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The complaint here is that Apple added a feature to its new computers that the old computers don’t get.
Even this framing of the statement is too generous. The complaint is that in four or more months, Apple will be adding features that some older machines will not be able to get. This is not yet released software.
If Apple never added new features to Macs, then we’d still be using System 1.0 on a Mac 128K. The complaint is just plain silly. As it has always been with any tech, if you want the new features, you have to buy the new computer or iPod or phone or car or whatever…
The ”fix” being proposed is that Apple add a warning, so here is my proposed wording: “Apple is constantly adding features to its software and hardware. Your machine may or may not run features that have not yet been released.”
 
“New” lol they still sell Intel Macs. Not understanding an equivalency doesn’t make it a false equivalency, and bolding stuff doesn’t make your point any stronger. this isn’t a textbook.

I’ll follow my own advice and end the discussion there, there’s really no point.
It is absolutely a false equivalency:

There seems to be an active double standard that I see a lot on here (and have for years as a lurker):
If Apple makes a change that excludes features, or has some sort of limitation, people are like “well you bought it so you’re entitled to what you got when you bought it and nothing more” which is to say “you knew the rules when you signed up, you can’t expect them to change now so suck it up”

If Apple makes a change to existing developer rules for the App Store, they’re somehow fully entitled to do that whenever they want and the developers cannot complain, which is to say “you knew the rules when you signed up but now they’ve changed, suck it up”

seems like for some folks, Apple always wins and that’s just not a convo worth having. I commend you for toughing it out for so long but it’s truly pointless to sing against the echo chamber
The App Store developer rules you mention have nothing to do with the M1-only features in MacOS Monterey. You’ve inserted your own straw man argument here and attacked it.

Apple hasn’t taken any features away from the Intel Macs. Intel Macs will be able to do more with Monterey than they could with Big Sur. The fact that there are some M1-only features in Monterey takes nothing away from the Intel Macs. The Intel Macs can run boot camp… the M1s cannot. They are not the same.
 
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Even this framing of the statement is too generous. The complaint is that in four or more months, Apple will be adding features that some older machines will not be able to get. This is not yet released software.

The ”fix” being proposed is that Apple add a warning, so here is my proposed wording: “Apple is constantly adding features to its software and hardware. Your machine may or may not run features that have not yet been released.”

Good point…

I propose no warning at all. If people can figure out how to create a MR forum account, they can probably also figure out that all tech companies constantly add features to new products and differentiate contemporary products by offering different feature sets.
 
There seems to be an active double standard that I see a lot on here (and have for years as a lurker):
If Apple makes a change that excludes features, or has some sort of limitation, people are like “well you bought it so you’re entitled to what you got when you bought it and nothing more” which is to say “you knew the rules when you signed up, you can’t expect them to change now so suck it up”
That is not what is being said. What people are saying is that there is no guarantee that every product (even those being sold now), will get every future feature. Just as there features that only run on the 2019 Mac Pro, there will be features that will only run on Apple Silicon based machines. This is simply a fact of hardware and software development. To expect that every future feature will run on every previous design is absurd.
If Apple makes a change to existing developer rules for the App Store, they’re somehow fully entitled to do that whenever they want and the developers cannot complain, which is to say “you knew the rules when you signed up but now they’ve changed, suck it up”
If Apple makes a change to developer rules it applies to products submitted after that change (including updates). If a developer does not want to conform to the new rules, they can choose not to release updates and stop developing for the platform. When one chooses to develop for an ecosystem that one does not control, one takes risks. Google developed Project Tango devices and encouraged developers to produce products for them. Then they dropped Project Tango. That is what it is. Those developers were building a business in someone else’s sandbox and that entails risks. If one does not want those risks, develop for Linux, macOS or Windows, not for the App Store.
seems like for some folks, Apple always wins and that’s just not a convo worth having. I commend you for toughing it out for so long but it’s truly pointless to sing against the echo chamber
There is no double standard here, both of these views are completely congruent. Buying products based on the hope that some future unannounced feature that might interest you might come into existence is silly. Developing applications for an environment that a single company controls and expecting them never to make any changes is equally silly.
 
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Are you for real?
Are you?
how are people supposed to know?
How are people supposed to know that in the future there will be features that will not run on their current hardware? Well, I guess they could read any of the many articles that talk about the future OS, or just use common sense, as that is, and has always been, the case.

You stated earlier that the $3,500 you spent on your 2019 Macintosh was a lot of money for you. Did you do any research before you purchased it? Did you read reviews on other tech sites? Did you watch reviews on YouTube? Was Apple’s website the only place you looked before you purchased it? Did you know that every year Apple releases new phones with new features that only run on them? Why does it surprise you that the same is true for their laptops?
There is no notice on the Apple site.
What would you like this proposed notice to read? “Apple, like every technology company that is a going concern, is constantly releasing new products and software. It is highly likely that at some point in the future, there will be a release that will contain features that will not be supported on any hardware you purchase today.”
Surely you agree there should be such a notice?
Nope, I do not, as I think it is self evident that current hardware is not guaranteed to support all future features.
warning that Intel CPUs may not support features?
Nope, just as I do not think there needs to be a warning on the Apple Silicon Macintosh page that says it will not natively run Windows.
On the page where you buy the product. Not hidden away on a beta page.
You are talking about an unreleased product. Your argument seems to be that people who are about to spend $3,500 on machines do no research on them before they purchase them. Apple does not hide this information, it puts it where it makes sense, on the page for the new product. There are also many (many, many) articles both in the tech and mainstream press explaining this specific topic.
 
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Performance applies to all of them.... but you don't need 8-cores for blurred backgrounds in Facetime. Its just another Apple go-media frenzy to force people to upgrade to M1.

My take is: When people see those points and are ineligible on Intel-Macs, just like new features on iOS, customers will upgrade more likely. ....Either that, or in a few months time Apple will bring all this to intel-Mac's anyway... But even if its a good promo, it'll work :)

Apple's good at that
 
Its just another Apple go-media frenzy to force people to upgrade to M1.
Force people? Everyone that has a non-M1 system now absolutely must upgrade to M1? If so, that’s gonna be HUUUUGE sales for Apple!

But, it won’t be. Because Apple’s not forcing anything. If folks spend money to buy an M1 system it won’t be because they were forced by Apple. People buy what they like because that’s what they want to spend money on.
 
Force people? Everyone that has a non-M1 system now absolutely must upgrade to M1? If so, that’s gonna be HUUUUGE sales for Apple!

But, it won’t be. Because Apple’s not forcing anything. If folks spend money to buy an M1 system it won’t be because they were forced by Apple. People buy what they like because that’s what they want to spend money on.

Blurred backgrounds in FaceTime is absolutely a requirement for survival. Food, shelter, blurred backgrounds.
 
An interactive 3D globe doesn't require a neural network to display. Google Earth has had a 3D interactive map for almost fifteen years.

They NEVER have to explain anything - it's their choice. However, just because that is the case doesn't mean that people can't be rightfully angry about it.

Apple is selling devices TODAY that aren't capable of the full set of features in their latest OS release. This isn't a "we finished our transition to Apple Silicon - these new features will only be available for Apple Silicon Macs." This is them continuing to sell Macs starting at $1800 USD that will immediately become obsolete as it relates to running the full software stack.

That's not to say that some of this stuff does seem to require Apple Silicon support - like live text, etc. But that doesn't mean consumers can't be angry about this.
The 3D globe may need certain aspect of M1 to do the rendering. Just because Google Earth can do it, it doesn't mean it's the same for apple.
 
Force people? Everyone that has a non-M1 system now absolutely must upgrade to M1? If so, that’s gonna be HUUUUGE sales for Apple!

But, it won’t be. Because Apple’s not forcing anything. If folks spend money to buy an M1 system it won’t be because they were forced by Apple. People buy what they like because that’s what they want to spend money on.

Should have said "more likely"

If you want x feature only on m1,, you will get one
 
First, that is not actually a shipping product, just a rumor. Second, even if they ship it, it is not a new machine (just a new option on a two year old design). Third, if it ships, three things are true about its purchasers:

  1. Anyone purchasing it will be doing so because they have a specific need for its functionality (or they won the lottery and need sets of them to use as shelving units).
  2. Anyone purchasing that new configuration will know that Apple has begun their transition to Apple Silicon, meaning they already know what is happening before they purchase it.
  3. Anyone purchasing that new configuration who does any research on it at all will know that there are things it will not do.
While I think those who say that Apple should not have sold those machines in January of 2020 knowing they were going to start shipping Apple Silicon machines over the next few years, at least that argument is based on purchasers not having full information. Your current argument is that people with access to complete information who are going to spend large amounts of money despite not getting some future features are getting screwed.

I just do not buy it.
 
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Should have said "more likely"
“More likely” than what? Are you arguing that someone with the most recent Intel-based Macintosh system is more likely to upgrade than if that feature did not exist? I am sure that is true. Essentially meaningless, but true. The statement would also be true had you said: “If Apple offered anyone who had an Intel-based Macintosh purchased in 2020 $0.10 to upgrade while allowing them to keep their old machine it would make upgrades more likely” and just as meaningless.
If you want x feature only on m1,, you will get one
No, if your desire for a feature that is exclusive to an Apple Silicon system is great enough to overcome the downside (cost among other things) and you can afford to do so, you might get one.

Again, while even though my formulation is more accurate, the number of people for whom face blurring and a Maps globe crosses that threshold is vanishingly small.
 
I've already stated I have been with Apple for over a decade. Do carry on.
Ok. But what does that have to do with how long Alan has been a customer?

FWIW, I have only been a “customer” since around 2007? I guess I bought a few iPods before then. Though I owned a custom Mac with a secret processor in it since 1997, designed processors for a company Steve Jobs put out of business, and grew up using Apple II’s (which were far too expensive for me to own). Of course, all of that is irrelevant, just like Alan’s history with Apple.
 
Ok. But what does that have to do with how long Alan has been a customer?

FWIW, I have only been a “customer” since around 2007? I guess I bought a few iPods before then. Though I owned a custom Mac with a secret processor in it since 1997, designed processors for a company Steve Jobs put out of business, and grew up using Apple II’s (which were far too expensive for me to own). Of course, all of that is irrelevant, just like Alan’s history with Apple.
I am asking because at one time I was as in "love" with Apple, although I started to lose the love with the design changes that started to take place post 2013. My main reason for staying with Apple was security and privacy which Android or Windows is still catching up with.

No one is criticising anyone for being an Apple customer, as I said in one of my first posts, Apple is gaining customers. I just don't like the BS they come out with.

Are you Alan's spokesmen BTW?
 
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