Thunderbolt 3 Ports on Right Side of 13-Inch MacBook Pro Have Reduced PCI Express Bandwidth

[Santabean2000]

I think that at this point, it is safe to conclude that Apple isn't the problem. People like you are.

The issue isn't that Apple has changed, but that you people haven't. The mindset of the people here seem to be stuck in an era of Apple (roughly around the 2006 to 2011 period) that is long gone and will never return. And they appear utterly incapable of moving beyond that point.

Truth is, times have changed, and Apple too has changed in keeping with the times and the new challenges that follow. It's like walking into a French restaurant and complaining that it doesn't serve cheeseburgers.

You want what Apple can't and won't give you. I think the sooner you recognise and accept this, the better it is for you and everyone else around you.

What are you talking about?! Seriously. Your thoughts are so far off the issue here it's hard to know where to begin.

Point 1 - "Apple isn't the problem. People like you are?" Really? I'd argue that Tim Cook is the problem. And people like you making excuses for Apple are the next in line.

Point 2 - "Times have changed", something we can agree on. But your idea of changes are different to mine. Apple use to be known for their attention to customer satisfaction. Now they're focussed on 'growth' and 'dollars'. Apple use to be super focussed and attentive to details. Now they've convoluted line ups, confused feature sets and in other respects are just completely absent altogether (see Mac Pro, mini etc); 'the French restaurant' just won't serve you at all!

Point 3 - "You want what Apple can't and won't give you." Ummm, what, respect?

Apple has become shortsighted and profit obsessed under Tim Cook's reign. He's a 'numbers guy', so that's perhaps not a surprise.

Apple needs a 'product guy/girl' to bring back the passion to the place. Bring back the focus. Or lose me and everyone like me; I am far from alone in feeling like this.

 

[imageWIS]

Amen.

Not sure Apple got that memo.

They didn't, which is why they hired Angela 'I'm really bad at my job' Ahrendts.

 

[unplugme71]

I agree fully on the subject of overall IO. The overall IO Capability exceeds the outgoing model by far.

The only thing I don't like is the "need" for even more adapters now. I could handle buying stuff for TB2 as I still had regular USB and could chain more USB ports of the TB2 ports. Now they have went for absurdly thin, removing standard USB / TB2, requiring that I juggle more dongles to achieve the same connectivity my 2015 model does.

As others have asked of Apple in the other thread, would it have hurt for them to make it slightly thicker, given us some legacy ports, more battery, and perhaps offer a BTO version with 32GB or more RAM?

I don't think death to Apple at this point, but, this update has a few items that have put the brakes on my ordering a new laptop.

To me if they can't fit them on the side, do what MS, Dell, HP does. Put the large ports in the rear.

I sure as hell don't want to carry an HDMI and gigabit Ethernet dongle. I mean imagine showing up to a meeting at work and having to connect 4 adapters to display something on the tv, charge, connect to network, and plug in your USB flash drive that holds the content?

I'd be so embarrassed I'd buy a Dell. Oh wait. I did

 

[Zdigital2015]

I can't imagine dropping $2k on a pro/workstation laptop and not dropping the $150-$200 for a good docking station. Are there seriously people who like to plug in 6-10 cables each time they move their laptop? I only plug three cables into my laptop (power, USB-C dock, USB-C to DP cable to third display) and I wish my laptop supported power over USB-C so it was only two cables...

I think there are a lot of people who purchase a MacBook Pro, unplug it and take it with them somewhere twice a year. They would be better served by an iMac, but just can't stand the thought of being "tied" to a desk. I purchased a Cal-Digit Thunderbolt Dock for my rMBP soon after I bought it and it was money well spent!

 

[imageWIS]

Why do you think that way?

Enjoy what is given. Will you even utilize TB3 speeds on all 4 ports on a 13" that doesn't even have a dedicated gpu.

It's like having Ferrari build make 1 of the 4 tires only capable of 168mph instead of 190+.

Are you really ever going to go that speed?

Hello, non-Ferrari owner! There are these things called 'motor racing tracks'... and they allow you to go really f*cking fast in a closed setting in your car whenever a racing event isn't going on. So, yes you can go really f*cking fast in your Ferrari legally on a track, or illegally on the road... but only if ALL 4 TIRES ARE WORKING TOGETHER!
[doublepost=1477781511][/doublepost]

I think there are a lot of people who purchase a MacBook Pro, unplug it and take it with them somewhere twice a year. They would be better served by an iMac, but just can't stand the thought of being "tied" to a desk. I purchased a Cal-Digit Thunderbolt Dock for my rMBP soon after I bought it and it was money well spent!

Which is why I own both an iMac and a MBPr.
[doublepost=1477781646][/doublepost]

If you think the upgrades in the redesigned MBP are a fashion statement and not huge boost in capabilities for users, then I'm sad for you.

You should be sad for yourself as the specs on the 13" are not good for the price AND everything was sacrificed in order to make the computer thinner... which is wholly a fashion statement and has nothing to do with capabilities of the computer!

 

[lowkey]

"Most people are too stupid to know what's good for them." -- What a bizarre statement. If you are suggesting Apple Corporation knows more than people, we can't continue this conversation, it will be pointless. People very well know what they want. Customers here, PRO customers know what they want. They are demanding something better than emojis on a touch bar to get their work done.

You're demanding all their computers have 4 lanes of full bandwidth TB3.
Why do you want that? Just to whine.

If you need 4 channels of TB3 you can always buy the model that they realeasedbthat has it.

Or you could buy a machine from another manufacturer with it. Oh wait no you can't. Because only Apple makes one.
[doublepost=1477781990][/doublepost]

One side can do it, the other side can't. It's the stupidest thing I've heard this week in tech news.

That's because you don't understand tech.
As someone already wrote-

This has to do with the number of PCI Express lanes provided by the Intel chips. Thunderbolt 3 needs 4 PCI Express lanes for full throughput. The dual-core chips in the 13" MacBook Pro only have 12 lanes, so that can only support two full speed ports (2x4 lanes) and two ports at half speed (2x2 lanes). The quad-core in 15" MacBook Pro supports up to 16 lanes, which gives 4 full speed thunderbolt ports.

Now you can whine that every computer realeased by Apple should have 4 TB3 lanes, but there is not a single 13" computer in the world that has that...except the other model they just released.

The stupid thing is whining for the sake of whining when the machine you want, with 4 full TB3 lanes is right there staring you in the face.

 

[anthorumor]

Because they offer all other Thunderbolt 3 advantages including faster charging and support for peripherals. And it is likely any existing Thunderbolt 2 peripherals work with the adapter exactly as they do on the older MacBook Pros that do not have Thunderbolt 3...

That's not what I'm talking about. I mentioned that because the ports on the right for the 13' run TB3 at reduced capacity, they should be labelled to show the differentiation so some user plugging in a 40GBps capable device will KNOW to plug it in the left side just by looking at a symbol or a port that is coloured, instead of wondering why it's not running at full speed on the right. Someone mentioned how the introduction of USB 3.0 in the MacBooks didn't need to be coloured blue like they are in the PC world, because you knew they were all simply USB 3.0.

 

[Pootmatoot]

What are you talking about?! Seriously. Your thoughts are so far off the issue here it's hard to know where to begin.

Point 1 - "Apple isn't the problem. People like you are?" Really? I'd argue that Tim Cook is the problem. And people like you making excuses for Apple are the next in line.

Point 2 - "Times have changed", something we can agree on. But your idea of changes are different to mine. Apple use to be known for their attention to customer satisfaction. Now they're focussed on 'growth' and 'dollars'. Apple use to be super focussed and attentive to details. Now they've convoluted line ups, confused feature sets and in other respects are just completely absent altogether (see Mac Pro, mini etc); 'the French restaurant' just won't serve you at all!

Point 3 - "You want what Apple can't and won't give you." Ummm, what, respect?

Apple has become shortsighted and profit obsessed under Tim Cook's reign. He's a 'numbers guy', so that's perhaps not a surprise.

Apple needs a 'product guy/girl' to bring back the passion to the place. Bring back the focus. Or lose me and everyone like me; I am far from alone in feeling like this.

It's been said by others, but it really feels like Apple is entering its Steve Ballmer phase.

Only a decade or so to go, and it'll be great again!

 

[FreshBoy]

To me if they can't fit them on the side, do what MS, Dell, HP does. Put the large ports in the rear.

I sure as hell don't want to carry an HDMI and gigabit Ethernet dongle. I mean imagine showing up to a meeting at work and having to connect 4 adapters to display something on the tv, charge, connect to network, and plug in your USB flash drive that holds the content?

I'd be so embarrassed I'd buy a Dell. Oh wait. I did

So ignorant. There's an adapter that has all 4 ports you listed and more in one so you would actually have 3 more TB3 ports free. Do some research

 

[prattmeyer]

What are you talking about?! Seriously. Your thoughts are so far off the issue here it's hard to know where to begin.

Point 1 - "Apple isn't the problem. People like you are?" Really? I'd argue that Tim Cook is the problem. And people like you making excuses for Apple are the next in line.

Point 2 - "Times have changed", something we can agree on. But your idea of changes are different to mine. Apple use to be known for their attention to customer satisfaction. Now they're focussed on 'growth' and 'dollars'. Apple use to be super focussed and attentive to details. Now they've convoluted line ups, confused feature sets and in other respects are just completely absent altogether (see Mac Pro, mini etc); 'the French restaurant' just won't serve you at all!

Point 3 - "You want what Apple can't and won't give you." Ummm, what, respect?

Apple has become shortsighted and profit obsessed under Tim Cook's reign. He's a 'numbers guy', so that's perhaps not a surprise.

Apple needs a 'product guy/girl' to bring back the passion to the place. Bring back the focus. Or lose me and everyone like me; I am far from alone in feeling like this.

i agree apple is a company i dont like any more after 15 years of using apple products i dont like what i see any long. I agree cook is profit oriented to a fault. Actually i think the apple watch is possibly the most steve jobs like object theyve produced recently but the music and itunes experience is or was crap in ios 9 i did love the computers -os 10 but lately its gotten worse and worse. Snow leopard was an improvement very good then 4 crap & buggy OSs in a row, im up to el capitan which is acceptable if not great. instead of changing os s so often why dont they refine the os. im feed up with buggy eye candy.

 

[Pootmatoot]

So ignorant. There's an adapter that has all 4 ports you listed and more in one so you would actually 3 more TB3 ports free. Do some research

You know perfectly well that if other high end companies (especially Microsoft) released a flagship product that required a nest of dongles to perform basic 2016 functionality, you'd be the first to mock it. And quite rightly too, because it's absurd.

 

[FreshBoy]

You know perfectly well that if other high end companies (especially Microsoft) released a flagship product that required a nest of dongles to perform basic 2016 functionality, you'd be the first to mock it. And quite rightly too, because it's absurd.

I own a dell. Have ordered a 13" MacBook Pro and I'll order one adapter that has all the "old" ports. I had a MacBook Pro from 2009 to 2012 and it got water damaged and I couldn't afford a new one. Finally I'm paid enough to take the hit and return to macOS. I'm not a fanboy and can appreciate tech on both sides.
Microsoft is doing a great job at the minute...i was simply pointing out that he wouldn't need 4 adapters for 4 ports.

 

[Pootmatoot]

I own a dell. Have ordered a 13" MacBook Pro and I'll order one adapter that has all the "old" ports. I had a MacBook Pro from 2009 to 2012 and it got water damaged and I couldn't afford a new one. Finally I'm paid enough to take the hit and return to macOS. I'm not a fanboy and can appreciate tech on both sides.
Microsoft is doing a great job at the minute...i was simply pointing out that he wouldn't need 4 adapters for 4 ports.

Ah, ok.

But surely you agree just because you can, it doesn't change the situation that it's profoundly silly that you have to?

 

[FreshBoy]

Ah, ok.

But surely you agree just because you can, it doesn't change the situation that it's profoundly silly that you have to?

It's a bit annoying now but I'm willing to suffer in the short term for something that's going to improve the industry in the long term. Will you be purchasing one?

 

[geta]

You get what you pay for.

I wish! coz for €2700-3300 (13" MBP) im expecting to get much more.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

I think there are a lot of people who purchase a MacBook Pro, unplug it and take it with them somewhere twice a year. They would be better served by an iMac, but just can't stand the thought of being "tied" to a desk. I purchased a Cal-Digit Thunderbolt Dock for my rMBP soon after I bought it and it was money well spent!

That's what I do, but I move around my home with it, unlike a desktop.

 

[OnTheFly]

The transition to USB-C requires a one-time investment in new cables. USB-C will be around for a long time. Remember people said the same when Apple dropped the DVD drive and Ethernet (and DVI etc). Displays and Ethernet have long required adapters. There are USB-C to lightning cables now.

\


I don't doubt there is an transition happening. But, with ethernet being phased out and optic drives being eliminated there was an infrastructure and distribution for that content. Said differently, people were already using wifi and were streaming a lot of their content.

USB C is by no means the same standard as WiFi was when the took away our ethernet ports.

#missingmagsafe

 

[Pootmatoot]

It's a bit annoying now but I'm willing to suffer in the short term for something that's going to improve the industry in the long term. Will you be purchasing one?

I've always been a dual-OS user, and a MBP bought in 2013 is my workhorse.... but for this cycle, I think a Dell XPS 15 will replace that (the one due in January... riding the Intel and Nvidia cycles... which is what Apple and Microsoft should have done...).

Given Apple's current direction, as a Cintiq user, I can seriously see a Surface Book becoming my daily out-and-about driver if it gets a Nvidia 10s refresh next year in the 2nd version, and the Surface Studio looks equally going-in-the-right-direction (although unless they update guts, I pray they release just the monitor).

So after 10 years, I can see Apple being sliced out, unfortunately... and it's entirely because Apple have gone mental, at the same time everyone else got smart.

 

[rarkm1]

I have been a longtime DOS and Windows user since the early days. I think I still have DOS 3.1 installation disks around somewhere, although I doubt that modern hardware would let me install them.
I have been tortured by Windows 3, Windows for Workgroups, Windows (various iterations up to 10) and was planning on moving to Mac in 2014, despite having a fairly large investment in Windows files and s/w over a 30 year period. I planned on getting a Macbook Pro in 2014, but wanted to wait for the update, anticipating major new hardware and software improvements.

Two years later, Apple finally pulls the plug on its refresh of the MacBook pro. I could almost immediately tell that the presenters, Tim Cook included, were extremely nervous about this product announcement. They still slung around the "incredible"s, "fantastic"s, "amazing"s, "world class"s, and usual hyperbolic ******** that accompanies every Apple presentation. That hyperbole was actually not objectionable when their products were indeed amazing and groundbreaking. But the truth is that this update is too little, too late, and all the shiny-shiny and amazingly thin and light and dumbed down operating system crap that they've dragged in over recent years cannot hide the truth. These guys are out of ideas. They are still nickle and diming their customers for expensive cables, adapters and replacement parts, even though premium products must come with premium service to back up the value proposition.

There are three musts in new products: The new hardware (and software) must be more powerful, cheaper and significantly faster than the old stuff it replaces.

Apple doesn't do that anymore. It is so wedded to its high profit margin strategy, that it cannot see that time has run out on its (legal) monopoly on high innovation. The only way forward for these mopes is down, but they won't reduce profit margins, and can't admit that they no longer have the tremendous innovation potential of the Steve Jobs years. They have run out of time and suckers.

What a disappointment. The glory days of personal computing are over. The Nigerian Princes await the final assault.

​

 

[Merode]

Some people are really crazy. Die hard fans. I also like Apple, but let's face it - this company's changed.

New MacBook:

• Has a very weak GPU but that's nothing new
• Two out of four ports are slower and therefore aren't really TB3. Nobody mentioned it except for data sheet which is meant to mislead customer.
• New MacBook comes without power extensions cable and microfiber cloth. Yes, that's how money driven Apple has become.
• New MacBook doesn't connect to new iPhone without dongle which is not included.
• New MacBook features audio jack which Apple said is old, bad tech. It doesn't have Lightning connector which Apple advised as solution for plugging headphones. So if you bought new Lightning headphones, you won't plug them to MacBook without dongle. These products are same gen, released within one month of each other.
• New MacBook doesn't have most recent gen Intel processors.

All in all, you could forgive all this stuff (maybe not all of them for one product). Unfortunately, Apple has taken this opportunity to increase all prices. I have paid for my Late 2013 13" rMBP 6600PLN and it was the 'middle' model. The new MacBook without touch bar, so the lowest tier, starts at 7500PLN.

If you consider all this stuff at once, the new MacBook turns out to be the biggest flop Apple released since I started using their stuff in 2012. It speaks a lot, since they released in the meantime 'iPad Pro'.

EDIT: They also removed MagSafe which was one of the best features. Forgot to mention.

 

[citysnaps]

I have been a longtime DOS and Windows user since the early days. I think I still have DOS 3.1 installation disks around somewhere, although I doubt that modern hardware would let me install them.
I have been tortured by Windows 3, Windows for Workgroups, Windows (various iterations up to 10) and was planning on moving to Mac in 2014, despite having a fairly large investment in Windows files and s/w over a 30 year period. I planned on getting a Macbook Pro in 2014, but wanted to wait for the update, anticipating major new hardware and software improvements.

Two years later, Apple finally pulls the plug on its refresh of the MacBook pro. I could almost immediately tell that the presenters, Tim Cook included, were extremely nervous about this product announcement. They still slung around the "incredible"s, "fantastic"s, "amazing"s, "world class"s, and usual hyperbolic ******** that accompanies every Apple presentation. That hyperbole was actually not objectionable when their products were indeed amazing and groundbreaking. But the truth is that this update is too little, too late, and all the shiny-shiny and amazingly thin and light and dumbed down operating system crap that they've dragged in over recent years cannot hide the truth. These guys are out of ideas. They are still nickle and diming their customers for expensive cables, adapters and replacement parts, even though premium products must come with premium service to back up the value proposition.

There are three musts in new products: The new hardware (and software) must be more powerful, cheaper and significantly faster than the old stuff it replaces.

Apple doesn't do that anymore. It is so wedded to its high profit margin strategy, that it cannot see that time has run out on its (legal) monopoly on high innovation. The only way forward for these mopes is down, but they won't reduce profit margins, and can't admit that they no longer have the tremendous innovation potential of the Steve Jobs years. They have run out of time and suckers.

What a disappointment. The glory days of personal computing are over. The Nigerian Princes await the final assault.

​

What is it that you want from a laptop? Be specific.

 

[Merode]

What is it that you want from a laptop? Be specific.

I can't answer as you're not quoting me.

I'll ask you a question though. What would Steve Jobs do if he was alive and saw that:

• two out of four ports are slower
• iPhone 7 cannot be plugged to new rMBPs out of the box
• notebooks with audio jacks, phones with lightning
• removed microfiber cloth and cable extension
• one hundred versions of notebooks, 4-5 versions of iPads and 3 versions of iPhones

He would throw one huge tantrum. He strived to make everything interoperable and simple. All Apple products aren't simple anymore. All product lines are mixed and convoluted. Some iPads have some features and others don't but there isn't one that has all the features.

 

[oliversl]

The news about the new MBP keep getting worst everyday. I want use a mouse and charge my iPhone, that 40 US$ more, insanely courageous!!!

 

[citysnaps]

The news about the new MBP keep getting worst everyday. I want use a mouse and charge my iPhone, that 40 US$ more, insanely courageous!!!

"I want use a mouse"

No problem. Use any of the BlueTooth mice commonly available. Amazon sells one for $11.49 and is highly rated. Or buy an Apple mouse if you want to spend the money.

.

"...and charge my iPhone"

No problem. Use the charger and cable that came with your phone.

Be bold. Go for it!

 

[Larry The L]

Bring back the focus. Or lose me and everyone like me; I am far from alone in feeling like this.

I don't believe for one second that any of this would make you abandon apple. Not for a millisecond. You people love to bash apple for every tiny little thing. You magnify every perceived slight. You don't understand the world is changing and you must change with it. You always say that if only Jobs were alive, all would be fine. You have NO idea if that is true. But I do know your statement is false bravura that doesn't fool anyone!