Steve Jobs Suggests Blu-ray Not Coming to Mac Anytime Soon

[trip1ex]

Oh, come on, now. That is such a red-herring argument that it is laughable.

I want my thousands of dollars worth of computer equipment to do things that are reasonable to expect it to do. Something that less expensive equipment from other competing manufacturers ALREADY do... but they don't use Mac OS.

It is not arrogance to want the OPTION to continue to use Mac OS, but also be able to use BluRay. That is prudence, for not wanting to have to spend hundreds more for a stationary-use single-purpose dedicated player, for something that a more advanced, more versatile device, such as a COMPUTER, should be able to do.

No product is perfect, but I am not asking for perfection. I am asking for reasonable versatility and not obvious and large dis-advantages, where there doesn't NEED to be disadvantages. EGO is the only thing blocking bluRay compatibility with Apple computers.

There is no technical reason that prevents it. If there were a technical reason that it would be IMPOSSIBLE, I could understand that. It isn't that they can't. It is that they WON'T.

I don't have a bluRay player. I don't even have a flat TV. But I would like to get one at some point. And I would like to get a Mac Mini to drive it, without having to buy another device that has to be switched in and out of the audio and video systems, but rather just natively accept a disc and play it.

this sort of proprietary bullcrap game-playing and incompatibility between part A and part B, and requiring part C instead... is exactly what has me un-interested in spending thousands of dollars on today's equipment, and what has me wishing that companies would gain some common sense, and put out some truly versatile equipment that would appeal enough to me, to get me to purchase it.

I don't adopt new tech just for new tech's sake. I adopt it when it presents a useful, and valuable, and compatible upgrade scheme, and I am confident that I will be pleased with the new standards, not dissappointed that the new standards all generate convoluted compatibility issues.

Apple doesn't put tech in its machines for tech's sake either. Hence no BR.

Obviously they have bet on digital downloads/streaming being the future and that the future will come soon enough ( and is here already) that they can ignore BR.

I know some just hate that decision, but if it is a show stopper for you I guess you won't be purchasing another Mac.

 

[dgree03]

Can you not read?

C.

Sorry I miss read, but yes Housing places are starting to Store in Bluray, the self life on Bluray exceed HD storage life. I even know of one that is converting its old tapes and films and storing them on BD, Taking one storage rake of MGM movies from the late 50's(holds about 50 reels) and storing them ALL on one BD disc.

 

[KnightWRX]

Apple doesn't put tech in its machines for tech's sake either. Hence no BR.

Obviously they have bet on digital downloads/streaming being the future and that the future will come soon enough ( and is here already) that they can ignore BR.

Wait, it's here ? Might want to tell my ISP.

 

[Speedy2]

However, Blu-Ray as an enthusiast format, gotta say, it dosn't look like that to me. When DVD came out, a lot of people said that VHS was good enough and DVD was only for enthuasiasts, look how that turned out.

Really? You must have been living on an island. Everyone literally hated VHS, and DVD was welcomed with a lot of enthusiasm.
DVD has so many other advantages over VHS other than picture quality that people even accepted that fact that recording was not available for a long time.

BluRay on the other hand simply delivers a better picture quality and introduces whole bunch of new restrictions (e.g. it only works with HDMI and it cannot be copied). It will of course replace the DVD simply because there won't be much of a price difference soon, but it will never achieve the same success. In 5-10 years time, it will start to be replaced by something that is digital-only (streaming, downloads, whatever)

Until then, Apple will not support it and you'll have to buy something from another company.

 

[Carniphage]

No, you don't. Do I have to repost that graph from a few pages back ? 5-8 feet away, a 40" TV will have a very noticeable difference in quality between 480p, 720p and 1080p.

That's my favourite graph. It shows very clearly that if you sit 12" away from a regular 46" TV - you are getting 720p. You have to get way closer to get the benefit of 1080p.

Personally, I don't think sitting 5 feet away from a 4 foot screen is comfortable or normal.

C.

 

[trip1ex]

You're 100% right.

BluRay + HD is an enthusiast toy and most people just don't give enough **** to spend a lot of $$$ on it. Flat screen TVs became a success not because of HD but because they allow huge screens without weighing half a ton and because they look great (ask a woman). Most people I know with flatscreen TVs don't even own a BluRay player and their cable package is not HD either. Yet they still enjoy their TV shows and movies because they care more for the actual content and not the resolution or the last bit of sound quality.

What most people forget: Apple and SJ don't give a rat's ass about some enthusiast niche that loves to count pixels and hears a difference between cheap ass cables and golden super-expensive voodoo crap. They look at the mass market and they see that most people were extremely fine with accepting a less-than-CD-quality audio format because it's so much more convenient and GOOD ENOUGH. Same will happen for movies. No one but a few loud pixel counters cares about 1080p, 3D, THX and all that stuff.

I don't get all the rage. It's not that Apple will make BluRay disappear and take away their toys. They just won't support it, get over it. You have PLENTY of other companies that cater to your needs.

Exactly.

 

[leekohler]

Look, another kool-aid drinker that argued himself in a corner and would rather look foolish than admit he's wrong.

And you told me to put the coffee down?

You need to can it with the insults.

 

[KnightWRX]

Really? You must have been living on an island. Everyone literally hated VHS, and DVD was welcomed with a lot of enthusiasm.
DVD has so many other advantages over VHS other than picture quality that people even accepted that fact that recording was not available for a long time.

BluRay on the other hand simply delivers a better picture quality and introduces whole bunch of new restrictions (e.g. it only works with HDMI and it cannot be copied). It will of course replace the DVD simply because there won't be much of a price difference soon, but it will never achieve the same success. In 5-10 years time, it will start to be replaced by something that is digital-only (streaming, downloads, whatever)

Until then, Apple will not support it and you'll have to buy something from another company.

DVD when it came out couldn't be copied either. DVD is encrypted. To rip it and re-encode to another format, you need to break the encryption. This is what DeCSS does. This is why the guy who wrote DeCSS got dragged into court and lost his case under the provisions of the DMCA. The courts didn't buy that DeCSS was an interop measure that fell under the provisions of the DMCA that allow such tools.

Blu-ray is seeing a faster adoption rate than DVD did. It's now at 35% adoption, 5 years after its introduction. DVD was 32% 5 years into its lifetime.

And you told me to put the coffee down?

You need to can it with the insults.

You need to cool it. Drinking kool-aid is not an insult, I used to drink the stuff as a kid.

It's a flavorful beverage full of sugar. Some people like the Steve Jobs flavor, too bad it seems to induce vomitting.

That's my favourite graph. It shows very clearly that if you sit 12" away from a regular 46" TV - you are getting 720p. You have to get way closer to get the benefit of 1080p.

Personally, I don't think sitting 5 feet away from a 4 foot screen is comfortable or normal.

C.

Look at the floor plan for your house or appartment, not many TVs sit much farther than 8' away. At that distance, 1080p is very noticeable according to that same graph.

 

[cube]

You can sit 1 meter away from a 23" monitor and enjoy Full HD.

 

[leekohler]

You're 100% right.

BluRay + HD is an enthusiast toy and most people just don't give enough **** to spend a lot of $$$ on it. Flat screen TVs became a success not because of HD but because they allow huge screens without weighing half a ton and because they look great (ask a woman). Most people I know with flatscreen TVs don't even own a BluRay player and their cable package is not HD either. Yet they still enjoy their TV shows and movies because they care more for the actual content and not the resolution or the last bit of sound quality.

What most people forget: Apple and SJ don't give a rat's ass about some enthusiast niche that loves to count pixels and hears a difference between cheap ass cables and golden super-expensive voodoo crap. They look at the mass market and they see that most people were extremely fine with accepting a less-than-CD-quality audio format because it's so much more convenient and GOOD ENOUGH. Same will happen for movies. No one but a few loud pixel counters cares about 1080p, 3D, THX and all that stuff.

I don't get all the rage. It's not that Apple will make BluRay disappear and take away their toys. They just won't support it, get over it. You have PLENTY of other companies that cater to your needs.

Exactly- and this is the bottom line. The average person does not give a crap about 1080p and Blu-ray- they just want to watch movies.

 

[cube]

Exactly- and this is the bottom line. The average person does not give a crap about 1080p and Blu-ray- they just want to watch movies.

The average person also accepts Windows.

 

[leekohler]

The average person also accepts Windows.

Which proves my point.

You need to cool it. Drinking kool-aid is not an insult, I used to drink the stuff as a kid.

It's a flavorful beverage full of sugar. Some people like the Steve Jobs flavor, too bad it seems to induce vomitting.

Keep it up. You've been reported.

 

[LethalWolfe]

I have never heard of a large facility using BluRay as an archive format.
Most places I know of keep live project on Raid arrays and archive onto tapes. Smaller places archive on Firewire drives etc.

But that said 3rd party BluRay drives *are* available as an archive format on Macs.

C.

Many shows, for example, are shooting and mastering on Sony's XDCAM HD format (which is basically Blu-ray in a protective sleeve). On the industry sites I go to I'm seeing more and more people talking about data tape, Blu-ray and even cloud-based solutions for archiving as file based formats and workflows are becoming more common and leaving people w/o a master tape to go back to. If someone has no other choice than to use HDDs for long term storage then at the very least they should be stored in mirrored pairs and spun up every few months to ensure they still work. SSDs can't hit the right price-per-gig point soon enough, IMO.


Lethal

 

[cube]

Which proves my point.

We don't accept Windows. We don't accept less than Blu Ray or HD DVD.

 

[aaaaaaron]

The average person also accepts Windows.

more blu ray love.

why does everyone who doesn't want blu ray keep crying about getting it? don't get it, pretty simple right?

If it is ever given to us as an option, which i hope it will be, don't buy it and keep on downloading content. this thread is not about downloading content, it's about getting blu ray. go start your "i only want downloadable content" thread, cheer and hug each other for having the same tastes, and leave us [who want blu ray] alone.

thanks

 

[iSlave]

Simple really, get a PC. All the blu-ray you want at at least 50% of the price, not to mention the endless choice of hardware.

Windows? Yeah, boo hoo. Beats paying through the nose to get dictated to.

 

[aaaaaaron]

I have never heard of a large facility using BluRay as an archive format.

probably because their mac doesn't have a blu ray drive....

 

[Reddkryten]

Really? You must have been living on an island. Everyone literally hated VHS, and DVD was welcomed with a lot of enthusiasm.

Everyone literally, that wasn't my experience at all, from what I remember, most average consumers thought VHS was a fine format and didn't see a problem.

The people I remember who hated VHS were all enthusiasts. Most average consumers didn't even know that films on VHS had been panned and scanned.

 

[leekohler]

We don't accept Windows. We don't accept less than Blu Ray or HD DVD.

Apparently, that's not the case per this thread.

 

[aaaaaaron]

Keep it up. You've been reported.

be careful, watch out when he gets mad....

 

[Speedy2]

We don't accept Windows. We don't accept less than Blu Ray or HD DVD.

How many are "you" ?

 

[leekohler]

be careful, watch out when he gets mad....

Being mad has nothing to do with it. I'm not even the least bit angry. But calling people Kool-Aid drinkers and such is a direct insult. People need to learn to disagree without name-calling. That's the rules here.

 

[cube]

Apparently, that's not the case per this thread.

Fanboy is not equivalent to Mac user.

 

[dgree03]

Exactly- and this is the bottom line. The average person does not give a crap about 1080p and Blu-ray- they just want to watch movies.

So why is Blu-ray adoption rate faster than DVD?!

 

[sishaw]

Jobs is going to ditch the optical drive altogether. That's one reason he isn't going BR.

+1. I think he's looking toward Apple being the dominant content distributor for HD downloads and doesn't want Blu-ray as a competing option on Mac products. He ultimately wants every Mac owner to get their entertainment content from the iTunes store.

A few things have to happen for that to work--1080p downloads, an easy way to connect to a high-def TV (well, the Mini just got an HDMI port, so I guess that's solved), and agreements with the studios for ALL their content to be distributed over the Internet, which they seem to be reluctant to do.