Ok now try doing that when there's no App Store app because that is also an Apple app. You'll have to bring the phone to your computer at home and deal with the wild west of manually downloading and side-loading apps to an empty piece of hardware.
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U.S. Antitrust Legislation Would Require Users to Be Able to Delete All Pre-Installed Apple Apps [Updated]
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Sure it does. A market can be defined in any way you can specify. I can define a market as “MacDonald’s and Burger King’s” and, in that market, they’re a duopoly. Note that I did NOT define a market of “burgers”, you did.
Anti-trust laws have no regard as to what the specific product is. And correct me if I'm wrong, but last I checked telephone networks aren't a natural resource either.
I think that sums it up very well. Now, since Apple makes all 3 layers, you can't change the hardware part or the OS part, As this is not and Android device where there are hardware makers all using their flavor of Android....however (and I can be wrong see, because I am not an Android user) I believe you are locked into the hardware makes flavor of Android, so you can't install a bare Google version on a Samsung device...or am I wrong there. Since the iPhone and the OS are Apple, you can't put another OS (Android) on an iPhone. There are base apps that need to be there or the device has much reduced value and it won't connect into the Apple "ecosystem" and that is the big selling point and the value of the device. It just seems that you should be able to delete and and all of the Apple native apps....at your own risk should you choose to.
Yes, completely ignore Apple's existence as a duopoly with ability to write the rules while also playing the game.
Yes, that could happen, unless our own generation know when they are out of their league and step aside at the appropriate time.
False. They had systemic anticompetitive behavior:
- code to create synthetic error messages if you use some third party offerings
- branding the crash messages, e.g. netscape crashes give the user an option to download/switch to IE
- restricting vendors from installing third party applications
- penalizing hardware vendors by not giving them access to Windows 95 until post-consumer launch for not meeting Microsoft's demands
The biggest core difference is that Apple hasn't restricted OEMs, because they have no OEMs. Apple is the only one selling iOS devices.
Conversely, Apple did make the browser engine a core component of the OS, and shipped safari, chat, mail and music support a year before they even had the capability to install third party software.
And the browser (specifically the javascript engine) is indeed a component that is not replicable by third parties without breaking the OS security model. Javascript and WASM need to be either interpreted or compiled locally after being downloaded, making it the vector for dynamic buffer overflow/remote code execution attacks.
Microsoft couldn't make such a security argument because... well, they had zero security before ~2000.
Monopolies are a cherished part of capitalism. It is called doing your job better than anyone else and winning.
It's the abuses of monopoly position that are bad - that means you are changing the rules of the game to make it so nobody else can win.
The thing is - Apple has tried very hard not to change the rules. It's the expectations of what others can do on their platform is what has changed a the platform has grown.
Look at Spotify - they have basically said that Apple is abusing their monopoly position by taking iTunes and.. altering how it bills people. Well, and a bunch of complaints where (similarly to Epic) they whine that Apple gives them the same APIs and rules and cut that they give every other third party developer.
I think you are looking at from the technical part, while Anti-trust is not really about the technical part. Take for instance cars, none manufacturer has 50% market share. Anti-trust looks for balance taking into account lots of variables.
U.S. light vehicle market share by automotive manufacturer 2024| Statista
Two American brands held some of the largest US auto market shares in 2023, each at 13 percent or over. Toyota Motor Corporation ranked second.
www.statista.com
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You’re giving many users (like my wife unfortunately) far too much credit. I’ve had to install and setup every single app on her iPhone (thank goodness I got her off of Android at least).
Not sure what you are talking about here. I don’t use iCloud (or any of Apple’s pay services) and have never seen anything like this after any updates.
Why was it a good thing? It just gave google a massive leg up, which I’m not sure is a good thing.
sure IE was **** but I would rather Microsoft fixed it than lawmakers killed it.
If this passes in this form (unlikely!) I could see Apple adding a "Basic Phone Apps" group of apps to the store that you can install with one tap. You can already delete stock apps and reinstall them, so this is basically 50% of the way done already.
You can say whatever silly thing you want, but the rest of us will discuss topics as it pertains to how they actually exist in reality.
what a waste of tax payer money. This won't get passed, ever. But they will waste time and effort and donuts over debating and voting for this.
No, Microsoft was almost broken up because they refused to allow other browsers to be pre-installed, not just because they included IE, and also because of other anti-competitive practices, such as forcing OEMs to charge for a Windows license even if the machine didn't have Windows installed.
So when are we going to apply that to broadband ? you move in somewhere and you are told this is the only option for broadband/TV/phone......all because they made some shady deal with the township? I should be able to have all carriers available to me. We have Comcast....fortunately my area was part of the Verizon Fios project.....I made sure to be the first one to sign up, so I could be the first one to call Comcast that tell to shove their cable up their ass.
So, Walmart, is working very hard to compete with Amazon, there is no other player as big as Walmart. So once they get to that point there will be a duopoly of Walmart/Amazon...will they be knocked down??
Agreed. Don’t know what kinda process they expect but I wouldn’t want to download & install all the essential stock apps.
Bad enough I have to download all other apps I use when I setup a new phone.
Perhaps your mother doesn’t have as many apps or as much data to download.
I think I spent about 15 minutes just waiting for iOS to update. So half an hour is an impressive speedrun.
And no App Store, and no internet browser…….just a connection-less brick. Heck, Apple have already removed the power adapter of their own accord!
I agree and have brought up the Microsoft IE story a zillion times since that landmark case. I am beyond astonished what Apple has gotten away with since basically 2001.
I do not, however, necessarily agree with this bill because it seems to force Apple to make a phone with essentially an empty OS on it. What will be on the screen?...just the App Store and I now need to go looking for the top 5 basic apps I use on any phone (email, texting, web surfing, contacts list, phone application)? That just seems ridiculous. I would, however, suggest that although Apple can still load a bunch of apps on the iPhone by default, 100% of them should be uninstallable except for maybe the Settings app and the Phone app. I can't speak for iOS these days, but in the past, it was impossible to delete some/all of the Apple apps that come with the phone. I wanted to delete them to 1)save screen space, 2)save drive space, 3)I just plain would never use them.
i think that many ”naysayers” dont even realize why this is good for a customer. When there is a bug in a default preinstalled apple apps (an app that cannot be removed), then you need to wait when os get an update rather than the app is a separate app in appstore and updated via appstore. Would you rather download a mega than a giga and wait months to fix a small error?
That's less bad than what some in Congress are proposing, but it's still nothing consumers are demanding. In fact, from a consumer point of view, that screen would be annoying. Especially because iOS would need to show me a similar screen for Music, and web browser, and weather, and phone, and FaceTime, and camera, and so on.
It's not customers demanding features like what your mockup shows or what this legislation would require. It's other companies who want their products and services in front of your face, and they're looking to Congress and courts to make their job of marketing to you easier.
People mentioned the anti-trust case against Microsoft. This is same story: Customers weren't complaining that Microsoft bundled Internet Explorer (which, in the mid 90s was arguably a better browser than Netscape Navigator, which Netscape wanted you to pay for) for free. It was Netscape, along with Sun and other companies who, essentially, complained that Microsoft was just too damn popular with customers.
Really, All my data is not on the iCloud server. It's on my device and my local computer. i am not going to pay for over a TB of cloud storage to back up my iDevices... switching devices it a time consuming process. With all of the security, reentering everything in the wallet, logging back into different apps, etc.