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Uh, that's subjective. Now, MS Office may be the most widely used, but BEST?? NO. Obviously you haven't tried Pages from the iWork suite. In terms of templates, feature set, it kicks the crap out of MS Word and Keynote is the Gold Standard in Presentation software. Keynote can eat Powerpoint for lunch. :p

Yes, and that is why Apple won the battle with Microsoft :D
 
Uh, that's subjective. Now, MS Office may be the most widely used, but BEST?? NO. Obviously you haven't tried Pages from the iWork suite. In terms of templates, feature set, it kicks the crap out of MS Word and Keynote is the Gold Standard in Presentation software. Keynote can eat Powerpoint for lunch. :p

keynote destroys powerpoint but i hate pages, word 08 is much better especially with the notebook layout
 
I remember back in the day I would carry an 8 lb Sager 15" most everywhere I went, which was a full 2" thick. These days the younger generation may turn up their noses, but let them walk 10 miles in the snow with an 8 lb laptop on their back like the good old days, yeah boy, that's what I'm talkin' 'bout...

I just don't get it. Now a days they aren't even satisfied with what would be a comfy laptop for a woman; nearly the same thickness as some netbooks. 1.3 inches is too thick they say. Sounds to me like an upcomming generation of what Ahnold would describe as girly men.

Eniac was pretty good for a backpack too, ahhh, they don't make them like they used to anymore...
 
It's really simple. Because in corporate world there are still tons of projectors that use this connector. The irony here is that MacBook Pros are for amateurs and PC laptops are for professionals ;)

Any projector bought in the last 5 years has DVI or HDMI ports.. And for those that don't - I'd rather a carry a small VGA dongle than ruin a perfectly good laptop with an ugly and useless VGA port.
 
Any projector bought in the last 5 years has DVI or HDMI ports.. And for those that don't - I'd rather a carry a small VGA dongle than ruin a perfectly good laptop with an ugly and useless VGA port.

So,

VGA port - ugly,
USB port - good
FireWire port - beautiful


Is not that stupid? Computer must have the ports in order to work. It's only Apple (and its fanatics) who might think that adding card reader, HDMI port or VGA port makes computer ugly. You know which computer would look really great? The one without any ports. And you do not have to wait too long for that. iPad is coming. :D
 
The problem with the Z is that as mighty as it is, it's gonna feel like a cheap piece of plastic. Believe it!

Also, the 16:9 screen does impact the viewing quality of portrait images.
 
So,

VGA port - ugly,
USB port - good
FireWire port - beautiful

Is not that stupid? Computer must have the ports in order to work. It's only Apple (and its fanatics) who might think that adding card reader, HDMI port or VGA port makes computer ugly. You know which computer would look really great? The one without any ports. And you do not have to wait too long for that. iPad is coming. :D

What's with the silly strawmen? No one said a laptop shouldn't have video-out port.. just not the one from the last century. A mini-DVI or HDMI out is perfectly compatible with old VGA projectors, and doesn't protrude out of a laptop like a wart.
 
So,

VGA port - ugly,
USB port - good
FireWire port - beautiful


Is not that stupid? Computer must have the ports in order to work. It's only Apple (and its fanatics) who might think that adding card reader, HDMI port or VGA port makes computer ugly. You know which computer would look really great? The one without any ports. And you do not have to wait too long for that. iPad is coming. :D

Look if you don't care about aesthetics at all in your life or your devices (or furniture, clothes etc.etc.) it's up to you, but I see no reason why you should tell others that they shouldn't either.

A badly placed ugly protruding vga port as placed near the hinge is an abomination for many users who have some basic aesthetic appreciation of a device. Even more so when it's absolutely non necessary seeing as it's by now a very old standard that offers no functionality other than the usual crass machismo showcased in many pc's that of adding a few tens of ports on the maxim that more is always better.

Well more isn't necessarily better, it can superfluous and detract from the aesthetics of a device. Sure enough apple's simplicity isn't the only aesthetic paradigm, but it's a damn good one and one that has been successful over the centuries in industrial or other design.

Also your classification, your mock classification of ports completely misses the point. Of course usb is better than vga, because it's far more practical and has far more applications. And unless usb 3.0 becomes mainstream really soon, firewire still completely trumps usb 2.0 in terms of technical design and transfer rates hence it's the de facto standard in pro music devices say. Even firewire 400 is well ahead of usb, so yes at the moment they are the most technologically advanced connections, I don't see what your beef is with that?

Also apple has been very wise in implementing the mini display port connection in their ultra portable notebooks (as they did with mini dvi) as it allow for a smaller form factor, I don't see what's wrong with that either.

But I guess it's the usual tired blah blah knee jerk bashing of apple on some unfounded reasoning...
 
Because it's a best office productivity suit on the market, and I am generally not religious about what products or software I use. And if that is your argument for Microsoft still being a monopoly (as you haven't given any others) - that's just weak.

Best is subjective. The other suites all have 1 glaring weakness : Problems opening MS Office documents.

And that is not my only argument, but you choose to dismiss everything as "not a monopoly", so there's no arguing with you. You're either very dense, very naive, or some kind of paid poster.

On this, I end this debate. I'm glad the world knows Microsoft is a monopoly and that it abuses its position to further its own goals, sometimes at the detriment of the entire industry. You being oblivious to all this changes nothing.

That's exactly what I'm saying...

So you're agreeing Apple is not a monopoly of any sort. Because the end result of Apple being a monopoly wouldn't be Adobe users going elsewhere, it would be the death of Adobe. Good, at least someone here still understands what is and isn't a monopoly.
 
OSX vd Windows 7 is a non issue for me as I find Windows 7 to be absolutely equal in terms of user experience. Im more interested in seeing how the overall construction of the laptop feels (reports seem to say it is very solid).
 
I've tried almost every brand, and every windows OS, and just don't like them. Does that make me or anyone like me fanboys?
No at all, the other option is 'insignificant minority'.

As soon as you stop regarding a computer, hardware or software, as a tool it becomes either evangelism, 'lifestyle choices' or both. Neither of which is conductive to making objective statements.
5) No iWork (= having to fork out for and use MS Office)
Might just be me but I find OpenOffice superior to both. And free. *shrug*

Of course I write papers in LaTeX anyway but sometimes it's handy to open obscure file formats or print images to file for boxing and inclusion as EPS graphics.
I don't know why every Windows laptop must ship with a nasty 1990's style VGA port.
VGA and HDMI is the absolutely best combination of ports there are for those that use their notebooks for actual work, as opposed to looking good at the local coffee shop.

Most projectors and older displays still use VGA while more modern ones rely on HDMI.

DisplayPort, on the other hand, is debatable on technical merits but pretty much a propriety Apple port as far as consumer devices go. I'm aware of one non-Apple product that uses it and the adapters aren't just an inconvenience but quite expensive as well.

(To avoid confusion here, I'm well aware that DisplayPort is an open standard. It's just not used by anyone outside Apple.)
For $4500...
It's not $4500, that's the signature edition which is a limited edition item for people with more money than sense.

It's $2600 or thereabouts and quite frankly worth it with those specs, the only thing missing is USB 3.
Check out that ugly vga port on the side too..uuuggghhh...
I call that '$100 saved on not having to buy an adapter for what amounts to an Apple-only interface when connecting to a projector'.
Of course usb is better than vga, because it's far more practical and has far more applications. And unless usb 3.0 becomes mainstream really soon, firewire still completely trumps usb 2.0 in terms of technical design and transfer rates hence it's the de facto standard in pro music devices say.
So let me get this straight...

USB is better than VGA because it's more versatile? Not that I feel it's a vaild comparison due to the nature of the ports but alright.

Firewire, however, is better than USB 2 on technical merits despite being significantly inferior in versatility even to VGA?

No offense but there's not much you can do at this point, whether intentional or not your arguments read as carbon-copies from the gospel of Jobs. If Apple uses it it's good, if not it's of the devil.

Arguably VGA is of lesser importance in a consumer- and aesthetics-centric notebook like the MBP, I'll buy that, but turning the argument around completely by then supporting Firewire on entirely opposing merits makes no sense at all.
 
one of the main reasons why I didn't recommend my brother to buy a 13" MBP was the display port. DVI would be much better, VGA is a added benefit. He needs to give talks and DVI ports are in 95% of projectors, 5% have VGA only. Matte screen was the other.

Sony understands this, Apple doesn't.
 
The problem with the Z is that as mighty as it is, it's gonna feel like a cheap piece of plastic. Believe it!

Also, the 16:9 screen does impact the viewing quality of portrait images.

Have you handled a previous Z? I used one for work and it was made from carbon fiber. It felt pretty stable and did not feel like a piece of cheap plastic. It did not, however, feel as great as my PowerBook G4. But it was still nice and solid. Built very well.
 
I've had the chance to play with a Sony Vaio Z. The founder of my company has one. It feels lightweight and works beautifully. I don't know how he spec'd it, though, I'll check the next time I have a chance.
 
No at all, the other option is 'insignificant minority'.

As soon as you stop regarding a computer, hardware or software, as a tool it becomes either evangelism, 'lifestyle choices' or both. Neither of which is conductive to making objective statements.


Evangalism? Conductive to making objective statements?

What in the world are you talking about? It's called personal preferance. I work with windows on a Dell computer 10 hours a day. My personal preference is Mac and it's Osx. If anyone can give an objective opinion, I can. If you and the "significant majority" don't have a problem with windows and like the experience good for you. Why then are you concerned about the "insignificant minority".
 
Apple make coffee shop computers because they won't include every port ever made on a portable and instead opt for new and better open standards...:rolleyes: We 've heard everything in these forums...tstststst..
 
On this, I end this debate. I'm glad the world knows Microsoft is a monopoly and that it abuses its position to further its own goals, sometimes at the detriment of the entire industry. You being oblivious to all this changes nothing.

There is no debate, as you haven't given any reasons as to why Microsoft is still in a monopoly in 2010. Your simply asserting that Microsoft is still a monopoly doesn't make it so either.

I can buy Dell or HP systems with Linux or OpenDOS.. I can buy Apple MacOS systems on commodity Intel hardware.. I can choose between 5 or 6 browsers on any platform of my choice. Microsoft no longer strong arms its suppliers into offering exclusively Windows. Microsoft no longer forces competing browsers out of Windows systems. Things change.

You can choose to ignore all the facts on the ground and keep your 1999 mindset. That just makes you look dense and oblivious to the actual reality (using your own words).
 
wow .. it looks like this whole thread is going to be microsoft vs apple battle or it shall be Sony SZ vs apple macbook pro !

some of you argue that osx make the difference so .. you spend 1500usd for an OS ?

sorry but, even if the SZ is more expensive that macbook pro, the specs of the SZ is ..WAW really , outstanding !.. if apple , and i hope for us they does , upgrade the mpb in this way they gonna win , because at equal performance, the design and osx make the difference but only at equal performance .. !

osx and the design do not justify the overpriced mbp for those perfs..and if apple do not move his ass and upgrade the mbp , especially the 13' one , i will buy the SZ and a lot of people are going to


ps : not a native english speaker .
 
So you're agreeing Apple is not a monopoly of any sort.

Way to twist words... I never was talking about monopolies but if you insist, Apple has a monopoly on the approval process of apps on the iphone but somehow they're getting away with it right now. Anyways, the point I was agreeing with you on was that Apple is burning bridges with other companies and developers can't be good in the long run.
 
wow .. it looks like this whole thread is going to be microsoft vs apple battle or it shall be Sony SZ vs apple macbook pro !

some of you argue that osx make the difference so .. you spend 1500usd for an OS ?

sorry but, even if the SZ is more expensive that macbook pro, the specs of the SZ is ..WAW really , outstanding !.. if apple , and i hope for us they does , upgrade the mpb in this way they gonna win , because at equal performance, the design and osx make the difference but only at equal performance .. !

osx and the design do not justify the overpriced mbp for those perfs..and if apple do not move his ass and upgrade the mbp , especially the 13' one , i will buy the SZ and a lot of people are going to



ps : not a native english speaker .

Oh boy. Not another one of these "If Apple doesn't ... then i'm going to buy xyz" post. If that's how you and others feel, then good for you. You are entitled to get whatever you like. Good luck with it.

Let me be careful, or I will be accused of stifling discussion, or being an evangelist.

I believe if Apple bumped up the specs, all you who are crying for more specs will find something to complain about. Price, etc.
 
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