Rant: 30-year Mac fanatic finally buys Windows

[jpietrzak8]

Sure. So? If you want a new desktop every year, just buy a Dell or Acer.

Yup. Also, if you want a new desktop every two years, just buy a Dell or Acer.

Also, if you want a new desktop every three years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2014 Mini wasn't really an "upgrade".)

Also, if you want a new desktop every four years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2013 Pro still doesn't appear to have an upgrade in the works.)

Also, if you want a new desktop every five years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (Will the 2012 Mini be the last good Mini ever made?)

I guess, if you want a crippled, non-upgradable, overpriced AIO machine, you can get a Mac that fits that description which is less than five years old. But, that's about it.

 

[pika2000]

I think the point many of us are trying to make is that Apple appears to be making a big mistake in ignoring their desktop computer customers. From a purely dollars-in-the-bank-this quarter point of view, ignoring a small source of your overall market looks to be very smart. Investors love this sort of thing. However, my take, and I think the take of others on this thread, is that Apple is being penny wise and pound foolish in not continuing to innovate in the desktop area. The people who want and buy these desktops are also Apple’s primary app developers. Drive them off (as in your “just buy a Dell or Acer” attitude) might end up being a big mistake.

As for what’s really going on inside Apple, we have no idea. All we can do is see what they do and form our opinions as to whether Apple’s leadership has three brain cells among them based on that.

1. Apple is still selling desktops. They are just not as "new." So your comment of Apple "ignoring" desktop consumers is false. People just want newer stuff.
2. Developers can code on desktops/laptops, and Apple still sell them. Nothing in this discussion will affect how real people work. The discussion here is only about some consumers that want "newer" products just because. So yeah, if they want a 2017 model just because 2017 is > than 2016, go buy Acer/Dell.

 

[CaseyGV]

Yup. Also, if you want a new desktop every two years, just buy a Dell or Acer.

Also, if you want a new desktop every three years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2014 Mini wasn't really an "upgrade".)

Also, if you want a new desktop every four years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2013 Pro still doesn't appear to have an upgrade in the works.)

Also, if you want a new desktop every five years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (Will the 2012 Mini be the last good Mini ever made?)

I guess, if you want a crippled, non-upgradable, overpriced AIO machine, you can get a Mac that fits that description which is less than five years old. But, that's about it.

This exactly. I was running a mid 2011 Mac mini, and I was quite ready for an upgrade. I would have most certainly upgraded to another Mac mini had Apple not been selling 3 year old technology that was worse than the 5 year old technology they replaced it with. Instead, HP received my business.

 

[pika2000]

Yup. Also, if you want a new desktop every two years, just buy a Dell or Acer.

Also, if you want a new desktop every three years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2014 Mini wasn't really an "upgrade".)

Also, if you want a new desktop every four years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2013 Pro still doesn't appear to have an upgrade in the works.)

Also, if you want a new desktop every five years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (Will the 2012 Mini be the last good Mini ever made?)

I guess, if you want a crippled, non-upgradable, overpriced AIO machine, you can get a Mac that fits that description which is less than five years old. But, that's about it.

And how many people buy desktops? I used to have an iMac, and now my main machine is a MacBook Pro.
Steve Jobs said it himself. Go watch his video about trucks and cars.

 

[CaseyGV]

And how many people buy desktops? I used to have an iMac, and now my main machine is a MacBook Pro.
Steve Jobs said it himself. Go watch his video about trucks and cars.

Well, considering I just bought both a desktop and a laptop (both HP), Apple actually lost 2 sales. So there's that.

 

[pika2000]

This exactly. I was running a mid 2011 Mac mini, and I was quite ready for an upgrade. I would have most certainly upgraded to another Mac mini had Apple not been selling 3 year old technology that was worse than the 5 year old technology they replaced it with. Instead, HP received my business.

And that's how it should be. Instead of whining to Apple, buy what you need.
Another comparison is iPod. I can whine and moan about Apple not making newer iPod classic, but I just buy an Android phone with big SD card, and I'm done. Save me time and energy.
[doublepost=1485478499][/doublepost]

Well, considering I just bought both a desktop and a laptop (both HP), Apple actually lost 2 sales. So there's that.

Good. I don't see what the big deal is. Again, buy what you want. It's your money.
I also have Windows laptops for specific purposes where I don't find an Apple solution. It's my money, and I buy what I need.

So again, what's the point on harping on Apple and changing Tim Cook?

 

[Cape Dave]

Yup. Also, if you want a new desktop every two years, just buy a Dell or Acer.

Also, if you want a new desktop every three years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2014 Mini wasn't really an "upgrade".)

Also, if you want a new desktop every four years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2013 Pro still doesn't appear to have an upgrade in the works.)

Also, if you want a new desktop every five years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (Will the 2012 Mini be the last good Mini ever made?)

I guess, if you want a crippled, non-upgradable, overpriced AIO machine, you can get a Mac that fits that description which is less than five years old. But, that's about it.

Brilliantly spoken. Truth.

 

[Count Blah]

You know what kind of computers that Lenovo and Dell ship in volume right? Majority of their shipments are for enterprise contracts and low end laptops. Look at Lenovo's and Dell's own balance sheets. If you are a business, do you want to be a Lenovo/Dell, or do you want to be Apple?

And go back to what Steve Jobs said about trucks and cars. Apple is simply continuing Jobs' vision.

I'm not into computers for the sales aspect. I'm into computers for the useability aspect. And right now, Apple is charging full price for 2-3 year old computers, that were transitioned to be totally glued/soldered in, and Apple is also removing resources that used to be dedicated to Macs, onto other projects - All while greatly increasing the workforce, and banking tons of moneyfrom other revenue streams. That speaks volumes - Apple cares less and less about Macs.

How much money they make on watch bands is meaningless to me, who is interested in Macs - Something Apple used to knock out of the ballpark, about 5 years ago. Hmmm, what happened about 5 years ago? Let me think.

Actions speak louder than words, and Apple's actions scream 'we don't care about Macs, and you are lucky we even update the portables, so be happy"
[doublepost=1485479059][/doublepost]

1. Apple is still selling desktops. They are just not as "new." So your comment of Apple "ignoring" desktop consumers is false. People just want newer stuff.
2. Developers can code on desktops/laptops, and Apple still sell them. .

Here is where I stopped reading, and decided that you clearly are incapable of understanding.

Have a nice day, and please don't come back.

I don't ignore many, but I can't waste time on talking to a brick wall anymore.

 

[jpietrzak8]

And how many people buy desktops?

I buy desktops. I only buy desktops; no need for a laptop. I've got an overpriced, over-functional smartphone for when I'm on the go; a waste of money to use any other portable computing devices.

 

[Crosscreek]

I am happy with the fact that I no longer own an Apple computer and I will do the same with my phone when it dies.

The same can not be said of my wife's addiction though.

 

[Partron22]

You know what kind of computers that Lenovo and Dell ship in volume right? Majority of their shipments are for enterprise contracts and low end laptops. Look at Lenovo's and Dell's own balance sheets. If you are a business, do you want to be a Lenovo/Dell, or do you want to be Apple?

Don't really care what kind of company sells me my computers
I care that they sell the kind of computers I want.
Apple's been disappointing on that for about four years.
That makes it about time to move on.
I'm doing so, but will have legacy devices for years.

 

[Chicane-UK]

Dude, you're still rocking a 2013 MacBook Air. You yourself have shown the stagnation of PC market. Why should Apple put more effort in that if the consumers that said they wanted it are not actually upgrading as often anyway? As a business, why should you make something that people only want to see but not buy?

Ah.. I do have something newer.. I just haven't updated my signature. I just built a high spec PC a couple of months back (which I initially had success building up as a Hackintosh), and semi-retired the MacBook Air. I really liked the Air, so was fully prepared to buy another laptop Mac, but the new MacBook Pro was a bust (for me) and coupled with the price hike here in the UK because of the currency weakening, it was just far too much money for a not good enough product. I just spent the money on building a PC instead. Had Apple released a compelling new product, I had fully intended to buy. They didn't, so I haven't.

 

[Ursadorable]

Apple is simply continuing Jobs' vision.

Except Cook has no vision other than riding on the coattails of Jobs successes until it looses steam and completely stalls. Cook has proven he can barely keep status quo (by way of iOS devices), let alone bring Apple into the future.

 

[Lankyman]

I used to have an iMac, and now my main machine is a MacBook Pro.

Speaking personally I can't think of anything worse.

 

[Altis]

Except Cook has no vision other than riding on the coattails of Jobs successes until it looses steam and completely stalls. Cook has proven he can barely keep status quo (by way of iOS devices), let alone bring Apple into the future.

A rocket will continue to soar after you cut the fuel.

But once it starts coming downward, it will be difficult to stop.

 

[pika2000]

I buy desktops. I only buy desktops; no need for a laptop. I've got an overpriced, over-functional smartphone for when I'm on the go; a waste of money to use any other portable computing devices.

And why should Apple spent their resources just to cater to an individual user (you)?
[doublepost=1485570378][/doublepost]

Ah.. I do have something newer.. I just haven't updated my signature. I just built a high spec PC a couple of months back (which I initially had success building up as a Hackintosh), and semi-retired the MacBook Air. I really liked the Air, so was fully prepared to buy another laptop Mac, but the new MacBook Pro was a bust (for me) and coupled with the price hike here in the UK because of the currency weakening, it was just far too much money for a not good enough product. I just spent the money on building a PC instead. Had Apple released a compelling new product, I had fully intended to buy. They didn't, so I haven't.

And that's great. It's your money. Why waste time hounding Apple to make a cheap desktop when you can buy a PC? That's my point. Use common sense and buy what you need instead of whining. Case closed.

 

[jpietrzak8]

And why should Apple spent their resources just to cater to an individual user (you)?

Well, yes, that's true! I understand that Apple targets specific markets, and that my own market ("desktop computers") is one that they no longer have any interest in. I would imagine that they'll be phasing out laptops soon as well, to focus on their much more profitable iOS devices.

It is sad to see such a significant contributor to the personal computer industry making its way off the stage. I wish them well in their new businesses, but yeah, I'm probably not going to be a consumer of Apple products in the future. With the death of the Mac, Apple no longer has any devices that I care to purchase.

 

[pika2000]

Speaking personally I can't think of anything worse.

Sure, because other people's needs must be equal to yours, so your standard should apply for all.
[doublepost=1485571432][/doublepost]

Except Cook has no vision other than riding on the coattails of Jobs successes until it looses steam and completely stalls. Cook has proven he can barely keep status quo (by way of iOS devices), let alone bring Apple into the future.

Cook has no vision? What should be a vision of Apple then? Making cheap desktops/laptops like Acer/Asus? Glad you are not running Apple.

Under Tim Cook, Apple continues adding experience in making custom SoCs, and expanding it (W1, S2). But of course, that's not a vision. Rember when Jobs got back to Apple? People were whining when he cut off the licensing of mac to third parties. Yet now he's a visionary.

 

[navaira]

And why should Apple spent their resources just to cater to an individual user (you)?

Yes. There is only one person in the world who wants a Mac desktop.

 

[MacStu09]

Sure, because other people's needs must be equal to yours, so your standard should apply for all.
[doublepost=1485571432][/doublepost]
Cook has no vision? What should be a vision of Apple then? Making cheap desktops/laptops like Acer/Asus? Glad you are not running Apple.

Under Tim Cook, Apple continues adding experience in making custom SoCs, and expanding it (W1, S2). But of course, that's not a vision. Rember when Jobs got back to Apple? People were whining when he cut off the licensing of mac to third parties. Yet now he's a visionary.

Under Tim Cook, Apple has released the exact same line of products that existed when Jobs was in charge, over and over. Their only 'new' product was the failure that is the Apple Watch. Not only that, but once he was in charge, we saw the removal of ports, removal of drives, non-serviceable computers, more soldered-ram, decline of all professional software products, destruction of the Mac Pro, what exactly has improved? Even some newer Apple computers are benchmarking identical to their 2011 counterparts, you'd think it has to be a joke. And the iPhone still comes in 2 years behind competing phones, after really setting the mark with the 3g and 4.

And you say making cheap desktops/laptops is a fault of others? Have you seen the trash that is the intel M macbook? Or the $2k+ iMacs with 390 and 395 GPU's? Apple is the guilty party in making cheap/outdated products. It's starting to become a joke.

 

[Lankyman]

Sure, because other people's needs must be equal to yours, so your standard should apply for all.

Obviously the first two words of my post i.e. 'Speaking personally' means something different to you than that which is implied in the english language.
[doublepost=1485603259][/doublepost]

Cook has no vision? What should be a vision of Apple then? Making cheap desktops/laptops like Acer/Asus? Glad you are not running Apple.

Under Tim Cook, Apple continues adding experience in making custom SoCs, and expanding it (W1, S2). But of course, that's not a vision. Rember when Jobs got back to Apple? People were whining when he cut off the licensing of mac to third parties. Yet now he's a visionary.

Well at least you made me laugh. It's raining and miserable in the UK today but your post (above) had me laughing out loud.

 

[markscl]

Yup. Also, if you want a new desktop every two years, just buy a Dell or Acer.

Also, if you want a new desktop every three years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2014 Mini wasn't really an "upgrade".)

Also, if you want a new desktop every four years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (The 2013 Pro still doesn't appear to have an upgrade in the works.)

Also, if you want a new desktop every five years, just buy a Dell or Acer. (Will the 2012 Mini be the last good Mini ever made?)

I guess, if you want a crippled, non-upgradable, overpriced AIO machine, you can get a Mac that fits that description which is less than five years old. But, that's about it.

There is one HUGE difference that I haven't seen mentioned and that is that there is an excellent resale market for Macs. Sure, I can't upgrade my iMac. So, I just buy a 2 year old one on eBay that's still way better than all your new bargain basement PC's and sell my 4 year old one. Net upgrade is about $400 - $600 every two years. It's true that there is an investment to get your first Mac, but after that you actually have some capital that you can use to trade up.

 

[jpietrzak8]

There is one HUGE difference that I haven't seen mentioned and that is that there is an excellent resale market for Macs. Sure, I can't upgrade my iMac. So, I just buy a 2 year old one on eBay that's still way better than all your new bargain basement PC's and sell my 4 year old one. Net upgrade is about $400 - $600 every two years. It's true that there is an investment to get your first Mac, but after that you actually have some capital that you can use to trade up.

True! That is, if you can avoid the downside of an AIO machine (particularly the way Apple designs them today). If your four-year-old machine is still functioning perfectly, you can indeed sell it; however, if any part of the machine breaks, the entire machine is now unusable. Resale prices on Macs may be good, but repair prices on Macs are insane. So give your machine the velvet glove treatment! The first time a flaw occurs, you're going to lose all that capital you invested.

 

[Lankyman]

There is one HUGE difference that I haven't seen mentioned and that is that there is an excellent resale market for Macs. Sure, I can't upgrade my iMac. So, I just buy a 2 year old one on eBay that's still way better than all your new bargain basement PC's and sell my 4 year old one. Net upgrade is about $400 - $600 every two years. It's true that there is an investment to get your first Mac, but after that you actually have some capital that you can use to trade up.

Wow! a machine that was old tech two years ago has suddenly enjoyed a renaissance by being advertised on eBay and is now better than new PCs with a much higher spec - magic.

Why do you assume people are buying so called bargain basement PC's? You can buy a PC that is good quality with very high specs for much less than a Mac but which will last just as long.

I own a Mac but I'm not fooled into thinking it's internal workings are any better or worse than a good Intel Windows machine. I'm not sure if you are trying to convince yourself or others by your argument.

I keep my computers at least six years and if it was a Windows machine I could keep it current at any point during that cycle by installing user upgrades, therefore in theory I wouldn't need to keep buying and selling every couple of years.

Hmm!, I think your original arguments beginning to look a bit threadbare don't you?

 

[pika2000]

Yes. There is only one person in the world who wants a Mac desktop.

And does Apple not sell one?
People that wanted a Mac desktop can buy one.
Apple has made their decisions (go back to Steve Jobs' video about trucks and cars). There's no point in whining. Vote with your wallet. If you want newer PCs just for the sake of having the latest innards, there are plenty of them on the market without the fruit logo. There's no point being a fanboy.