PSA: Your Older 32-Bit Apps Won't Launch After Installing iOS 11

[wib]

Wow! I wonder what apps are so great they got abandoned! And no replacements where made......

You would be surprised...

I have a really great study app for Kanji which has no replacement at all. I would happily pay a lot of money to be able to keep it. It's 32 bit, only had one release and no need for updates as it was (and still is, perfect). It's an SRS app, but instead of being a flashcard or pick from multiple choices, you actually have to type in the hiragana reading for the kanji. It is excellent for memorising (although I'm getting old so need to keep refreshing my memory as things don't stay in my brain for long these days) as it has both visual and physical components.

There is NO alternative to it. I've been searching the app store since I was first made aware of this on MacRumors. The developer isn't contactable. I wrote a plea on the review page, but of course they wouldn't have seen it. There is nothing I can do. I would rather have access to this app than a new phone, so I'll be keeping my lovely 7+ and trying to stave off updates for as long as possible.

That probably fits your definition of sad, but some people really do need certain apps in their lives. Unfortunately a lot of us seem to be in very small niche markets where no one else feels the urge to make replacements/alternatives so we're stuck!

 

[Bryan Bowler]

I'm not understanding the pushback here. This, again, is a case of people thinking of themselves instead of the overall growth of innovation.

To clear some of this up:

• If an app hasn't been updated in 1-2+ years, get rid of it
• 32bit vs 64bit isn't just about accessible RAM
• Supporting 2 architectures is a headache for a developer (1st hand knowledge)
• Lack of upstream software support and upstream security support on 32bit adds to this
  
• Servers for apps that are still supporting 32bit are usually 32bit servers. Meaning that upgrading server CPUs and hardware that you'd want for the longevity of an app, would nix this. A phase out. Even Linux is dropping 32bit support officially.
• Servers pulling double duty for 32bit and 64bit apps are pulling double architecture cycle duty, which is inefficient.
• Cross-compiling is a REASONABLE feature, but final binaries are best compiled natively (due to potential compiler quirks)
• 64bit is superior to 32bit because of the amount of data that can be processed in one cycle (64bit vs 32bit processed chunks). More data processed = faster applications = people NOT complaining about a device or app being slow.
• Also everything that they announced (IR dot matrix camera, 4k@60/1080p@240, etc) would be nearly impossible to do on 32bit architecture. The bottleneck struggle would be insane.

So THAT is why they're 100% 64bit. It's not a cash money scheme, it's the natural evolution of technology and product lines.

And please do not use Microsoft/Windows as a counter argument. The ONLY reason that they still support 32bit apps is because Microsoft had a long-time stronghold on nearly every Fortune 100 company, with developers that locked them into that architecture by deploying massive data sets on top Microsoft exclusive products that would take a very long time to re-do. This hurt the feel-bads of those corporations which screamed in outrage and, in order to not lose their place and foothold in the many sectors they're servicing, Microsoft complied with their demands for 32bit support. You wouldn't believe some of the Microsoft messes I've walked into when restructuring a corporations architecture and data infrastructure.

Oh, and for those of you not updating your iOS version...I really hope that your phone isn't used for mission critical things. Those updates aren't just for flashy new interactions, there's also VERY IMPORTANT security updates that you're not getting. So when you get hacked or data mined, do not complain.

Trying to please everyone is a recipe for disaster, and never works. You have to do what's best for the advancement of usability and technology, and people will slowly but surely conform.

Bravo! Well said.

 

[bwintx]

Bravo! Finally, somebody on this thread who gets it.

I'm not understanding the pushback here. This, again, is a case of people thinking of themselves instead of the overall growth of innovation.

To clear some of this up:

• If an app hasn't been updated in 1-2+ years, get rid of it
• 32bit vs 64bit isn't just about accessible RAM
• Supporting 2 architectures is a headache for a developer (1st hand knowledge)
• Lack of upstream software support and upstream security support on 32bit adds to this
  
• Servers for apps that are still supporting 32bit are usually 32bit servers. Meaning that upgrading server CPUs and hardware that you'd want for the longevity of an app, would nix this. A phase out. Even Linux is dropping 32bit support officially.
• Servers pulling double duty for 32bit and 64bit apps are pulling double architecture cycle duty, which is inefficient.
• Cross-compiling is a REASONABLE feature, but final binaries are best compiled natively (due to potential compiler quirks)
• 64bit is superior to 32bit because of the amount of data that can be processed in one cycle (64bit vs 32bit processed chunks). More data processed = faster applications = people NOT complaining about a device or app being slow.
• Also everything that they announced (IR dot matrix camera, 4k@60/1080p@240, etc) would be nearly impossible to do on 32bit architecture. The bottleneck struggle would be insane.

So THAT is why they're 100% 64bit. It's not a cash money scheme, it's the natural evolution of technology and product lines.

And please do not use Microsoft/Windows as a counter argument. The ONLY reason that they still support 32bit apps is because Microsoft had a long-time stronghold on nearly every Fortune 100 company, with developers that locked them into that architecture by deploying massive data sets on top Microsoft exclusive products that would take a very long time to re-do. This hurt the feel-bads of those corporations which screamed in outrage and, in order to not lose their place and foothold in the many sectors they're servicing, Microsoft complied with their demands for 32bit support. You wouldn't believe some of the Microsoft messes I've walked into when restructuring a corporations architecture and data infrastructure.

Oh, and for those of you not updating your iOS version...I really hope that your phone isn't used for mission critical things. Those updates aren't just for flashy new interactions, there's also VERY IMPORTANT security updates that you're not getting. So when you get hacked or data mined, do not complain.

Trying to please everyone is a recipe for disaster, and never works. You have to do what's best for the advancement of usability and technology, and people will slowly but surely conform.

 

[pat500000]

These threads are funny because there's always one or two posters who lurk in them for _hours_, not adding much, just upvoting every single pro or con post (protip: some of the posts you think are aligned with your perspective aren't - that's the downside with knee-jerk clicking )

Anyway ...




Yeah, I'm very interested in hearing about the architecture.




It rarely, if ever, happens like that in software development (speaking from 25+ years of experience as a dev/architect/writer). Software flips out and inherits bugs all_the_time. Underlying libraries change as the OS is updated, dependencies break, performance issues arise over time - I'm currently working on an update for a pretty major application because the original devs left, and even just over the course of 12 months or so, dozens of new issues arose as usage picked up and more use cases were explored. Software is never static, there's always some to improve, fix, correct, test - this is no different, it's a bit of adaptive maintenance due to a requirement from the OS, and devs were well aware of this months ago.




I feel for you, certainly your case is a bit of an outlier (in regards to the price). The development I mentioned above, is for a client with deep pockets, so it's easy for them to adapt.

If the data/resources could be extracted (I'm sure that's easily done), maybe you can put together some interested devs from your organization and build a new app. Make it opensource*, I think given the nature of the app and your situation, you'd have a decent amount of interest and contributors.

(* The app could be opensource, even if the underlying data has some cost associated for licensing)

Hahah about that upvote and downvote......hahahahah i'm laughing while i'm trying to type....,,but...can't lmao

 

[newellj]

How can I tell what Apps are 32 bit?

Settings. Read the first post.

 

[sracer]

I'm not understanding the pushback here. This, again, is a case of people thinking of themselves instead of the overall growth of innovation.

To clear some of this up:

• If an app hasn't been updated in 1-2+ years, get rid of it
• 32bit vs 64bit isn't just about accessible RAM
• Supporting 2 architectures is a headache for a developer (1st hand knowledge)
• Lack of upstream software support and upstream security support on 32bit adds to this
  
• Servers for apps that are still supporting 32bit are usually 32bit servers. Meaning that upgrading server CPUs and hardware that you'd want for the longevity of an app, would nix this. A phase out. Even Linux is dropping 32bit support officially.
• Servers pulling double duty for 32bit and 64bit apps are pulling double architecture cycle duty, which is inefficient.
• Cross-compiling is a REASONABLE feature, but final binaries are best compiled natively (due to potential compiler quirks)
• 64bit is superior to 32bit because of the amount of data that can be processed in one cycle (64bit vs 32bit processed chunks). More data processed = faster applications = people NOT complaining about a device or app being slow.
• Also everything that they announced (IR dot matrix camera, 4k@60/1080p@240, etc) would be nearly impossible to do on 32bit architecture. The bottleneck struggle would be insane.

So THAT is why they're 100% 64bit. It's not a cash money scheme, it's the natural evolution of technology and product lines.

And please do not use Microsoft/Windows as a counter argument. The ONLY reason that they still support 32bit apps is because Microsoft had a long-time stronghold on nearly every Fortune 100 company, with developers that locked them into that architecture by deploying massive data sets on top Microsoft exclusive products that would take a very long time to re-do. This hurt the feel-bads of those corporations which screamed in outrage and, in order to not lose their place and foothold in the many sectors they're servicing, Microsoft complied with their demands for 32bit support. You wouldn't believe some of the Microsoft messes I've walked into when restructuring a corporations architecture and data infrastructure.

Oh, and for those of you not updating your iOS version...I really hope that your phone isn't used for mission critical things. Those updates aren't just for flashy new interactions, there's also VERY IMPORTANT security updates that you're not getting. So when you get hacked or data mined, do not complain.

Trying to please everyone is a recipe for disaster, and never works. You have to do what's best for the advancement of usability and technology, and people will slowly but surely conform.

That is a well-reasoned list of reasons, though not all of them are applicable in this case, or at least to the extent as to justify Apple's actions.

Keep in mind that Apple is NOT dropping support for 32-bit iOS devices today. They still have to maintain infrastructure support for both 32-bit and 64-bit for quite some time. the "only" thing that they're doing today (with the release of iOS 11 and iTunes 12.7) is to make it difficult (and later impossible) for 64-bit iOS devices to stay on 32-bit.

 

[newellj]

Man, I need to update my daughter's iPod Touch 5th gen! A glorified video machine.

Won't run anything over iOS 9.
[doublepost=1505839046][/doublepost]

Can you not just load the App Store on iOS 10, load your purchased apps list, and redownload the 32-bit app. I thought it stayed there even after being withdrawn from the App Store listings (with some exceptions).

If I understand what you're saying, no. When you access the "new" App Store on your iOS device, you're not going to see 32 bit apps any more. The only way you can redownload it is if all three of the following are true: (1) your iOS device is on iOS 10 or earlier, (2) you have iTunes 12.6 or earlier running on your computer and (3) you previously downloaded a local copy of the 32 bit app. If any of those three isn't true, you're out of luck.
[doublepost=1505839079][/doublepost]

Perfect. That works.

Thanks!

I don't think it will - see above.

 

[tgara]

Kids, keep in mind Adobe will be sunsetting Flash in 2020!

https://www.macrumors.com/2017/07/25/adobe-flash-end-of-life/

You've been warned! Plan now for the obsolescence!

The question to be asking is why should Apple be stressing people out to begin with? Between this and the itunes update they really have not been very customer friendly. And if you don't show loyalty to customers, why should they show loyalty to you?

Instead of making people's lives easier, they are making things harder and more complex. The exact opposite of what they should be doing.

I guess I don't see this as Apple's fault. App developers knew that Apple was transitioning to 64-bit apps when the iPhone 5s launched in September of 2013, four years ago. All apps and app updates have been required to use 64-bit architecture since June of 2015, more than two years ago. And customers were also warned starting in October 2016, nearly a year ago. Over the summer, I even wrote to one app developer and inquired if they were going to update their app, which they finally did a few weeks ago after a barrage of bad reviews on the App Store.

The way I see it, if the developers chose not to update their apps after having this much forewarning, it's really their fault, not Apple's.

 

[dannyyankou]

I’ll keep my old 4s as my exclusive flappy bird device.

 

[psionicsin]

That is a well-reasoned list of reasons, though not all of them are applicable in this case, or at least to the extent as to justify Apple's actions.

Pretty much everyone of those reasons is applicable. Also I’m fully aware of the rollout cycle and their plan of action.

They also don’t have to maintain 32bit architecture/infrastructure support. Apple went 100% 64bit with Snow Leopard in...2009??? Almost 10 years ago, so it’s not unrealistic for mobile to follow suit. Saying they have to is unrealistic.

I’ve been back and forth to Cupertino over the past 2 months working on a joint effort between Apple and my company. As a UX Designer and Digital Technologist, I have to know that plan and roadmap inside out to make sure the team is adequately equipped.

Also, some people are getting their info wrong. 32bit apps (regardless of your iOS version) will not be in the App Store. So by not upgrading, you’re only freezing a point in time in your device. There will be absolutely no new 32bit apps nor updates for anyone.

 

[2010mini]

Yes, also developer must send birthday greetings cards to you and your grandchildren and their grandchildren.

listen....Apps are not just cute little playful stuff. Its a business. And it should be treated as such. The responsibility to let customers know the app the bought/downloaded will no longer be supported is on the Devs. And I am not just talking about support for new OS.... I am talking in general. If they pull support.... take it off the market or sell it to another Dev who will support it. Stop making excuses for Devs abandoning their customers.

 

[tgara]

Not bad, just one app "Super 8" (8mm camcorder app, also free way back in 2011)
I figured I'd have a ton more that would not be compatible.

I only had one app, Fine Cooking Magazine, that was not updated until a few weeks ago. I actually pay an annual subscription to the magazine, and having the digital copy was how I received it, so needless to say, I was quite concerned when, by the middle of summer, there was no update to it, or any of Taunton Press's apps. None had been updated since 2014, and many subscribers were complaining and warning about the impending loss of activity on iOS 11. But then, finally, the update came and now it works on my iPad.

Wife had 4 apps that were not updated, but they are either games she does not play anymore (Bejeweled?), or apps where there are now better alternatives available (e.g., Goodreader).

 

[fairuz]

What exactly is the cost of keeping 32-bit support? Because all the user sees is that their 32-bit apps don't work anymore after the update.

That includes me. Hopefully by the time I'm lacking some security updates and need to update to iOS 11, most apps will be updated or replaced.

 

[psionicsin]

What exactly is the cost of keeping 32-bit support? Because all the user sees is that their 32-bit apps don't work anymore. That includes me. I see no reason to update now.

See my post at the end of page 13. Very detailed. And my follow up post on this page.

 

[fairuz]

Pretty much everyone of those reasons is applicable. Also I’m fully aware of the rollout cycle and their plan of action.

They also don’t have to maintain 32bit architecture/infrastructure support. Apple went 100% 64bit with Snow Leopard in...2009??? Almost 10 years ago, so it’s not unrealistic for mobile to follow suit. Saying they have to is unrealistic.

Minor point, but Snow Leopard just made the kernel and (not sure if all) system programs 64-bit. OS X / macOS have always supported 32-bit userspace programs.

 

[truettray]

wow. Just checked and have 22 apps not supported.

Going to miss super monkey balls! My 1st ever iOS game.

I just went searching for it only to discover that Sega removed it a few years back. So sad!

 

[baconcow]

Won't run anything over iOS 9.
[doublepost=1505839046][/doublepost]

If I understand what you're saying, no. When you access the "new" App Store on your iOS device, you're not going to see 32 bit apps any more. The only way you can redownload it is if all three of the following are true: (1) your iOS device is on iOS 10 or earlier, (2) you have iTunes 12.6 or earlier running on your computer and (3) you previously downloaded a local copy of the 32 bit app. If any of those three isn't true, you're out of luck.
[doublepost=1505839079][/doublepost]

I don't think it will - see above.

iOS 10 doesn't have the new app store. I have iOS 10 (old iPhone) and iOS 11 (iPad Pro 10.5). Your purchases, 32-bit and 64-bit still show up on the iOS 10 purchased list on your device in the App Store. Goto Updates -> Purchased and then find your 32-bit app and download it. You do not need iTunes or a previously downloaded copy of the 32-bit app.

 

[psionicsin]

Minor point, but Snow Leopard just made the kernel and (not sure if all) system programs 64-bit. OS X / macOS have always supported 32-bit userspace programs.

Yes, but those legacy applications also may or may not be able to address the instruction set of new CPUs. So it’s a YMMV situation.

If anyone is developing on, and subsequently supporting, 32bit architecture that’s a fail. And then questions of security and usability will be the prevalent topic of the hour.
[doublepost=1505840927][/doublepost]

iOS 10 doesn't have the new app store. I have iOS 10 (old iPhone) and iOS 11 (iPad Pro 10.5). Your purchases, 32-bit and 64-bit still show up on the iOS 10 purchased list on your device in the App Store. Goto Updates -> Purchased and then find your 32-bit app and download it. You do not need iTunes or a previously downloaded copy of the 32-bit app.

Partially correct. You can still do this now due to them not eradicating 32bit YET. Eventually the rollout will be to drop (akin to a dev removing an app from the AppStore) 32bit apps in the AppStore database.

So while you’ll see your purchases, you won’t be able to download them if they’re not updated. Won’t matter your iOS version.

 

[D.T.]

Hahah about that upvote and downvote......hahahahah i'm laughing while i'm trying to type....,,but...can't lmao

I'm giving you one of each





(Well, not really, but it's the thought that counts ...)

 

[baconcow]

Partially correct. You can still do this now due to them not eradicating 32bit YET. Eventually the rollout will be to drop (akin to a dev removing an app from the AppStore) 32bit apps in the AppStore database.

I guess I am not sure about that. However, I have several games on my list that were removed from the App Store ages ago. I do not see why this would be any different. For example, Tap Tap Revenge 2.6 was pulled from the App Store in January 2014, yet I was just able to download and install it into my iPhone. Are we certain we won't be able to continue doing this to removed applications? If Apple states it will not affect people on iOS 10, I am guessing this will continue to be the case.

 

[psionicsin]

I guess I am not sure about that. However, I have several games on my list that were removed from the App Store ages ago. I do not see why this would be any different. For example, Tap Tap Revenge 2.6 was pulled from the App Store in January 2014, yet I was just able to download and install it into my iPhone. Are we certain we won't be able to continue doing this to removed applications? If Apple states it will not affect people on iOS 10, I am guessing this will continue to be the case.

Certain. There are 10 of our apps that are being sunset with the big push coming next year. And how you’re able to do that I have no clue, as I can see Flappybird in my list, but can’t download it on my non-iOS 11 device.

More importantly, can I ask why you’re set on not upgrading to iOS 11? Is it for mission critical (life or death) apps, or for games?

 

[fairuz]

Doesn't matter who's 'right' or 'wrong.' It's happening and there's no going back. On the Apple Discussion Forums there's a section for those still using OS 9, people struck forever in the past like "The Land That Time Forgot."

LOL, if you're going to stay on an iOS version, why 9 of all versions? 6 is the one people stick with if anything. TBH I wish I could go back to 6 with all security updates. My iPhone was so smooth and easy to use back then.
[doublepost=1505842303][/doublepost]

Wow! I wonder what apps are so great they got abandoned! And no replacements where made......

Phoenix Wright broke in, what, iOS 8? Famously good game. It was the only game I played.
[doublepost=1505842551][/doublepost]

See my post at the end of page 13. Very detailed. And my follow up post on this page.

Thanks, didn't see it before. I just wonder if it's worth it right now, which is a lot trickier. Users don't care about the internals, only the OS features and apps and responsiveness at the end of the day. Apple could keep 32-bit support at some extra financial cost and some performance degradation that's hard to quantify.

 

[baconcow]

Certain. There are 10 of our apps that are being sunset with the big push coming next year. And how you’re able to do that I have no clue, as I can see Flappybird in my list, but can’t download it on my non-iOS 11 device.

More importantly, can I ask why you’re set on not upgrading to iOS 11? Is it for mission critical (life or death) apps, or for games?

I have been on iOS 11 since the public beta began. Only the older iPhone remains on 10.

 

[psionicsin]

I have been on iOS 11 since the public beta began. Only the older iPhone remains on 10.

Ahh ok. Yeah people seem to have the wrong mindset when talks of "upgrading" are tossed around.

With iPhone upgrades I know people that have an iPhone 4 (still), refuse to upgrade, but want to complain about the data speeds and operability of the phone. When in reality, the iPhone 4 & 4s don't and never will support LTE. Which means not only are they no longer getting security updates, but their connection technology hasn't evolved with the newer cell tower technologies. Foolish to use antiquated technology as a daily driver.

Same with iOS and app upgrades. The majority of complaints I see are about games that are no longer supported, not applications that get things done. Applications which, I'm highly sure, have equal if not better performing alternatives. So they don't want to upgrade and hence are then putting heir personal data security at risk. And then those same people want to complain when crap hits the fan, which will inevitably happen.

Both of these situations, IMHO, are impacting your personal safety and security in one way or another. Does anyone remember the shenanigans that ensued on these forums when the 2G spectrum was official dismantled? People were outraged. "How dare cell companies provide us better and faster service without asking us!" was something along the lines of the arguments (paraphrasing of course).

You know, I recently saw a movie this weekend called "Backcountry" that was released in 2016. About a couple that gets lost in the Canadian(?) wilderness and have to fight for survival against a very rude black bear. What held my attention wasn't the movie per say, but the fact that the woman was in the middle of the wilderness trying to use her Blackberry Curve to call for help. I couldn't help but think "If you'd have not been stubborn and upgraded to the new iPhone and iOS when you should have, you probably could've made that call. Now you're running for your everlasting life trying to not be bear food while screaming where nobody can hear you".

Based on this thread, I feel like that black bear is going to snack on a whole lot of people in this next year or two.

 

[elmaco]

Most of my upset about this issue comes from a different perspective: Look at old computer platforms, like the Apple II, C64, IBM PC (pre-windows) and so on. Look at all the groups dedicated to archiving classic software from those platforms, so our computing history isn't lost to time..

When we owned software on disk, there was always someone who would eventually write an emulator, but with the App Store we are no longer in control of the Apps we bought.

I'm sure this will make life easier for Apple's developers, but there should be away to run old apps. Perhaps in an emulator App or seperate branch that doesn't need to be maintained when new iOS version are developed.