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I did and returned it... great device but hampered by iOS. They need a pro version of iOS.

This is where your wrong, it is a high end piece of hardware that can handle anything IOS throws at it . Just kidding, I’m liking mine, and hoping the next IOS update takes more advantage of the power. Just need a better file system and Pro apps and they will almost be there.
 
I guess you're not aware of the 10% tariff discussion on Apple products?

Your conflating two totally separate topics
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I will ruminate greatly over why it would make perfect sense for a barren state to have their vote counted the same as a densely-populated one. After all, why shouldn't someone living alone on a vast piece of land the size of a small town have the same say as 100,000 people in a densely-populated neighborhood elsewhere?

It's becoming clear now.

I'm sorry if I sound harsh, but there's not a lot of deep-thinking to be had with every state having the same electoral vote.

Actually there is a lot of deep thinking to be had. Just because most people aren't willing to do it doesn't make it less true.

First, every state does NOT have the same number of electoral votes. It's still based on population. The difference is that some states (actually, most) have STATE LAWS that require all EC vote to go to the single candidate wining the local popular vote. Each state is free to make that law if they choose. Each state is also free to repeal/change that law. Each EC Voter, however, is bound by that law.

For the record, the rationale applied at the time of the constitutions ratification is STILL true. People in cities and urban areas *tend* to see life differently from people in rural areas. Nothing complex. Nothing sinister. Not even anything devoid of intelligence. Just difference in life experience driving political views. The electoral college makes sure that the MAJORITY of people - those living in cities and urban areas - don't get to run over the MINORITY of people living elsewhere. Recall that a basic tenet of the constitution is "Majority Rules / Minority Rights".

So, without the electoral college, presidential candidates would have little to no reason to visit the majority of states.

I'm willing to debate the implementation versus an alternative, but so far I haven't seen anyone offer a better solution that still addresses the basic requirement.
 
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First, every state does NOT have the same number of electoral votes. It's still based on population. The difference is that some states (actually, most) have STATE LAWS that require all EC vote to go to the single candidate wining the local popular vote. Each state is free to make that law if they choose. Each state is also free to repeal/change that law. Each EC Voter, however, is bound by that law.

For the record, the rationale applied at the time of the constitutions ratification is STILL true. People in cities and urban areas *tend* to see life differently from people in rural areas. Nothing complex. Nothing sinister. Not even anything devoid of intelligence. Just difference in life experience driving political views. The electoral college makes sure that the MAJORITY of people - those living in cities and urban areas - don't get to run over the MINORITY of people living elsewhere. Recall that a basic tenet of the constitution is "Majority Rules / Minority Rights".

So, without the electoral college, presidential candidates would have little to no reason to visit the majority of states.

I'm willing to debate the implementation versus an alternative, but so far I haven't seen anyone offer a better solution that still addresses the basic requirement.

Ok, let me correct myself and say I do think there's thinking to be had, I've thought about, and I think the electoral college is outdated and needs to change to a national popular vote.

The whole majority/minority thing is a joke when we a conservative candidate hasn't gotten into the White House for their first term since the 80's. There is no balancing to be had. Yes, people in rural areas see things differently from those in urban areas by and large. And the conservatives - generally those in rural areas - have gotten their choice twice since the turn of the century despite more people voting for the other candidate. If you want to require candidates to "visit places", that to me is a totally different issue and has no bearing on how the voting system works.
 
Ok, let me correct myself and say I do think there's thinking to be had, I've thought about, and I think the electoral college is outdated and needs to change to a national popular vote.

The whole majority/minority thing is a joke when we a conservative candidate hasn't gotten into the White House for their first term since the 80's. There is no balancing to be had. Yes, people in rural areas see things differently from those in urban areas by and large. And the conservatives - generally those in rural areas - have gotten their choice twice since the turn of the century despite more people voting for the other candidate. If you want to require candidates to "visit places", that to me is a totally different issue and has no bearing on how the voting system works.

The irony is that candidates would visit more rural areas with national popular vote.
 
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Painting broad strokes saying everyone is racist without any examples to point out is not calling it out, it’s following the sheep. You do realize many of these white, rural, unsophisticated people voted Obama in twice right? And pointing out entire sectors of people based on their color and location as unsophisticated is racism....just thought I would point that out too.

So as you believe there is no chance of him getting re-elected the same way people and polls pointed out he wouldn’t get elected the first time.....enjoy the next 6 years. We still have yet to hear or see the evidence after an almost 2 year investigation. Good luck with that.

First off I’m not saying Trump’s voters are all racist but a large chunk are whether they know it or not. This is not my opinion but fact. It’s fine to want to control illegal immigration but when they care about this so much it is because they don’t want more brown in this country. They also think that these immigrants will all vote Democrat!

2016 was a tumultuous year. Only 1968 can compare to 2016. 2018 is different and we’re passed the major crises of that year: Brexit, lots of jihadist terrorism in Europe and the refugee/migrant crisis in Europe.

The polls said there was going to be a Blue Wave and that’s exactly what happened. We picked up 40 House seats! That’s the best performance for the Dems since Nixon’s midterms during Watergate.

Dems also got 8.8 million more votes more than the GOP in the midterms. That’s huge!

Trump is just not popular and he can’t rely on his base to carry him over the finish line again. He has lost most of the rust belt voters that gave him a chance. Michigan, Pennsylvania, Ohio and Wisconsin are all voting blue for the most part. We also picked up a Senate seat in Arizona. The map is changing quickly.
 
First off I’m not saying Trump’s voters are all racist but a large chunk are whether they know it or not. This is not my opinion but fact. It’s fine to want to control illegal immigration but when they care about this so much it is because they don’t want more brown in this country. They also think that these immigrants will all vote Democrat!

2016 was a tumultuous year. Only 1968 can compare to 2016. 2018 is different and we’re passed the major crises of that year: Brexit, lots of jihadist terrorism in Europe and the refugee/migrant crisis in Europe.

The polls said there was going to be a Blue Wave and that’s exactly what happened. We picked up 40 House seats! That’s the best performance for the Dems since Nixon’s midterms during Watergate.

Dems also got 8.8 million more votes more than the GOP in the midterms. That’s huge!

Trump is just not popular and he can’t rely on his base to carry him over the finish line again. He has lost most of the rust belt voters that gave him a chance. Michigan, Pennsylvania, Ohio and Wisconsin are all voting blue for the most part. We also picked up a Senate seat in Arizona. The map is changing quickly.

Hmm, I’m not saying all Trump’s voters are racists, just most of them, and he states this as a fact? You’ve lost all credibility with that statement. If I turned that around and told you most black people in urban areas hate white people, and that’s a fact. Because I stated it as a fact does not make it one, it would make me as ignorant as you.

Here’s another one, when Obama, Schumer, Both Bill and Hillary Clinton and Pelosi fought just as hard against illegal immigration years ago before they were recently and conveniently for it, and Obama sent all those illegals packing, was this a favor to all those brown hating White people your referring to? Was he afraid they were going to convert to republican? I’m not going to entertain your racist hate filled ignorant statements any further. Your mindset is part of the problem of the division in this country. Put down your victim flag and join reality.
 
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Wait, what?

He is getting the benefit from his predecessor.

While there is truth to that, Trump has implemented far more economy impacting changes than most. Regardless, every single president takes credit for the econo
Ok, let me correct myself and say I do think there's thinking to be had, I've thought about, and I think the electoral college is outdated and needs to change to a national popular vote.

The whole majority/minority thing is a joke when we a conservative candidate hasn't gotten into the White House for their first term since the 80's. There is no balancing to be had. Yes, people in rural areas see things differently from those in urban areas by and large. And the conservatives - generally those in rural areas - have gotten their choice twice since the turn of the century despite more people voting for the other candidate. If you want to require candidates to "visit places", that to me is a totally different issue and has no bearing on how the voting system works.

So what would change that would guarantee every single adult WHO CHOOSES TO PARTICIPATE the opportunity to have his/her vote counted in a meaningful way?

We can agree to disagree on the specifics, but I will concur that the current system appears to be broken. Doesn't mean it is, but it certainly appears that way. I'm of the opinion that if we could resolve many of the smaller / regional voting issues this would become less problematic.

From my perspective we have some serious issues to address long before we can even begin to discuss replacing the electoral college.

One Citizen = One Vote
The idea that non-citizens even could vote (whether or not it actually occurs) is inherently a problem that should not be ignored. This also applies to people who are not legally able to vote, having names on the roster that don't align to living adults, and other every other challenge in linking a voter with a vote. It's a collective issue that speaks to the overall trust. A government "of the people, by the people and for the people" exists because the people trust that the system works. While we will always have difference of perspective on the implementation of governance (policy, finance, etc.) there is zero excuse for not having a strong foundation of trust... at a minimum to know that the 'winners' actually won.

My Vote Is Counted
Though it is a State issue, the whole process of HOW voting occurs is broken. Where I live (Texas) we have this antiquated 'electron' system that has us spinning a wheel to select a candidate/position then a different button to vote. At age 52 I've done this many times (only missing one election in my life) but it's still easy to mess up. Worse, what about places where votes are still on paper? How about places (Florida anyone?) where it requires a human to count/recount these things. Ignoring biases and opportunities for fraud, just the fact that it's easy to misread things should make it obvious that we need to get PEOPLE out of the equation.

What's Counted is My Vote
This is the flip side issue. Is every citizen absolutely certain that his/her vote is counted as cast? If not, is it possible that some person/process changes the vote between casting and counting?

Only Legitimate Votes are Counted
From my perspective this is one of the truly mind-boggling issues. As a citizen I have the right to vote and I have the responsibility to do so. Easy enough, but what's to prevent YOU from casting MY vote? Right now, it's not a guaranteed. Sure, it doesn't happen a lot, but statistically is DOES happen.

If we're going to entertain changing the system at the top, we have to make sure it is based on a foundation of truth and trust.
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I don't think there is a need to "balance the interest" of states when it comes to a Presidential race. You are free to move wherever you want to in this country, if you choose to live in Montana that has fewer electoral votes then that is your choice. A popular vote would break down these barriers. The only logical reason I can deduce for people not wanting a nationwide popular vote is because their candidate would lose. A president isn't meant to be a governor of governors, his job is to be elected by the people (sort of) and to preside over the legislative body and armed forces. The state's have representation in the house and senate.

Your comment that the President presides over the legislative body is inaccurate. They are EQUAL branches. Separate. Elected. Equal. Thus, that is why each state must have a weighted say in who's going to hold that office.
 
While there is truth to that, Trump has implemented far more economy impacting changes than most. Regardless, every single president takes credit for the econo


So what would change that would guarantee every single adult WHO CHOOSES TO PARTICIPATE the opportunity to have his/her vote counted in a meaningful way?

We can agree to disagree on the specifics, but I will concur that the current system appears to be broken. Doesn't mean it is, but it certainly appears that way. I'm of the opinion that if we could resolve many of the smaller / regional voting issues this would become less problematic.

From my perspective we have some serious issues to address long before we can even begin to discuss replacing the electoral college.

One Citizen = One Vote
The idea that non-citizens even could vote (whether or not it actually occurs) is inherently a problem that should not be ignored. This also applies to people who are not legally able to vote, having names on the roster that don't align to living adults, and other every other challenge in linking a voter with a vote. It's a collective issue that speaks to the overall trust. A government "of the people, by the people and for the people" exists because the people trust that the system works. While we will always have difference of perspective on the implementation of governance (policy, finance, etc.) there is zero excuse for not having a strong foundation of trust... at a minimum to know that the 'winners' actually won.

My Vote Is Counted
Though it is a State issue, the whole process of HOW voting occurs is broken. Where I live (Texas) we have this antiquated 'electron' system that has us spinning a wheel to select a candidate/position then a different button to vote. At age 52 I've done this many times (only missing one election in my life) but it's still easy to mess up. Worse, what about places where votes are still on paper? How about places (Florida anyone?) where it requires a human to count/recount these things. Ignoring biases and opportunities for fraud, just the fact that it's easy to misread things should make it obvious that we need to get PEOPLE out of the equation.

What's Counted is My Vote
This is the flip side issue. Is every citizen absolutely certain that his/her vote is counted as cast? If not, is it possible that some person/process changes the vote between casting and counting?

Only Legitimate Votes are Counted
From my perspective this is one of the truly mind-boggling issues. As a citizen I have the right to vote and I have the responsibility to do so. Easy enough, but what's to prevent YOU from casting MY vote? Right now, it's not a guaranteed. Sure, it doesn't happen a lot, but statistically is DOES happen.

If we're going to entertain changing the system at the top, we have to make sure it is based on a foundation of truth and trust.
[doublepost=1543555893][/doublepost]

Your comment that the President presides over the legislative body is inaccurate. They are EQUAL branches. Separate. Elected. Equal. Thus, that is why each state must have a weighted say in who's going to hold that office.

I appreciate your post. But you could write a novel and I’d respectfully disagree Montana and Florida deserve equal representation via electoral college.
 
I appreciate your post. But you could write a novel and I’d respectfully disagree Montana and Florida deserve equal representation via electoral college.

Understood with one exception. Montana and Florida already DO NOT have equal representation in the electoral college and never have. Per the results of the 2010 census, Florida has 29 EC votes while Montana has 3. What am I missing?
 
Understood with one exception. Montana and Florida already DO NOT have equal representation in the electoral college and never have. Per the results of the 2010 census, Florida has 29 EC votes while Montana has 3. What am I missing?

You're missing the debate in which I made that post. Someone said every state should have the same number of electoral college votes. I disagreed.
 
Saying Tim Cook is going with the equivalent of a blowup doll is a shallow statement. Comparing a woman that helped run her fathers business along with starting a few successful businesses of her own to applying lipstick and picking colors minimizes a woman’s accomplishment. In your myopic worldview, I guess all rich people’s children don’t have brains of their own? I suggest you broaden it a little.

Many businesses start and fail, there is no such thing as willing it to work. I can come up with a million dollar idea for a product, if I don’t market it, put it on the right shelves, or develop the right website, people aren’t going to buy it. If my father was a good mechanic, and I watch what he’s doing, ask the questions my whole life, I might become a good mechanic too. Put me in school to work on cars, and I’ll be an even better mechanic, no?

I would rather write posts that are not in response to emotional reactions, instead that elicit rational response. Your post could have been more intelligible, instead of throwing my verbiage back to me.

Ok here goes, I didn't reference anything to Tim Cook, you did. I was responding to the poster who reduced Ivanka down to a sexual object, hence the comment about passive sexual objects. If you don't understand my post, please ask for clarifications instead of making tangent inferences.

Which reminds me, Ivanka was into modeling, essentially offering her body for hanging clothes off of, as in mannequin, and which at some level can be extrapolated to be sexual object.

Here is an opposite perspective about rich people and starting businesses, my statement about that was they are simply renting their money instead of adding anything of value other than monetary part.

When people get rich they have a habit of thinking themselves as experts at things other than what made them rich, they start renting money for endeavors that they don't really understand in the hopes of making windfall rent payout on the money. They thus become experts at everything because they have the money to facilitate that endeavor and really provide no other value than the rent. And this hubris makes them think that they are great business people, which they are far from.

They should just stick to being expert at what they have a proven track record for being an expert for.

I cannot even come to consider Donald Trump to be a successful business person, given his history of failures and bankruptcies. And Ivanka's direct association with him then taints her character as well.

I don't have in depth knowledge of her business pursuits, my anecdotal view is that she has some fashion based enterprise, and who enters fashion enterprise apart from being a designer or an entrenched expert in fashion, musicians and sports personalities late in their career, because they don't have anything to offer but their money and name. This portrayal fits Ivanka pretty well.
 
Hmm, I’m not saying all Trump’s voters are racists, just most of them, and he states this as a fact? You’ve lost all credibility with that statement. If I turned that around and told you most black people in urban areas hate white people, and that’s a fact. Because I stated it as a fact does not make it one, it would make me as ignorant as you.

Excuse me. In what would does a large chunk mean most? A large chunk can be 50% and most can mean 80-90%. That is a big difference. I chose my words carefully.
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Here’s another one, when Obama, Schumer, Both Bill and Hillary Clinton and Pelosi fought just as hard against illegal immigration years ago before they were recently and conveniently for it, and Obama sent all those illegals packing, was this a favor to all those brown hating White people your referring to? Was he afraid they were going to convert to republican? I’m not going to entertain your racist hate filled ignorant statements any further. Your mindset is part of the problem of the division in this country. Put down your victim flag and join reality.

Yes they did. They also were against same-sex marriage and transgender rights but they now support both. Times change and people change.

While Obama deported a record number of illegals/undocumented migrants, it was not a main issue for Democrats. We were concerned with healthcare (Obamacare), fun control and the economy.

Trump’s base is all about “build that wall.” Every his supporters that live in areas that have little to no immigrants view immigration as some threat to their dominance in American life.

That is the difference. When people are so preoccupied about people that look different than them are coming in, that is driven by racism and xenophobia. There is no way to sugar coat it. Ironically, Mexicans and South Americans are all Catholics and very conservative. After a generation they are more likely to support the GOP than the Dems because they are very anti-abortion and birth control and also do not support same-sex marriage. They are very conservative on social issues.
 
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Trump’s base is all about “build that wall.” Every his supporters that live in areas that have little to no immigrants view immigration as some threat to their dominance in American life.

What's odd is that in states where you think this issue would do best... AZ, Texas, New Mexico... not so much. The AZ vote for Sinema really surprised me. I wasn't sure how a replacement for Flake would go... he's certainly probably not popular among Trump supporters. Despite his criticism of Trump - which I'm sure will lead his base to label him a RINO - he offers little to the other side of the aisle and is very conservative. (Though I do appreciate him taking on Trump).

The truth is, Trump's anti-brown immigrant stance is a facade. Illegal immigration is very low, most illegal immigration are not from people jumping borders or coming in on boats... its a talking point and not much more, and I'm glad so many people saw through that.
 
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What's odd is that in states where you think this issue would do best... AZ, Texas, New Mexico... not so much. The AZ vote for Sinema really surprised me. I wasn't sure how a replacement for Flake would go... he's certainly probably not popular among Trump supporters. Despite his criticism of Trump - which I'm sure will lead his base to label him a RINO - he offers little to the other side of the aisle and is very conservative. (Though I do appreciate him taking on Trump).

The truth is, Trump's anti-brown immigrant stance is a facade. Illegal immigration is very low, most illegal immigration are not from people jumping borders or coming in on boats... its a talking point and not much more, and I'm glad so many people saw through that.

I wasn’t that surprised by Arizona. It’s become pretty blue over time. And there’s lots of native Americans who vote blue.

Arizona and Texas becoming blue is why the republicans look to struggle with the presidency in the 2020s.
 
I wasn’t that surprised by Arizona. It’s become pretty blue over time. And there’s lots of native Americans who vote blue.

Arizona and Texas becoming blue is why the republicans look to struggle with the presidency in the 2020s.

I wasn't aware, but am damn glad nonetheless.
 
Ocasio Cortes is definitely over her head. She’s a complete embarrassment and emblematic of a leftist culture that’s built on resentment and ignorance and fueled solely by emotion.

LOL time will tell, won't it. No time like the present to start bashing the future?
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He’s still a millionaire

That's probably up for revision considering all his legal problems after he leaves office.
 
LOL time will tell, won't it. No time like the present to start bashing the future?
[doublepost=1543626052][/doublepost]

That's probably up for revision considering all his legal problems after he leaves office.

His net-worth may actually be debt to Putin. Would explain a lot. Who knows with this conman. You've been quiet the last few days...
 
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His net-worth may actually be debt to Putin. Would explain a lot. Who knows with this conman. You've been quiet the last few days...

Chalk it up to procrastination over finishing up Christmas presents... and also to the run-up to the winter solstice. Hate the early darkness, and I also figure I'm far more likely to get banned between mid-November and mid-December than any other time of year including campaign season! I'm not Scrooge nor the Grinch but I'm gloom-and-doom-ready at this time of year, which equates online to grouchiness and possibly to outright incivility.

On the thread topic: I don't have a problem with Ivanka Trump and Tim Cook doing a joint appearance at a rural school district where Apple has brought computing devices to the classroom. I have a problem with her dad appointing her and her husband to government positions but any time any corporate head or any government employee publicly touts STEM education and bringing tech to rural areas, I'm a fan. May other corporations and government agencies and Congress become fans too.
 
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