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I'd rather call people uneducated who fall for the corporate "1080p is absolutely necessary and you can't live without HD Audio" crap. Some people just don't care, you need to accept that or you are the stubborn one here.

I totally accept that some people just don't care. I don't accept other people telling me that it shouldn't be an option just because they don't use it. That's a big distinction.

Yea I agree, its not like there are no other choices out there.

I just think people's mentality is more on the line of, "oh other PC's got bluray" so I should have the shiny as well!

Its more of I got it in my machine too and its there, so its good.

I know we had the debate about being out and about and watching a bluray movie is all fine and dandy but honestly I would think that bluray would be more important in a more theatre atmosphere where its really needed as to a small portable machine that can get you just as satisfied with a 720p content.

There are other choices... what is a legitimate reason for not offering it as a choice for Mac?
 
I totally accept that some people just don't care. I don't accept other people telling me that it shouldn't be an option just because they don't use it. That's a big distinction.

There are other choices... what is a legitimate reason for not offering it as a choice for Mac?

Very much agree!

Yep he has a PS3 at home and a Mac for on the road....but what happens if he wants to watch the same film. Should he buy two copies? I only own one copy of A Single Man, on Blu-Ray. If I want to watch that on a Macbook, should I go out and spend more money on a lower quality version I don't really need?

Netflix streaming also has a problem, bandwidth and availability. I've stayed in hotels with horrible/nonexistant wifi.

Admittedly my analogy is overly dramatic, how about this you can have an engine without a car, or a car without an engine? That more appropriate?

Not overly dramatic. These issues seriously hamper the adoption of online options. The insane limit of one machine for rentals and no CC (closed caption - the fact that this has not been addressed is deplorable) on films and all TV shows are even more reasons why Apple should at least offer a BTO option and include a BR-capable CODEC.

Cheers,

Well if you already bought the copy and watched the movie at home, why would you want to watch the same movie again on the road! I'd much rather watch something new.

snip

Uh duh! That's why we bought the movie or TV series! To watch it whenever we want, repeatedly if we want and on whatever device we want!

Cheers,
 
apple is a hardware company who I purchase products from, that is all. They do not have the right to dictate how many times I can watch a certain film, weather I watch the film once, twice or a thousand times, it is my decision.

But yet your trying to dictate to them what they should sell? Since when do you run apple?
 
Yea I agree, its not like there are no other choices out there.

I just think people's mentality is more on the line of, "oh other PC's got bluray" so I should have the shiny as well!

Its more of I got it in my machine too and its there, so its good.

I know we had the debate about being out and about and watching a bluray movie is all fine and dandy but honestly I would think that bluray would be more important in a more theatre atmosphere where its really needed as to a small portable machine that can get you just as satisfied with a 720p content.

Are you having a different discussion than the rest of the people on here? What people are saying is they ALREADY OWN BD's. So, they want to take the content they ALREADY OWN on the road with their laptop. Not have to buy separate DVD just for travel and spend more money.

It's not about "the shinny" aspect as you put it. It's about me being an OSX user and not having the ability to use the stacks of BD's on my shelf on the road or anywhere outside my living room where my PS3 is.

Seriously, how hard is this to understand?
 
I'd rather call people uneducated who fall for the corporate "1080p is absolutely necessary and you can't live without HD Audio" crap. Some people just don't care, you need to accept that or you are the stubborn one here.

Or you can always d/l flac audio.
 
This only proves that Jobs is in fact a LIAR. He said the reason for no support was that licensing was a "bag of hurt" and that is clearly no longer true AT ALL. It's a tiny fraction of the cost of a machine and well worth it for many people. Newer Macs have the required security checks to output the video so that's not an issue either. This is about ONE thing and that is that Steve wants your money going to the iTunes store and nowhere else. He doesn't give a crap what *YOU* want in a computer. It's all about his pocket book and that's a load of horse manure. Computers are supposed to serve the user, not Steve Jobs. If I want to buy a Blu-Ray drive for my Mac, I should be able to do so and I should be able to use it. Steve deciding I don't need one is just a load of ego and profit driven BULLCRAP (and I may very well not want Blu-Ray; it's besides the point. This should be a consumer decision, not a corporate decision).

I am increasingly of the opinion that Apple's "Mac" future is doomed and that Apple will be increasingly a toy company catering to phones and other gadgets and once the competition catches up (Android is doing so very rapidly these days), Apple will literally be DONE as a company. It will be 1998 all over again. Steve's vision doesn't matter once everyone else copies it. And unfortunately for Apple, that is EXACTLY what happened to the Mac the first time around. Windows copied the basic interface and the rest is history. People don't pay more for less forever. It just doesn't happen. With Blu-Ray Apple is saying "we don't want to be a part of the future; we want to dictate the future to you" and that might as well be middle finger to the consumer's desires of how they might want to use their own computers. Notice how he mentions "rentals" (yet you cannot rent 99% of HD material except with Apple TV which most people do not have) and not buying movies (because you cannot buy what they do not offer; Apple has almost NO HD movies to buy!!! That is not going to change. Hollywood is on to Steve and they are refusing to play his game and they are doing it by not offering their titles for sale in HD on iTunes). So while Steve plays this "Blu-Ray is dying" line of BS, where is his alternative? You cannot buy movies in HD from Apple (save a couple dozen titles, over half of which are total CRAP b-movie junk). So Mac users are left with NO HD.

I mean honestly, if you seriously believe that Steve will keep the "Mac" alive in the long run because of any kind of logic or loyalty to his own computer platform, THINK AGAIN. It's iOS and iPad and iToys all the way. Sadly, the only hope for Apple as a company in the long run, IMO is for Steve to retire or step down and someone with a little BROADER vision to step in there because it is clear to me that Steve literally has epitaph to the Mac as we know it now written in stone in his head. And if he lied about Blu-Ray, he'll lie about the Mac too. Yes, buy one right now. It's not going anywhere in the future (bells tolling in the background). It's just sad. No, make that pathetic. Apple has this great operating system and they're going to let it die in favor of focusing on gadgets.... :mad:
 
Are you having a different discussion than the rest of the people on here? What people are saying is they ALREADY OWN BD's. So, they want to take the content they ALREADY OWN on the road with their laptop. Not have to buy separate DVD just for travel and spend more money.

It's not about "the shinny" aspect as you put it. It's about me being an OSX user and not having the ability to use the stacks of BD's on my shelf on the road or anywhere outside my living room where my PS3 is.

Seriously, how hard is this to understand?

I'm just giving you my perspective on why bluray on the go isnt really necessary. Even if some hotels dont offer wifi, dont they offer hbo or movie channels anyway? Might as well pay a few bucks to watch one when your bored.

I guess now I understand the argument that moved to the direction of, "I want to watch the bluray movie I already own on the go" but how much of a huge deal is that anyway? I'm sure you as an individual might travel more than others but the majority of people are not moving from hotels to hotels eager to watch movies that they've watched already without wifi connections.
 
I'm just giving you my perspective on why bluray on the go isnt really necessary. Even if some hotels dont offer wifi, dont they offer hbo or movie channels anyway? Might as well pay a few bucks to watch one when your bored.

I guess now I understand the argument that moved to the direction of, "I want to watch the bluray movie I already own on the go" but how much of a huge deal is that anyway?

You've sure come up with a lot of workarounds for a problem that could easily be solved by Apple offering a Blu-ray drive as a BTO option on their machines.

And you continue to assume that everyone lives their life the way you do. Is it that hard to admit that people have different priorities, motivations, wants, etc?
 
Here's the problem with not allowing Blu-Ray. And I've encountered this multiple times...I have AT&T DSL with the fastest speeds I can get in my area, which is 3.0mpbs. When you're trying to download a movie with those speeds, it's hours and hours of time waiting. If I have a Blu-Ray disc, I put it into PS3, and 30 seconds later I'm at the menu. Why do I have to make the decision to wait two hours to watch the movie I just bought on iTunes, IN STANDARD DEF, no less, when I could just as easily pop in a Blu-Ray for a slight premium that will often also give me a Digital Copy.

Here's an example...I was staying at a friends house back east last month, and we wanted to rent Singin in the Rain from iTunes. Her internet is 900kbps, according to an iPad speed test. It took us 2 hours to rent the movie, in standard definition. We could have just watched it in the time it took. We had a Macbook at our disposal, that COULD have played a Blu-Ray instantly. Why do we need to be forced into a standard that doesn't support "instant gratification"?
 
But yet your trying to dictate to them what they should sell? Since when do you run apple?

When Apple starts paying me, I'll stop complaining.
However as long as I am the one who buys computers and gives money to them, I think I have a right to voice my opinion.

If Steve Jobs wants to make computers for his own personal use without Blu Ray, he can do that and I won't try to stop him. Unfortunately he is not doing that, Apple makes computers for public sale.
 
But yet your trying to dictate to them what they should sell? Since when do you run apple?

No, just strongly suggesting they would be wise to offer a Blu-ray option to those of use willing to pay for it.

Even understanding, initially it would only be available for desktop Macs or as an external add-on for laptops since there are no reasonably priced 9.5mm slot-load Blu-ray drives available today.

Supporting choice is not dictating.

Cheers,
 
You've sure come up with a lot of workarounds for a problem that could easily be solved by Apple offering a Blu-ray drive as a BTO option on their machines.

And you continue to assume that everyone lives their life the way you do. Is it that hard to admit that people have different priorities, motivations, wants, etc?

How is that an easy solution when Apple will lose alot of revenue from offering that option? I suppose I'm not the only one that is thinking about "himself."

I want Apple to make the best choice for the company so that they can continue to grow and offer amazing devices and computers in the future.
 
Here's the problem with not allowing Blu-Ray. And I've encountered this multiple times...I have AT&T DSL with the fastest speeds I can get in my area, which is 3.0mpbs. When you're trying to download a movie with those speeds, it's hours and hours of time waiting. If I have a Blu-Ray disc, I put it into PS3, and 30 seconds later I'm at the menu. Why do I have to make the decision to wait two hours to watch the movie I just bought on iTunes, IN STANDARD DEF, no less, when I could just as easily pop in a Blu-Ray for a slight premium that will often also give me a Digital Copy.

Here's an example...I was staying at a friends house back east last month, and we wanted to rent Singin in the Rain from iTunes. Her internet is 900kbps, according to an iPad speed test. It took us 2 hours to rent the movie, in standard definition. We could have just watched it in the time it took. We had a Macbook at our disposal, that COULD have played a Blu-Ray instantly. Why do we need to be forced into a standard that doesn't support "instant gratification"?

Not a big deal. Steve Jobs, er I mean jjahshik32, has a 83852Mbps connection and downloads 500TB of video each month. Maybe you need to get with the times!
 
How is that an easy solution when Apple will lose alot of revenue from offering that option? I suppose I'm not the only one that is thinking about "himself."

I want Apple to make the best choice for the company so that they can continue to grow and offer amazing devices and computers in the future.

Neither of us can say what it would cost Apple to put a Blu-ray in one of their machines. But guess what, if it's BTO, you can actually charge the customer more to have that option!

There are many prebuilt computers offering Blu-ray drives. If you think it would cause Apple to fail in any sense, you're delusional. This is solely an issue of corporate greed.
 
Not a big deal. Steve Jobs, er I mean jjahshik32, has a 83852Mbps connection and downloads 500TB of video each month. Maybe you need to get with the times!

Well you need to look at the big picture (not only the consumer side) and you'll see that Steve made the right overall decision.
 
There are MANY articles stating this. Year per year, Blu ray has a much faster adoption rate than DVD.
Which you'd expect, since those figures aren't normalized for population or economic situation or adoption price.

Blu-ray is one of the cheaper and easier technologies to be released, and has the benefit of being the quintessential necessity for making full use of HDTVs. The other technologies it's often compared to had nothing to piggyback on. What the slides don't show about Blu-ray is the fact that it's much more likely to be a sole device in those households--almost no one is buying BD players to replace all the DVD players in the house and instead choosing just the primary viewing location. That has shown little sign of changing. Even the cheap players are predominantly being bought as first units within a household. This is reinforced by the presence of only one large HDTV in the typical household that would benefit from Blu-ray (and far fewer with the audio equipment to handle it).
I don't know about anyone else, but the last time i stepped into Best Buy, their Blu ray section has grown to almost half the size of the DVD one. And it's getting bigger every year. I estimate a 50/50 split by the holiday season.
That has much more to do with them being more profitable. Retail space is at a premium, and Amazon dominates the distribution channels. Retail stores rely on new releases and impulse buys, and in terms of dollars per square foot, serving fewer customers at higher prices works out in their favor since they can't compete with Amazon on selection.
Yep he has a PS3 at home and a Mac for on the road....but what happens if he wants to watch the same film. Should he buy two copies?
If he voluntarily chose to put himself into the situation where he could only use it on one device, yes. Otherwise, he could have gone for a bundled DVD or digital copy, or he can bring other entertainment options with him.
Admittedly my analogy is overly dramatic, how about this you can have an engine without a car, or a car without an engine? That more appropriate?
Not at all. Most people who have Blu-ray at all (about 1/3 of American households) have one BD player and one TV that can benefit from it. Everywhere else in their life, whether it's a bedroom, den, computer, or portable device, they can't view that film. Further, for these casual viewing situations, Blu-ray offers no benefit and people have shown with their purchasing decisions that they're not willing to replace all the gear for the sake of the Blu-ray.

Studios know this isn't going to change, and that's why combo packs have become standard on new releases. Small screens and devices with limited storage mean that a reduced-quality digital copy is necessary and sufficient for casual entertainment.
 
Neither of us can say what it would cost Apple to put a Blu-ray in one of their machines. But guess what, if it's BTO, you can actually charge the customer more to have that option!

There are many prebuilt computers offering Blu-ray drives. If you think it would cause Apple to fail to deliver, you're delusional. This is solely an issue of corporate greed.

Well I'm not talking about the cost of putting bluray drives but mostly how much that would eat up of the iTunes HD movie sales.

Corporate greed or not, it is still a business. Its not like they're polluting the air or water and killing our animals and trees.
 
There are MANY articles stating this. Year per year, Blu ray has a much faster adoption rate than DVD.

You should compare that to how prices of DVD players and BluRay players have developed. The reason for the faster penetration is simply because BluRay players have become cheaper so much faster than DVD players did. These days it can almost be considered stupid if you buy a DVD player instead of a BluRay player as your main home entertainment player. But what does that really mean?

If you look at sales of BluRay media, you will see that they are still far away from the heights of DVD sales and, by the time they could have reached that level in maybe 5-7 years, they will already start to be superseded by Internet-based video distribution. The studios will never make as much money with BluRay as they made with DVDs simply because people don't replace their DVDs with BluRays same way they replaced their VHS tapes. BluRay prices have already come down so much, because they can't get away charging $20-30 for a movie anymore like they did with DVDs for so many years.

Anyway. This has nothing to do with Apple's choice not to support BluRay. Apple's current place is not under the TV, it's on your desk or lap. You wouldn't really crave for BluRay there anyway.
 
Well I'm not talking about the cost of putting bluray drives but mostly how much that would eat up of the iTunes HD movie sales.

Corporate greed or not, it is still a business.

http://mediamemo.allthingsd.com/20100225/apple-billions-of-songs-billions-of-apps-not-much-profit/ said:
(Apple CFO) Peter Oppenheimer:
…Regarding the App Store and the iTunes stores, we are running those a bit over break even and that hasn’t changed.

It's not like they're making a killing with iTunes sales.
 
Which you'd expect, since those figures aren't normalized for population or economic situation or adoption price.

Blu-ray is one of the cheaper and easier technologies to be released, and has the benefit of being the quintessential necessity for making full use of HDTVs. The other technologies it's often compared to had nothing to piggyback on. What the slides don't show about Blu-ray is the fact that it's much more likely to be a sole device in those households--almost no one is buying BD players to replace all the DVD players in the house and instead choosing just the primary viewing location. That has shown little sign of changing. Even the cheap players are predominantly being bought as first units within a household. This is reinforced by the presence of only one large HDTV in the typical household that would benefit from Blu-ray (and far fewer with the audio equipment to handle it).

That has much more to do with them being more profitable. Retail space is at a premium, and Amazon dominates the distribution channels. Retail stores rely on new releases and impulse buys, and in terms of dollars per square foot, serving fewer customers at higher prices works out in their favor since they can't compete with Amazon on selection.

If he voluntarily chose to put himself into the situation where he could only use it on one device, yes. Otherwise, he could have gone for a bundled DVD or digital copy, or he can bring other entertainment options with him.

Not at all. Most people who have Blu-ray at all (about 1/3 of American households) have one BD player and one TV that can benefit from it. Everywhere else in their life, whether it's a bedroom, den, computer, or portable device, they can't view that film. Further, for these casual viewing situations, Blu-ray offers no benefit and people have shown with their purchasing decisions that they're not willing to replace all the gear for the sake of the Blu-ray.

Studios know this isn't going to change, and that's why combo packs have become standard on new releases. Small screens and devices with limited storage mean that a reduced-quality digital copy is necessary and sufficient for casual entertainment.

All nicely reasoned and explained but none of which has anything to do with Apple not offering a simple choice to the consumer. Jobs is just being stubborn and we, his formerly loyal customers are paying the price.

Cheers,
 
All nicely reasoned and explained but none of which has anything to do with Apple not offering a simple choice to the consumer. Jobs is just being stubborn and we, his formerly loyal customers are paying the price.

Cheers,

All that needs to be said.
 
Bring the bluray options and bye bye iTunes HD movie section.

My point is that even a slight decrease of iTunes movie sales would be a big deal to Apple.

Right... so it's all about offering a more restrictive service to their customers in order to maximize their own profits. You're OK with that. But again, you're forgetting that not everyone is living your life.
 
It's not like they're making a killing with iTunes sales.

Exactly, it's always been about encouraging additional hardware sales. I am always amused when people bring up iTunes and digital downloads. Apple is the largest music seller and it still represents a very tiny portion of their business, which is providing the most satisfactory customer experience to play all these things (music TV movies apps) on the coolest premium priced hardware your hard working consumer can buy.

Blu-ray should be a no brainer for a high-end company like Apple. Jobs just can't admit he's wrong and we'll suffer for it until he no longer runs Apple.

Cheers,
 
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