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Steve Jobs on Lack of Firewire in MacBooks

Among-Us said:
Ive used alot of devices not one has been firewire im glad there taking it out because i would love to have another usb plug where my firewire is,and firewire in the macbook(white,black)is slower then usb 2.0 right??and fire wire is used for movie people right?
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So.. you love that they have taken FW out because you would like another USB instead, but why are you happy? They haven't replaced FW with anything -_-

And no, even FW400 is way faster than USB 2.0, among other clear advantages, which make FW irreplaceable for some uses.
 
I never use the firewire port on my MacBook anyway, so I have nothing to complain about. Because its slower than USB 2.0, I think its a good decision. But, what I would love to see from Apple in the next update of the new MacBook's, is the new USB 3.0, which is supposed to be a lot faster.
 
Don't know if this has been mentioned before but this is just another case of betamax and vhs

FW is easily more superior, but just doesn't appear as often on devices thus more expensive to produce

as for those who don't believe they own a FW device.... then you don't own a mac, a very handy yet underrated feature on a mac is the 'Target Disk Mode', it treats the mac device as a storage disk and allow you to modify it from a different terminal

this can only be done with firewire because of the standardised male male cables as opposed to usb where jack A to jack A are hard to find
 
alexbates said:
firewire.. its slower than USB 2.0
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Incorrect. Only the official burst speed is faster on usb 2, but sustained speeds are much faster over firewire. And from what I've read, in the real world you're never even gonna see close to the officially published USB speed. In the real world, firewire demolishes usb 2's speed.
 
alexbates said:
I never use the firewire port on my MacBook anyway, so I have nothing to complain about. Because its slower than USB 2.0, I think its a good decision. But, what I would love to see from Apple in the next update of the new MacBook's, is the new USB 3.0, which is supposed to be a lot faster.
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:rolleyes: Why do some people post in threads they didn't even bother to read?
 
robanga said:
Is this because that bad old USB2 is so vastly inferior to FW when writing to an external hard drive? Is your average user really going to notice a difference or even care?

Really I see some difference on my FW drives in transferring video and audio files, but that is it, and it is not exactly like moving that data via USB is painful or anything. I have time machine backups going to both FW drives and USB drives. For moving most files I can not see a difference.
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What a heck is the chipset in these 's-l-o-w as USB' Firewire enclosures of your's? :D
 
motulist said:
In the real world, firewire demolishes usb 2's speed.
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I wouldn't call 10% faster "demolishes" - at least that's what I see with Seagate drives/enclosures with eSATA/USB2.0/1394a interfaces. Sustained transfers (spiral reads/writes) about 10% faster with 1394a over USB2.0.

By the way, you don't want to hear how much faster 3Gbps eSATA is compared to 1394 -- you just don't want to know until The Steve puts some eSATA ports on an Apple.

Of course, he'll use some proprietary micro-eSATA connector that's only compatible with the new micro-eSATA Time Machine. :eek: </sarcasm>
 
AidenShaw said:
I wouldn't call 10% faster "demolishes" - at least that's what I see with Seagate drives/enclosures with eSATA/USB2.0/1394a interfaces. Sustained transfers (spiral reads/writes) about 10% faster with 1394a over USB2.0.

By the way, you don't want to hear how much faster 3Gbps eSATA is compared to 1394 -- you just don't want to know until The Steve puts some eSATA ports on an Apple.

Of course, he'll use some proprietary micro-eSATA connector that's only compatible with the new micro-eSATA Time Machine. :eek: </sarcasm>
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My God, it wont be for the last time someone has to clear this up but let me reiterate... its not so much about the fastest speed of firewire over USB2 reaches its about the steady transfer rate.

Theres a reason why all the best audio interfaces-read 'soundcards'-use firewire instead of USB. Its because it is much better at sustained transfer speeds, and as others have noted does not use hardly any CPU cycles. If you try a USB card and youre doing anything remotely taxing you get drop-outs, pops and clicks. Its terrible. It is not legacy, thats why they put it on the new MBP. Apple has just decided to designate it a 'pro' feature when you can get 4-pin firewire on MANY $400 and up windows laptops. Its mega annoying.
 
Among-Us said:
Ive used alot of devices not one has been firewire im glad there taking it out because i would love to have another usb plug where my firewire is,and firewire in the macbook(white,black)is slower then usb 2.0 right??and fire wire is used for movie people right?
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And music people and those who want a quick way to transfer files from one Mac to another, especially in case of an emergency. A couple other things. First, USB2.0 has a higher theoretical speed, but since it has to use the system's CPU instead of a dedicated chip like firewire, it can't keep it up except for in burst. In the real world firewire has a higher sustained rate. Second, you didn't get that third USB port, you got a case that three and a half millimeters thinner.
 
eXan said:
alexbates said:
I never use the firewire port on my MacBook anyway, so I have nothing to complain about. Because its slower than USB 2.0, I think its a good decision. But, what I would love to see from Apple in the next update of the new MacBook's, is the new USB 3.0, which is supposed to be a lot faster.
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:rolleyes: Why do some people post in threads they didn't even bother to read?
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Especially at a stage when the thread already contains 2000+ posts. Repeated statements such as "usb 2 is faster than firewire" and "I've never used firewire so it's no loss" are just irritatingly ignorant/stupid and contribute nothing to the discussion. I wonder what they think was mentioned in the first 2000 posts... geez
 
Good god

alexbates said:
I never use the firewire port on my MacBook anyway, so I have nothing to complain about. Because its slower than USB 2.0, I think its a good decision. But, what I would love to see from Apple in the next update of the new MacBook's, is the new USB 3.0, which is supposed to be a lot faster.
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Except that USB shares the system bus, while FW doesn't. Christ man.
 
eXan said:
:rolleyes: Why do some people post in threads they didn't even bother to read?
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Good question.

hugo7 said:
Especially at a stage when the thread already contains 2000+ posts. Repeated statements such as "usb 2 is faster than firewire" and "I've never used firewire so it's no loss" are just irritatingly ignorant/stupid and contribute nothing to the discussion.
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Agree.

As for those who mention eSATA, until it is self powered, I don't get too excited. Currently I can use FW800. Only need a connection cable for a 2.5 inch HD. Don't need a power adapter which is nice. Plus you connect at FW800 speeds.
 
Add me to mac users unhappy about this decision. FW, while I don't use it as much, is absolutely essential - especially target disk mode, I couldn't tell you how many times I've used it to salvage information over the years. I think it's really a shame. I've only just recently seen the new macbooks - they're very nice and desirable, predictably, but I will just have to wait a bit longer to save up for a macbook pro model.
 
I missed Firewire immediately with my new Macbook. I tried to migrate files and data using the network - wouldn't work, either with ethernet or Airport. After a day of messing around with it, I finally gave up and constructed a Time Machine backup of my old Macbook. Using that did work but it took two tries because the first time it hung in the middle. Nice going, Apple.
 
Eric S. said:
I missed Firewire immediately with my new Macbook. I tried to migrate files and data using the network - wouldn't work, either with ethernet or Airport. After a day of messing around with it, I finally gave up and constructed a Time Machine backup of my old Macbook. Using that did work but it took two tries because the first time it hung in the middle. Nice going, Apple.
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Welcomw to the windowsification of the mac for the iPod user.
 
This may have been mentioned before and I'm not going to read all the posts to find out (sorry) but here is my theory:

I think Apple have removed FW from the MacBook to discourage MacBook Pro customers from buying MacBooks. After all if you can tempt old MacBook customers up in price to the new model then you risk tempting old MacBook Pro customers down in price to the new MacBook too. I know there are many other spec differences besides the lack of FW but I think this is one spec change which would put off many MB Pro customers without putting off all that many MacBook customers, especially first time MacBook customers who don't yet have any investment in FW peripherals. Also, as has been mentioned before, there is always the White MacBook for those on a tight budget who simply can't live without FW.

If this has been suggested before (and I'd be surprised if it hasn't) then apologies and all due credit to the original poster.

Cheers,
Craig.
 
craig1410 said:
This may have been mentioned before and I'm not going to read all the posts to find out (sorry) but here is my theory:

I think Apple have removed FW from the MacBook to discourage MacBook Pro customers from buying MacBooks. After all if you can tempt old MacBook customers up in price to the new model then you risk tempting old MacBook Pro customers down in price to the new MacBook too. I know there are many other spec differences besides the lack of FW but I think this is one spec change which would put off many MB Pro customers without putting off all that many MacBook customers, especially first time MacBook customers who don't yet have any investment in FW peripherals. Also, as has been mentioned before, there is always the White MacBook for those on a tight budget who simply can't live without FW.

If this has been suggested before (and I'd be surprised if it hasn't) then apologies and all due credit to the original poster.

Cheers,
Craig.
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And it might backfire and discourage said users from buying a Macbook at all. These are not iPod switchers or cultists who will follow Apple without question here, but informed users who know their own needs and don't appreciate Apple trying to take advantage of their past loyalty.

sushi said:
Agree.

I would encourage all individuals who want FW on the MB to politely write SJ and provide feedback on the lack of Firewire on the MB.
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I don't think that would do any good. This is the same man who kept Radeons out of the PowerMac g4 (and users hands) for a couple months as punishment for accidentally leaking that they would be an option before MWNY 2000. He may be a product and marketing genius, but there is barely enough space on this planet to hold his ego.
 
Instead of writing him, why wouldn't you just spend the extra 1k on a MBP? He's not gonna care if you switch over to another company because he knows that everybody in your family is giving everybody else an iPod and he's rolling in the money. Writing him isn't going to get him to change it so just pony up the $1000 and stop drinking your Starbuck's for a week.
 
Santyman said:
Instead of writing him, why wouldn't you just spend the extra 1k on a MBP? He's not gonna care if you switch over to another company because he knows that everybody in your family is giving everybody else an iPod and he's rolling in the money. Writing him isn't going to get him to change it so just pony up the $1000 and stop drinking your Starbuck's for a week.
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Thank you for such a thoughtful and intelligent post. :rolleyes:
 
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