Waiting for the 2018 MBP

[CWallace]

I was clearly talking about Intel's 9th gen CPUs which will launch probably shortly before or after Apple introduces their MBPs with 8th gen CPUs.

Intel may announce them, but we'll see how long it is before they are in mass production to the point Apple or other major OEMs can use them. I mean according to Intel's original charts, they were supposed to have them ready for the 2016 MacBook Pro refresh.

 

[Zdigital2015]

The Asus ZenBook Pro is looking pretty good right now, anyone have one of those?

The newest one with 8th Generation 45w H-Series CPUs has a mid-July availability date, so I doubt anyone beyond reviewers has one yet. That being said, it looks quite nice.
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Sure, that's also the reason why I still buy MacBook Pros instead of the comptetitors. But I'd still prefer to purchase a competitive notebook at twice the price, not some outdated hardware.



I was clearly talking about Intel's 9th gen CPUs which will launch probably shortly before or after Apple introduces their MBPs with 8th gen CPUs. Also, it's not true that no Intel CPU supports LPDDR4 - the Core i3-8121U does based on its Cannon Lake architecture. Not that it's a competitive CPU, but it still is a shipping Intel CPU that supports LPDDR4.

Intel just released 28w U-Series and 45w H-Series in April of this year, which bookends the rollout of the 8th-Gen CPU series that started in August of 2017, with the exception of the 5w Y-Series. They are also still (AFAIK) working through their 10nm yield and production issues. The Core i3-8121U is either a curiosity piece or a proof of concept at this point since it requires a dGPU to function as it has no iGPU, which seriously diminishes its value to most PC manufacturers.

As for the launch or rollout of 9th-Gen mobile CPUs, I think your chances of that happening are slim to none for 2018. Intel release schedules slip more than a clown on a banana peel. 14nm was a challenge for them and 10nm has proven to be even harder. Second quarter of 2019 is a much more realistic target.

 

[Sterkenburg]

I mean according to Intel's original charts, they were supposed to have them ready for the 2016 MacBook Pro refresh.

We're almost there, I can guarantee that the 32GB LPDDR4 MacBook Pro will be out by 2026 at the latest! At this point, I would wait.

Jokes aside, waiting for Intel (and then adding several more months for Apple to roll out a refresh) has been a pointless exercise in frustration for many years now. I'm personally growing very tired of it.

 

[hajime]

They used to always release new things on Tuesdays, until at some point a couple of years ago they released things not on a Tuesday

What so special about Tuesdays?

 

[Nugget]

Jokes aside, waiting for Intel (and then adding several more months for Apple to roll out a refresh) has been a pointless exercise in frustration for many years now. I'm personally growing very tired of it.

PowerBook G5 confirmed! (Seriously though, things have been worse)

 

[infernohellion]

AM I the only one who's rooting for Apple Sim enabled or SIM card enabled MacBook Pro?

 

[MBX]

Do you guys think the non-TB 13'' version will get quad CPU's too?

 

[Cardino]

Do you guys think the non-TB 13'' version will get quad CPU's too?

Sure. Otherwise it will be a macbook orair.

 

[Poki]

Intel just released 28w U-Series and 45w H-Series in April of this year, which bookends the rollout of the 8th-Gen CPU series that started in August of 2017, with the exception of the 5w Y-Series. They are also still (AFAIK) working through their 10nm yield and production issues. The Core i3-8121U is either a curiosity piece or a proof of concept at this point since it requires a dGPU to function as it has no iGPU, which seriously diminishes its value to most PC manufacturers.

As for the launch or rollout of 9th-Gen mobile CPUs, I think your chances of that happening are slim to none for 2018. Intel release schedules slip more than a clown on a banana peel. 14nm was a challenge for them and 10nm has proven to be even harder. Second quarter of 2019 is a much more realistic target.

I do not disagree with you at all here - it's just frustrating waiting for a quad core 13" notebook running macOS when the competition is selling them for almost a year now. And the wait might continue until the end of October, or maybe Apple decides to wait even longer - I'm just growing tired of waiting.

 

[TheralSadurns]

When looking at the competition, it seems like Apple could make the MacBook Pro thinner and lighter while keeping both battery life and performance on the same level (i.e. using chips with the same TDP). I really hope they take this opportunity, since 1.3 kg is on the upper end of what I would like to carry with me all day together with all my other stuff, but I don't expect them to actually change anything significant on the chassis for the next model.

You, my friend. Are my new biggest enemy in this subforum it would seem.

"Hey we want a powerful computer!!! It's a PRO machine!!!" you go "Puhh... 1.3kgs... omg... WAY WAY heavy... I cannot. Apple should sacrifice their MBPs even MORE!" This makes me REALLY REALLY angry.

 

[Poki]

You, my friend. Are my new biggest enemy in this subforum it would seem.

"Hey we want a powerful computer!!! It's a PRO machine!!!" you go "Puhh... 1.3kgs... omg... WAY WAY heavy... I cannot. Apple should sacrifice their MBPs even MORE!" This makes me REALLY REALLY angry.

I did NOT say Apple should sacrifice anything. I more than clearly stated they should keep using the CPU class they currently use, and I also stated they should use a battery of at least the same size as the current one. I only said that they most probably could fit all of this inside a lighter enclosure. You do not need to sacrifice anything in order to do this. If they keep the current size and weight, I would at least expect a larger battery or a dedicated GPU – the space isn't used as effectively as possible when comparing the MBP to the competition.

 

[TheralSadurns]

I don't really care about the thickness (though it's impressive just how thin the XPS is compared to the MBP), but I'm thankful for every gram of weight I can save. I want to bring the MacBook Pro with me on assignments, and I prefer to use a shoulder bag since I need to have quick access to some stuff in the bag.

This often means that I have a bag over one shoulder for five plus hours without pause. While I already tried to make it as light as possible, it still weighs about 4 kg without a notebook - and that can already hurt pretty badly after multiple hours. If Apple could shave off a couple hundred grams from the 13" MacBook Pro, I'd be thankful for sure.

A shoulder bag is not healthy and an ergonomic nightmare. Use a bagpack instead that distributes the weight evenly. Heck soldiers carry backpacks that way 20-30kg and MORE and march 20+ miles with this.
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I did NOT say Apple should sacrifice anything. I more than clearly stated they should keep using the CPU class they currently use, and I also stated they should use a battery of at least the same size as the current one. I only said that they most probably could fit all of this inside a lighter enclosure. You do not need to sacrifice anything in order to do this. If they keep the current size and weight, I would at least expect a larger battery or a dedicated GPU – the space isn't used as effectively as possible when comparing the MBP to the competition.

No they DID sacrifice a LOT already when they went as thin and light as they did in 2016. Starting with the size of the battery, everything being glued and non-replaceable, a keyboard with basically no travel that is prone to failure, a lack of space for additional and USEFUL ports that will never be replaced by USB-C, such as an SD card slot and HDMI. Make it EVEN thinner and lighter and you also start messing up the structural integrity of this thing. On top of everything else...

If you had said "Damn Apple... please create a new MacBook AIR! Make it really thin and light and give it a Quad Core U-Class CPU!!!" I would not have said a WORD. I would have actually SUPPORTED your statement!!! But further lobotomizing the PRO machines is a RED FLAG. If anything the MacBook Pros should be HEAVIER.

 

[richinaus]

A shoulder bag is not healthy and an ergonomic nightmare. Use a bagpack instead that distributes the weight evenly. Heck soldiers carry backpacks that way 20-30kg and MORE and march 20+ miles with this.
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No they DID sacrifice a LOT already when they went as thin and light as they did in 2016. Starting with the size of the battery, everything being glued and non-replaceable, a keyboard with basically no travel that is prone to failure, a lack of space for additional and USEFUL ports that will never be replaced by USB-C, such as an SD card slot and HDMI. Make it EVEN thinner and lighter and you also start messing up the structural integrity of this thing. On top of everything else...

If you had said "Damn Apple... please create a new MacBook AIR! Make it really thin and light and give it a Quad Core U-Class CPU!!!" I would not have said a WORD. I would have actually SUPPORTED your statement!!! But further lobotomizing the PRO machines is a RED FLAG. If anything the MacBook Pros should be HEAVIER.

I have just been looking at the new HP ZBook studio 360. For size and weight this computer still looks acceptable plus has decent CPU and GPU options together with drawing on the screen [which is a big benefit to me].
It is so tempting just to change the office to windows machines, and stop all this compromising.

 

[Robotti]

If you had said "Damn Apple... please create a new MacBook AIR! Make it really thin and light and give it a Quad Core U-Class CPU!!!" I would not have said a WORD. I would have actually SUPPORTED your statement!!! But further lobotomizing the PRO machines is a RED FLAG. If anything the MacBook Pros should be HEAVIER.

I could not agree more. There could be much more separation between the series. It’s very unfortunate that creative pros such as video and photographers have to settle for hardware that’s optimized for portability. In a sense, the naming convention is bad, because the non-pro models are really not non-pro. They are just targeted at people with workloads that are less compute-intensive, such as writers or traveling sales people. Yet these customers may be drawn towards the Pro, simply because it’s called ”Pro”.

 

[OzyOly]

AM I the only one who's rooting for Apple Sim enabled or SIM card enabled MacBook Pro?

They did actually prototype this but it never reached production.

 

[richinaus]

I could not agree more. There could be much more separation between the series. It’s very unfortunate that creative pros such as video and photographers have to settle for hardware that’s optimized for portability. In a sense, the naming convention is bad, because the non-pro models are really not non-pro. They are just targeted at people with workloads that are less compute-intensive, such as writers or traveling sales people. Yet these customers may be drawn towards the Pro, simply because it’s called ”Pro”.

I have a friend who fell into this trap, and almost immediately commented on how ‘slow’ the computer was. She is not tech savvy and trusted Apple on the ‘pro’ moniker. I basically told her if she wanted faster, to get a PC laptop, but she is scared to change, so suffers along with her macbook’pro’. A lot of creative pros are simply not tech savvy, and just buy the machine that is in front of them labelled a ‘pro’ model. They basically don’t know what they are buying.

Another thing to consider is the fact that people buy these laptops as their sole business machine. I don’t think they are designed to be this, but in fact compliment a desktop, for the more ‘demanding creative’ among us. But the issue I guess is that Apple only has one desktop that suffices [imacpro]. $10k later and you have a pro setup...........

 

[afir93]

AM I the only one who's rooting for Apple Sim enabled or SIM card enabled MacBook Pro?

You're not the only one, though it seems unlikely as Apple's way of providing mobile internet to your devices on-the-go seems to go more and more towards personal hotspots from your iPhone, aswell as continuity/handsoff/AirDrop functionality as a supplementation (most of which works with Bluetooth).

Which kind of makes sense for countries with unlimited or very high mobile data plans, but sucks for the countries that don't have such great mobile data plans yet. For example, here in Germany the average data plans of many big mobile careers still only include around 3GB of monthly volume. Which is a far cry from the unlimited data plans some other countries already have in affordable price ranges. Now if you want to use that data for not only your phone but your other devices on the go aswell, you can barely do anything with it apart from basic texting and the like.

 

[cool11]

Wonderful article about the touchbar, full of truth.
Apple removes really useful features, while providing questionable toys.

https://appleinsider.com/articles/1...well-implemented-but-serves-no-useful-purpose

 

[maflynn]

Wonderful article about the touchbar, full of truth.
Apple removes really useful features, while providing questionable toys.

https://appleinsider.com/articles/1...well-implemented-but-serves-no-useful-purpose

My issue is that its a solution in search of a problem. I think they made the change for change sake, and to try to change the narrative in why they don't offer a touch screen based laptop

 

[cool11]

My issue is that its a solution in search of a problem. I think they made the change for change sake, and to try to change the narrative in why they don't offer a touch screen based laptop

This is what I have called in my previous messages, like 'they are losing focus' there in Apple.

 

[Appleaker]

Apple should be rolling out updates to the 13" MacBook Pro before the end of the year. To me the size difference and weight difference (160g) heavier is pretty negligible, but YMMV. The delay in moving to 8th-Generation is more an issue with Apple refusing to release 15w U-Series updates before the 28w U-Series or the 45w H-Series were released. Dell and others don't have the same qualms, but I get where Apple is coming from. With such a limited lineup and media scrutiny, there would be howls of being cheated by people who want a 15" MacBook Pro that would have had no CPUs to go into it. Patience wins the day.

Not really, these MacBooks were always scheduled for Fall, it's not just a processor bump. However you do have a point. Ensuring all models is updated is of course important for Apple, but at the same time can hold them back when it comes to refreshing products.

 

[Mr. Dee]

My issue is that its a solution in search of a problem. I think they made the change for change sake, and to try to change the narrative in why they don't offer a touch screen based laptop

I really don't get the big deal about a touch screen laptop.

Touch screen Windows devices was just Microsoft's way of proving they can say they one step ahead on the innovation scale. I have owned a Surface Pro 3 for nearly 3 years now and I hardly ever touch the screen. The Type Cover is always attached.

Microsoft has made great progress on optimizing the interface for touch, but its still not a natural experience. you have this mix of classic desktop with the new elements; almost feels tacked on. Its not a ground up like iOS or Android.

If Apple were to introduce a touch screen to Macs, the current macOS ui would not be optimized for it. Probably the only touch optimized part of the Finder is the Dock.

The Global menu bar is an issue; the Finder is an issue; not to mention it would feel out of context on a clamshell design.

You already have this powerful large touch pad with these second to none swipe gestures that work so efficient already.

It would be like taking the Touchbar to another level.

My conclusion, the Touchscreen Windows PC Laptops is a desperate gimmick; a check box option.

This applies to the vast majority though, but if you are a creative who probably needs to have a single device can do it all, it might work for you. But then again, this is usually the problem, a device trying to do too much.

I don't want my iPhone to be a Mac and an iPad either. Sometimes, you want distinct devices that are optimized and good at what they do.

 

[Appleaker]

Wonderful article about the touchbar, full of truth.
Apple removes really useful features, while providing questionable toys.

https://appleinsider.com/articles/1...well-implemented-but-serves-no-useful-purpose

Yeah, if there is a space for the touch bar than it is above the trackpad, since the additional/custom key functionality will soon become pointless, it's main use is for swiping where it is still a unique interactions. But even that isn't a great place for it, especially on a notebook. Having a seamless biometric integration won't be a concern for the keyboard as Face ID makes the most sense on Macs, using Touch ID isn't a great experience and like the Touch Bar, isn't easily scalable to peripherals and therefore all desktop Macs, unlike their successors.

 

[TheralSadurns]

Not really, these MacBooks were always scheduled for Fall, it's not just a processor bump. However you do have a point. Ensuring all models is updated is of course important for Apple, but at the same time can hold them back when it comes to refreshing products.

If it is not just a CPU bump (and GPU presumably...) what else are they gonna do?
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Yeah, if there is a space for the touch bar than it is above the trackpad, since the additional/custom key functionality will soon become pointless, it's main use is for swiping where it is still a unique interactions. But even that isn't a great place for it, especially on a notebook. Having a seamless biometric integration won't be a concern for the keyboard as Face ID makes the most sense on Macs, using Touch ID isn't a great experience and like the Touch Bar, isn't easily scalable to peripherals and therefore all desktop Macs, unlike their successors.

Are you hinting at the fact that FaceID is coming to the Mac THIS year? (We all know that it'll come at SOME point...).

 

[afir93]

My issue is that its a solution in search of a problem.

The way I see it, the problems Apple aimed to address with the TB were:

(1) A vast majority of people weren't using or taking advantage of the the classical fn keys anymore (outside of system functions which are more suitable for a touch-like interface anyway), yet the fn keys occupied space on the central part of the laptop for everyone.

(2) Useful functions oftentimes have to be tucked away in submenus or the menubar because there's no great place on-screen to display them in a given situation. This is an increasing problem since both macOS and iOS get tons of new features each year, yet Apple aims to keep the systems simple and intuitive to use and features visible and accessible. But there's only so much you can add to, for example, a Finder or Pages window before you need to cram features into hidden places.

(3) Screen space is limited (especially on a laptop) and there's sometimes no good place on-screen to display useful information. For example, if you're watching a movie and want it to fill the entire screen, then obviously there can't be any controls for it on-screen because they would obstruct the movie. But that means that information like how far you are through the movie, how much time you have left will be hidden unless you wiggle around the mouse. The TB is one possible place where you can put at least some information (for example, a movie timeline can always be visible that way), though there are of course plenty other approaches to this problem aswell (using a second screen, remote apps for your iPhone or iPad, etc.).

(4) Some things or actions that you perform on your PC/Mac regularly are just more suited/intuitive to do on a Touch Screen. Moving around sliders or scrubbing back-/forward through songs or movies and the like are prime examples, but to give another example, which one do you prefer doing: hammering in the shortcut "Command" + "Z" forty times to swap through forty undo-steps, or just flicking a few times with your finger through one long undo-timeline where each undo-step is visualized? I know which one I'd prefer to do. (And yes, this undo-timeline on the Touch Bar is actually a thing on some photo editing apps, I just wish that it was more widespread and that Apple would adopt it aswell for Pages and the like)

There's probably more, but a vast majority of things that the TB does can be categorized into one of multiple of these points.

Again, this is what I think Apple views as the problems. I'm not saying that every user perceives them as problems during his everyday life, nor do I claim that the Touch Bar is a good solution to all of those, but it's certainly an attempt at addressing these issues. Just because these issues aren't always visible doesn't mean they aren't there – for example, when I'm editing a document or photo, I'm not sitting there thinking "Wow spamming a shortcut forty times to go back forty steps is so annoying", but when I saw the TB undo-feature, I thought "Well that's obviously better than the former".