Professional Mac Users' Complaints List Grows After 'Disappointing' Apple Event

[DudeDad]

I find this fixation on the 16 GB limit on RAM bizarre. The complaints usually start with, "I am a pro user and 16 GB is just not enough ...".



Do most of these self-proclaim "pros" even understand the relationship between RAM, virtual memory and mass storage? There is NOTHING you can do with 32 GB of RAM that you cannot do 16 GB or even 8 GB!



When you're low on RAM, you start to get more disk activities. In the old days of hard drives, that was a big deal. Things slow to a crawl and you can *hear* thrashing (the hard drive head would be jumping all over the place). But with the switch to SSD: 1. You no longer hear thrashing and 2. Even when paging occurs, it isn't that slow anymore



The new MacBook Pros have much faster SSDs. Extra RAM has benefits only for a very limited number of users and then only in very limited situations. I am willing to wager that the vast majority of these so-called "pro users" won't even be able to tell if they are on a 16 GB or a (hypothetical) 32 GB MBP in a blind test (self-proclaim pro users are the new self-proclaim wine connoisseurs?).



I develop software and routinely have multiple virtual machines running in VMWare. My 4 year old MBP has 8 GB of RAM and the only way to find out I am low on RAM is by looking at Activity Monitor.



To sum up, how much RAM you have does not determine what you can or cannot do. It is just another aspect of performance. So basically the pro-users-need-32GB complainers are saying these new MacBook Pros don't meet their performance needs. But I have a question for you: how do they even know this? These MBPs aren't even out yet! The new MBPs have faster CPU, faster RAM and faster SSD. How do they know the overall system is not fast enough for them?

you are making too much sense. I also find it funny that those with older Macbooks who complain that the new ones will not let them do their "pro" work will continue to do their "pro" work on a several year old machine. I ordered the 13 inch with touch bar and can't wait to get it.

 

[Uofmtiger]

Doesn't it seem equally arrogant to assume that only the needs of the "power user" matter and no one else's?

Yeah, maybe some people don't mind short battery life in exchange for 32 gb of ram because their laptops will be plugged in at their desks 24/7. But not everyone is going to be using their laptops in this manner. To make this group of "power users" happy, other people are going to have to put up with a thicker and heavier laptop with worse battery life.

Does it seem right for Apple to focus on the needs of the 20% at the expense of the other 80%?

And I still stand by my earlier assertion that I would take 4 USB C ports over 7 specialized ports any day. Think about it. Not everyone uses their ports evenly. Don't be surprised if some people have never plugged anything into their HDMI port since day 1. But these are ports which nevertheless take up space and that we are paying for. Now, with the right adaptors, those ports can be whatever port you want them to be, on whichever side you wish.

Still seems like a win in my book.

I agree. I think there is a lot of the market that want a bigger screen than a MacBook, but don't want to have 2 hours of battery life and a heavy computer in exchange for it.

The problem for Apple is that they have MacOS on a select few computers, while Windows is available on just about anything you want. To make it worse, they haven't released an updated Mac Pro in years and these vocal critics have been complaining for at least two years about it. Many are just taking that frustration out on the MBP, since it isn't a pro desktop and that is what some "pros" (whatever that means) really want.

I think some of these people will just have to bite the bullet and move on to Windows or Linux. That is the only way they will be able to get a computer spec'd out exactly the way they want it or need it. Not saying they should be happy about it, and they have made it clear that they aren't, but Apple is shooting for maximizing profits and making a computer with 2 hours of battery life that weighs 8 pounds isn't going to do that.

Personally, I am not a pro video developer, so this machine will be a nice update to my 2011 MBP. However, I am not happy about the fact that they didn't put a USB-C to USB connector on the thing so I could at least attach my iPhone or iPad if it had a problem booting. However, I consider the price of that dongle in the price of the computer.

 

[pat500000]

Because the MacPro forum has already gone toxic and many of us are about to give up all hope and move to HP-Z workstations. I'm beyond frustrated with Apple right now - moving my whole company off apple hardware isn't an easy transition, but to keep up with our client demands and be competitive vs. similar firms we simply need more powerful desktop hardware. Big Linux workstations are a possibility, but the convenience of a powerful workstation combined with productivity apps and great support for our IDEs on OSX was very appealing.

Secrecy in consumer devices is fine, but it sure as heck makes it hard to run a business.

I hear you. Such ****** move from Apple giving "discount" rather than announcing another Mac Pro. Yeah...I can't believe Apple is causing people to move away.

 

[AdonisSMU]

32GB ram option exists in many laptop running windows example

View attachment 669879

Not only is it significantly more expensive but it only has is gimped 128GB of storage and its massive. This is a desktop is laptops clothing...and even that is questionable with just 128GB storage. I'm not paying 2700 bucks for a device that has only 128GB of storage. Sorry.

 

[masterhiggins]

It's pretty clear Apple has been iOS-centric under Cook.

Cook is a businessman, he's not passionate about these products. He's passionate about bottom lines, marketing, and his bonuses tied to stock performance.

Apple culture died with Steve Jobs. We need a creative visionary at the helm, not someone who is more interested in influencing politics and culture.

Agree 100%. Steve jobs was an incredible visionary, but evidently a poor judge in character appointing cook.

 

[PatriotInvasion]

"The future." Hm. Really? If that's the case, how come my brand new iPhone 7+ comes with a Lightning to USB-A cable instead of USB-C? (Which means I can't plug in my Apple iPhone to my Apple Mac WITHOUT a $25 dongle lol)

Same with stupid headphone jack. Double standards from Apple. Pathetic.

Because most people still own computers with USB-A, but that will likely change in a year. And the only Macs you can buy with USB-C start at $1,299 and go all the way up to $2,799. At those prices, Apple is banking on the fact that the extra $19 for a USB-A to USB-C adapter or a $25 direct cable for those that must connect their iPhone to their Macs (something that is fading away as a necessity) is a cost they'll be willing to bear during this transition.

I have a 12-inch MacBook with USB-C only and a 27-inch iMac with USB-A along with some USB-A peripherals. I bought my $19 dongle and have used it a small handful of times. Non-issue for many people.

The alternative is to just keep USB-A forever so people don't get mad. No thanks.

 

[Release]

Mac "PRO" users are not the company's base. Get over yourself if you think that's the case. Mac didn't become this "wealthy" because of Mac Pro's, but from most things i. iPod, iPhone, iPad, even iMac. The people that read MacRumor sites are not the 'base' we all know many people who have those iDevices (as well as music and content subscriptions) that don't ready this site. The sky isn't falling at Apple, and Time Cook is wearing clothes.

See, this is exactly why I'm pissed off with Apple. The "Pro's" are the ones who gave Apple the opportunity to do those things. The hardcore users. The creatives. The power users. I don't blame Apple for shifting focus to where the real money is, but its an absolute insult to us to see how they keep slowly abandoning the base that got them where they are. If they're going to shift away from the pro users, let us know. We'll leave. We won't be happy, but stringing us along and giving us "Pro" gear, which is NOT pro-level, just stinks.

 

[zygmunt]

The fastest part in the new macbook pro is fan...

 

[Kestrel452]

Hunting for USB-C adapters and chargers that actually work with a specific model of laptop is the fastest growing tech niche on Youtube.

I honestly had no idea that USB/C was that precarious before reading this piece. Not only will people have to buy dongles/adapters, they'll have to make sure the "universally compatible" USB/C cord they're buying actually work with each specific device?!?!?! How are people going to easily keep track of all their cables and remember which one is for which accessory, or which one will charge the machine without blowing up? I sense a great uptick in label maker sales...

 

[falainber]

The reason behind the lack of 32 GB or DDR4 is Intel. Skylake does not support LPDDR4 (LP for low power) RAM. Kabylake is set to include support, but only for the U category of chips.

It's always Intel that is at fault. I still remember how Apple was one year late (compared to other vendors) with USB 3 because "Intel chipset did not support it". Everyone else was using NEC controller which cost $4 but Apple would not do it because it would reduce their profits. As others said, there are plenty of laptops with more than 16GB of RAM - just not from Apple.

Realistically though it does not look like Apple's business model is ever going to work for professional users. These days Apple is all about volume and inventory management. That's why they have so few models. While PC vendors will offer you dozens of models for all sorts of customers, Apple offers basically one model (in a couple of sizes). This model is seemingly optimized for college students (and, perhaps some executive types) and is absolutely not suitable for regular home users (too expensive) or the professional ones (performance is too poor).

 

[PatriotInvasion]

I'll fight the battle. I'm not buying one of these pieces of cow excrement. I'll go with a company that. I don't know. Creates things that are actually useful and comes with ports that I will use.

You've been a MacRumors forum member for over 5 years now. Something tells me you're bluffing. If not, have fun with your "Intel Inside" sticker-filled Dell Inspiron with Windows and your thick USB-A ports for all eternity.

 

[Instrumentality]

Hardly anyone has USB-C devices... but that doesn't mean we shouldn't have USB-C ports.

We've had USB-A for almost 20 years. Every device and cable you own, and have ever owned, has been able to plug into USB-A since it has always been the same shape.

But now the new USB-C port is a different shape. Whoops!

I actually support the change even though the transition will be messy with dongles and extra cables. This is clearly the direction it needed to go.

We maxed-out the capabilities of USB-A. It had four pins to start... then they were able to cram in five more pins. But it was still limited. And you still needed additional ports for other things.

Now USB-C has 24 pins and it's able to do much more than the old port... while also replacing other ports.

We will finally have one port to rule them all. USB-C will be THE port for the next 20 years.

Transitions suck... but I believe this is necessary.

I agree USB-C is the "next gen" port and USB-A is maxed out. I would assume most people find that to be the case. The issue is they put out a computer with 4 of the same ports that nobody uses (Apple, myself, you?, peripherals). I believe wireless is the future for video/charging but if they release a computer with no ports they would also be jumping the gun there too!

Apple has tried to consolidate ports and introduce new standards in the past with limited longevity. 20 years for this port? I doubt it, but I hope its true. Here are some Apple ports that over the last 20 years that didn't last as long: ADC, Mini VGA, Mini DVI, 30 pin USB, Mini Display, Firewire 400, Firewire800, Thunderbolt, Lightning Bolt, Mag Safe 1, Mag Safe 2

 

[Manatlt]

Because most people still own computers with USB-A, but that will likely change in a year. And the only Macs you can buy with USB-C start at $1,299 and go all the way up to $2,799. At those prices, Apple is banking on the fact that the extra $19 for a USB-A to USB-C adapter or a $25 direct cable for those that must connect their iPhone to their Macs (something that is fading away as a necessity) is a cost they'll be willing to bear during this transition.

I have a 12-inch MacBook with USB-C only and a 27-inch iMac with USB-A along with some USB-A peripherals. I bought my $19 dongle and have used it a small handful of times. Non-issue for many people.

The alternative is to just keep USB-A forever so people don't get mad. No thanks.

...as long Microsoft and others holds on to USB-A, USB-C isn't going to catch on for at least another few years.

And what I'm saying is that Apple is inconsistent. Either you make all things USB-C or not. The iPhone 7+ is not compatible with the new MacBooks unless you buy a freaking unnecessary dongle.

They could have left at best ONE USB-A port on these laptops.

 

[Pootmatoot]

I honestly had no idea that USB/C was that precarious before reading this piece. Not only will people have to buy dongles/adapters, they'll have to make sure the "universally compatible" USB/C cord they're buying actually work with each specific device?!?!?! How are people going to easily keep track of all their cables and remember which one is for which accessory, or which one will charge the machine without blowing up? I sense a great uptick in label maker sales...

USB-C is a funny beast: it's a basket of absolutely brilliant decisions, coupled with complete insanity.

 

[TurboPGT!]

32GB ram option exists in many laptop running windows example

View attachment 669879

$2,782 for that hideous thing that runs Windows and only a 128 GB of slower SSD storage?!?!

That 32 RAM tho...

 

[Pootmatoot]

...as long Microsoft and others holds on to USB-A, USB-C isn't going to catch on for at least another few years.

And what I'm saying is that Apple is inconsistent. Either you make all things USB-C or not. The iPhone 7+ is not compatible with the new MacBooks unless you buy a freaking unnecessary dongle.

They could have left at best ONE USB-A port on these laptops.

USB-C will be driven by one thing: phones. And because the world has gone mad, every single phone in the world bar Apple's.

 

[TurboPGT!]

I honestly had no idea that USB/C was that precarious before reading this piece. Not only will people have to buy dongles/adapters, they'll have to make sure the "universally compatible" USB/C cord they're buying actually work with each specific device?!?!?! How are people going to easily keep track of all their cables and remember which one is for which accessory, or which one will charge the machine without blowing up? I sense a great uptick in label maker sales...

It's pretty safe to assume with Apple's eventual mass adoption AND the PC industry's mass adoption AND the accessory market's mass adoption all starting to happen...these growing pains are not going to last for long. This is the start of something.

 

[Manatlt]

USB-C will be driven by one thing: phones. And because the world has gone mad, every single phone in the world bar Apple's.

That's funny isn't it? Most expensive modern phones currently use USB-C, except iPhones. The IRONY.

 

[dwarg]

I don't really get what is wrong with the new MBP.
I'm a web/software developer with a 2015MBP and next year i'm going to renews plan and i like the idea of the new smaller lighter mbp.
touchbar has potential

While you're a technical power-user you're not a resource power-user. You probably know a lot more about software/hardware than I do, but I work in 3D graphics and maintain a render farm of 8 classic cheese grater mac pros (12-cores, 64Gig RAM, Nvidia Geforce Titans all) with multiple battery backups on multiple 30 amp circuits. And mine is a small setup in this industry. I need to use Nvidia graphics cards so the new Mac Pros are useless to me.

The good news for me as our industry keeps migrating over to PCs, is that Apple made an incredible machine with those cheese grater macs way back in 2010 so I can snap those puppies up cheap on EBAY. When people talk about how much cheaper/better PCs are for what we do, I always laugh to myself. Yes new Mac Pros are almost entirely useless outside of doing video editing in Final Cut Pro (which Apple also destroyed to make it a more "Prosumer" app). But these old 2010 Macs give me better performance per $ than anything else I've found-based on what I do (possibly also because we don't pay for electricity with our lease). And I know of 1 other local 3D production house that made the same discovery.

The bad news is that I occupy a shrinking niche of my field, even if I am right, I may need to change jobs someday and being a Mac-based 3D render farm nerd doesn't leave me a lot of employment options.

Apple has completely abandoned the resource power-user market and is focussed on their highest profit products which are consumer devices. I keep hoping they might decide to go back to the traditional model of developing new technologies for a premium-priced pro-level system and then those features trickle down to the consumer models as they get cheaper over time. But I have to admit that model makes sense for cars more than computers. There's more money in developing consumer focused features to begin with than features aimed at higher performance, because 99% of users don't use a fraction of what their machines are capable of. Surfing the web, email, and chat don't require a lot of horsepower.

Maybe VR will get Apple thinking about high-end resource-hungry applications, but it's a long shot.

 

[typicaluser]

Back when Apple tried to make innovative products that were better than the competition, instead of just trying to convince us to have the courage to buy dated hardware at inflated prices.

I just can't stop watching it all over. Missing Steve so much.

 

[TurboPGT!]

USB-C will be driven by one thing: phones. And because the world has gone mad, every single phone in the world bar Apple's.

Apple will likely switch to USB-C on iPhone. But they probably intentionally want to be the last. With well over a 1 billion Lightning devices active in use today, a switch from that to anything will be painful. The blow will be lessened at a time when USB-C is already ubiquitous.

 

[canadianreader]

$2,782 for that hideous thing that runs Windows and only a 128 GB of slower SSD storage?!?!

That 32 RAM tho...

I was answering someone he pretended that 32gb ram is only for desktops. Yep the design is horrible

 

[bruno7]

Well, I too am a bit surprised by the new MBP line.

The laptops will most likely be quite good, but I myself couldn't care less for the touch bar and I'd surely miss MagSafe.
I love the idea of the power cable to be inserted into the laptop the closest to the display - with these new ones it looks just weird being two inches from the screen. My Wacom tablet is usually placed on the right side touching the laptop. Now I'd have to get used to having the tablet much further away because of the headphone port being on the right.
And how can the SD card slot be 'cumbersome' in any way I will never understand. I don't even talk about all the dongles needed to connect everything together.

I still have my MBP 15" from mid 2010. This year I replaced the original HD with 500GB SSD, and I will be getting a new battery as well. Still running Mavericks and I love it.

I consider myself a creative professional - fortunately this machine is still good enough for my needs.

However, I've been considering getting a new laptop for a while just to be able to sell this old one for some decent cash.

I know I'd be getting a much better display, faster processor, arguably better keyboard etc.

BUT!

Apple laptops used to carry the same price tag for years - basic 15" models have always been for 1999$ or so. New models would get better and better and still be sold for the same price as the previous models. Brilliant idea.

As of this moment the basic 15" here in Czech Republic is 3043 USD incl. all the taxes. This lovely old laptop of mine was 2048 USD in 2010. And I forgot to mention the I've got the upgraded matte hi-res display, too.

No way I can afford that. Pity I have no space for iMac at home, I'd get one tomorrow.


Anyway, my 2 cents.

 

[Art Mark]

They need to decide if - A - they actually want to make PRO models. And B- Then create a PRO model that is for Pros. That is, more memory, more hard drive. A bit heavier, OK if you can do the Pro work you need to. If Apple wants to be a consumer company than stop making PRO anything. I don't see them walking away from the Mac. Phone sales will decline in time. They need to keep selling something. But I have to admit as a 'Pro' user, every time I buy Mac hardware now, I feel like I am forced into buying a typical consumer machine and hoping it can handle the work.

 

[Rob_2811]

you are making too much sense. I also find it funny that those with older Macbooks who complain that the new ones will not let them do their "pro" work will continue to do their "pro" work on a several year old machine. I ordered the 13 inch with touch bar and can't wait to get it.

Why is that funny?

The increase in actually CPU performance between these new models and the previous Broadwell/Haswell models is minuscule, you aren't getting any more RAM in the new models, the battery life is the same, the i/o will likely be incompatible with most of their peripherals and they keyboard, lets be honest , is a step backwards for most.

Not exactly the most appealing upgrade for a lot of professionals given the exorbitant pricing.