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Waiting for Haswell MBP Mega Thread
- Thread starter thadoggfather
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I want to wait for Broadwell as well. And I dont think it will be 2015. It will be the next major refresh in October 2014.
And by the way Haswell-E is only for desktop right? Broadwell is for laptops.
:d
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Wrong. Apple used a 650M overclocked to a 660M's range. Therefore, they will either use the 750M (same as the 650M) outright, or overclock it to 755M's range (660M equivalent) which would make it, essentially, the same exact situation as the current rMBP's.
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I highly doubt broadwell would be pushed into February or so of 2015. I think people are blowing it out of proportion because they changed their schedule changed from 2014 to 2015, but then back to 2014. If I were investing, it would be a different story. But for now I'm going to assume that most of the here-say around here are conservative thoughts, and not liberal assumptions
I can't comment on Haswell-E as I haven't looked anything up on it but that may be the Haswell part 2 that is usually released sometime in the spring?
Am I the only one here who cares about images being displayed at 100% without having them resized to some small percentage like 5%/12.5%.33% and so on?
With all the medium format sensor talk (it is inevitable), I would absolutely love the images from these 50-200+MP to be displayed at 100%. Everything else can be scaled but the images left at native resolutions. (Similar to how the retina screens work with images in scaled modes right now.)
It may be very small bullet point to some, but for some Photos/Images are a huge part of the usage of the machine.
4k displays can only show 8-12MP images at 100%. When the Medium Format cameras become mainstream (relatively), an 8k display can't even show anything beyond a 33-35MP image at 100% without scaling.
I know this is a nit pick but there is some value. It is perhaps on the tail end of the diminishing returns curve, but it's there.
And let's not forget that, being able to discern individual pixels from each other is not a single parameter that's affected by high resolution. Microcontrast is a big side effect, which adds a lifelike - almost 3D look to images.
Yes there is probably some theoretical point beyond which no matter what you do things won't look any better to your eyes in any way, but I refuse to believe 8K is that point.
I haven't done much research on this and this is an armchair rambling so keep you salt shaker handy.
Also, I'm open to anyone correcting me since I will admit what I've posted is opinion, not verified fact.
With all the medium format sensor talk (it is inevitable), I would absolutely love the images from these 50-200+MP to be displayed at 100%. Everything else can be scaled but the images left at native resolutions. (Similar to how the retina screens work with images in scaled modes right now.)
It may be very small bullet point to some, but for some Photos/Images are a huge part of the usage of the machine.
4k displays can only show 8-12MP images at 100%. When the Medium Format cameras become mainstream (relatively), an 8k display can't even show anything beyond a 33-35MP image at 100% without scaling.
I know this is a nit pick but there is some value. It is perhaps on the tail end of the diminishing returns curve, but it's there.
And let's not forget that, being able to discern individual pixels from each other is not a single parameter that's affected by high resolution. Microcontrast is a big side effect, which adds a lifelike - almost 3D look to images.
Yes there is probably some theoretical point beyond which no matter what you do things won't look any better to your eyes in any way, but I refuse to believe 8K is that point.
I haven't done much research on this and this is an armchair rambling so keep you salt shaker handy.
Also, I'm open to anyone correcting me since I will admit what I've posted is opinion, not verified fact.
For me, it will be 1-3 day(s) after release.
Although, my case varies a bit, as I am holding out to see if the rMBP update impresses me. If it is a lackluster announcement I will then opt for a maxed-out 27" iMac and wait eagerly for Broadwell rMBP.
Also keep in mind, reviews for Mac products usually come within hours of release, with the more detailed/unboxing ones within days.
PS the posts count is almost over 9,000!
can someone explain to me why it's worth it to wait for broadwell? isn't haswell the first in the series of new intel chips and haswell is more of a tick update?
Yes. There is no real reason to wait for anything other than practicality. Broadwell should bring even better battery life gains (It's rumored that the gains are even more significant than Haswell), and some expect the next iteration of Intel's graphics (successor to Iris Pro) will really blow mid-level dGPU's out of the water. Also, assuming Apple sticks with the current (speculated) trend, of putting Intel graphics in the base model, and dGPU in higher model, next years dGPU will actually be a new chip from NVIDIA with decent gains, instead of 10-20% like this years is likely to be.
But that's typical stuff, I suppose. The main reason why I'm waiting is because I don't set myself up to need a computer right away. I can actually wait 1 more year and be fine. So I will wait. I probably just got into the MacRumors forum a little too early
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Hahah touché
Personally, I'm not waiting for Broadwell. I will buy next Tuesday: Haswell if it will have been released, otherwise Ivy Bridge.
Broadwell is likely to introduce quad-core CPUs to the 13" MacBook Pro. As mentioned above by VanillaCracker, Broadwell is expected to continue the dramatic improvements in Intel integrated graphics.
I will be a little bit surprised if Apple offer Haswell MBPs with discrete GPUs. I will be stunned if Apple offer Broadwell MBPs with discrete GPUs.
I dont' think Intel is ready today to catch up with mid-high level discrete graphics, so I will be surprised if the drop dGPU, not if they keep it.
But I agree with Mcarling, the trend is pretty obvious and in one or at most two generations we will see apple drop dGPU. But not today.
As for me, after some hesitations, I'm still in the waiting club for Haswell rMBP (that is I will buy it).
I may change my mind only if I'm able to get actual generation cMBP at a ridicolous price: let say Apple put cMBP at 999€, that become 880€ after Apple on Campus discount and still less than 1000€ with a Samsung SSD instead of superdrive. In that case it will be an hard choice, but I think that's very unlikely.
We will see. At this point I'm very curious about what will be Apple choices. For instance, they cannot keep cMBP at the same price level. Either they drop it either they cut price. In my opinion they will drop it if Apple is able to reduce rMBP, or they will keep it at a reduced price if Apple cannot cut retina price. And what about base SSD configuration? And what will be the actual battery life? 8 hours? 9? 10 or even 12?
But I agree with Mcarling, the trend is pretty obvious and in one or at most two generations we will see apple drop dGPU. But not today.
As for me, after some hesitations, I'm still in the waiting club for Haswell rMBP (that is I will buy it).
I may change my mind only if I'm able to get actual generation cMBP at a ridicolous price: let say Apple put cMBP at 999€, that become 880€ after Apple on Campus discount and still less than 1000€ with a Samsung SSD instead of superdrive. In that case it will be an hard choice, but I think that's very unlikely.
We will see. At this point I'm very curious about what will be Apple choices. For instance, they cannot keep cMBP at the same price level. Either they drop it either they cut price. In my opinion they will drop it if Apple is able to reduce rMBP, or they will keep it at a reduced price if Apple cannot cut retina price. And what about base SSD configuration? And what will be the actual battery life? 8 hours? 9? 10 or even 12?
Is quad-core in the 13-inch pretty definite for Broadwell? Would it be able to be able to come in a 28W CPU that Apple is moving down to in Haswell?
Cant wait to upgrade from my late 2008 macbook pro model..Itching for a new line of macbooks!
Amen!
Quad-core Broadwell CPUs in the 13" MBP are not definite, but seem very likely. I guess it would probably be back up to something near the 35W range we now have with Ivy Bridge CPUs in the current 13" rMPBs. The shrink to 14nm should make it possible for a Broadwell CPU with roughly the features of a 4750HQ or 4850HQ to have a heat dissipation of approximately 30-35W.
I don't see how any of what you said makes me wrong. Yes, Apple overclocked the 650m, I said that. And yes, they could overclock the 750m to the 755m range. My point is that it's not the equivalency people are making it out to be:
650m, 750m and 755m are all the same chip. The difference is their stock clock speeds. That means that a 650m overlocked to the same speeds as a 750m basically is a 750m, just with greater potential for instability (obviously the 750m chips will be a more stable batch or Intel wouldn't be selling them at those clocks).
But I don't care how stable those chips are, you're not going to clock them much higher without issues (or introducing way more power and cooling). There simply is very little overclocking headroom left on a 750m. In other words, no matter what you do the 750m cannot be a significant upgrade over the overclocked 650m Apple used last year. And it definitely will use more power/heat for any performance gains it manages, because that's the only way it can happen.
In other words the 15" really can't end up with a serious GPU improvement this year without going to a larger more power-hungry chip (760m), it's just not possible.
To make this simpler:
650m--------------------------650m overclocked-------750m-----755m/750m overclocked
The Broadwell CPUs with high-end integrated graphics (whatever will replace the Iris Pro 5200) is expected, based on Intel's claims, to outperform the 750M.
This is why the little kid in me was hoping for a 760 - since if Apple uses and overclocks the 750, it will only be marginally better than their overclocked 650s in the current rmbps.
Oh well, manufacturers can only work with what they're given.
But the Razer! 765! Come on Apple!
9000 Posts
It seems that we haven't made much progress since we were at 8000 posts -- except that we now have Haswell iMacs and know that Apple's incremental DRAM pricing remains the same, but incremental SSD pricing has improved. We also know that the Haswell iMacs don't have Thunderbolt 2, so the Haswell MBPs probably also won't have Thunderbolt 2. Speculation about integrated versus discrete GPUs in the 15" MBP remains inconclusive. A 1080p FaceTime camera also remains speculative. Haswell CPUs, 802.11ac, and PCIe SSD are the only improvements we can count on with anything near certainty.
It seems that we haven't made much progress since we were at 8000 posts -- except that we now have Haswell iMacs and know that Apple's incremental DRAM pricing remains the same, but incremental SSD pricing has improved. We also know that the Haswell iMacs don't have Thunderbolt 2, so the Haswell MBPs probably also won't have Thunderbolt 2. Speculation about integrated versus discrete GPUs in the 15" MBP remains inconclusive. A 1080p FaceTime camera also remains speculative. Haswell CPUs, 802.11ac, and PCIe SSD are the only improvements we can count on with anything near certainty.
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