What to expect from iMac 2012 - Discussion

[JTyler82]

I'm guessing in between WWDC and July sometime. I don't think we will see it this month, Unfortunately. But it'll be ok. 30 days isn't that long =)

 

[Monty Pavement]

Usually the UK online store is a good sign, and I am afraid to say that at 08.00 (BST) there were no signs of the store being down. So we move on to the 29th then...

A bit premature ...

The UK store doesn't go down til about noon UK time when it gets updated with new releases so there are another 3 and a half hours until we'll know for sure that today isn't the day.

Not that I think it is.

 

[willcodejavafor]

Usually the UK online store is a good sign, and I am afraid to say that at 08.00 (BST) there were no signs of the store being down. So we move on to the 29th then...

It's too early. Pretty sure it's later, around 11am?

 

[7709876]

My, we are going around in loops aren't we.

The most powerful MOBILE chip available today is the 7960m. M.

You cannot play games like Crysis2 at 2560x1440 on high settings on a 7960m at acceptable frame rates.

So no, they are not.

You can order laptops with the 7970m right now. Just use Google.

The 7970m is a mobile GPU.

This will play Crysis2 at 2560x1440 at high settings.

Stop talking nonsense.

 

[Opspin]

That makes no sense. Mountain Lion is not going to be released at WWDC.

Why not, wouldn't it be an obvious chance to show of a slew of new features?

 

[theSeb]

Why not, wouldn't it be an obvious chance to show of a slew of new features?

I was specifically referring to the comment about releasing the 2012 models with Mountain Lion. Looking at the last build, it does not seem like ML is ready for showtime and I don't believe that it will be ready for release for WWDC. There will certainly be lots of previews and new SDK features to the developers at WWDC, but I believe that ML will be released later in the summer. Hence I don't think that Apple will wait for ML to release the new models. I do, however, think that some of the new products may be announced at WWDC and they will ship immediately with a complimentary upgrade to ML, when it comes out.

If there are revolutionary (resolutionary) new features and a re-design, then I think Apple will announce the products during WWDC. If it's just a bump spec, then it will be silent refresh in the next couple of weeks.

 

[Crazy82]

I'm guessing in between WWDC and July sometime. I don't think we will see it this month, Unfortunately. But it'll be ok. 30 days isn't that long =)

It is if you alrady been waiting for a copple of monthes!

 

[Chippy99]

You can order laptops with the 7970m right now. Just use Google.

The 7970m is a mobile GPU.

This will play Crysis2 at 2560x1440 at high settings.

Stop talking nonsense.

I fear you are the one talking nonsense.

The 7870 is the same GPU as the 7970m, but faster.

The 7870 manages 24fps for Crysis2 at high settings and 2560x1600 resolution. The 7970m will be slower than that. This is with a i7-3960X Extreme.

http://www.techspot.com/review/504-amd-radeon-7870-7850/page6.html

It's hard to find 7970m Crysis2 benchmarks, but the one I did find says:

Crysis 2 - Maxed out Ultra settings, DX11, Hi-res texture pack
Run: From the start of "Second Chance" to the end of firefight in the enemy encampment, killing everybody, blowing up barrels
Min - 25 fps
Max - 61
Avg - 42.8

i.e. just about playable, although the 25fps minimum is iffy. But....

This is at 1920x1080 resolution and with overclocked GPU!!! It would be much slower at 2560x1440 and not overclocked.

 

[Commenter]

I'll bet you there are no retina iMacs in 2012. Makes zero sense to me.

I was gonna say "you're on", but really I said I think there's a better-than-50% chance of a Retina iMac in 2012, which means up to 50% not.

I have my arguments, but let's best just wait. Even if there's only an MBP announcement during or around WWDC we'll get a feel for where things are going. Only a couple weeks to go.

 

[lifeguard90]

I'm guessing in between WWDC and July sometime. I don't think we will see it this month, Unfortunately. But it'll be ok. 30 days isn't that long =)

Yes it is. Been waiting since December and April without comp

 

[AppleDApp]

Yes it is. Been waiting since December and April without comp

Exactly in comparison 30 days isn't so long.

 

[lifeguard90]

Why not, wouldn't it be an obvious chance to show of a slew of new features?

ML previews are not close to GM let alons primetime. New macs wont wait to come just for some new ios like UI features

----------

Exactly in comparison 30 days isn't so long.

Still is because theres still little mac news,3 weeks goes by slow. plus not having my own computer for now sucks & my money is ready

 

[7709876]

I fear you are the one talking nonsense.

The 7870 is the same GPU as the 7970m, but faster.

The 7870 manages 24fps for Crysis2 at high settings and 2560x1600 resolution. The 7970m will be slower than that. This is with a i7-3960X Extreme.

http://www.techspot.com/review/504-amd-radeon-7870-7850/page6.html

It's hard to find 7970m Crysis2 benchmarks, but the one I did find says:

Crysis 2 - Maxed out Ultra settings, DX11, Hi-res texture pack
Run: From the start of "Second Chance" to the end of firefight in the enemy encampment, killing everybody, blowing up barrels
Min - 25 fps
Max - 61
Avg - 42.8

i.e. just about playable, although the 25fps minimum is iffy. But....

This is at 1920x1080 resolution and with overclocked GPU!!! It would be much slower at 2560x1440 and not overclocked.

The 7970m is benchmarked here :

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Computer-Games-on-Laptop-Graphic-Cards.13849.0.html

Giving 55fps average in Crysis2 at 1920x1080 with extreme settings in a laptop. I have read reports of people getting playable 30FPS averages at 2560x1600 in Crysis2 with extreme settings. These are forum posts rather than formalised benchmarks.

So, to clarify the 7970m is available now, not next year. That point isn't debatable.

It will play current games at 2560x1440 with max settings. What is debatable is what you define as playable. Games such as COD Black Ops will play fine with everything turned up to max and not drop frames. Games such as Crysis2 when played with everything turned to max will average a very playable framerate. You may get moments when things slow - is one happy with that? Well that is an individual choice.

 

[brucebrendon]

self-cleaning glass'd be handy (+ on iOS devices!)

 

[iMacFarlane]

Yes it is. Been waiting since December and April without comp

What are you using to post here? Phone? iPad?

 

[HurryKayne]

Apple will not release New macs At WWDC! The only reason Apple would release new macs at WWDC would be if thay have a realy big upgrade for exapmle: iMac with tuchscreen and reteena desplay witch thay won't release just yet maybe reteena desplay but not tuchscreen.

I think release of new iMac's and Macbook's will be on this tuesday the 8/5 or maybe next 16/5 not later but, I can be wrong!!

and now what you think..
maybe WWDC won't see new macs on its stage..but...
i really find it very realistic..
i hope to see macs before but not after (please..this waiting is killing me)
don't you think?

 

[Bendrix]

I think the new iMacs will come out this or next Tuesday. If not, definitely on a future Tuesday.

 

[Chippy99]

The 7970m is benchmarked here :

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Computer-Games-on-Laptop-Graphic-Cards.13849.0.html

Giving 55fps average in Crysis2 at 1920x1080 with extreme settings in a laptop. I have read reports of people getting playable 30FPS averages at 2560x1600 in Crysis2 with extreme settings. These are forum posts rather than formalised benchmarks.

So, to clarify the 7970m is available now, not next year. That point isn't debatable.

I never doubted 7970m availability, that is not the point.

It will play current games at 2560x1440 with max settings. What is debatable is what you define as playable. Games such as COD Black Ops will play fine with everything turned up to max and not drop frames. Games such as Crysis2 when played with everything turned to max will average a very playable framerate. You may get moments when things slow - is one happy with that? Well that is an individual choice.

Personally, I doubt it's playable. The 7870 is more powerful (as I keep saying) and yet struggles, and that is with a very powerful processor.

But all of this is irrelevant. The point is, if it *struggles* at 2560x1440, it has not a prayer of a chance at 3840 x whatever. i.e. there isn't a chip in existence that can drive a 27" retina display properly and therefore Apple won't be releasing a retina display iMac in 2012. You can count on it.

 

[lifeguard90]

What are you using to post here? Phone? iPad?

iphone4 Which idc about iphone rumors 10x a week

 

[HurryKayne]

I think the new iMacs will come out this or next Tuesday. If not, definitely on a future Tuesday.

i like it..^^ especially the on future Tuesday...
till the world ends^^

 

[iMacFarlane]

I never doubted 7970m availability, that is not the point.



Personally, I doubt it's playable. The 7870 is more powerful (as I keep saying) and yet struggles, and that is with a very powerful processor.

But all of this is irrelevant. The point is, if it *struggles* at 2560x1440, it has not a prayer of a chance at 3840 x whatever. i.e. there isn't a chip in existence that can drive a 27" retina display properly and therefore Apple won't be releasing a retina display iMac in 2012. You can count on it.

All good points, but I got to thinking . . .

What if the displays were retina, and the OS automatically switched between drawing 1x1 pixels in GUI and 2D windows, and 2x2 pixels for all windows filled via OpenGL?

It's really an argument against a capability being properly matched to an activity that meets the intended purpose of that capability.

For example,
A formula racecar is capable of incredible speed. It is designed for this speed, but the assumption is made that the car will be driven at the speeds it is capable of on roads that meet certain conditions of asphalt smoothness, turn radii, and no dips/potholes/bumps.

Assuming the intent of a retina display of 5120x2880 is to run a 3D game full screen would be akin to assuming the formula racer could be driven at top speed on a US Interstate or the Autobahn. Doesn't make sense because it doesn't make sense.

 

[HurryKayne]

i understand your point and it makes..sense..
speaking about me i really hope to see
Retina displays just on MacBookPro line..
and not in the Imacs..
i also wish,hope,desire..to not see Nvidia Gpu on Imacs
maybe just on Notebooks where i desire to see reshape
as seen on the Air..
as you can see ..i have many wishes..so i just hope to have
Imacs with 7970m and not Retina..

 

[7709876]

I never doubted 7970m availability, that is not the point.

No, but you did say :

2. We are years from mobile graphics chips being able to run current games - e.g. Crysis - at 2560x1440 on high settings. No chance of running at 4k. So you'd be forced to play at reduced resolution anyway - i.e. what's the point.

Now, we have agreed that the 7970m is current tech and available.

We are disagreed as to how playable Crysis2 is. One thing I am sure of though is that current games ARE going to be playable at 2560x1440 with the 7970m. Not all games are as demanding as Crysis2. The likes of COD Black Ops2 and Diablo III will play at full rez with all the eye candy turned up to the max.

Personally, I doubt it's playable. The 7870 is more powerful (as I keep saying) and yet struggles, and that is with a very powerful processor.

But all of this is irrelevant. The point is, if it *struggles* at 2560x1440, it has not a prayer of a chance at 3840 x whatever. i.e. there isn't a chip in existence that can drive a 27" retina display properly and therefore Apple won't be releasing a retina display iMac in 2012. You can count on it.

I agree that the 7870 (desktop GPU) is more powerful than the 7970m. I also agree that nothing will play at any retina resolution on an iMac.

I think we are both pretty much in agreement that a retina iMac is just plain silly.

 

[Chippy99]

All good points, but I got to thinking . . .

What if the displays were retina, and the OS automatically switched between drawing 1x1 pixels in GUI and 2D windows, and 2x2 pixels for all windows filled via OpenGL?

You are of course correct that they could do that. (Although some hardware somewhere is still having to fill the pixels, even if 4 pixels are all the same.)

But really, you then start to think "is it worth it?" I mean, retina will add $hundreds to the costs and then you can't use it for 3d. All you will get is *slightly* smoother fonts on your desktop.

I'd rather not bother and I have no doubt Apple won't bother either.

 

[beosound3200]

You are of course correct that they could do that. (Although some hardware somewhere is still having to fill the pixels, even if 4 pixels are all the same.)

But really, you then start to think "is it worth it?" I mean, retina will add $hundreds to the costs and then you can't use it for 3d. All you will get is *slightly* smoother fonts on your desktop.

I'd rather not bother and I have no doubt Apple won't bother either.

but it makes sense in macbooks with a lot less gpu power?