Ok people why the hate on apple laptop

[jasin]

I'm sure Johhny Ive's team would take exception to your view point that all they do is select components. Layout of components is not a trivial task, for one, with lots of considerations, not least of which is where the ports are going to be, where the battery will be, the optical drive, etc. All of those items tie in closely with the physical design of the chassis - the form factor, the screen size, etc.

Well, any teenager who builds a PC at home is doing just that. Exactly that. And as I already have established everything is standardized now. There is nothing to design or redesign. At least, as far as the hardware, components, and cases go.

 

[iLog.Genius]

You can install Mac OS X on a PC. Many have done it. Its actually called a hackintosh. You do not need to do anything special either. You only need to format the drive for the Mac Os X file system.

http://www.hackintosh.com/

And of course you cant install it in windows, but you can't install windows inside mac Os X either. That's nothing to do with mac or pc though, that's just the nature of what an OS is and how it is designed operate.

Nice. Quote part of my post and take it out of context. I didn't say it wasn't possible. We all know it is but it requires tweaking/additional work and isn't as going to the Apple Store, buying OS X, popping it in and install. If you watch the video, it requires you to download additional software/files in addition to installing OS X - this isn't something an average consumer who wants a simple solution will want to do. But you'll probably reply saying it's a small task if you really want to do it. It is but really compare:

Installing Windows on a Mac Computer: it really is just inserting the install disc and booting off it like you would normally do.

Installing OS X on a PC: downloading additional files, creating a USB boot disk (depending on situation) and making sure your hardware is supported.

Simply put, someone can't just go out and buy parts and expect OS X to work, you actually have to consider the hardware where as with a Mac, Windows will install regardless of computer whether it be iMac, MacBook (Pro), MacPro.

 

[jasin]

I get the opposite, people usually ask me a few questions about what they do and if they can do it on a Mac. Then the next thing I hear is OMG it's expensive.

Yes OS X is great, but the real explanation and value proposition for any Mac is it's hardware quality. None of my macs have broken down due to quality issues, sure each one has had a hiccup, but it's usually fixed in software asap by Apple.

That's just simply not true either. Macs do breakdown! If they didn't then there would be no need for apple care. There are, in case you did not know, lots of threads on this forum here ... of people asking how to fix their macs.

The reason I am buying a Mbp this summer is because its the only computer that has everything I need and/or want. Its not that I can't get a quality PC laptop or one that will outperform a mac because I certainly can. Its just I have very, very specific needs.

 

[Salukipilot4590]

AppleCare runs circles around any extended warranty provided by other companies, this especially holds true if you have a nearby Apple Store to go to.

In 2003 I bought a Dell Inspiron 5150, maxed out, for somewhere around $2500 (I know, I know). I also got the complete care crap that they were touting at the time, the whole 3 year warranty, the accidental breakage care, and the home repair serivce....thats actually where a big chunk of the cost came in.

About a year later, as expected, the laptop started to fall apart. I called Dell and within 24 hours a repair tech was at my dorm room fixing the computer. Had to have them come out a couple more times but other than that the computer was running great until I sold it about 18 months ago.

Now that's what I called service!

Too bad my "new" Dell Inspiron 17 is an utter crowning POS. The build quality is crap, it's got three dead pixels right out of the box, the integrated graphics BLOW and there's no more accidental care warranty. Hell even the extended warranty was only good at the time of purchase and for an additional two years was something along the lines of $499 more....for a $799 laptop.

I should have gone Apple sooner.

Now I'm just waiting for my next big check to get the MBP 15" and say "screw it, I want service like I had before."

If that all makes sense.

 

[maclaptop]

To some it matters, to some it doesn't. It's only a computer. I simply don't care what others think. I use what I want.

 

[bigjobby]

Actually does both. Just depends on which level and scale in the design process he or she is at. When a fashion designer, for example, comes out with a new line of clothing or a new style he or she is inventing that as the designer is creating something new and it is created new from scratch. Computers do not use the same criteria or processes for design and innovation though as the clothing design industry does so your analogy is not really applicable here.

Its not about analogy, its about you trying to quote people on words they never used. Never knew Toyota invented the car.

 

[jasin]

To some it matters, to some it doesn't. It's only a computer. I simply don't care what others think. I use what I want.

Exactly. It should not be about pc vs. mac. It should be about your needs and wants. Which is why I am buying a Mbp this summer. Its meets my needs and has what I want.

Its not about analogy, its about you trying to quote people on words they never used. Never knew Toyota invented the car.

Right, same difference. Its like saying apple invented the computer, which they did not. That's part of the beauty of apple advertising and what makes them so successful though. They act like they invented the stupid thing with anything they release. Apple loyalists eat this stuff up too. Its becoming like a religious cult almost.

In 2003 I bought a Dell Inspiron 5150, maxed out, for somewhere around $2500 (I know, I know). I also got the complete care crap that they were touting at the time, the whole 3 year warranty, the accidental breakage care, and the home repair serivce....thats actually where a big chunk of the cost came in.

About a year later, as expected, the laptop started to fall apart. I called Dell and within 24 hours a repair tech was at my dorm room fixing the computer. Had to have them come out a couple more times but other than that the computer was running great until I sold it about 18 months ago.

Now that's what I called service!

Too bad my "new" Dell Inspiron 17 is an utter crowning POS. The build quality is crap, it's got three dead pixels right out of the box, the integrated graphics BLOW and there's no more accidental care warranty. Hell even the extended warranty was only good at the time of purchase and for an additional two years was something along the lines of $499 more....for a $799 laptop.

I should have gone Apple sooner.

Now I'm just waiting for my next big check to get the MBP 15" and say "screw it, I want service like I had before."

If that all makes sense.

There's a reason warranties are only for so long. Apple knows the life of their products as do PC companies. Its a tightly held industry secret that will never be released. So do not expect to get more life out of a computer just simply because its a Mac.

 

[mac00l]

For me, everything is quite simple.

Using a Mac is a choice. Using Windows, most times (not always) is because you have never used another platform in your life.

Why the hate?? Most times it is due to people not knowing mac osx at all, for most people mac osx is just something like windows, which comes with a computer that is excessively pricey.

I never engage in that kind of discussion, If I did, then I would have to be discussing about every single item at my home

xbox vs playstation, nikon vs canon, geforce vs ati, android vs ios, cisco vs (your favorite chinese manufacturer), amd vs intel.

I use what I like, if someone asks me about it then I answer. Most time using x or y product is a matter of taste, and it's impossible for everyone to have your tastes right??

 

[JD92]

...

 

[MrNomNoms]

Interesting that you followed a similar route to me, although I was using Macs at school before getting an Amiga (cue nervous comments from my Father about whether I was sure I knew what I was doing with Workbench). But as somebody who was used to a logical file system, a Shell and a multi-tasking environment, OSX feels to me like what Workbench could have become has Commodore not messed up and gone bust.

I had a brief exposure to Apple back in my primary school years but that was around 25 years ago - most of the experience since then was using BBC Micro, Acorn (w/ RISCOS) and Amiga 500 (was tempted to upgrade to 1200 but I was a kid without a job hence I was sh-t out of luck).

But you're right about the other stuff, although problems I've had with dust under the screen of my 2009 Macbook Pro made me go for an AG model instead this time round. Apple's design and testing is generally first rate, I think their manufacturing process is letting them down somewhat at present.

You must have a run of really bad luck because in ten years of owning various Macs I have only had 2 issues - my iMac G5 with the capacitor issue was repaired and returned quickly, and my old iMac DVD drive died but it I didn't help the situation by ripping 300+ music cds over several days lol that was fixed under warranty and picked up the next day.

Like the above poster said, hater's gonna hate.

The Apple Hi-Fi was a disaster. The mobile me service is crap, as is the first generation of Time Capsule's that would die after a year. Apple devices most certainly do require reviews before purchasing. Did you forget about Antenna-gate?

But the main point I think he was trying to make is that the general rule of thumb is, if you've purchased a MacBook Pro in the past you really don't need to sit around waiting for a review to then feel safe going out to buy a new one. With that being said, as you've noted, they've made some major missteps - the whole nVidia debacle could have been resolved by simply replacing the customers MacBook Pro with an entirely new one without the design flaw then send the bill off to nVidia for the cost of replacing the laptop. What did they keep doing? they kept replacing one faulty one with another faulty one that'll need replacing in 6 months.

With that being said, I know many people who equally have confidence in Lenovo and don't have to wait for a review of the next Thinkpad because they know Lenovo isn't going to do something to destroy the iconic Thinkpad brand by doing something stupid.

Likewise, Vista was an amazing operating system, if you ran it on modern hardware and not low end crap. Heck, even Windows 8 generates a bunch of press, and so far all we've officially seen of it is a demo of the touch UI.

Begin a fanboy is fine, supporting an OS is fine, and there's nothing wrong with disliking a specific OS, or loving one, but being a blind fanboy for either side just seems silly.

True; hence the reason I'm sitting here with two Mac's and I love my Windows Phone 7 whilst excited about Windows Phone 7 Mango to be released towards the end of this year. I also enjoy using Office 2011 on Mac OS X in stark contrast to the hatred there is again Microsoft by some - look at the juvenile iWork vs. Office 2011 debates that amount to little more than covert Microsoft bashing under the illusion of a rational argument.

Sadly there is enough Apple users that act like Justin Long, from the Get a Mac ads, and frankly that level of smugness is annoying. Spend enough time on macrumours and you will realise there is alot of elitest fanboys on here that are so blind to anything that does not have an Apple logo (most have not used windows 7 and bitch about it). Its the smug elitest attitude of some owners that spoils it for us mac owners.

*shrugs* its an ad - what do you expect, an overweight man dressed as an Apple walking on stage to then announce, "I'm Apple, we sell computers, we think they're pretty good" then walk off stage again? Come on, I've seen far worse ads than that, the Dell ad trying to compare their computers to 'fresh ingredients' by getting a celebrity chief in Australia to endorse it, HP hiring 'hip hop' stars that all the 'young people admire' to endorse their products by claiming they're 'cool' and 'hip' - something that escapes me, am I buying a computer or some sort of image?

Yeah, I thaught the same thing. Those commercials were cute but PC people I talked to never really felt hit by it. It was more like the Mac dude was glorifying himself in some sort of strawman argument.

But on the other hand. There are always those who are agitated by what they feel is false marketing, resulting i things like this:

Image

If you view your iMac as a laptop that stands vertically then how is it any ridiculous than for example your webcam not working in your notebook thus requiring you to take it in to get it fixed?

 

[fattire357]

Nice. Quote part of my post and take it out of context. I didn't say it wasn't possible. We all know it is but it requires tweaking/additional work and isn't as going to the Apple Store, buying OS X, popping it in and install. If you watch the video, it requires you to download additional software/files in addition to installing OS X - this isn't something an average consumer who wants a simple solution will want to do. But you'll probably reply saying it's a small task if you really want to do it. It is but really compare:

Installing Windows on a Mac Computer: it really is just inserting the install disc and booting off it like you would normally do.

Installing OS X on a PC: downloading additional files, creating a USB boot disk (depending on situation) and making sure your hardware is supported.

Simply put, someone can't just go out and buy parts and expect OS X to work, you actually have to consider the hardware where as with a Mac, Windows will install regardless of computer whether it be iMac, MacBook (Pro), MacPro.

It can actually be incredibly difficult to install OSX in a PC. I got a new Sandy Bridge motherboard and i5 processor, and despite having somebody make a boot CD with every kext I'd ever need for that motherboard, it took me two weeks to get running because my graphics card was not compatible (despite happening to be an ATI 5770 card that is also sold for a Mac Pro). I finally figured out the Mac-version ATI 5770 has an EFI-compatible ROM flashed onto the card, and my PC version did not, so I had to flash a new ROM to the card. Thankfully somebody had already compiled that. My point is, geesh, do not try to put OSX on a PC unless you really like that stuff

 

[fattire357]

That's just simply not true either. Macs do breakdown! If they didn't then there would be no need for apple care. There are, in case you did not know, lots of threads on this forum here ... of people asking how to fix their macs.

The reason I am buying a Mbp this summer is because its the only computer that has everything I need and/or want. Its not that I can't get a quality PC laptop or one that will outperform a mac because I certainly can. Its just I have very, very specific needs.

Just look at the resale value of a Macbook Pro on eBay. Everyone knows that the hardware of a Mac is more likely to hold up so they sell for more than a PC when they are used.

I have a 2008 top of the line Dell that I can't sell for $300. I see plenty of Macbook Pros from that year selling for twice that amount.

 

[fattire357]

I think you'll find this isn't true in the vast majority of cases. You'll be kidding yourself otherwise.

Edit: And it is also illegal (I believe).

There has never been a federal, state or local law banning you from installing OSX on a PC (or jailbreaking an iPhone), unless you break copyright law by:


1. Redistributing copies of Apple's intellectual property to the masses on a Hackintosh forum. To be 100% legal, you have to distribute directions on how to modify OSX, and not the modified OSX components themselves.

2. Selling a hackintosh machine.

This generates a lot of confusion in the public because many people assume that if selling a hackintosh machine is illegal then building it must be illegal too . I actually had a drunk guy in a bar tell me repeatedly that what I was doing what criminal...quite the frustrating experience when you're not one at all. There is so much misperception here with some people in the public.

The only thing you do is break your contract with Apple in the EULA, and because you broke your contract Apple doesn't have any obligations to you (warranty or otherwise).

 

[dr Dunkel]

If you view your iMac as a laptop that stands vertically then how is it any ridiculous than for example your webcam not working in your notebook thus requiring you to take it in to get it fixed?

Yes, if my view were to be just that, then that silly counter-ad would make no sense. In reality, my view is that the iMac is a desktop machine and then, it's a quite qute tounge-in-cheek

Regarding iMac, the prices in my market was, finally, adjusted some in the last update. Today, a traditional desktop with a quality monitor like that (even given all the silly limitations added to the screen by Apple) would be quite close to, for example, your unit.

This generates a lot of confusion in the public because many people assume that if selling a hackintosh machine is illegal then building it must be illegal too . I actually had a drunk guy in a bar tell me repeatedly that what I was doing what criminal...quite the frustrating experience when you're not one at all. There is so much misperception here with some people in the public.

I wonder where such desinformation comes from?

It would be fine to sell hackintoshes without the OS, right?

 

[iLog.Genius]

It can actually be incredibly difficult to install OSX in a PC. I got a new Sandy Bridge motherboard and i5 processor, and despite having somebody make a boot CD with every kext I'd ever need for that motherboard, it took me two weeks to get running because my graphics card was not compatible (despite happening to be an ATI 5770 card that is also sold for a Mac Pro). I finally figured out the Mac-version ATI 5770 has an EFI-compatible ROM flashed onto the card, and my PC version did not, so I had to flash a new ROM to the card. Thankfully somebody had already compiled that. My point is, geesh, do not try to put OSX on a PC unless you really like that stuff

Thanks for sharing and your experience backs the fact that you have to do far more to get OS X on a built PC than to put Windows on a Mac. I too had a similar experience where I had the required hardware from the Hackintosh community themselves and still could not get it to load the first few times. There was a lot of tweaking that needed to be done and I eventually got it to work. I'm sure OSX86 community has come a long way since but to me, that will always be a hobby and if I want to really use OS X, I'd just get a Mac.

 

[Vudoo]

I'm a Mac. I'm a PC.

Cute commercials that totally pissed off an entire market segment and created the stigma of Mac users being trendy douchbags in the minds of people who've never actually met a real live Mac user before.

They were great commercials in that they definitely raised the Mac's profile in the marketplace... however I do wonder how many PC users they alienated in the process?

Even though I am a Mac user, those commercials alienated me as a PC user. Yes I thought they were funny, but inaccurate. It just made people feel that Mac users were better than PC users and that's not true at all.

 

[jnpy!$4g3cwk]

Source? In head-to-head comparisons with identical specs, Macs are rarely more than $100 more expensive than the closest competitor's machine, and usually there are several specs that can't be exactly matched (at the very least, OS X and the aesthetics). Often, the Mac is actually the better deal.

They simply don't offer low-end configurations. They are not ripping anyone off, however.

jW

I recently priced out a higher-end Dell comparable to an MBP. Price was surprisingly close. What Apple refuses to give you is a $400 model that will break after a year. Some folks are very offended by this. Go figure.

 

[Fubar1977]

I love the Apple the products.
I hate the cult-style and the monger for total control.
I hate the people loving the Apple products.

There was an article in the newspaper the other day, describing findings from some professor who had found that people devoted to Apple displayed the same type of brain activity as deeply religious people do.

I have never come across such devotion to a brand, ever.

Yep, I read the same article.
It`s pretty much my biggest issue with being an Apple user.
It should not matter what any individuals choice of machine is and the haters/fanboys give the rest of us a bad name.

@ Fattire357: Yep, Hackintosh is an impressive feat but strictly for the masochists!

 

[bigjobby]

There has never been a federal, state or local law...

That makes sense and thanks for the clarification.

 

[AMDGAMER]

This is a totally legit topic. Its similar to BMW costing 55k with the same options and power as a nissan for 35k. There is a premium for these computers and anyone who says there isn't is not in reality. I pay the premium for what I think is a great computer.

 

[iLog.Genius]

This is a totally legit topic. Its similar to BMW costing 55k with the same options and power as a nissan for 35k. There is a premium for these computers and anyone who says there isn't is not in reality. I pay the premium for what I think is a great computer.

Yes and no. If you just look at it for what is it, there might be a big difference but like some have already posted, there are computers out there that cost the same or in the same ballpark as a Mac. But any price difference, I'm sure whoever is buying will justify the price whether it be build or OS. Like a BMW, some say it's grossly overpriced, but the driving dynamics and overall feel of my 3-Series justifies whatever the difference in price whether it be an Audi, Mercedes or Infiniti.

 

[shansoft]

Just look at the resale value of a Macbook Pro on eBay. Everyone knows that the hardware of a Mac is more likely to hold up so they sell for more than a PC when they are used.

I have a 2008 top of the line Dell that I can't sell for $300. I see plenty of Macbook Pros from that year selling for twice that amount.

Huh?

Not quite sure what you talking about..

I bought a Acer for USD700 brand new from almost 2 years ago, and sold it in last couple days for 550. The value loss is way much less for PC than Mac.

A MBP cost 2k from a year ago probably only get you around 1200 or less to actually sold it out. I don't see how it hold the value at all when you are losing more......

 

[Ach111es]

Huh?

Not quite sure what you talking about..

I bought a Acer for USD700 brand new from almost 2 years ago, and sold it in last couple days for 550. The value loss is way much less for PC than Mac.

A MBP cost 2k from a year ago probably only get you around 1200 or less to actually sold it out. I don't see how it hold the value at all when you are losing more......

LOL my vostro that I paid 1000 for with anti glare, nvidia 8600gt, and 2.1 core duo would maybe get 300...the CD drive broke and I had to replace the battery

 

[shansoft]

LOL my vostro that I paid 1000 for with anti glare, nvidia 8600gt, and 2.1 core duo would maybe get 300...the CD drive broke and I had to replace the battery

It looks like your laptop been around more than 3 years.......

Try to sell a MBP that is 3 years from now that cost you around 2K, you are lucky if you can get rid of it with 400 buck....