OS X Lion to Drop 'Rosetta' Support for PowerPC Applications

[Xenomorph]

I use a 1.33 GHz PowerPC G4 system still (1.5 Gigs RAM and a Radeon 9700 Pro). It's loaded with games and apps I've been using over the years.

I don't know which apps I have are PowerPC-only, but I'm pretty sure a ton of my games are PowerPC only. Blizzard stuff like StarCraft, Warcraft III, Diablo II, etc. I think Halo and Unreal Tournament 2004 are PowerPC-only as well.
I still fire up StarCraft every now and then - especially since it works better than it does on Windows!

Guess I still have a reason to keep the G4 around. It has Mac OS X 10.4 installed, so it still does Classic mode and has great support for old PowerPC games. I can't run WoW on it any longer (it dropped support for PowerPC some time ago), and the official builds of Firefox 4 don't work on PowerPC either.

I guess it's no big loss moving my Core 2 Duo and Core i7 systems to 10.7...

 

[gnasher729]

Very, very old news. People knew about this back in February when this came out. We knew that Rosetta couldn't be supported because the kernel has to run in full 64 bit now. If you check the Activity Monitor, it says kernel_task Intel (64-bit).

What makes you think the kernel would have anything to do with it? Rosetta runs just fine on Macs with 64 bit kernel. It is actually invisible to any applications, including Rosetta. Apple could support Rosetta as long as it supports 32 bit Intel applications.

 

[NAG]

So what are die-hard Eudora users moving to for email under Lion?

I tried both Thunderbird and the Apple Mail app a couple years ago, and went back to using my 6 year old copy of Eudora.

Well first you have to port Hypercard to Intel OS X. Then you'll need to create a stack to present all your arguments why you need Eudora and why all the alternatives won't work. After that you'll need to create a time machine using a Mac Classic to recover your backup files from 1969 and quickly zap your pram to avoid a paradox. And after you get the port you can never mention it to anyone or your computer will turn into a pumpkin.

 

[bentoms]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8F190 Safari/6533.18.5)

Simple solution.

Don't upgrade to Lion!

If your mac needs replacing due to a hardware fault... refurbs, eBay etc...

Will sort you out whilst a decent alternative/upgrade is released.

It's not Apple's problem.

Keeping Classic & Rosetta would leave us with an OS like Windows. Full of old inefficient code.

 

[Eriamjh1138@DAN]

Drop Rosetta. Drop the legacy stuff. It only holds us back.

It was horrible in OS8 and OS9. Old 680x0 code still running on PPC machines. Classic dragged it on when OSX launched and no one misses it today.

 

[roland.g]

You've been here since 2005 and you are that oblivious to what we are all talking about?

No. You're just gullible.

 

[FocusAndEarnIt]

Believe it or not, my office still uses Appleworks...

 

[ten-oak-druid]

Believe it or not, my office still uses Appleworks.

With this news, we are finally making the transition to Pages.

Thank you, Steve Jobs.

P.S.

In a conversation with a "Genius" at the Apple Store, I was told that (the employee) too used Appleworks - albeit to save his passwords into. He figured that if his info was ever stolen, almost nobody would be able to open a .cwk file.

I used appleworks for quite a while after their discontinuation for two applications: Paint and Draw. Apple had very good apps there and let them die. These two could have been part of iwork if they had kept them current.

The last time I tried to run apple works though, it was rather clunky. I think in Leopard or SL it became unusable for me. I didn't try very hard to revive it though.

I still have not found a good substitute for these.

 

[gnasher729]

I understand that keeping Rosseta in Lion would be easy for Apple and people still using PPC apps could keep on using them, but in 2011 3rd party software that is not updated to intel is not Apple's problem either. Office 2008 also is not Apple's screw up.

Here's the problem: Many people have invested significant money in applications that work just fine. Any new MacBook runs PowerPC apps better than any G5 MacPro ever did. So these people will not want to run Lion. Which means if I write apps that require Lion then these people will not be able to run them, so they won't buy them. So I have to continue to write code that runs on Leopard. If Apple kept Rosetta, then I could write code for 10.7.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

The switch to intel has been going on since 2005.

I hate to break it to some people but its probably time to upgrade.

Rosetta isn't about people switching to Intel dude! It's about Intel machines being able to run software that was never updated (like Quicken) to run natively as Intel code.

Frankly, I think this is a stupid move on Apple's part. WTF does it hurt them to leave Rosetta functional for those who need it (like with Snow Leopard an optional install) ??? Is there something about Rosetta that breaks OSX? I don't think so. This is just Apple being stupid. Steve probably has it in his head he wants to leave that PPC nightmare (that he loved so much in the past) behind completely just so he can sleep at night. Screw the people who need to run Quicken. Have Intuit even offered a discount for them to the Windows version? Of course not.

I'd be curious to know what exactly Rosetta needs to function under Lion. What part of the OS is causing the current version to crap out on developer builds? Most emulators I have for other systems couldn't care less about the OS version. After all, they are emulating the OLD software, not the new software.

 

[ten-oak-druid]

This is the normal sequence of events. We have had several transitions:

68k --> PowerPC
Classic --> OS X
PowerPC --> Intel

Each time Apple has done a fine job of offering compatibility of older software long after the transition. I believe business schools have used Apple as a model of how to do this right.

Eventually the support for older systems goes away.

 

[firewood]

Old 680x0 code still running on PPC machines.

Still running...

Really old 680x0 code will run under vMac. And the vMac emulator will run on the latest Intel Macs under Lion.

 

[Mac-Mariachi]

Pixelmator is not vector based image creation and editing software.

You're absolutely correct. I meant to say VectorDesigner .

 

[Marx55]

All Mac OS X versions are basically the same; fixings of a beta software still in beta (and the amazing thing is that they charge with each new beta version; so many bugs still need fixing since version 1.0). Thus, it should be possible to re-install Rosetta from Mac OS X 10.6 to Mac OS X 10.7.

 

[Amblydoper]

With Rosetta, there was never any incentive to replace PPC apps with Universal or Intel apps. Now, there is a clear reason for developers to do so. Give them some time, and the ones that care about their customers will provide solutions. The ones that don't... stop giving them money.

Quicken is a different story. Quicken sucks. If you refuse to switch to an alternative AND you require Lion, then you need to keep a copy of SL somewhere. (dual boot, virtual machine, second computer or external drive).

As for the 5 to 15 year old video games, either say good bye, or keep SL alive some how.

 

[sith33]

If anyone actually cares about the reason this is happening, wjlafrance had it right on the first page - to support rosetta, all libraries have to be cross compiled for ppc. So it's not just a matter of "leaving it in," it's a matter of devoting developer resources to building, enhancing, testing and maintaining those libraries.

Apple made the decision that it was better to put those resources into 10 more cool new Lion features. You can disagree with that, but claiming that it's a conspiracy to make you buy a new machine is just plain old internet crazy.

 

[milo]

I have a Dell 3100cn networked color laser printer that I really like, despite the Dell badge. Unfortunately the driver is PPC-only and Dell has not updated it. This is the only concern I still have regarding losing Rosetta.

Does anyone have advice or suggestions for keeping a printer alive in Lion when its drivers are PPC-only? I'm wondering if there's some kind of generic Universal driver I can use; the printer is pretty basic, after all.

Initially I didn't care at all about dropping rosetta, but after reading the comments I realized that my printer and scanner may not be supported. I'll probably still update to 10.7, but I won't be happy if I have to dump perfectly good hardware just for an OS update.

Chris Breen on Macworld said that the installer works, though some people have reported issues with some of the updates (e.g. corrupt databases). He said it's nothing Microsoft couldn't fix with updates (and probably will since it's in its "current" support phase).

A PPC only installer works on 10.7 without rosetta? How?

I would be impressed with MS if they finally shipped an update to the installer. Bonehead move in the first place not making the installer universal when they made the apps universal.

 

[nik911sc]

Apple will lose out

To replace mission critical software that is PPC I am looking at the equivalent cost to a MBA. The end result is wasteful software upgrades at the expense of a MBA. Apple loses, I lose and mediocre software vendors win.

I suppose I am one of the lucky ones where there is an upgrade path albeit at the expense of my next Apple purchase.

The point about Rosetta getting dropped being known for a long time is overstated. It's has only ever been rumored and I have read lots of rumors about this but have read nothing concrete to say it is definite.

 

[NAG]

Rosetta isn't about people switching to Intel dude! It's about Intel machines being able to run software that was never updated (like Quicken) to run natively as Intel code.

Surfer-speak aside, you're wrong. The functionality was introduced so people wouldn't be skittish about updating to an Intel Mac due to lack of software/chicken and the egg problem. Essentially, if your old software didn't work on Intel Macs why not jump ship to Windows if you're going to have to rebuy everything. It was never meant as a crutch for developers to use ad infinitum. It was a way for Apple to get the new hardware out to create a userbase so developers would have a market to sell the new Intel compatible software to.

Frankly, I think this is a stupid move on Apple's part. WTF does it hurt them to leave Rosetta functional for those who need it (like with Snow Leopard an optional install) ??? Is there something about Rosetta that breaks OSX? I don't think so. This is just Apple being stupid. Steve probably has it in his head he wants to leave that PPC nightmare (that he loved so much in the past) behind completely just so he can sleep at night. Screw the people who need to run Quicken. Have Intuit even offered a discount for them to the Windows version? Of course not.

You're making the assumption that this is similar to how the iPad has a 2x mode to help with the product launch there. You make quite a few assumptions regarding just how much time and other resources are (not by your lack of understanding) required. Your underestimation is actually kind of shocking.

The simple fact is that 10.6 will still run your software that hasn't been updated for 5 year old hardware so why do you care if you can't run the latest OS? 10.6 isn't going to lose any functionality and will likely receive security updates until 10.8 if previous security updates are any indication. And if you want to upgrade then, you might want to ask the company why they don't upgrade their software to work on hardware released within the last decade.

 

[artguy3d]

This irks me so much I have to weigh in...

Now how hard would it of really been for apple to leave the functionality for those upgrading from Snow Leopard? And how many billions of dollars do they have now - of our money and purchases over the years?

What a pisser (sorry for the language).

A quick look at my system shows more than 40 programs affected!

I've got most all the new stuff, but the old versions are needed for various reasons - especially for design and printing legacy users - not to mention long time developers, engineers, architects, designers, etc.

The new systems can run this old stuff without a cough. It's often the new versions that are full of bloat that hog resources and slow machines.

Various work flows are going to be interupted and I don't think we have even began so see the complaints and ill-will this will cause. And for what reason?

Steve - what's the point?

 

[Sjhonny]

I keep Tiger installed on an external drive for all old games since 2007. Almost all old games work just fine on Tiger. Diablo I/II, Alien vs Predator, Alice in Wonderland, Return to Castle wolfenstein, Heretic and many others. Problem solved.

Well the problem with that is, you'll have to maintain your current hardware. There will be a time Apple'll releases hardware that wouldn't be able to run Tiger, Leopard or Snow Leopard (maybe a post OS X time) ... What then? I find it hard to believe that someone will build an OS X emulator like they did recently for the Atari ...

 

[Thunderhawks]

Older software does not work. I think this was a bad idea. They could remove the ability to compile new software using Rosetta but there is going to be a lot of stuff that just stops working. I believe Office 2008 can not even install with out Rosetta as the installer is PPC the program itself does not need it but the installer does.

I think it was a bad idea for Apple do drop a bomb shell like that. Honestly Apple should of give at least 2 years noticed so companies and enterprise which tend to move slower have noticed but then again this is why Apple sucks in the enterprise market.

And after a 2 year notice we would hear the same kwetching.

Anybody releasing MAC Programs shouldn't need notice. All the info what is to happen when has been available for a long long time.

Companies and Enterprises who tend to move slower need to get with it.
Sounds heartless, but the computer world of today is fast paced in case they didn't notice.

Don't think Apple should be asked (or given a negative rap) to wait for the slowest to catch up.
Surefire way to go broke!

 

[roadbloc]

I'll miss my old games. I guess I could just stick the Windows versions on my Windows 7 box instead when I do upgrade to Lion...

...interesting on how Microsoft manages to keep compatibility, but Apple can't.

 

[ryanwarsaw]

Poop. No more Disk Inventory X?

I was thinking that too. It is the only app I use that uses Rosetta as far as I know.

 

[gkarris]

NO, NO, NO, NO....

(holds onto "Quake" and "AppleWorks" discs/boxes...)