Previously Purchased Items Not Available Due to Billing Issue

[Daisy81]

Time and time again, none of this would be a problem if people kept proper offline backups of all their purchased content. You paid good money for the file, why be stingy about a few gigs of hard drive space for it?

Also, this situation here is exactly why "the cloud" is not the be-all end-all solution to all out technology problems. Even for leisure activity such as watching movies, I don't want to cede control of my files to the whims of someone else. A few large external hard drives or a proper NAS are cheap cheap cheap compared to all the headache they prevent.

i don't know exactly how this is working or what all this branches into but the implications of what has been reported sounds quite serious. You seem to be minimizing it because it is only for streaming videos. But how do you know? This customer sounds like he is not overly vested in the Apple platform. What about people that have more then just an Apple TV?

More to the point what about people buying iOS apps and OS X Programs? Will a download on iTunes for some dinky 99 cent song knock out something like Final Cut or Logic? This sounds like a very serious problem.

 

[Marina Sky]

You guys realize this is nearly 3 years old, right?

Yes ))) I realize but the problem doesn't get old unfortunately.

 

[Daisy81]

Yes ))) I realize but the problem doesn't get old unfortunately.

Actually no I didn't realize that this was necroed. This one really got dug up from the dusty attic of the forums.

 

[oneMadRssn]

i don't know exactly how this is working or what all this branches into but the implications of what has been reported sounds quite serious. You seem to be minimizing it because it is only for streaming videos. But how do you know? This customer sounds like he is not overly vested in the Apple platform. What about people that have more then just an Apple TV?

More to the point what about people buying iOS apps and OS X Programs? Will a download on iTunes for some dinky 99 cent song knock out something like Final Cut or Logic? This sounds like a very serious problem.

Let's not exaggerate. What is happening here is Apple put some kind of hold on an account with outstanding balance, where the hold is prevent re-downloading previously purchased files. First, the fact Apple allows re-downloading previously purchased files at all is a gift in of itself - many alternative stores do not. Second, Apple is not disabling installed software nor is Apple un-signing previously signed downloads. Thus, if it's on your computer already, whether it is an app or media file, it's safe. That's my point: if you care about it, it should already have been downloaded.

Worried about not being able to re-download an iOS app? Backup your iOS devices to iTunes regularly, where app files will always be available to reinstall offline anytime you need (this has saved me before, where a developer pulled their app and it was no longer available to download, but I had the app file backed up). Worried about not being able to re-download professional OS X programs? Keep the installers if purchased outside the MAS, and keep good up-to-date backups of your systems for all other programs (which you should be doing anyway if you're a professional!).

Same applies to movies and music - download them using iTunes and store them on a hard drive. They will always be able to various AppleTVs in the house via HomeSharing or to load onto an iDevice offline.

All of the issues you cite have to do with over-reliance on the cloud. Nobody that cares about their files, whether its songs, movies, apps, or work product, should ever rely on the cloud. The cloud should be a nice-to-have convenience, but it should never be the backup of last resort. If the only way a person has access to something they might really need or want in the future is through a cloud service, they are only asking to be screwed at some point and they have no one to blame but themselves. Thus, the only serious issue here is that some people still aren't backing up properly.

 

[Daisy81]

Let's not exaggerate. What is happening here is Apple put some kind of hold on an account with outstanding balance, where the hold is prevent re-downloading previously purchased files. First, the fact Apple allows re-downloading previously purchased files at all is a gift in of itself - many alternative stores do not. Second, Apple is not disabling installed software nor is Apple un-signing previously signed downloads. Thus, if it's on your computer already, whether it is an app or media file, it's safe. That's my point: if you care about it, it should already have been downloaded.

Worried about not being able to re-download an iOS app? Backup your iOS devices to iTunes regularly, where app files will always be available to reinstall offline anytime you need (this has saved me before, where a developer pulled their app and it was no longer available to download, but I had the app file backed up). Worried about not being able to re-download professional OS X programs? Keep the installers if purchased outside the MAS, and keep good up-to-date backups of your systems for all other programs (which you should be doing anyway if you're a professional!).

Same applies to movies and music - download them using iTunes and store them on a hard drive. They will always be able to various AppleTVs in the house via HomeSharing or to load onto an iDevice offline.

All of the issues you cite have to do with over-reliance on the cloud. Nobody that cares about their files, whether its songs, movies, apps, or work product, should ever rely on the cloud. The cloud should be a nice-to-have convenience, but it should never be the backup of last resort. If the only way a person has access to something they might really need or want in the future is through a cloud service, they are only asking to be screwed at some point and they have no one to blame but themselves. Thus, the only serious issue here is that some people still aren't backing up properly.

I haven't seen the issue first hand personally. As long as this only effects the cloud and doesn't lock down everything on my machine it's not as big of a deal but seeing as everything is tied to the iTunes account it shouldn't be difficult to understand the issue. Unless of course you're one of the types of people who do nothing until they come for you.

 

[miffed man]

So basically, all your previous purchases will be held ransom until you get current with your bill regardless of how much you're in arrears.

 

[Snoopy4]

Time and time again, none of this would be a problem if people kept proper offline backups of all their purchased content. You paid good money for the file, why be stingy about a few gigs of hard drive space for it?

Also, this situation here is exactly why "the cloud" is not the be-all end-all solution to all out technology problems. Even for leisure activity such as watching movies, I don't want to cede control of my files to the whims of someone else. A few large external hard drives or a proper NAS are cheap cheap cheap compared to all the headache they prevent.

The whole idea is so that you don't have to waste gigabytes of hard drive space downloading movie files or have stacks of discs on a shelf. This is like saying if you want to use the internet you need to start downloading it and backing it up. The whole idea is to minimize hardware and storage requirements.

 

[Boyd01]

The whole idea is so that you don't have to waste gigabytes of hard drive space downloading movie files

I think the whole idea is that if you want Apple to waste gigabytes storing your stuff, then you'd better pay your bill.

 

[Snoopy4]

I think the whole idea is that if you want Apple to waste gigabytes storing your stuff, then you'd better pay your bill.

Yeah, I think that too....

 

[oneMadRssn]

The whole idea is so that you don't have to waste gigabytes of hard drive space downloading movie files or have stacks of discs on a shelf. This is like saying if you want to use the internet you need to start downloading it and backing it up. The whole idea is to minimize hardware and storage requirements.

I don't see it as a waste at all. Storage is super cheap today. Large external drives cost around $0.05/GB, give or take (and that is a generous estimate, some can be had for as low as $0.03/GB). How much space does an HD movie take up from iTunes? 1GB? 4GB? How much would it cost to store it on a backup? 5-20 cents? That's not subscription pricing, that's essentially a one-time forever payment. For a couple of dimes, I can ensure this movie I paid $20 for will always be available to me, regardless of what happens to Apple, iCloud, or my ISP. It's a no brainer. There is no good reason not to have a backup of files that are important to you, that you paid for - certainly not cost or lack of space.

 

[Snoopy4]

I don't see it as a waste at all. Storage is super cheap today. Large external drives cost around $0.05/GB, give or take (and that is a generous estimate, some can be had for as low as $0.03/GB). How much space does an HD movie take up from iTunes? 1GB? 4GB? How much would it cost to store it on a backup? 5-20 cents? That's not subscription pricing, that's essentially a one-time forever payment. For a couple of dimes, I can ensure this movie I paid $20 for will always be available to me, regardless of what happens to Apple, iCloud, or my ISP. It's a no brainer. There is no good reason not to have a backup of files that are important to you, that you paid for - certainly not cost or lack of space.

HD is 6-8 gigs of data. We have 367 movies as of today. If you're going to do it properly you would want to use an NAS with Raid to ensure system reliability and availability. You also need to replace the drives about every 5-6 years and NAS unit about every 8-10. An initial investment of $700-800 plus recurring costs to overcome inevitable hardware failure. It's not a "regardless what happens to Apple" either. If they imploded tomorrow the files are useless. This is why lockers properly implemented like Disney are better than an ecosystem.

 

[oneMadRssn]

HD is 6-8 gigs of data. We have 367 movies as of today. If you're going to do it properly you would want to use an NAS with Raid to ensure system reliability and availability. You also need to replace the drives about every 5-6 years and NAS unit about every 8-10. An initial investment of $700-800 plus recurring costs to overcome inevitable hardware failure. It's not a "regardless what happens to Apple" either. If they imploded tomorrow the files are useless. This is why lockers properly implemented like Disney are better than an ecosystem.

You're talking about business level, even if small-business, hardware. A simple 5-8TB USB external is good enough for 90% of users, and will easily fit all your movies and much much more. Replacing it ever 5-6 years is reccomended on NAS because NASes tend to be on 24/7 and thus they run up their MTBF faster - not an issue for most basic users.

Look, we can imagine all sorts of extravagant scenarios of a perfect self-hosted backup system. That isn't the point, nor is it proportional to the OPs original problem. Even if each movie is 10GB, and someone has 500 movies, that will fit on a 5TB drive. For simple backups of iTunes files, or offloading the storage from your internal drives, that is already a better backup system than what most people have.

Also, if Apple implodes tomorrow, the files are not useless. The DRM can be stripped quite easily.

 

[Snoopy4]

You're talking about business level, even if small-business, hardware. A simple 5-8TB USB external is good enough for 90% of users, and will easily fit all your movies and much much more. Replacing it ever 5-6 years is reccomended on NAS because NASes tend to be on 24/7 and thus they run up their MTBF faster - not an issue for most basic users.

Look, we can imagine all sorts of extravagant scenarios of a perfect self-hosted backup system. That isn't the point, nor is it proportional to the OPs original problem. Even if each movie is 10GB, and someone has 500 movies, that will fit on a 5TB drive. For simple backups of iTunes files, or offloading the storage from your internal drives, that is already a better backup system than what most people have.

Also, if Apple implodes tomorrow, the files are not useless. The DRM can be stripped quite easily.

I'm taking about proper home hardware. Business hardware would be an easy $10k. Your suggesting people use throw away hardware as protection of your files.

 

[oneMadRssn]

I'm taking about proper home hardware. Business hardware would be an easy $10k. Your suggesting people use throw away hardware as protection of your files.

If the choice is no backup at all and being stuck in the situation the OP was stuck in, or an inexpensive USB drive for backups, I'll take the latter everytime and recommend it to others as well. Any backup is better than no backup, how can you argue against that?

 

[Snoopy4]

If the choice is no backup at all and being stuck in the situation the OP was stuck in, or an inexpensive USB drive for backups, I'll take the latter everytime and recommend it to others as well. Any backup is better than no backup, how can you argue against that?

That's not really a backup. When it fails you have to download everything again. Same problem as not having a backup at all.

 

[oneMadRssn]

That's not really a backup. When it fails you have to download everything again. Same problem as not having a backup at all.

Are you for real? No backup means if the internet is down or your files are somehow lost from the cloud, you have 0% chance of getting them back. Even an inexpensive backup increases those odds to 90-95% maybe (yes they fail, but it's rare and rare enough that they usually get full well before failure and people are forced to upgrade due to storage needs). Sure, a proper NAS with redundancy might increase it further to 98%, and several NASs configured in a proper 3-2-1 backup system will increase the odds to 99.9%, and a full enterprise backup solution increases the odds to 99.999%. You cannot in good faith say that a having a simple USB backup drive isn't a significant step up from having no backup at all because even with all it's faults, it's better than nothing. All I said was the OP probably would have been able to watch his movie.

I guess my question is, why are you arguing this? Are advising people that having no backup is better than a simple USB drive for backup? Are you saying the OP would with certainty have been screwed in the same way if he had a USB drive backup of the movie files? Or are you just nitpicking by pointing out that there are better backup solutions and arguing for the sake of arguing?

 

[Snoopy4]

Are you for real? No backup means if the internet is down or your files are somehow lost from the cloud, you have 0% chance of getting them back. Even an inexpensive backup increases those odds to 90-95% maybe (yes they fail, but it's rare and rare enough that they usually get full well before failure and people are forced to upgrade due to storage needs). Sure, a proper NAS with redundancy might increase it further to 98%, and several NASs configured in a proper 3-2-1 backup system will increase the odds to 99.9%, and a full enterprise backup solution increases the odds to 99.999%. You cannot in good faith say that a having a simple USB backup drive isn't a significant step up from having no backup at all because even with all it's faults, it's better than nothing. All I said was the OP probably would have been able to watch his movie.

I guess my question is, why are you arguing this? Are advising people that having no backup is better than a simple USB drive for backup? Are you saying the OP would with certainty have been screwed in the same way if he had a USB drive backup of the movie files? Or are you just nitpicking by pointing out that there are better backup solutions and arguing for the sake of arguing?

I'm saying that if you're going to want a backup, do it right. Too many people do not with cheap USB.

 

[JulianneNR]

You guys realize this is nearly 3 years old, right?

And yet still just as applicable today, and not properly addressed, legally or otherwise. Your point?
[doublepost=1457107347][/doublepost]In fact, if people are still coming across it due to relevant searches, then it's obviously still very much a present issue. One that has not been properly addressed by Apple, to this day.

"Well, it's part of our terms" does not properly address the OP's concerns which were clearly stated but promptly ignored, which are also MY concerns, as well as many people here, and those still coming across these forums to this day. Nor does claiming it's just a part of their terms make it RIGHT or even LEGAL.
But until they address that properly, there will ALWAYS be people still searching for and coming to these forums for it.

So does pointing out it's a 3-year old ongoing issue make you feel superior in some fashion?

 

[oneMadRssn]

I'm saying that if you're going to want a backup, do it right. Too many people do not with cheap USB.

No debate there. I'd say too many people (such as the OP) don't have a backup at all. No cheap backup, no right backup, nothing. First I'd like to get people in the habit of having a backup at all, then we can fight the good fight of good and proper backups.

 

[Parkerz]

With how apple works today you can use any of their products without having to have a computer as well. So someone with an Apple TV could buy content and have no means to back it up. Which is ridiculous anyway in my opinion. For what they charge for space in the cloud? Absolutely ridiculous rates and prices, that I can't say I don't pay for myself out of convenience, should render backing up any purchases unnecessary. I agree entirely with OP's argument and have had the same issue over an outstanding 1.38, and couldn't watch any episodes of an entire series of a show. Because it is simply another dollar and change I typically couldn't be bothered to fight it more than a call to customer service, but their method of revoking content that, as mentioned by OP, has been paid for as a closed deal, because of a separate billing issue.... I'd say that logic would be about the same as repossessing someone's car the day after they miss a payment. Extreme? Yes. But a fair analogy indeed. It's unacceptable. It verges of communism and capitalism.

[doublepost=1462680036][/doublepost]its more like repossessing your wife's paid off car, because you miss a payment on your car.
[doublepost=1462680249][/doublepost]

I haven't seen the issue first hand personally. As long as this only effects the cloud and doesn't lock down everything on my machine it's not as big of a deal but seeing as everything is tied to the iTunes account it shouldn't be difficult to understand the issue. Unless of course you're one of the types of people who do nothing until they come for you.

What about how they lock you from updating or getting new apps until you pay it? Even if you don't owe it or dispute it, they lock up you ability to use your device properly until you pay whatever it is they want. Essentialy they hold your phone functionality for ransom.

 

[ukpetey]

So, this thread has got me thinking. I have around 300 iTunes movies, none of them downloaded since I stream them to my ATV4's. I don't want to download them to my MacBook Pro as I only have a 128GB SSD, which is far too small. But the suggestion is that I should DL them, as Apple is doing me a favour effectively in allowing me to stream.

My question then - if I buy an external HD can I download them to the drive and without filling up my SSD on my MacBook ? I'd appreciate any advice. Thanks

 

[Boyd01]

Sure you can. This article is a little old, but I think it's still accurate and it was very helpful when I moved my library off my MacBook Air: http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/articles/comments/moving-your-itunes-library-to-a-new-hard-drive/

 

[ukpetey]

Sure you can. This article is a little old, but I think it's still accurate and it was very helpful when I moved my library off my MacBook Air: http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/articles/comments/moving-your-itunes-library-to-a-new-hard-drive/

Thanks, a very useful article. The relevant bit was right at the end. So basically consolidate my library on to the external HD and then consolidate again when I've downloaded new movies. I shall give that a try. Cheers

 

[Tech198]

This thread is a troll magnet.

Is sure is .... ...

This is an ongoing customer support thread with Apple:

Lang_Country : en_US
Product : iTunes Store
Support Subject : Purchases, Billing & Redemption
Sub Issue : Previously Purchased Items Not Available
GCRM Case ID : 444391591
See additional info below
Choose the iTunes Store or App Store for your country: United States
Item title: Princess and the Frog
Order number: M2M768ZT3Z
Details:
This weekend we attempted to watch The Princess and the Frog. We purchased this movie on April 21st, 2013. When we tried to watch this movie we were told that a billing issue on our account was preventing us from watching the movie

Apple has the right until any outstanding payments are done.... Check your iTunes billing history to make sure it WAS payed, and u got got email 'Receipt'

Other than that, checking your billing info

 

[RealityTVBitch1]

This email is completely unprofessional. Letting it be known the past due balance against your illegal policy is absurd. You should be ashamed.

iTunes Store <iTunesStoreSupport@apple.com> Response

iTunes Store <iTunesStoreSupport@apple.com>
2013-05-13 10:12 AM


Dear Rusty,

Thank you for contacting iTunes Store customer support team. My name is Judith and it will be my pleasure to assist you today. I understand that you are temporarily unable to stream your previously purchased item from cloud, nor re-download them due to a billing issue with one of your orders. I understand how this can be frustrating and I can't blame you for that.

I apologize for the inconvenience it may cause you; however, as per iTunes policy, downloading of past purchases or downloading of new purchases, as well as updating any purchases are impeded by outstanding balances. As soon as the order is paid (6.87 USD) you will be able to resume downloading.

If would like to voice your feedback and suggestion on this issue, I encourage you to use the iTunes Feedback page to submit your comments here:

http://www.apple.com/feedback/itunesapp.html

By taking the time to contact Apple about your concerns, you provide valuable input on how to make iTunes better for everyone. Apple recognizes that no one is better qualified to provide feedback about iTunes than the people who use it. Your email may make the difference.

While you will not receive a response from this department, please be assured that the advisors who review all of our patron's concerns do take these matters seriously. The more feedback we gather on these issues, the better and more likely to incite changes. Your efforts to share your feedback are very much appreciated.

Thank you for your patience and understanding in this matter, Rusty. Your experience is very important to us and we truly appreciate your support to the iTunes Store. Please let me know if there is anything else I can assist you with.

Sincerely,

Judith
iTunes Store/Mac App Store Customer Support
www.apple.com/support/itunes/ww/

Please Note: I work Sunday-Thursday, 9:00AM-6:00PM EST