Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
So will Apple ever offer us the full web in a tablet device like the others do?
- Thread starter ApplesAOranges
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
It won't.
Bad designers will simply inflict their bad designs on us with HTML5.
Code:
Flash != bad design;
bad designer = bad design;Simply put.
Anyone who believes Flash "just works" must have never experienced it at length on a Mac, Linux computer, or any mobile device.
Flash only works as well as Adobe want it to work. And Adobe are very, very lazy (unless the platform controls 90% of the market.) Steve Jobs knows this from how they treated the Mac, and he hasn't forgotten it in regards to the iPhone. Open standards all the way, thanks.
Well, you've got a point there! But I admit I'm not familiar with HTML5 -- will a badly designed html5 page take as long to load as badly designed flash pages? Also, won't you be able to override font and color coding in html5 with your own css styles?
I've experience Flash, on my Mac laptops, for over a decade and it has always worked for me.
Your love life notwithstanding, there are many users who have problems with Flash. Steve Jobs validates their experiences. Adobe agrees that problems exist and is doing "everything" it can to address the issues. However, it is too late. Several of my favorite repositories of free video have completely abandoned .flv in favor of .mpg and .mp4.I have a PC and I love Flash
...
That doesn't make sense. Apple is pushing HTML5 which they can't skim profits on. Besides, most Flash apps are free, and Apple allows free apps where they don't skim anything.
Shilling fail.
Do you know Flash does not work on "supported" mobile devices?
What other tablets? Oh right, the stuff with no release date, and running last year's software.
Do you know Flash does not work on "supported" mobile devices?
What other tablets? Oh right, the stuff with no release date, and running last year's software.
And yes, I´m talking about the infamous "F word".
It seems that all the other tablets are starting to offer the full web experience. F is now much better and efficient and looks like it´s never going away, at least for a very long time. The hardware is also much more powerful now.
Will Apple swallow their pride? Ever? iPad 2? Maybe 3?
Or do we who would like a full web in a tablet device have to start looking elsewhere? Or maybe just get a MBA then?
Oh God, another Flash thread.
Prepare for an influx of members who'd rather see holes all over the web cause Stevie would too.
Also, Flash works great on iDevices in the form of Frash. Oh, and for everybody but Mac users, Flash takes up no more than 10% CPU (6% on my laptop with a Core 2 Duo, and pretty much zero on my Core 2 Quad Desktop.) This is because Microsoft helped Adobe get Flash working on their platform. If Apple had done the same instead of being so childish, Flash would work on OSX well too. I mean it works very well for Ubuntu and other Linux distros. OSX isn't that far off. So it's Apple's fault, really. The problem here is a lack of effort from Apple, not Adobe. Probably because they knew that Flash would pretty much cancel out the need to purchase movies from iTunes.
Last edited:
And yes, I´m talking about the infamous "F word".
It seems that all the other tablets are starting to offer the full web experience. F is now much better and efficient and looks like it´s never going away, at least for a very long time. The hardware is also much more powerful now.
Will Apple swallow their pride? Ever? iPad 2? Maybe 3?
Or do we who would like a full web in a tablet device have to start looking elsewhere? Or maybe just get a MBA then?
Please!! Just stop it. There are over 100 threads about flash on the iPad or iPhone. It kills battery life and slows stuff down. How do I know? I was on the iMac on YouTube while my mom had cafe world running in the back ground and everything was laggy and sometimes didn't even load until I closed out cafe world. Plus for me all the websites I go to don't use flash. Now please stop making new threads and saying flash is full Internet when truly it isn't!
Hmm... if there´s so many threads and this is that big of a controversy, don´t you think Apple would be at least a bit worried?
What about as an option then? Like they give with the MBA. You can install F and use it if you want it or just not install it. Or maybe they could put just a ON/OFF switch in the Settings? I don´t see why they couldn´t do that, other than maybe protect their own stuff? (That was an interesting point you made mKTank).
Like I said earlier, I ran daily into F and many problems (caused by the lack of it) with my iPhone. It´s very annoying. But I forgive that, ´cause it´s just a 3,5" device that goes into my pocket. But if I were to buy a 10" device... hmm I don´t know, would kinda suck.
Last edited:
ApplesAOranges, meet FlexEngineer...
Flash is dead!
Man you guys sound so much alike! U all should have a little pow-wow, except I think he is in timeout on these forums. As a matter of fact, it looks like you joined the exact same day he was temporarily banned....
Flash is dead!
Man you guys sound so much alike! U all should have a little pow-wow, except I think he is in timeout on these forums. As a matter of fact, it looks like you joined the exact same day he was temporarily banned....
I´m not trying to troll, so that´s a bit insulting.
Flash is dead!
Man you guys sound so much alike! U all should have a little pow-wow, except I think he is in timeout on these forums. As a matter of fact, it looks like you joined the exact same day he was temporarily banned....
And who is this FlexEngineer? Never heard of him. I´ve been lurking here for awhile, so I´ve noticed some craziness going on with the F, but I´m just trying figure out whether iPad 2, Xoom, MBA or something else... would be best for me.
I´d really like a tablet, ´cause touchscreens are cool.
But I would like to have the full web, ´cause I know what the browsing is like with my iPhone. I don´t enjoy it very much, although like I said it´s ok for a 3,5" phone that goes to my pocket.So I´m waiting for the iPad 2 for now to see what Apple has in store. Although I´m starting to get the feeling that it won´t have the infamous F. :/
I really like how Apple does things otherwise, so Xoom or something else isn´t that tempting, although the demo looked very nice. It´s an option. MBA is another option...
I´m not trying to troll, so that´s a bit insulting.
Any new thread about Flash is a troll. The insult hit home.
If you're for real please use the forum search facility and stop wasting bandwidth.
Okay wow!
Are you a moderator deciding that? Apple shill? I guess the F threads hit home too. So very touchy.Maybe the moderators could make that one a rule then?
No threads about F.
I would just like to have calm discussing whether Apple will EVER offer the full web in a tablet form.
Okay wow!
Maybe the moderators could make that one a rule then?
No threads about F.
I would just like to have calm discussing whether Apple will EVER offer the full web in a tablet form.
As time goes on the "F" issue will become more difficult or more easy.
If there does become an alternative to Flash (and I don't just mean video clips which seems to what 99% of people seem to think Flash is only about) and virtually all current Flash based sites that offer Games, Animations and Video's in Flash move over to this alternative then the issue will fade away.
If however, Adobe keeps improving Flash performance, and Android tablets sell in the ten's / hundreds of millions and they can play Flash, and tablet power gets higher and higher, meaning over the years Flash will become easy to run without "other" tablets even breaking a sweat, then it's going to be very hard for Apple to hold out without looking stupid as they won't then even be able to use a technical argument.
Which way it goes, I think it's still too early to call.
This whole Flash support issue is inconvenient. Either Apple needs to support Flash, or web developers need to incorporate HTLM5 for non-flash devices. Doesn't Adobe have a tool that converts Flash into HTML5? If so why are so many still using Flash? like Steam, IGN, and many other websites that I visit? from where I'm sitting, it doesn't look like Flash is dead or dying, nor does it look like Apple is budging. The sad thing is, this whole Flash issue has to do with money, profits and control, and there are those of us that just want to browse a website the way it was designed to be viewed, nothing more, nothing less.
Indeed.
It's like Apple making a car that only runs on one type of fuel, and there are only a handful of gas stations that sell that fuel.
The fact it's the poor customer that is the one that is the one that suffers as he has to drive past a dozen normal gas stations to find the one that is Apple approved seems to be lost.
As normal the giants act like kids in the school yard rather than working together and the poor customer who has to work hard to afford to buy their products is the one who suffers.
I'd lock Adobe and Apple in a room and not let them out till they realise it's the customer they should both be working TOGETHER for. Not calling each other names.
You mean exactly like diesel? So then this is like someone buying a diesel car and then complaining that they can't get diesel fuel everywhere; yes I agree.
You'd swear the customer is forced into this, those poor souls buying luxury electronics who suffer when they can't watch some stupid Internet flash video, or terrible sitcom, or play a game, all of which can be done on the iPad through other means, via HTML5.
I'm all for government intervention but in this case I think it's fine for Apple to offer people what they do; if people don't like it they don't have to buy it. Maybe another company can seize the opportunity and sell you what you would like. Or we can go your route and just force them to do what you want, sure.
I don't think it will happen, apple won't ever use flash and soon when the rest of the world uses HTM5 it will be awsome. As for downloading things and other Internet features that will come with a file system and let's hope that happens
I have a PC and I love Flash
Over the entire history of owning PC's both purchased and my own assembly from chosen parts, I have never had and problems with Flash.
It was not till around a year ago, when I started reading Mac Forums about the new Apple tablet that was coming that I even knew anyone on the planet had any issue with Flash whatsoever.
I saw it used everywhere, enjoyed the richness it brought to old boring static web sites and assumed everyone on any machine was enjoying it also.
I even tried Ubuntu a few years back and Flash played back fine on that.
It was, and is a non issue for me, and I gues for tens of millions of other people. You have a new machine, you go to a Flash website for the 1st time on your new machine, you click a button to download and install Flash, which you do and you never even think about it every again.
It just works.
I expect there are tens of millions of people out there who are like what I was like a year ago, and don't even know what the problem is, as for most people with computers there just is no problem.
As for power soaking. I have played back 1080p video from YouTube in the new format and also the exact same 1080p clip in, what Mac users sadly say is horrid flash, and the Flash version used considerably less CPU power to play back than the HTML5 version of the same video.
So, for me. how can I say anything other than, in my experience on all my machines I love Flash, as there is nothing else I can say.
If Apple had worked closely with Adobe from Day 1, instead of having childish battles with them. I'm sure the excellent Apple and Adobe programmers could of made Flash run even better on a Mac than it does on a PC.
The whole this is like watching a bunch of children and is sad.
It's only the consumers that suffer in the end.
First of all, you are talking about PC/Mac, which are high-powered devices. The processors are very powerful, but these machines are usually kept plugged in. Tablets and other low-powered devices (i.e. mobile devices) are not meant to be kept plugged in all the time.
This is where Flash fails. Adobe so far cannot show Flash running successfully on a mobile device. Also, that "rich web experience" that people got through Flash in the forms of games and movies was made for PCs. Those Flash games were made for devices that use a mouse and a keyboard. They are not made for multi-touch devices.
As for Apple refusing to work with Adobe, that's not exactly true. It's not that Apple refused to work with Adobe. Back when the first iPhone came out in 2007, smartphones weren't very popular. Now, however, smartphones and other low-powered mobile devices are exploding. Yet, Adobe didn't care that Flash was excluded from the iPhone. This continued up until the iPad came out. When Apple excluded Flash from the iPad, that's when Adobe grabbed the bull by its horns. The iPad released in 2010, three years after the first iPhone. Within that timespan, tons of smartphones came to the market. Adobe still hadn't optimized Flash for mobile devices. In fact, the first mobile version of Flash player was released in the summer of 2010 for the Droid.
So it's not like Apple is refusing to work with Adobe. Adobe should have been able to foresee the trend. The "excellent Apple and Adobe programmers" could have definitely done something in three years time.