Phil Schiller: Apple Working With Consumer Reports to Understand MacBook Pro Battery Test

[ThisBougieLife]

It's fake news guys, don't worry:

http://www.inquisitr.com/3823982/macbook-pro-2016-consumer-reports-test-may-be-fake-news-opinion/

 

[mwidjaya]

That's the problem. When Apple is still selling laptops, why sell ones that make them lose a consumer for a decade? Combine that with the rapid advances in technology that occur every two or four years...

Please read again what you responded to. I think you mis-read.

"The MB Air, all we asked for was a retina screen, and they could laugh all the way to the bank for another 10 years."

If they updated MB Air with retina, it will likely be a big hit for some years. How is that losing a consumer for a decade?

 

[Count Blah]

What are the odds that Consumer Reports is just reading the joke that passes for "Tech Journalism" these days and using that as their basis, and not actually doing any real testing anymore?

I'd say pretty effing high.

You can't be serious.

 

[Reason077]

That seems strange since Safari even when playing a video will not always shown as using more energy when at the same time chrome only needs to be open with a blank page and it will use more energy (based on activity monitor number).

If the issue causing poor battery life was something so simple as to show up in activity monitor, I'm sure Apple wouldn't have let it slip through.

It would also, most likely, be showing up on various different hardware and not just one model of MacBook!

This is something a little more tricky... And intermittent. Triggered by using Safari but not in Safari itself. Graphics drivers? Kernel?

 

[applefan69]

Probably late to say it. I feel like this event is going to push Apple more towards their arm systems. Like many have said before, when the energy saving technologies are working this laptop really has great battery life except the moment you step into boundaries where those energy saving technologies do not work the battery quickly drains.

The energy saving technologies are very complex and hardware specific, the reason Apple never uses latest and greatest from Intel is because they need months or years to integrate the chips intelligently. I bet this problem exists increasingly as Apple develops their heavily integrated energy saving techniques. This is why I dare suggest this to be another incentive to the concept of a full arm Mac. But unfortunately I already know Apple would not re-write OS X, we would get iOS of some kind, I would hope they have more up their sleeve than i imagine here, also I would miss bootcamp.

In the case of the Macbook Pro Apple used high end hardware that was almost sort of near cutting edge, tried to engineer it into a very efficient package. In my opinion it sounds like either hardware or time constraints caused them to cut corners in hardware integration and therefore energy saving technologies.

Lets not be too disappointed though. From a realistic standpoint Apple has developed an insanely powerful computer in an insanely small package that in fact does last insane battery life. So what if the system has minor flaws where system gaps in the energy saving technologies exist.

 

[CrownVic]

Totally agreed.

It is so maddening that these guys are overlooking the strategic value of Mac platform in the whole Apple ecosystem.
You know the cracks are appearing when lots of Apple fans are up in arms with what is happening in Apple these days.

Many signs of imbalances within the company showed up this year. Long laundry list of actions big and small that demonstrates Apple execs are out of touch with the user base.
- languishing of Macs - be it MacBook Air, Mac mini or Mac Pro
- screwing up MacBook Pro updates
- too lazy to update iPhone 7 design (to think that this is their most important product)
- whole donglelife thing is so form over function
- killing off the Apple display
- killing off the Apple wireless routers
- removing time remaining estimate

Aaaarrrrghhh, I sense disturbance in the force!

I couldn't agree more! Especially with what you said about Apple fans being upset. I have been an Apple fan since 2011 and I have always said (and, despite these troubling times, still do) that I will always buy apple products. I am deeply into the ecosystem and love how they all work together. That being said, I think that there is something weird going on at apple. Even a "die hard" fan such as myself is recognizing that there is a problem.

 

[Paul Dawkins]

If the issue causing poor battery life was something so simple as to show up in activity monitor, I'm sure Apple wouldn't have let it slip through.

It would also, most likely, be showing up on various different hardware and not just one model of MacBook!

This is something a little more tricky... And intermittent. Triggered by using Safari but not in Safari itself. Graphics drivers? Kernel?

I guess it's possible, but I haven't experienced it. I use both browsers and with Chrome it is always worse.

 

[Theway400]

Bottom line, this is a garbage MacBook Pro release

Had so much potential but they blew it.

Can't even connect your iPhone to it without an adapter.

also, removing the magsafe.....

I signed up just to like this post! I don't care so much for the missing ports but this was funny. I'll miss the sd slot a little but decent trade for size and weight that I imagine goes into the form/design.

I agree with the comment about a MBA with retina is all I really wanted...

I got the 13" with touch bar and returned it for the 15" base, but will return it when my 15" with Radeon 460and 512gb arrives this week. I hope to do a few batteries test with both in front of me.

For the record I have seen 10hrs from the current 15" the two times I measured it, 1: Developing in Xcode, browsing, and some light adobe stuff 2: Watching a movie in VLC and light other use

I will also add that, during most days the battery life feels pretty lame on both the 13" and 15" even if you factor in indexing, gpu, or background tasks. But I can't be sure of exact timing, just the frequency at which I needed to charge

 

[djgamble]

Interesting that he didn't say CR is just wrong. An indication that there really is an issue, though with what we don't yet know.

It would be good to see Apple put more focus on the Mac platform and ecosystem.

To me it sounds like he's saying... 'our lab tests give significantly different results - we want to improve things, but can't because we can't replicate their results'.

What can Apple do if in their lab tests the machines last for 10-16 hours but since one site released results suggesting more like ~3 hours, every blogger's been repeating that the battery life is hopeless.

It sounds to me like Apple are gathering facts before they can come out with an accurate, technical statement about the matter. I mean... if Chrome is the killer (for example) then WHY? If it's entirely because of Google's engineering then Apple can say 'ask Google why Chrome kills batteries'. If Chrome (for example) exploits some memory leak in OS X (that other apps can too) then Apple can fix that.

I don't think Apple's 'accepting' there's an issue. What they are doing is fact-finding so that they can fix the issue (if it's their problem) or accurately deny responsibility (if the reports are incorrect). And if it's just poor testing (with no scientific basis, that accidentally involved exporting 10 4K videos in the background during testing) then they can call out the testing procedures.

 

[MH01]

It sounds to me like Apple are gathering facts before they can come out with an accurate, technical statement about the matter.

I don't think I've ever seen apple accept fault let alone provide a technical statement . An accurate technical statement on the mater, no hope. Their testing approach already is flawed using pre-production units.

They will make a statement , but it will be vague and reassuring .

 

[SusanK]

I agree in principle, but I don't think Forstall was fired for Maps sucking. I think he was fired for petulance, and also as a result of some post Jobs power struggles / not playing nice with others.

In that case Cook can't even tell a decent lie. Forstall is a brilliant software engineer. Too many half baked issues since Forstall's been gone.

If there was an issue as you stated Cook should have run the middle. Cook was too busy running all over the globe at that time cutting ribbons on Apple stores. Time for Cook to go. Past time.

 

[Theway400]

I don't think I've ever seen apple accept fault let alone provide a technical statement . An accurate technical statement on the mater, no hope. Their testing approach already is flawed using pre-production units.

They will make a statement , but it will be vague and reassuring .

What about this?
http://www.apple.com/support/iphone6plus-multitouch/

But yes I agree that they are very crafty at navigating customers concerns.

 

[Paul Dawkins]

I don't think I've ever seen apple accept fault let alone provide a technical statement . An accurate technical statement on the mater, no hope. Their testing approach already is flawed using pre-production units.

They will make a statement , but it will be vague and reassuring .

You know that pre-production unit is exactly the same? It's what production unit is built based on. Moreover a battery is a battery. It lasts based on what you are doing. If indeed there is a software bug or bugs that cause the battery to be wasted then it will be fixed. End of story. Otherwise there is no mystery here or conspiracy.

 

[drumcat]

So going by your statement, CR could have used an inappropriate or flawed testing methodology and it's Apple's fault, not theirs?

The only assumption I'm making is that the methodology being used by CR is consistent across products. Since no one has said, thus far, that this is the new method CR just came up with, I'm assuming they've applied this to all of the laptop testing they've done recently.

So, by your statement, you're either questioning CR's methodology, or just don't like the fact that they came up with wildly different times. If we speculate as to why it's doing what it's doing, then we're guessing what Apple screwed up. It's likely that there are lots of people at Apple trying to solve this now. But there is zero inclination that any of this is "an inappropriate or flawed testing methodology".

 

[H2SO4]

You know that pre-production unit is exactly the same? It's what production unit is built based on. Moreover a battery is a battery. It lasts based on what you are doing. If indeed there is a software bug or bugs that cause the battery to be wasted then it will be fixed. End of story. Otherwise there is no mystery here or conspiracy.

Don't be ridiculous. Pre-production is NOT the same that’s why they are required to mention it.
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More tests could be done by Consumer Reports, and Apple will always backup their tests more over any one elses as "we have build out machines, therefore we also know what's it capable of" and single out anyone else's tests..

I blame CR for this,, since not all Macbook Pro (2016) were affected, therefore the problem does not lie with Apple.

If Apple says the new 'Pro' lasts 10 hours, i'm incline to believe that. But can also be the individual machines only..

Seriously? No really, I mean, seriously?
Since time immemorial Apple have never posted exactly how they tested machines. Why?
Look at this;

It’s what Virgin Broadband in the Uk say you might get and what you’ll maybe get. Apple have enough data grabbed from users that they can do something similar with battery.
How shortsighted. Apple know what their machines are capable ONLY for the regimes under which they test. This is why plenty of manufacturers have problems when their hardware hits the shelves.

 

[cablecartman]

Fat Philly doing some damage controll.......again!

Not sure the 'fat' remark helps.

 

[cire1244]

A true power user, I'm having zero battery issues with my new fully loaded MBP. Feel bad for those that are.

13" or 15"? I'm having plenty of battery problems with my fully loaded 13" tbMBP

 

[rtrutter]

I love how befuddled Phil seems. It's almost like he can't imagine Apple would produce something in err.
[doublepost=1482557478][/doublepost]

The problem though is that guys like Rene Richie and Jim Darlymple are in no way shape or form objectionable. Richie takes the term "Blind Fanboyism" to a whole new low and can't admit that Apple may have faults.

Rene Richie is the head cheerleader for Apple. All he needs is the pom poms and uniform...

 

[inplainview]

As additional sauce for the goose, the fact that they removed the SD card slot is a slap in the face of photographers. For Phil "the fat man" to claim that the removal was because the SD card is clunky simply shows that he does not understand a large sector of his buyers. SD cards are a staple of of almost all cameras, consumer and pro, on the market. What was he thinking? I think Apple has gone too far in the form over function area. Oh, and the removal of the MagSafe. This might be my last MacBook Pro.

 

[happyslayer]

While I believe there are certainly battery issues because I have experienced them on my 13" TB MBP, I have also found that the solution has consistently been reinstalling the OS to fix it. The stock OS. I had Sierra 12.2.1 when it arrived, but immediately installed the current beta of 12.2.2 (Think it was 4) and my battery life was crap (4-5 hours max no matter what.) I did a clean install of 12.2.1 using recovery mode and was back up to getting 10 hours. Installed the next beta release, 5... battery life went to crap. Reinstall again... good. Finally installed beta 6 (because I'm a glutton for punishment apparently) and battery life went back to bad. However, the final release of 12.2.2 hit and I installed it over the top of the beta and... battery life is back to 10 plus hours.

I use Coconut battery and Battery Logger 2 to check it.

The first of the 12.2.3 betas are ready for me to install in the App Store update section, but for now, I'm just letting them be. I do think this is more software related since clean installs are good, but betas seem to kill it. Basically, per Coconut, 2-5 watts average usage with clean installs and 5-10 watts average usage with betas per Coconut. I can't comment on the 15's with dGPUs since I don't have one, but I assume they are suffering similar issues with power handling with the current CPUs as well.

Hopefully Apple working with CR will help them find some kind of software fix.

For those having issues, maybe try a clean recovery install--after a good Time Machine backup, of course.

 

[bobob]

The MB Air, all we asked for was a retina screen, and they could laugh all the way to the bank for another 10 years

The 13" MBP is the MBA with a retina screen - the most impressive Air ever made.

Let's rewind time for a moment. It's Thursday, October 27, and Apple's event is under way.

Imagine that instead of introducing the new MacBook Pro, Apple unveiled a new MacBook Air. One that's 12 percent lighter, 13 percent smaller by volume and practically the same weight -- but manages to cram in a faster Intel processor, faster graphics, plus the far sharper, brighter and more colorful Retina Display the MacBook Air so desperately needed.

Sure, it starts at $1,500 rather than $1,000, but you get twice the solid-state storage for the price -- and you can double the RAM, quadruple the storage and get the awesome new Touch Bar secondary screen with Touch ID fingerprint sensor if you're willing to pay even more.

How long has your MacBook Air had a 1.6GHz processor? This new one is 2.0GHz or 2.9GHz; there's even a 3.3GHz option.

And sure, it's got a thinner keyboard and only two (or four) general-purpose Thunderbolt 3 ports instead of handy full-size USB ports and SD card slots. But we, Apple, figured you'd rather have a more accurate keyboard and amazing single-cable Thunderbolt 3 docking options to go with your mobile MacBook Air lifestyle.

Now, you can pull your MacBook Air right out of your manila envelope and plug in a single cable to charge it, dock with your peripherals and power multiple monitors all at the same time.

Oh, and one more thing: we knew you'd like the MacBook Air so much, we built a 15-inch model. You won't believe how fast it is -- this Air has a quad-core CPU that's 50 percent faster than last year's MacBook Pro! The graphics are over twice as fast, and yet we've kept the same 10 hour battery life as the 13-inch version.

If you've ever wanted to edit photos or home videos on a MacBook Air, this computer's for you. Oh, and it comes standard with the Touch Bar and Touch ID, too.

We think you're going to love the new MacBook Air. It's the best MacBook we've ever made.
​

 

[Deuce on the Clock]

You mean the the company that measured and reported 12 hours, 16 hours, 18 1/2 hours, and 19 1/2 hours (almost double Apple's maximum life claims) in their real-life usage battery test, apparently not blinking an eye or thinking that was strange?

They only reported the results. Its up to the manufacturer to disprove them or validate them. Sadly Apple lacks the Q and A to test properly and relies on others after the fact.
Were the results strange? Absolutely, but Apple needs to dig into, not Consumer Reports.
[doublepost=1482654236][/doublepost]

Disagree, Q&A and innovation have gone down since Steve Jobs passed away. They need a new idea guy since Cook is just a numbers guy IMO.

Theyv

Disagree, Q&A and innovation have gone down since Steve Jobs passed away. They need a new idea guy since Cook is just a numbers guy IMO.

I agree its gotten progressively worse since he died. It started when the first phone was released. Tim and company have nothing left in the pipeline. Steve left nothing and took all innovation and creativity with him. Soon the mighty will fall with billions.

 

[amegicfox]

were Tim Cook and Phil Schiller the guys who:

1. crippled the mac mini from quad core to dual core
2. crippled the mac mini from user replaceable RAM to soldered irreplaceable RAM ?
3. crippled the iMac to soldered RAM and 5,400 rpm HD
4. crippled the MacPro removing all the expansion HD slots and CARD slots ?
5. crippled the mac book to one only port, a slower processor, a flat keyboard and removed mag safe ?
6. crippled Mac OS X so you no longer can access ROOT, no longer can format to 0, etc. ?
7. crippled Quicktime and stopped updating automation software ?
8. removed the airport base stations and Apple monitor ?
9. crippled the new macbook pro to only 2 ports, a flat keyboard, less battery and removed mag safe ?

and do you expect any honesty or product improvement by these guys ?

they are all about dumbing down and crippling the Mac in the hope we switch to the iPad

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

100s of reviews and user reports contradict CR.

95% of negative comments here by people who don't have new MBP.

Congrats for looking like hysterical wallies. It makes the rest of us wonder what else you use the internet for besides spreading misinformed and inexperienced opinion.
[doublepost=1482656439][/doublepost]

were Tim Cook and Phil Schiller the guys who:

1. crippled the mac mini from quad core to dual core
2. crippled the mac mini from user replaceable RAM to soldered irreplaceable RAM ?
3. crippled the iMac to soldered RAM and 5,400 rpm HD
4. crippled the MacPro removing all the expansion HD slots and CARD slots ?
5. crippled the mac book to one only port, a slower processor and removed mag safe ?
6. crippled Mac OS X so you no longer can access ROOT, no longer can format to 0, etc. ?
7. crippled Quicktime
8. removed the airport base stations and Apple monitor ?

Some of that is agreeable but some of that is misinformed. Let's break down what you posted.

1. crippled the mac mini from quad core to dual core

I agree that more cores can be useful but apps have been making better and better use each core in the last few years. Intel pricing and release dates also had an impact on Mac Mini specs.

Quad cores have higher energy consumption too. The planet matters.

2. crippled the mac mini from user replaceable RAM to soldered irreplaceable RAM ?

The whole Mac line is moving towards easy recyclability. This is something people need to be aware of. The planet matters.

3. crippled the iMac to soldered RAM and 5,400 rpm HD

Soldered RAM again is an issue of ease of recycling. The HDD is became home users prefer disk space and want to keep costs down. If you are pro you go for the SSD version.

4. crippled the MacPro removing all the expansion HD slots and CARD slots ?

True this annoyed a lot of us Pros. But it was primarily EU energy regulation that killed off the Mac Pro tower. When Apple had to take it off the market they redesigned the Mac Pro to be power efficient. The planet matters.

5. crippled the mac book to one only port, a slower processor and removed mag safe ?

Intel's release dates decide which CPUs get used.

You can't have MagSafe and USB charging. It would require multiple power lines and a bigger PSU.

6. crippled Mac OS X so you no longer can access ROOT, no longer can format to 0, etc. ?

You can access root if you want. You can format to zero - choose the higher secure option. It's just the wording that has changed.

7. crippled Quicktime

Because soon it will no longer be needed and is no longer supported on Windows.

8. removed the airport base stations and Apple monitor ?

Because Apple is happy to let specialist companies supply these peripherals to consumers. What's there point of buying panels from Samsung or LG and competing against them when they can sell cheaper?

 

[MH01]

You know that pre-production unit is exactly the same? It's what production unit is built based on. Moreover a battery is a battery. It lasts based on what you are doing. If indeed there is a software bug or bugs that cause the battery to be wasted then it will be fixed. End of story. Otherwise there is no mystery here or conspiracy.

Sorry cannot agree. In the last company I worded at We were shipped many products for testing under NDA that were pre-production and the final products have had changes .
[doublepost=1482656980][/doublepost]

100s of reviews and user reports contradict CR.

95% of negative comments here by people who don't have new MBP.

Congrats for looking like hysterical wallies. It makes the rest of us wonder what else you use the internet for besides spreading misinformed and inexperienced opinion.

Since you called a lot of member wallies here, you know what, congrats yourself on being a wally failing comprehension and maths. Try generalising less in the future and have some empathy for people with actual issues .

I doubt you even own a 2016 unit?