tossing it all in one package doesnt give you ownership of the individual ideas. which were pretty much all copies
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Samsung's 'Crisis of Design' Memo Enters Patent Trial as Early Apple Designer Testifies on Confusion
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tossing it all in one package doesnt give you ownership of the individual ideas. which were pretty much all copies
There isn't much to say. I mean really - the memo's, graphics, designs and the preponderance of evidence completes the picture.
Samsung decided not to innovate and they were caught "sleeping".
They will loose. It's inevitable. One coincidence is one thing - but many - that's a different story.
Samsung decided not to innovate and they were caught "sleeping".
They will loose. It's inevitable. One coincidence is one thing - but many - that's a different story.
"I shot the sheriff, but I did not shoot the deputy."
As a developer, you should care about protected work.
I guess Apple gets a free pass for their blatant copying (the choice words around here) right? Or do you condemn Apple for being copycats?
An icon for a function of a phone isn't exactly the same as a product or company. If Samsung were on trial for your example and/or using Apple's font/type treatment and color for their Logo - I'd be first on board to say it's illegal.
"simply evolved over time?" Way to get it wrong, man. Look, everybody knows the handset shape has represented "phone" from the beginning of all cell phones. That's certain. Heck, using green is also something that came well before cell phones too.
But that's not the problem.
This is the iPhone dialer icon:
This has the Palm OS dialer icon on a Centro:
This is the webOS dialer icon:
This has the original stock Android dialer icon (Samsung doesn't use the stock Android):
Android 2.3:
Android 4:
Windows Phone 7:
Windows Mobile:
Different Windows Mobile:
There are obviously tons of ways to design a phone dialer icon that makes sense. All those listed above are very unique and distinguishable. Heck, Palm even use to use the shape of the device it's running on as part of the icon. Very unique. Many of them even use different colors.
Apple's icon is different in that it's not a green handset. It's a white handset icon, on a green background. Who else up in that swath of phones has a white handset on a green background?:
Nobody. Not even Google. Got that? Not. Even. Google.
But Samsung made one.
But that's not a big deal. The big deal is that Samsung not only made a phone icon that's similar to Apple's, they made a crapton of more icons that are similar to Apple's.
Like seriously, look at the icons in the HTC G1 picture. Then look at a Samsung Captivate's icons. Then look at an iPhone 3G. You can't possibly deny that Samsung's icons look significantly more like Apple's than Google's.
As for the LG Optimus 4X HD P880 (man, that name is horrible), I have a feeling that if LG keeps that up, they'll be served the same lawsuit soon.
I have always been paid my regular salary by my employer, plus $7 hr by the state
not sure what those other guys are talking about, i guess it just depends on the state and/or the employer
Yeah, and the phone icon is probably the one that comes closest to "copying", but they're all so generic and nondescript, I have a hard time seeing why anyone would trademark it, let alone bring it up in court.
It's a phone icon. Only this time rotated slightly to the left. On a green background. Those icons before? They were rotated more to the right and on a black background. Sometimes they had little wavy lines coming out of them. That makes all the difference in the world.
The rest of the icons? Only superficially similar.
wow $75,000 paid for his expert opinion?
there r quite a few experts on this board too. i think you all ought to contact apple.
http://www.phonearena.com/news/Design-expert-got-75000-from-Apple-so-far-for-his-testimony_id33081
!!!
there r quite a few experts on this board too. i think you all ought to contact apple.
http://www.phonearena.com/news/Design-expert-got-75000-from-Apple-so-far-for-his-testimony_id33081
!!!
For those that don't see any copying, or say that Apple copied others, the thing is that many see these things as ubiquitous now because both Apple's penetration and the blatant copying that Samsung and others have done to make these things ubiquitous. It really isn't right or fair to Apple given they created what we all know the smartphone OS is - at least in regards to ios and android are concerned.
And yes, Apple may have taken design cues from Skype, for example, for their phone icon, but Skype wasn't a smartphone application back in 2004 or even 2006 because there weren't smartphone apps back then.
Apples patents are related not just to the design but the design for the intended use with a smartphone.
And others have braved their own ridicule, by pointing out the fact that the Asian culture does not frown upon stealing IP. This is true in tech, pharmaceuticals, aeronautics, etc.
This type of lawsuit is not uncommon and happens more than those of us perusing sites like this would realize.
And yes, Apple may have taken design cues from Skype, for example, for their phone icon, but Skype wasn't a smartphone application back in 2004 or even 2006 because there weren't smartphone apps back then.
Apples patents are related not just to the design but the design for the intended use with a smartphone.
And others have braved their own ridicule, by pointing out the fact that the Asian culture does not frown upon stealing IP. This is true in tech, pharmaceuticals, aeronautics, etc.
This type of lawsuit is not uncommon and happens more than those of us perusing sites like this would realize.
Trademarking it probably has a lot to do with recognition of the iPhone's particular style. The rounded square icons, the gradient shine, and that it's Apple's first phone. At a glance, without looking at the details of it icon, it's already reasonably distinct and understandable. That's my guess; to be quite honest, I'm not well versed in trademark law.
I've had an old Windows Mobile phone as well as multiple Pocket PC devices, as well as multiple Palm OS devices, and a even a couple of Newtons. Oh, and I have an HP Touchpad. And a Nexus S.
Every one of them has a general style to it. And the rounded square icons happens to be fairly unique to iOS.
Likewise, you can see Palm OS tends to go with the "object at angled view over tilted circle platform" icon style. Palm's webOS has the same tilted platform concept, but it's a rotated square underneath instead of a circle. Windows Mobile 7 has the white silhouette on flat color and sharp tiles sort of look.
If you took a few icons from any of those platforms and moved them to another, you'd instantly see they're out of place.
Yes, the phone is probably the most similar. I would have dismissed the contacts one if it wasn't for the silhouette and paper rings. The music icon is just too similar to iTunes to ignore.
But as I said before. If it was just one or two icons, meh, whatever. In Samsung's case, they redid almost all of them in the Apple-ish style. And then copied the dock. (I played with a Samsung Captivate while trying to decide which Android device to get)
please go look at the moto blur icons from 2.1 on. THey are all the white phone on a green back ground.
I think one of Apple's biggest problems in showing consumer confusion is that their products are normally displayed in their own special section, also rarely are you able to purchase any phone or tablet off the shelf without getting help from someone, so if there was confusion at any point (if you somehow managed to not look at the logos, Samsung's just so happens to be on the front to see easily) the person helping with your purchase would most likely point it out, unless they were a DB
What a twist of events, one that can only be found in courtroom dramas seen on television. Dun dunnn.....
I agree mostly. Except the last part. Does the trademark speak directly to phone apps or are they general design patents.
Also - copying is copying. If you're (general not you specific) going to condemn Samsung or others for copying - you can't turn a blind eye to Apple's copying. It doesn't matter if they made it popular. The prior art existed and was used and was public.
Bad analogy perhaps - but if a painter paints a painting and it's sold to a person. Another person visits the curator and paints a similar painting and then that painting becomes uber popular and there are postcards, prints, etc all from that image - that doesn't change the fact that the copier copied.
I'm tired of people complaining that Samsung didn't copy from Apple. Let me just say from experience of BEING KOREAN!!! WE COPY!!! have you ever been to asia. And if they don't think the user experience didn't have an "apple" favoring, then they are delusional.
It's a quiet a simple formula that is used across all genres.
Sports: copy last year's champion blue print for winning.
Entertainment: Copy whatever is hot right now.
Technology gadgets, copy whatever will appeal to customers. Samsung has no innovation whatsoever in the phone division and I see this blatantly in the 8 months of owning a Galaxy S2. They have an Android framework, but they stole minor tweaks here or there to make it feel like apple. It doesn't help that everything they made now trying to copy apple. I have some issues initially with their series 7 laptops even copying the apple trackpad.
Samsung doesn't know what innovation is or know how to even optimize. They are truly only good at hardware (in terms of RAM, processor, Memory and maybe even tv's ...whatever).
But lately, I don't care too much of the GS2, or GS3. It is what it is. But the Galaxy tab looks without a doubt an ipad and they can't get that through their heads. Then damn, I hope they lose. I'm all for korean companies finding honest ways of making good products. This isn't honest, this is ....lets see what apple does and then copy it. S-Voice really? Lame.
It's a quiet a simple formula that is used across all genres.
Sports: copy last year's champion blue print for winning.
Entertainment: Copy whatever is hot right now.
Technology gadgets, copy whatever will appeal to customers. Samsung has no innovation whatsoever in the phone division and I see this blatantly in the 8 months of owning a Galaxy S2. They have an Android framework, but they stole minor tweaks here or there to make it feel like apple. It doesn't help that everything they made now trying to copy apple. I have some issues initially with their series 7 laptops even copying the apple trackpad.
Samsung doesn't know what innovation is or know how to even optimize. They are truly only good at hardware (in terms of RAM, processor, Memory and maybe even tv's ...whatever).
But lately, I don't care too much of the GS2, or GS3. It is what it is. But the Galaxy tab looks without a doubt an ipad and they can't get that through their heads. Then damn, I hope they lose. I'm all for korean companies finding honest ways of making good products. This isn't honest, this is ....lets see what apple does and then copy it. S-Voice really? Lame.
So you're saying you speak for all Koreans?
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. For some it's "blatant" copying. For others it's not so "blatant" or copying. (Yes.. blatant was my choice of words, not yours)
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. For some it's "blatant" copying. For others it's not so "blatant" or copying. (Yes.. blatant was my choice of words, not yours)
I don't understand how a former APPLE designer Susan Kare could be used as an expert supposedly neutral witness. Even so, if she picked up a Samsung phone and thought it wa an iPhone she's anything BUT an expert. Jeez.
In case case, if Apple wins this ridiculous lawsuit I will never buy an Apple product again. I really mean that.
You are joking, right?
Oh, you mean Motorola's version of Android? That was made after the iPhone, right? Honestly though, the rectangle icon distinguishes it from the iPhone enough.
I don't thinks it's the colors, the shape, the placement, or anything else individually. It's the whole package that comes together so that at a glance you get the branding of the product. That's what it's about, really. And I do think Samsung's phones look like knockoffs. Cheap, ugly knockoffs, but knockoffs nonetheless.
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He does in this case. If you'd ever lived there for any length of time, Samsung's actions would be completely transparent to you. This goes on all the time in Korea, where copying does not have the same stigma it does in Western countries.
This is an open and shut case. Look at the phones before the iPhone was made public and look at them after. Even a child could see the copying. Whether or not this is or should be illegal is besides the point: they slavishly copied iOS.
My wife, not only has a degree in law but one in criminology as well, and whilst she is quite unaware of the current battle between Apple and Samsung, I am sure that if I were to ask her she would agree that Apple have a fair case against Samsung.
lol what?
By your logic, anyone could've "tossed" everything together and came out with an iPhone equivalent. Oh wait, they didn't, because Apple didn't "copy", they came out with their own unique product.
Next you're gonna argue that Apple didn't innovate because telephones already existed
Jury Duty
Each company has different standards regarding Jury duty. Most will pay full salary for at least 2 weeks of trial. If a company doesn't pay for Jury duty then, the Judge will excuse you from duty. So no one is going without a paycheck while serving, unless they are unemployed and choose to serve anyway.
Each company has different standards regarding Jury duty. Most will pay full salary for at least 2 weeks of trial. If a company doesn't pay for Jury duty then, the Judge will excuse you from duty. So no one is going without a paycheck while serving, unless they are unemployed and choose to serve anyway.
The sad part is, the non-iPhone icons are often better, and yet Samsung decided to copy the mediocre to crappy iPhone designs rather than the better designs out there.
I like my iPhone less and less all the time because the icons are poor.
Why are phone and chat so similar (same color green with white in middle). Why are safari, voice memos, app store and mail basically the same color?
You must LOOK at the phone to use those icons rather than glance.
And now that Apple is defending this craptacular design in court as what makes an iPhone an iPhone, they can't change it!
EDIT: For that matter, because all iPhone icons have to be that square with rounded corners, we get icons that are far to similar, not just from Apple.
Apps on my phone with Shades of Blue Squares with white icon/middle: App Store, Safari (with a little red), Mail, Voice Memo, Stocks, Apple Store, American Express, Realtor.com, Facebook, twitter, Skype, LinkedIn, United Airlines
Apple's design inspires third party app companies to do this, and what you get is something that requires too much focus to be intuitive. If you have poor eyesight, good luck.
Apple likes Blue icons on the Mac OS too, but at least there they can be different shapes. And you can change them if you want to with a simple cut and paste of another icon. Can't do that in iOS.
I like my iPhone less and less all the time because the icons are poor.
Why are phone and chat so similar (same color green with white in middle). Why are safari, voice memos, app store and mail basically the same color?
You must LOOK at the phone to use those icons rather than glance.
And now that Apple is defending this craptacular design in court as what makes an iPhone an iPhone, they can't change it!
EDIT: For that matter, because all iPhone icons have to be that square with rounded corners, we get icons that are far to similar, not just from Apple.
Apps on my phone with Shades of Blue Squares with white icon/middle: App Store, Safari (with a little red), Mail, Voice Memo, Stocks, Apple Store, American Express, Realtor.com, Facebook, twitter, Skype, LinkedIn, United Airlines
Apple's design inspires third party app companies to do this, and what you get is something that requires too much focus to be intuitive. If you have poor eyesight, good luck.
Apple likes Blue icons on the Mac OS too, but at least there they can be different shapes. And you can change them if you want to with a simple cut and paste of another icon. Can't do that in iOS.
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On a related note - this is a very interesting turn of events... and involves Florian Mueller
Judge orders Oracle/Google to disclose paid journalists and bloggers
Judge orders Oracle/Google to disclose paid journalists and bloggers
Have you ever served on a jury? I have many times over the years. I always got paid full salary by my company. If your company doesn't pay for jury duty the judge will excuse you from duty for what's called "financial hardship".