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Tim Cook 'Deeply Offended' by BBC Documentary on Apple Factory Conditions
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There's so much covert racism going on in this thread. I can guarantee that if the kids in the factory were white-skinned and had blonde hair all of you would be crying for them.
Funny, buddy, you don't know me at all. I actually don't think they're that bad in Apple's factory at all. So, how I am inconsistent?
In fact, I've been to the countryside in China and know why people go work in those factories. You, are the one dwelling in your superiority over those poor little soul you think you'll save by your pity (yes, this is sarcasm).
There are terrible conditions in China. But, Apple factories in general are not the ones with the terrible conditions. There are some issues (mostly in sub-sub contractors); in the case mentioned here its not even contractors, but raw metal suppliers were Apple is a minor buyer (It is a tiny part of the overall phone's bill of material).
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Huh? The racists and bigots are the one being condescending to people working in those factories and acting like they are to idiotic to know what's best for them.
99% of those that work in those factories are not "kids"; btw. My father started working at 16 (in 1945) and I'm pretty sure he's not saying he was a slave back then. I can't believe the idiocy of the comments!
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Oh, right, sensational hyperbole. Why not say something totally crazy instead of debating the point.
From reading his response (second post in this thread, in case you mentioned it), I don't get the impression that he's out of touch, or anything that the BBC showed was a surprise to him.
Regarding the tin mining, he specifically lists the two things that Apple could do. One is easy (and shields Apple from criticism like this), and the second is difficult, leaves Apple open to criticism like this, but in the end, sounds like it's the only way to eventually have a positive impact in an otherwise completely crap situation were it seems like literally NOBODY is doing anything to make it better. They chose the second way. It's not going to have instant results. The BBC can go back next year and show more bad crap STILL happening, but if they're not going to bother to put it in the context, what's the point?
He also says that suppliers are only averaging 93% compliance with the 60-hour limit. He specifically says "We can still do better".
This is out of touch?
He seems very aware that things aren't yet perfect. Apple's made a promise to improve things. They started it 2011. It's 2014. If anyone thinks its realistic to assume that three years later, everything would have been fixed, then I think they're the folks looking through the rose colored glasses, not Tim Cook or Apple.
IMO, he's not offended by the truth. He seems offended that Panorama is making the point "hey world, Apple hasn't fixed 100% of everything wrong with manufacturing and mining in China and India after a few years --- THEY'VE BROKEN THEIR PROMISE and yeah, if you're an Apple customer, they've mislead you".
Actually, if the kids were white and had blond hair we would have eaten them, just like Jonathan Swift suggested back in the day. They're much better as snacks than as factory workers. The other kind are too gamy. Plus, once they get into the minds they take on a metallic flavor that no amount of ketchup can get rid of.
Because we use apple products we should defend their business of exploiting labor? Don't think so.
This documentary didn't paint apple as bad as some people are making out to be (if they even watched it?). Presenter even showed evidence that chinese managers were covering their exploit with paper work (masking long and forbiden overtime as "bonus money"), so Apple would not find out. Only think that apple here is "guilty" off is that they probably know what is going on, but they just need that signature from chinese managers so they can clean their hands off. Maybe reality is that Apple can't really do anything about it. They are outside company who have no knowledge or right to tell chinese how to work with they workers. And also Apple knows that without this labor exploit they have no other way to built this much phones, with this little expense and with that quality. It really is vicious circle that is hard to get out. But not impossible. But lets not kid ourself here....nor chinese managers, nor tim cook care about people. All they see is $,$ and again....$. He probably laughed while watching this poor kids fall asleep next to machines because of 16 hour work shifts and 18 days without day off. And he laughed also when apple soldiered ram on new mac mini for no other reason than strong arm people to buy apple gold covered ultimate edition certified best ever RAM at extreme price.
But all this things are standard. Labor being exploited is not something new. It has been here for centuries.
I liked that this documentary backed up their claims and call apple on their BS. How tim c(r)look even have audacity to say that this are "further from truth" when there is video footage of making him and his comments look like fool.
This documentary didn't paint apple as bad as some people are making out to be (if they even watched it?). Presenter even showed evidence that chinese managers were covering their exploit with paper work (masking long and forbiden overtime as "bonus money"), so Apple would not find out. Only think that apple here is "guilty" off is that they probably know what is going on, but they just need that signature from chinese managers so they can clean their hands off. Maybe reality is that Apple can't really do anything about it. They are outside company who have no knowledge or right to tell chinese how to work with they workers. And also Apple knows that without this labor exploit they have no other way to built this much phones, with this little expense and with that quality. It really is vicious circle that is hard to get out. But not impossible. But lets not kid ourself here....nor chinese managers, nor tim cook care about people. All they see is $,$ and again....$. He probably laughed while watching this poor kids fall asleep next to machines because of 16 hour work shifts and 18 days without day off. And he laughed also when apple soldiered ram on new mac mini for no other reason than strong arm people to buy apple gold covered ultimate edition certified best ever RAM at extreme price.
But all this things are standard. Labor being exploited is not something new. It has been here for centuries.
I liked that this documentary backed up their claims and call apple on their BS. How tim c(r)look even have audacity to say that this are "further from truth" when there is video footage of making him and his comments look like fool.
Because I've been on apple forums long enough to know that for whatever reason it attracts a lot of social Darwinists/eugenics experts/flat-out racists. This is not applied to the general population of Mac lovers. But Apple forums are like CNN comments threads.
Hell, man. That's the internet in general. No matter where you go around here, crazy's always waiting.
Apple will always be singled out in these kind of reports because at the moment they are the top dog. It doesn't make it any less worrying though that people are used as slaves like this.
It's also silly for Tim Cook to say he's deeply offended by the documentary. I'd be more deeply offended that I do business with people like this.
It's also silly for Tim Cook to say he's deeply offended by the documentary. I'd be more deeply offended that I do business with people like this.
I get it, it's all the fault of the Chinese society !
You clearly have no idea what the panorama program is. Apple is not a victim here, they are just another company that has been exposed on pandorama, we are all aware of the bad working conditins In China , though when Tim comes out and says he is deeply offended , that just shows you Apple themselves want to carry on as though this is totally acceptable. Hey Tim got all the free positive press when he went tot China , to improve the conditions etc, well this is a really check for him, either it was for show, or he has not done enough. Being deeply upset..... Get over it Tim, and do something about it. Either you were bluffing about changing the conditions or your were naive, either way step up to the plate.
And as for falling asleep at your desk, did you just compare your job as a web designer to that of a Chinese factory worker. You poor thing... How about swapping with them for a couple of weeks
really silly comparison mate, If you were falling asleep in our company, you would be sent home, under occupational health and safety. Its good to be able to choose when you work longer hours ----------
Correct, Apple will get picked on cause they are huge, and also cause they pretend they care more than any other company currenty doing business in China.
Tim did get a lot of positive press when visited China to address the working conditions. And your spot of that Tims needs to revisit the issue of either him not doing enough, or being naive that it was all sorted cause he paid them a visit.
I doubt Apple can change the culture within these factories , in that is the case I just want them to shut up about it. If he is that offended he can move the factories back to the US.
i don't think people are as racist as they come across on MR. People on here are so blinded by thier bias, that they will turn to reasoning that comes across as being racist to apologise for Apple. The amount of people who do not read the actual articles or watch the content, and straight away jump in defeding Apple is a major problem on MR, and those comments without the context of the actual article, can come across as racist. As you can see people justifying the conditions that they would be disgusted to work in, cause thier Apple products are made there.... Selfish human behaviour , they really have no idea what a factory worker does anyway, how many factory workers in US or Europe buy Apple products ???
Anyone here a factory worker ? And Im not talking about the students having part time jobs while getting thier degree..... Factory worker as your full time job??
I simply don't understand why Apple has such target painted on their back in this regard.
They aren't declaring their corporate motto to be 'do no harm'. Nor are they the only computing company located in so called 'liberal' California.
All of your tech devices, shoes and clothes are made in working conditions that most middle class westerners would avoid. This is true of Samsung phones, Levi jeans and Nike shoes as well.
Now of course I do not excuse Apple or any other company for deliberately using suppliers with brutal labor practices in an effort to shave margins. However I am more suspicious of companies like HP that seem to have a more toxic corporate culture.
Or companies like RIM that are teetering on the brink of destruction for years.
But hey, Apple makes neat stuff we all want, and they do that product(red) thing, so lets drag them through the mud.
They aren't declaring their corporate motto to be 'do no harm'. Nor are they the only computing company located in so called 'liberal' California.
All of your tech devices, shoes and clothes are made in working conditions that most middle class westerners would avoid. This is true of Samsung phones, Levi jeans and Nike shoes as well.
Now of course I do not excuse Apple or any other company for deliberately using suppliers with brutal labor practices in an effort to shave margins. However I am more suspicious of companies like HP that seem to have a more toxic corporate culture.
Or companies like RIM that are teetering on the brink of destruction for years.
But hey, Apple makes neat stuff we all want, and they do that product(red) thing, so lets drag them through the mud.
More horsepucky.
Short term thinking, such as you depicted, is the mark of a bad capitalist.
Try again.
Mac Pro, made in USA.
90% of my clothes made in USA. Shoes made in Portugal or UK.
I actually take this kind of stuff seriously as I've lost a job to outsourcing in the past. When I cant find a US made version of something I try to find something made in a capitalist democracy with a middle class, like Japan or an EU member nation.
It DOES cost a lot more, but often you are left with higher quality stuff. Shoes that last more than a year. Clothes that last 4 or 5 years easily. So in the long run the price is much the same.
Now of course BBC will follow up with a doc about Walmart right?
Never said it was apples fault, nor did the program, it just honestly said apples promises are being broken, and showed the evidence.
Apple does however have the power to do more, it's their supply line after all, if they didn't, why bother making new worker rights and promises anyway?
If it's your opinion apple is doing enough to stop the almost torturous conditions they work in, then fine.
For me, I believe they need to step thier game up and make sure what they've promised is being carried through.
Yeah full of looney toons posts like yours.
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Because nobody else could possibly be biased. Only those who aren't condemming Apple 24/7.
Nobody working for a Apple supplier in China is used as slave. Your abusive use of the word is offensive to them and to me. That's it. Using this kind of crappy hyperbole destroys your whole so called argument and makes you look like some kind of massive hypocrite unless you live nude in cardbox box... Because by your definition, there is no non slave labor anywhere in the third world and developing world
The racist is the person saying that everyone there is a slave. If Apple's conditions are "slave" labor as many idiots here say, then we have to come to this "conclusion" that 99% of produced goods in the last 30 years are untenable to people saying that. That's logical consistency.
So, these people need to strip down, sell everything they own (yes, I'm betting nothing you own, is really 100% union wage (sic) to the resource and component level) and show their principle. I won't accept any more argument about this until this happens. I'd expect those people won't be logging in on this forum anymore because there is no way to do so without using "slave" labor.
I'm tired of grand declaration of moral superiority of anyone here without this being done. Then, everyone who did this can spent the big money and time to hunt down those products not touched by "slave" labor. You're in for some fun I tell you.
I'm going to wait for a reply on this ; mail it in, because obviously nobody who is so principle will actually own a computer, tablet, smart phone, network equipment....
These also just shows that users will believe any thing, and any documentary without first knowing what a large company like Apple would be like...
It doesn't even make sense a popular company like Apple using workers as slave labor.... I can understand a tight-fisted company, not much money, but not Apple, or big guys...
It also just shows that any thing the media brings out even if it is wrong, they don't care about reporting the truth... All they care about is a story they dream up on the doorstep..
It doesn't even make sense a popular company like Apple using workers as slave labor.... I can understand a tight-fisted company, not much money, but not Apple, or big guys...
It also just shows that any thing the media brings out even if it is wrong, they don't care about reporting the truth... All they care about is a story they dream up on the doorstep..
slave
sleɪv/Submit
noun
1.
(especially in the past) a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.
I didn't know that FoxConn legally owns their employees and are forced to work there.