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The return of the Newton
- Thread starter sblasl
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Agreed.
The iPhone is still too limited in its current form. It can replaced a combined phone + iPod (although limited storage capacity and lack of physical buttons makes it a poor iPod replacement) but it cannot replace a Palm: it's missing a long series of basic applications, as simple as a password keeper, or a small database application (like FileMaker Pro Mobile), which would allow you to store some basic information.
This could easily be done through applications (widget style) and "voila" here is an Apple PDA and a valuable reason to buy an iPhone.
I will not buy an iPhone until the capacity exceeds 10GB for songs, and there is a way for me to save some information on it.
Stop thinking so small
PDA = Personal Digital Assitant
I don't get this meme about the PDA being 'dead'. Its alive an well in every iPhone, Blackberry, ad nauseum.
If anything the Newton was miscategorized as a PDA in that it went far beyond 'personal assistant' functionality. Too far for its time and capabilities.
But to say Newton = PDA ergo PDA is dead is a bit myopic (indeed provincial.)
There will inevitably be a form factor between iPhone/Touch (screen too small for many applications, and indeed application crippled) and Laptop (too bulky and overkill for many mobile functions.)
-document reader
-media viewer (with decent sized screen, although I enjoy my Touch.)
-internet browser/communications
-appropriately interfaced applications (skys's the limit here.)
Has to fit in your pocket? Then its not for you I guess.
This is going to be a fun ride!
PDA = Personal Digital Assitant
I don't get this meme about the PDA being 'dead'. Its alive an well in every iPhone, Blackberry, ad nauseum.
If anything the Newton was miscategorized as a PDA in that it went far beyond 'personal assistant' functionality. Too far for its time and capabilities.
But to say Newton = PDA ergo PDA is dead is a bit myopic (indeed provincial.)
There will inevitably be a form factor between iPhone/Touch (screen too small for many applications, and indeed application crippled) and Laptop (too bulky and overkill for many mobile functions.)
-document reader
-media viewer (with decent sized screen, although I enjoy my Touch.)
-internet browser/communications
-appropriately interfaced applications (skys's the limit here.)
Has to fit in your pocket? Then its not for you I guess.
This is going to be a fun ride!
Do you really think people are that stupid
Hhhhmmm, I just can't see someone accidentally buying a UMCP instead of a Touch or iPhone. This forum has certainly gone to the crapper lately with all the new dimwit Mac owners/switchers. There was once a time on this forum when you could actually have an intelligent discussion. Those times are now long gone though. I suppose this is what happens you gain marketshare
Matt
If there's any truth to this (regardless of product name), and if that truth every leaves the labs and becomes a produst, then I'd be VERY interested... but ONLY IF it runs a future low-power Intel chip (Silverthorne?) instead of ARM like iPhone/iPods. Because I'd really need it to run FULL existing Mac apps, without requiring the developer to build an ARM compile.
Mostly I would use dedicated touch apps, but for emergency changes to projects etc., I'd need to be able to launch and use my current tools. I'd accept limited functionality in my pocket, with full functionality (at limited speed) when connecting an external display and keyboard. And most places I go already having those lying around, so I'd actually have pretty good capability when visiting a friend or client.
(I certainly hope it's a large iPhone rather than a phone-less Newton. Maybe it could come in a phoneless flavor too though.)
Mostly I would use dedicated touch apps, but for emergency changes to projects etc., I'd need to be able to launch and use my current tools. I'd accept limited functionality in my pocket, with full functionality (at limited speed) when connecting an external display and keyboard. And most places I go already having those lying around, so I'd actually have pretty good capability when visiting a friend or client.
(I certainly hope it's a large iPhone rather than a phone-less Newton. Maybe it could come in a phoneless flavor too though.)
What, so a MacBook Pro fits in your pocket then ? I didn't think so. Not every device people own actually fits in a pocket
I would love to see a MacBook or MacBook Pro model that would be similar to the Gateway laptop/tablet models where the laptop screen can twist, detach, and then be used as its on tablet computer. The only failing of that computer is Windows, which OS X would remedy.
This would be a bad move by apple. The PDA market is completely dead....its not just a popular saying either. Take a look at palm sales of non-mobile units.
The only reason why Palm and PocketPC platforms are still around is the mobile component.
How many people buy computers without any intention of connecting them to the internet? WiFi does not count...the coverage is useless outside the home or office. Thats exactly how i see PDA's today
The only reason why Palm and PocketPC platforms are still around is the mobile component.
How many people buy computers without any intention of connecting them to the internet? WiFi does not count...the coverage is useless outside the home or office. Thats exactly how i see PDA's today
Do you really think people are that stupidGimmeSlack12 said:
This forum has certainly gone to the crapper lately with all the new dimwit Mac owners/switchers. There was once a time on this forum when you could actually have an intelligent discussion. Those times are now long gone though. I suppose this is what happens you gain marketshare
Matt
GimmeSlack is dead on. You are wrong. It's not that people are stupid; that they don't realize the difference between an iPhone, a touch, and a Newton, but rather having similar devices confuses the majority of gadget-illiterate consumers about which suits their needs, especially when the price points are fairly close. This is what screwed up Apple in the early 90s when they had a billion Performa models that were just slightly different from each other, and it's they kind of blurred product line Jobs set out to eliminate when he came back to Apple. When consumers get confused they put off their buying as they are afraid they will buy the wrong model for their purposes. That is beauty of having a tight product line.
I don't think a new Newton will happen for that reason + there is no real market for it (there are no enough geeks, sorry) + the market is going towards all-in-one PDA/Phone/Camera products. People want a million GBs in their pocket, not a million gadgets. I expect Apple to stay focused broadening the iPhone and iPod touch.
And I still think Apple should buy Danger (the SideKick folks!) and let the iPod/iPhone/OS X tech seep into their products, that way Apple can profit off of T-Mobile USA without violating their "exclusive" contract with AT&T over the Apple-branded iPhone.
About data entry on the rumored PDA (or the iPhone).
What about bluetooth keyboards? It would be perfect to connect to a keyboard at home or at work. No cables, and today "everyone" have (or can afford) a bluetooth keyboard.
Then the virtual keyboard will function as the touchpad does today. A solution we use when we need mobility, as an option to the more precise mouse that we use when we are at some locations.
Thats on my wishlist
What about bluetooth keyboards? It would be perfect to connect to a keyboard at home or at work. No cables, and today "everyone" have (or can afford) a bluetooth keyboard.
Then the virtual keyboard will function as the touchpad does today. A solution we use when we need mobility, as an option to the more precise mouse that we use when we are at some locations.
Thats on my wishlist
While I like the idea of a multitouch PDA, I feel w/ the iPhone & iPod Touch, it might confuse many consumers. I fear that someone would see an iPhone box and be like "Oh there's an iPod Touch" and buy that and later find out they were wrong b/c they didn't read. I've seen countless people get frustrated about something and is easily solved if only they read the signs or whatever.
Also, people might get confused by the different offerings. Not saying anybody reading this would get confused, but I know a lot of people who would spend a long time wondering which they needed. It would be nice, imho, if they merged the iPhone & iPod touch. The only thing that would need activation would be the phone part. The music part, Safari, everything else would work w/o activation.
One thing I'd like to see is a 12" or so tablet Mac w/multitouch. Full version of Mac OS X. It would serve as a digital clipboard or something where someone can take notes on it w/ either their fingers or maybe a stylus. Also, it could serve as a digital map. I know at the zoo near me, they hand out paper maps and sometimes I get turned around. It would have an accelerometer & maybe GPS tracking. This way, you could have a "You are here" dot. Plus if you turn to the left, it'll automattically adjust. It would be good to have a stand, too or even better a base station. The base station could have extra hard drives, optical drives and other expansion.
Two things that would be nice to be built in to the Mac OS X, iPod, & iPhone is better text-to-speech and better speech recognition. Right now, text-to-speech is awful. Sure, Leopard's going to add a higher quality voice, which I heard. It still sounds awful and robotic. For speech recognition, it would be nice to make a voice note & have it put into text. This would really help w/ people who have a hard time typing/reading. Or just someone who prefers dictating. Just my 2 cents.
Also, people might get confused by the different offerings. Not saying anybody reading this would get confused, but I know a lot of people who would spend a long time wondering which they needed. It would be nice, imho, if they merged the iPhone & iPod touch. The only thing that would need activation would be the phone part. The music part, Safari, everything else would work w/o activation.
One thing I'd like to see is a 12" or so tablet Mac w/multitouch. Full version of Mac OS X. It would serve as a digital clipboard or something where someone can take notes on it w/ either their fingers or maybe a stylus. Also, it could serve as a digital map. I know at the zoo near me, they hand out paper maps and sometimes I get turned around. It would have an accelerometer & maybe GPS tracking. This way, you could have a "You are here" dot. Plus if you turn to the left, it'll automattically adjust. It would be good to have a stand, too or even better a base station. The base station could have extra hard drives, optical drives and other expansion.
Two things that would be nice to be built in to the Mac OS X, iPod, & iPhone is better text-to-speech and better speech recognition. Right now, text-to-speech is awful. Sure, Leopard's going to add a higher quality voice, which I heard. It still sounds awful and robotic. For speech recognition, it would be nice to make a voice note & have it put into text. This would really help w/ people who have a hard time typing/reading. Or just someone who prefers dictating. Just my 2 cents.
Oh good lord... that's exactly where I want to have my financial transactions hidden... in a nice simple PHONE BILL!.
MacBook replacement
I'm thinking on similar line. I use the MacBook primarily for personal thing, but I don't like it heavy/big size and battery hog attitude.
If you observe what most of us do away from work, you come to realize that there is only a few things we actually use such as email/surfing and a little bit of Microsoft Office. I much rather carry around something small and has battery life twice that of my MacBook. Carrying it in my planner along with my phone would be awesome!
A typical life: at work a desktop computer that can do heavy computing,
at home or away, a PDA and iPhone.
It make absolute sense to me. The day of the laptop is gone!
Cinch
I'm thinking on similar line. I use the MacBook primarily for personal thing, but I don't like it heavy/big size and battery hog attitude.
If you observe what most of us do away from work, you come to realize that there is only a few things we actually use such as email/surfing and a little bit of Microsoft Office. I much rather carry around something small and has battery life twice that of my MacBook. Carrying it in my planner along with my phone would be awesome!
A typical life: at work a desktop computer that can do heavy computing,
at home or away, a PDA and iPhone.
It make absolute sense to me. The day of the laptop is gone!
Cinch
An 6 inch widescreen touch device could possibly be a good replacement for a laptop. So I'd say this is an evolution of the laptop rather than an iPhone type device.
iNetwon
Okay. So why should I carry around something that is slightly bigger than an iPhone and a lot smaller than a MacBook. What are Apple up to with their touchy-feely OS X division? What would I like them to sell me?
Information. Time management. Data storage and retrieval. Easy on the eye. A virtual Filofax. A photo album with slideshow. A personal Hi Fi with Wi Fi. A personal TV/ cinema with built-in speakers that don't sound like transistor radios. A thing of beauty; of quality. Something I can talk to, touch and look things up on. Something that purrs to my stroke. Something I can share with a few other people; as in "look at this".
I don't really need handwriting recognition; a larger virtual touch keyboard should do nicely. I don't want another device with a power brick. I don't want to worry about battery life or about data foul-ups when syncing to my Mac. I don't want a palm or one of its imitators; they made PDAs ugly and killed-off Psion (remember the Series 3a; simple and effective; a great diary and database, in a black and white sort of way). I don't want another iphone. I don't want another iPod. But an iNewton ... oh yes. Yes please. I want one of those.
Okay. So why should I carry around something that is slightly bigger than an iPhone and a lot smaller than a MacBook. What are Apple up to with their touchy-feely OS X division? What would I like them to sell me?
Information. Time management. Data storage and retrieval. Easy on the eye. A virtual Filofax. A photo album with slideshow. A personal Hi Fi with Wi Fi. A personal TV/ cinema with built-in speakers that don't sound like transistor radios. A thing of beauty; of quality. Something I can talk to, touch and look things up on. Something that purrs to my stroke. Something I can share with a few other people; as in "look at this".
I don't really need handwriting recognition; a larger virtual touch keyboard should do nicely. I don't want another device with a power brick. I don't want to worry about battery life or about data foul-ups when syncing to my Mac. I don't want a palm or one of its imitators; they made PDAs ugly and killed-off Psion (remember the Series 3a; simple and effective; a great diary and database, in a black and white sort of way). I don't want another iphone. I don't want another iPod. But an iNewton ... oh yes. Yes please. I want one of those.
Are you serious? How do you efficiently edit a Word doc or and Excel spreadsheet or a Indesign layout or an iMovie movie with a 6in screen much less a virtual keyboard?
I would believe so. You bet Apple is going to use their Touch technology on more products outside of the iPod and iPhone lines.
Successful companies don't design from the 'suggestion box'. Customer input is great, and helps with the little iterations, but its rarely where the big or great ideas come from.
Whatever the next gen product is, JUST DON'T LET GARY TRUDEAU GET HIS HANDS ON ONE!!!
It is call a desktop computer or a Dell elephant laptop.
Cinch
I agree, but they probably has an in house focus group (designers and executives).
Yes, Gary Trudeau would probably want a parallel port on this thing so that he can plug his Zip Drive into it.
Cinch
I think Apple built a larger Touch for their own internal assessment of usability, I don't think this is a future product.
There's this whole middle ground in personal devices that people can't get to work, and the problem is one of size. The PDA thing was useful when phones couldn't carry all of your information, but now they can. And so can your iPod. Viewing documents on a handheld device is useful, but the devices are too small for information entry. I remember sitting in meetings and watching people chicken scratch at their Palms and it just wasn't useful. That's what killed the PDA-- you can't use it to input information beyond to-dos, phone numbers and appointments and all of those things are better handled by your phone.
Once you make something big enough for document entry, it's too big to carry on a belt or in a pocket. If you need a bag for it, you may as well carry a laptop. There's room for smaller, lighter laptops, but they're increasingly niche products because they can't be full functioned. The smaller and lighter they get the more niche they become until you cross through the dead zone and get to phone size.
There's just no place for this, as far as I can tell.
There's this whole middle ground in personal devices that people can't get to work, and the problem is one of size. The PDA thing was useful when phones couldn't carry all of your information, but now they can. And so can your iPod. Viewing documents on a handheld device is useful, but the devices are too small for information entry. I remember sitting in meetings and watching people chicken scratch at their Palms and it just wasn't useful. That's what killed the PDA-- you can't use it to input information beyond to-dos, phone numbers and appointments and all of those things are better handled by your phone.
Once you make something big enough for document entry, it's too big to carry on a belt or in a pocket. If you need a bag for it, you may as well carry a laptop. There's room for smaller, lighter laptops, but they're increasingly niche products because they can't be full functioned. The smaller and lighter they get the more niche they become until you cross through the dead zone and get to phone size.
There's just no place for this, as far as I can tell.
Not anymore-- you just put it in the public domain...