Trump Administration Considers Global TikTok App Store Ban

[coldwaves]

It was reported that US government has not found any evidence that Chinese government accessed TikTok data.

CIA Finds ‘No Evidence’ Chinese Government Has Accessed TikTok Data, Report Says

Though the intelligence agency said it’s possible the Chinese government could get TikTok data, it hasn’t done so yet.

www.forbes.com

It was also reported that US government has used TikTok to spy on US citizens.

BlueLeaks Reveals What TikTok Shares with U.S. Authorities

A glimpse at what TikTok does in the U.S. underscores that data privacy issues extend beyond China.

theintercept.com

US government Saying Chinese government may be able to use TikTok to spy is pure hypocrisy.

 

[yaxomoxay]

For Q3/2020, international sales accounted for 60 percent of the quarter’s revenue. That's still most, compared to 40% US.

You are comparing 1 country vs the cumulative remaining ~200 countries. 1 country accounts for 40% of Apple's revenue, that's huge.

 

[Dwalls90]

that’s another issue. Saying that Trump is doing it only because he’s mad of the alleged interference with his rally is ignorant at best considering that intelligence experts, DNC, GOP, Schumer etc all agree that it’s a serious issue. Now, the approach might be wrong, but the problem is very real.

So the issue is all that matters, but how it's handled doesn't? How situations are handled is a core principal of politics.

To use your logic, two people can dislike the same person for doing something they may not agree with. Person A opts to maim or hurt them, whereas person B opts to engage in a meaningful discussion to seek an understanding about why they are doing something they don't agree with. Do you not see the difference?

 

[0924487]

If it's legal for the administration to do this (possibly is), Apple would have to comply as a U.S.-based company. If they incorporated outside the U.S. they wouldn't.

/My comment does not indicate support of this executive action.

They can isolate their App Store operation to a Switzerland-based company, for example, or give up their China App Store operation to a Chinese company, just like they have done for iCloud.

 

[twolf2919]

First off....we actually do have a plague and its killing people in the 21st century....and its Chinas fault.
...

Oh, get a grip, will you? It's China's fault - because Trump told you it was? Viruses develop everywhere in the world. This one happened to emerge in China. As the Chinese government has no control over evolution, only a dolt would blame them for that. Yes, the local government tried to ignore and/or cover it up. No excuse for that, but there are id1ots in every local government - one has to look no further than the governor of Florida who's trying real hard to outdo Trump in being responsible for the most deaths due to ineptitude/ignorance/sycophancy.

The Chinese government warned other countries about the virus by end of December. The US didn't do anything except block a few travelers from China until March. And even then it has been half-a$$ed and mostly on the state level, because the Orange One takes no responsibility or leadership and has no plan. Trump's ineptitude is single-handedly responsible for at least 70k deaths out of 170k (and counting - we still don't have national strategy).

 

[darkcompass]

It’s not unprecedented, as a US company Apple will have to comply.

Apple are welcome here in the UK, all they need to do is fire the rockets below the campus, and fly it over the atlantic to us here, drop it somewhere nice, like Wales.

 

[yaxomoxay]

It was reported that US government has not found any evidence that Chinese government accessed TikTok data.

CIA Finds ‘No Evidence’ Chinese Government Has Accessed TikTok Data, Report Says

Though the intelligence agency said it’s possible the Chinese government could get TikTok data, it hasn’t done so yet.

www.forbes.com

Explain to me how a source article (NYT) that states this:

"when the C.I.A. was asked recently to assess whether it was also a national security problem, the answer that came back was highly equivocal" and "The most recent C.I.A. assessment, the latest of a series, has been kept classified, though it has been widely circulated and much discussed in Washington" and "Intelligence officials insisted the C.I.A. assessment did not mean that the app was safe or that installing it on a phone was wise" and "you are the U.S., you probably don’t want your government officials to have TikTok.”

Becomes (Forbes):
"The CIA concluded there is “no evidence” Chinese intelligence services have ever accessed data from TikTok, the New York Times reported Friday"

(of note, the "no evidence" in quotes is from the NYT article, not a quote from a CIA report as the article would lead one to believe.)

 

[Mescagnus]

You are comparing 1 country vs the cumulative remaining ~200 countries. 1 country accounts for 40% of Apple's revenue, that's huge.

I am aware of that.

Yet, the share of international revenue would probably look even better, if No. 45 didn't try to play "King of the world" and disrupt Apple's market (China being the largest international market for Apple).

 

[0924487]

It’s not unprecedented, as a US company Apple will have to comply.

Apple is not necessarily a US company. Namely, it is, but legally, only partially, and it doesn't have to be that way. Most of Apple's Operation is outside of the US already, they can move more of their operation to neutral countries. Apple will never give up the Chinese market, not because they cannot forgo the sales there, but because if they do, they won't be able to remain relevant in the global market as a mature Chinese system will very quickly replace them globally. In China, Apple has lost ground on Apple Pay to Alipay, iMessage to WeChat, Apple Music to QQ Music, Apple Maps to Gaode Maps, etc.

 

[yaxomoxay]

So the issue is all that matters, but how it's handled doesn't? How situations are handled is a core principal of politics.

To use your logic, two people can dislike the same person for doing something they may not agree with. Person A opts to maim or hurt them, whereas person B opts to engage in a meaningful discussion to seek an understanding about why they are doing something they don't agree with. Do you not see the difference?

Of course how it's handled matters, but my initial reply was on the reason for the ban, and the reply to my reply was about the methodology, which is another item.

 

[Wildkraut]

The point isn’t about whether the US is guilty of spying on other countries or not, but that Tik Tok has close ties with a government with a history of human rights abuses.

To put it another way, think about what is the worst that the US government could do with user data from say, facebook, vs what the Chinese government could do with Wechat or Tik Tok. In the US, you are criticised for not criticising the US government. Americans by and large enjoy unfettered freedom of speech and they all just take it for granted.

In China, people can disappear just for saying something negative about the CCP. Wechat is used to spy on and monitor its users, censor what can and cannot be said, as well as be involved in corporate espionage. Tik Tok has the facial, biometric and location data of an entire generation of US citizens which it can use to build a database, as well as use its algorithms to either surfaces or suppress content depending on what the agenda of the Chinese government is at any one time.

I am not saying that this somehow gives the US the right to police the entire world, but this may well be one of those scenarios where two wrongs end up making a right. Trump is clearly doing this for less than altruistic reasons, but if the outcome is ultimately the same, this move just might end up being on the right side of history after all.

Unfettered freedom of speech in USA, heh? In USA and other countries you have somewhat more freedom of speech, but its not a real freedom of speech at all. The latest happenings proves it. Human rights in USA, heh? Is there another USA out there? I just know the one that is currently divided by the biggest racism out there, and which still has the death penalty, etc.

Is about time that the rest of the world stops kissing USAs ass. There are uncountable Apps and Hardware with close ties to the USA government related to espionage, just to name a few - Cisco, Dropbox. And of course USA is pushing other countries to not install Huawei 5G hardware, because the self appointed world police would lose control, and their spying network would simply fall apart, making them blind.

 

[mrr]

Trump is still hurting from those 14 year olds who punked his rally with TikTok.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Unfettered freedom of speech in USA, heh? In USA and other countries you have somewhat more freedom of speech, but its not a real freedom of speech at all. The latest happenings proves it.

Not sure what you're referring to. In the US you can say whatever you want without government retribution. That's why we have awful stuff as pro-Nazi, pro-pedophilia, pro-Isis groups and the gov't can't do anything until they act or threaten/cause violence.

and which still has the death penalty, etc.

Thankfully!

Is about time that the rest of the world stops kissing USAs ass. There are uncountable Apps and Hardware with close ties to the USA government related to espionage, just to name a few - Cisco, Dropbox. And of course USA is pushing other countries to not install Huawei 5G hardware, because the self appointed world police would lose control, and their spying network would simply fall apart making them blind.

Well, the international community must make up its mind. Whenever Trump says that he doesn't want the US involved he's criticized because he's leaving countries behind and so on. Whenever the US intervenes then the US is an imperialist SOB country.

 

[0924487]

You are comparing 1 country vs the cumulative remaining ~200 countries. 1 country accounts for 40% of Apple's revenue, that's huge.

Do you know Chinese students and travellers like to buy many Apple products in the US and bring them back to China? Apple products are very cheap here in the States because many places don't charge sales tax and import tax. In China, it's ~20% import tax, then a 17% sales tax.

A significant portion of the highest-end Apple products are bought by Chinese students, especially Chinese girls.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Do you know Chinese students and travellers like to buy many Apple products in the US and bring them back to China? Apple products are very cheap here in the States because many places don't charge sales tax and import tax. In China, it's ~20% import tax, then a 17% sales tax.

A significant portion of the highest-end Apple products are bought by Chinese students, especially Chinese girls.

If memory doesn't fail me, Apple makes about 60,000,000,000 per quarter, which would mean about $24,000,000,000 per quarter in the US. I highly doubt that Chinese students buying iPhones account for much of it.

 

[coldwaves]

Explain to me how a source article (NYT) that states this:

"when the C.I.A. was asked recently to assess whether it was also a national security problem, the answer that came back was highly equivocal" and "The most recent C.I.A. assessment, the latest of a series, has been kept classified, though it has been widely circulated and much discussed in Washington" and "Intelligence officials insisted the C.I.A. assessment did not mean that the app was safe or that installing it on a phone was wise" and "you are the U.S., you probably don’t want your government officials to have TikTok.”

Becomes (Forbes):
"The CIA concluded there is “no evidence” Chinese intelligence services have ever accessed data from TikTok, the New York Times reported Friday"

(of note, the "no evidence" in quotes is from the NYT article, not a quote from a CIA report as the article would lead one to believe.)

First two paragraphs of the NYT report:

"TikTok has long presented a parenting problem, as millions of Americans raising preteens and teenagers distracted by its viral videos can attest. But when the C.I.A. was asked recently to assess whether it was also a national security problem, the answer that came back was highly equivocal.

Yes, the agency’s analysts told the White House, it is possible that the Chinese intelligence authorities could intercept data or use the app to bore into smartphones. But there is no evidence they have done so, despite the calls from President Trump and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to neutralize a threat from the app’s presence on millions of American devices."

I guess the vagueness comes from this statement in the NYT article "But there is no evidence they have done so". One may think this is a statement from the CIA analyst. Or one may think this is a statement that the NYT reporters make based on what they know.

Whatever this statement means, it is abundantly clear that no evidence of Chinese government access to TikTok data has been presented so far.

 

[TrevorR90]

What if you were stopped for a minor traffic violation and the cops wanted access to your phone? Where is the line in the sand?

Do you know Chinese students and travellers like to buy many Apple products in the US and bring them back to China? Apple products are very cheap here in the States because many places don't charge sales tax and import tax. In China, it's ~20% import tax, then a 17% sales tax.

A significant portion of the highest-end Apple products are bought by Chinese students, especially Chinese girls.

Yeah if I recall, during iPhone launch events, the lines to purchase iPhones are filled with Chinese citizens that will purchase iPhones and send them to China for huge profits.
Although this isn’t just Apple products, there are other big ticket items as well.

 

[yaxomoxay]

First two paragraphs of the NYT report:

"TikTok has long presented a parenting problem, as millions of Americans raising preteens and teenagers distracted by its viral videos can attest. But when the C.I.A. was asked recently to assess whether it was also a national security problem, the answer that came back was highly equivocal.

Yes, the agency’s analysts told the White House, it is possible that the Chinese intelligence authorities could intercept data or use the app to bore into smartphones. But there is no evidence they have done so, despite the calls from President Trump and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to neutralize a threat from the app’s presence on millions of American devices."

I guess the vagueness comes from this statement in the NYT article "But there is no evidence they have done so". One may think this is a statement from the CIA analyst. Or one may think this is a statement that the NYT reporters make based on what they know.

Whatever this statement means, it is abundantly clear that no evidence of Chinese government access to TikTok data has been presented so far.

My criticism is about Forbes' article, they clearly went for an angle that neither the CIA or the NYT intended.

At any rate, I am not sure that the fact that China hasn't accessed the data yet is the issue. National Security is also about possible threats, and it's clear that the threat that the CCP could access all TikTok data at will is true. Now, they might never do it, but the threat is definitely real.

 

[PostApple2016BrainWash]

It's better and time for California to distant from the toxicity of government by declaring as a state of independence.

Why? The Silicon Valley will crumble if it is going to blindly follow orders from White House that can create a lot of problems and damage the company prospect of trust and equality in conducting how it works as a reliable partner.

 

[LarryJoe33]

Or maybe parents should be better at their job?

Oops, I forgot, it's the government's job to raise children. Explains why everyone wants to hurry their kids back into public daycare, I mean, school.

I find this comment presumptuous and insulting.

 

[dannyyankou]

If only Trump cared as much about a pandemic killing 160,000 and counting as he did about TikTok...

 

[Wildkraut]

Not sure what you're referring to. In the US you can say whatever you want without government retribution. That's why we have awful stuff as pro-Nazi, pro-pedophilia, pro-Isis groups and the gov't can't do anything until they act or threaten/cause violence.



Thankfully!



Well, the international community must make up its mind. Whenever Trump says that he doesn't want the US involved he's criticized because he's leaving countries behind and so on. Whenever the US intervenes then the US is an imperialist SOB country.

Thankfully a death penalty? Wtf! I’m ashamed to be part of this craziness... If someday Aliens invade the earth, i will try to negate being a human, despite knowing that its senseless to try.
What a wonderful freedom of speech:

 

[LillDrutten]

Umm; nope. We'll download w


Millions also still use Facebook outside the USA, shall the EU issue a world wide ban on Facebook to stop our data ending up in the hands of a Trump regime?

Sort of we all ready have, it is called GDPR. So if they leak data for any european citicen they will big fee and can be stopped from have any activity within europe. And it does not matter if it is Trump or Biden. I feel a shame for us europeaans not standing behind USA effort against communist china. Whatever you think about Trump it is very different thing in china. The Americans has chosen Trump, the people of china is not free to select their leaders.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Thankfully a death penalty? Wtf! I’m ashamed to be part of this craziness... If someday Aliens invade the earth, i will try to negate being a human, despite knowing that its senseless to try.

Okay?

What a wonderful freedom of speech:

Should I mention WW2 or go for more modern times?

Police violence in Germany: An underreported problem? – DW – 09/17/2019

Police violence is a contentious issue in most countries, with Germany being no exception. A recent study suggests that there could be more instances of violence by law enforcement than official statistics show.

www.dw.com

 

[Wildkraut]

Okay?



Should I mention WW2 or go for more modern times?

Police violence in Germany: An underreported problem? – DW – 09/17/2019

Police violence is a contentious issue in most countries, with Germany being no exception. A recent study suggests that there could be more instances of violence by law enforcement than official statistics show.

www.dw.com

Sorry, but I wont play the german patriot in anyway, the german government are also just greedy selfish rats cooperating with the USA, as I said before USA “and other countries” ... as half german and brazilian im also ashamed for the current happenings and history of these countries.