdictions where hands free was legal).

 

[Miles Teg]

Clearly the person who wrote the report is a Samsung user just getting in a dig at Apple.

 

[tobybrut]

Why is it the employer's business what their employees do in their private time? The fault is the driver's alone.

 

[ErikGrim]

Now that’s some professional victim blaming.

 

[Kabeyun]

This, I looked at the headline and started reading the article, assuming one of Apple's test cars had had a fatal accident --

No, wait, not Apple's car, it's a Tesla. So, clearly Apple was conducting some sort of tests in a Tesla --

No, it was an Apple employee, who also happens to be an individual human, "driving" their own Tesla, and doing foolish - and illegal - things while driving (texting is "distracted driving" under California law).

And the judge goes after Apple? WTF? Go after Tesla for calling their assisted driving feature, "AutoPilot" (no matter how many asterisks you put on it, if you call it that, some will believe the marketing), and if you really feel the need, tell the dead guy's family, in court, that he was a bad person for texting while driving, but Apple had no part in causing this accident (texting while driving was a thing long before Apple got in the phone business, and Apple has implemented features specifically designed to help people avoid using their phones while driving).

All true, except it wasn’t a judge; it was the head of the NTSB and current leading candidate for Douchebag of the Year.
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Now that’s some professional victim blaming.

Not unless one considers Apple the crash victim. The problem here is that D-Bag Sumwalt isn’t blaming the victim enough for his own stupidity.

 

[MauiPa]

Sounds like a stupid comment from the NTSB. Maybe all companies need wide-ranging policies: thou shal not murder, steal, commit adultery, sleep or play video games while driving, commit frau, hit your spouse.....

come on man, it was against the law already, isn’t that enough

 

[s66]

I'd go as far as saying that any employer has absolutely no business telling what an employee can do and can't do in their own car.
If it was a company car and if it was on a company trip: they might have something to say about it, but why bother repeating in a company policy what the law already -and clearly- states. It's redundant and breaking the law has potential for much more consequences (fines, jail time, being declared responsible for accidents, ...) than a company policy ever could have.

It's just a cheap shot at Apple.
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NTSB is saying they should have a very strict company regulation that's uniform in all states.

They should pressure the different states to come up with uniform laws in that case, not go round via tech companies to do the work the politicians don't want to do.
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Correct. Not just criminally, but often more importantly, civil (lawsuit). When,

1) Phone (or other similar device) is provided by company.
2) (Even if private phone), vehicle provided (including rental) by company. This can also include private vehicle used on company busines (ie mileage being reimbursed to employee).

My company has very clear rules, world wide, against both cases above for all employees. These rules were in place long before the first iPhone. Later, were expanded to include even fully hands free use (even in countries and jurisdictions where hands free was legal).

All your company should do is "don't break the law", not even an "or else".

Limiting people to do what is legal to do is ridiculous. And might well violate the rights of the employees in certain jurisdictions. I'm pretty sure if your company is active where I live, they are breaking the law out here for having that overreaching policy in place in itself.

 

[Professor Rucy]

Teslas are not autonomous vehicles.

“...who was using the autopilot feature of a Tesla Model X...”

Reading comprehension is key here.

 

[Stella]

Apple, like other companies and the government, can be held responsible if the phone itself was owned or reimbursed by Apple. That's a second dimension.

spot on.


The majority of posters didn’t read the article or understand the implications of the phone being an Apple supplied device.
It is not the employees personal device.

 

[D.T.]

“...who was using the autopilot feature of a Tesla Model X...”

Reading comprehension is key here.

Directly from Telsa.com:

Autopilot and Full Self-Driving Capability Features

Autopilot is a suite of driver assistance features that can be purchased before you buy your car or after it’s been delivered, and brings new functionality to your Tesla that makes driving safer and less stressful. Available packages include:

The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous.