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You don't own the OS; Apple does. And you use it under the, agreed upon, Terms and Conditions. If you want to use your phone without iOS. . .

The hardware is locked to the software and Apple does not give away their firmware code. What do I do now? Other than let EU fairly regulate what is a world dominating phone provider, that is.
 
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This still won't get me to sign up for a music service when I already have Apple Music which offers as many songs as Spotify. Second reason I can't see all my subscriptions in 1 place, I don't want to go to every app vendors website to see if I'm signed up there or not. For those that say well you do it for every other vendor out there, if I could find a way to have them all in one place I would. My bank provides this where I can ebill and pay right from there and I don't have to worry about it. What 100% sucks is all the vendors who say do automatic billing through our site and we'll give you a 5% discount. WHY you are getting paid every month regardless if I do ebill and automatic payments it's the same thing. They want your bank info or credit card number so they feel better. Sorry I don't trust Spotify or anyone else with my banking information. Sucks they are getting a free ride on the App Store. For all these vendors I think apple should start charging a monthly developer fee MUCH higher than today to recoup the costs they are losing because these guys want a free ride. Use App Store and IAP get developer for free or reduced cost. Don't use IAP your monthly developer costs are 10% monthly sales. Have fun kids.
 
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I choose Apple hand-holding. Freely. With zero coercion. Apple doesn't have a police force. They don't have an army. They can't force me to do anything, unlike Government.

But that I have to explain that is a big part of the problem on these threads. Some people want authoritarian government to protect them from their choices. I want government to trust me with my choices.

No, to be clear I do not want government intervention, either. But the reason the government is involved in the first place is that far more than one developer has complained to the government asking for intervention. And Apple has done very little to actually stop that intervention, whether they think so or not. They think they are fighting the good fight, but they are being too stubborn.

The way to stop the government intervention that neither of us want is to give just a little, so the government doesn’t take a lot.
 
You do have a choice; don't buy an iPhone.
Maybe one like iPhone and iOS and Mac and macOS best overall, but don't like some aspects and rules Apple has set that could hopefully be changed?

I like macOS more than Windows, but I think there are a few things that are handled better in Windows.
I like iOS and it works well with macOS, but I stil think some aspects seem to be handled better on Android.
 
The hardware is locked to the software and Apple does not give away their firmware code. What do I do now? Other than let EU fairly regulate what is a world dominating phone provider, that is.
"Fairly" 😂😂😂 Sure, ok.

By the way...aimlessly defending power hungry politicians is also suspiciously strange. If yours are anything like mine...you don't mean squat to them until campaigning time starts up. Outside of that time...they couldn't care less about what you think or want. They aren't going to give you a break on your taxes for kissing their butts. They aren't doing this for the consumer benefit. Spotify, Meta, and Epic stand to gain the most from this. These billion dollar corporations thank you for your support.
 
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On iOS there is only one App Store so you don’t have a choice hence
Not having a choice that’s why iOS is getting opened up
That's like saying that at a Costco or Trader Joe's, they only sell certain products and I want them to sell XYZ, If you don't like what the store is selling, go to another store. Or in this particular case, if you don't like the terms of iOS, buy a different device.
 
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You trust Apple with unlimited power rather than a union that is voted in and out regularly?
Tell me you are American without telling me you are American.
Did I say I trust Apple more? No, I don't believe I did. I don't trust ANYONE with unlimited power. Even if they're elected! Is that clear enough?
 
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No, to be clear I do not want government intervention, either. But the reason the government is involved in the first place is that far more than one developer has complained to the government asking for intervention. And Apple has done very little to actually stop that intervention, whether they think so or not. They think they are fighting the good fight, but they are being too stubborn.

The way to stop the government intervention that neither of us want is to give just a little, so the government doesn’t take a lot.
So if I complain about any corporation selling consumer products that a company is not allowing me to do certain things and we get x signatures, I can be assured of regulations coming in the future to remedy my beefs?
 
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So if I complain about any corporation selling consumer products that a company is not allowing me to do certain things and we get x signatures, I can be assured of regulations coming in the future to remedy my beefs?

Depends if the corporation is abusing it's market position like Apple is.
 
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"Fairly" 😂😂😂 Sure, ok.

By the way...aimlessly defending power hungry politicians is also suspiciously strange. If yours are anything like mine...you don't mean squat to them until campaigning time starts up. Outside of that time...they couldn't care less about what you think or want. They aren't going to give you a break on your taxes for kissing their butts. They aren't doing this for the consumer benefit. Spotify, Meta, and Epic stand to gain the most from this. These billion dollar corporations thank you for your support.

The EU thanks you for yours. They spent all your tax money on cheese and tech regulation. 👍
 
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Thank you to the EU for USB-C and hopefully giving alternatives to the APP store payments. I think 30% is crazy, and you know we all pay the price for it. Greed has kept me away from the APP store for almost 10 years. Almost every app is a subscription.
 
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That's like saying that at a Costco or Trader Joe's, they only sell certain products and I want them to sell XYZ, If you don't like what the store is selling, go to another store. Or in this particular case, if you don't like the terms of iOS, buy a different device.
Don’t have to thanks to the European Union
 
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Exactly. Buying an iPhone is DECIDING to live in a gated community.

Disagree as the effects of living in the gated community are mostly felt by developers/other companies rather than the user purchasing the phone. Ask your regular iPhone user if they're in a gated community and most won't even know what you're on about, this is not a concisous decision for the vast majority of users.

What Apple does have though is a platform that over a billion people in the world use. And with that comes responsibility.

I see nothing wrong with having the option to remain in the gated community, with it being the default. But if you're one of the two major mobile operating systems you should be able to purchase apps and load them on your device elsewhere if you wish to do so. You should be able to subscribe in apps without Apple taking a cut.

This was the norm until the iPhone App Store launched and is how the Mac operates perfectly happily to this day. With a Mac you purchase the hardware and you can then load onto it what you like. There is zero argument for not giving the user the choice other than greed on Apple's part.
 
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I do struggle a bit to understand why Apple thinks this is so important for iOS but not macOS?
But of course less subscriptions and apps and stuff on macOS and less money to be lost, perhaps?

Because people would stop buying Macs if they were as locked down as iPhones. Because iPhones have always been locked down, people don't see anything wrong with it.
 
so jealous of the EU. it's silly that i can't see prices in app, get charged more for subscribing in the app versus the website, and actually having to go to the website to buy things.

apple is too greedy and ruining the experience of users. they are making it awkward to use certain apps just so they can make more money.
You don't understand the situation everything has a processing fee. It's why some gas station (only example the freely comes to mind) have prices that are different if you pay cash vs paying with card.

Its completely up to the app owner/gas station if they pay said fee or pass it along to you.

It's up to you to look at one of those gas station and go yeah if you are that cheap I'll just go to 90% of other gas stations that absorb the cost.
 
You don't understand the situation everything has a processing fee. It's why some gas station (only example the freely comes to mind) have prices that are different if you pay cash vs paying with card.

Its completely up to the app owner/gas station if they pay said fee or pass it along to you.

It's up to you to look at one of those gas station and go yeah if you are that cheap I'll just go to 90% of other gas stations that absorb the cost.

Can you explain why this isn’t the case on the Mac then?
 
Can you explain why this isn’t the case on the Mac then?
It's the model. You want to shop at Sams Club you pay a membership fee. You are 100% allowed to shop at Walmart and not pay a fee. They are owned by the same people.

I 100% promise you anything you buy on your mac there is someone processing the transaction and there are fees. Where those fees are and who's paying them varies.

Spotify like the dude who owns the cruddy gas station thinks it's wrong and passes the cost to the consumer.

Even if tomorrow Apple got zero from Spotify you would pay the same price. Spotify also wouldn't get 30% back because there is no way to process billing transactions for "free" they might pay 10% to johnny's payments and he might be a secure processor he might not be who knows. All I know is Spotify isn't passing any savings to you. Any illusion they are charging more or less is basically just them trying to get out of paying fees and making it look like Apple is doing something different than everyone else. Once they win they will likely celebrate with a rate hike honestly.
 
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