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Honeycomb will be a piece of crap just like Android. The only reason people choose Android over iOS is because of carrier preference. Tablets don't need cell carriers. People won't buy Honeycomb.

Actually that's just your blinded fanboy assessment.

I went from a Nexus One on AT&T from an iPhone 3GS, I then went to a Droid X on VZW. I opted for the platform then the carrier.

I thought we were beyond the idea that people are choosing android because they can't have iOS. More accurately people are choosing android because the device they want is running it. People are choosing the galaxy tab because it fits a need, they're opting for android phones because they want what it offers.

You know not everyone likes the iPhone, iPad, iOS. Different strokes for different folks.
 
Yep. I think even all the posts that obviously miss the point, just can't wrap their heads around that crossroads of technical and liberal arts that has been a mantra at Apple pretty much since the invention of the original Mac, and our first consumer GUI. The market for people who don't care about inner aspects of their devices, or having to learn a larger degree of how to work computers is absolutely huge. Even in this world, that market far exceeds the "tech heads" that litter this forum and much of the companies that want to compete with the iPad.

They grab the smartest, most technically inclined people to make their new *ahem* iPad/iPhone killer. The most university-programmed students, who learned how to speak the technical alien-speak and think of computers in the way they've been programmed to. Of course, the biggest mistake the university programs don't teach, is how to speak to regular people, or to think from a non-computer user's mindset. The only class, perhaps, a technical writing class to write documents for the business leaders, but that also doesn't teach that. You have to break away, on your own, and remember what it is like before all this, and keep your own translations of all the technical jargon you learned. Then apply it on how to relate it to people who don't speak your new found language.

Anyway, the idea is that they make operating systems for the computer savvy, those who already think like computers, and want everything to work that way. You say that for yourself the moment you say, "what I want is something where I can fully control what I want it to do, on a higher technical level" This isn't speaking for the entire industry for which the iPad, or Apple computers try to sell to. They sell to the folks, who generally try to steer clear from computers, because they're daunting to the average user.

We're talking about these average users which avoided smart phones, when they first came out, because they'd rather stick with simpler cell phones because it did only a few functions which was easy to wrap their heads around. Smart phones were daunting.

The iPhone was the first to convincingly bring smart phone capability without looking or seeming complicated to users who feared the complication of smart phones. There was no nerdy stylus to drive them away. No complicated file system screens or understanding how background processes worked in order to understand why the application wouldn't launch. Just general conversation to loads of people still using simple cellphones speak this in volumes. They'd rather have a really limited device over functionality if the functionality brings complications or things to learn with it. The same folk who wouldn't even understand, when seemlessly multitasking, that something is really running in the background and why (for those other devices) is my battery running down faster.

It's actually kind of laughable that any company trying to directly compete with that same market, still doesn't have anybody that actually sees the simple concept. It's like one of those puzzles designed for a dummy, for which the smart one often over thinks the situation and comes up with the wrong conclusion.

Now don't get me wrong, some of these devices may just be a hit with the Tech-savvy person. I'm also convinced they'll carve out a market, this way. However, they wont capture the *big* market. The reason is very much like the video game market, the world is different today. Now top platforms are dictated by the less technical who completely outnumber the technical folks. Like how something like Madden may be one of the top reasons your console sells. They aren't hardcore video gamers, they're just people who like football. A demographic, at least in this country, that vastly outnumbers the gaming crowd. iPad sucessfully brought these folks onto the tablet industry, and as long as the competitors don't appeal to them, they'll never get them.
 
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Performance, Performance, Performance

That is what will decide the issue. The primary usability factor of the iPad is it runs for 10-12 hours on a charge. It wouldn't matter if Honeycomb spit out spun gold if by running it your device won't last a full day of use. True multitasking is a potential battery killer and is the primary reason that  went with severely limiting what features can truly multitask - background downloads, audio and the like.

As has always been  design strategy they will expand the features and iOS when the technology will support it and when there's a need for it for their vision of the user experience. Yes, the geeks that want LCARS systems on their PADDs will probably go to something they can easily hack and tweek, those of us that use our tablets as media consumption devices will get along with our iPads that even with my heavy usage has never run out of power between my own 'recharge' times.
 
That is what will decide the issue. The primary usability factor of the iPad is it runs for 10-12 hours on a charge. It wouldn't matter if Honeycomb spit out spun gold if by running it your device won't last a full day of use. True multitasking is a potential battery killer and is the primary reason that  went with severely limiting what features can truly multitask - background downloads, audio and the like.

As has always been  design strategy they will expand the features and iOS when the technology will support it and when there's a need for it for their vision of the user experience. Yes, the geeks that want LCARS systems on their PADDs will probably go to something they can easily hack and tweek, those of us that use our tablets as media consumption devices will get along with our iPads that even with my heavy usage has never run out of power between my own 'recharge' times.

Battery life is one of the main reasons I would never buy anything like an iPhone. Pathetic battery life.
I'm used to having to charge a mobile phone up, at most once a week. The thought of having to charge a phone up once a day like some people seems crazy to me.
A phone I need to work and I don't want to be in trouble if I forget one day to charge the thing.
 
Some day soon, these other companies will have to do something other than just copy Apple. You would think that they could actually invent a product instead of waiting for Apple. At some point, you have to grow up and stop feeding off momma's nipple.

Most of these announced Android devices will never see the market and those that do will always be 2nd tier. Why would engineers want to work at these companies?
 
The interface of android is a natural for the tablet, with widgets and full multitasking. The article really doesn't provide any more information other then what we already know.

Honeycomb is poised to be a very popular OS, in part because Googles business model of using multiple manufacturers. As a droid x owner this is where the model breaks down, its a double sword.

customers have to wait until the manufacturer releases updates, not google, and from my experience, Motorola has been exceedingly slow and when they eventually released 2.2 it was buggy and I had wait another 3 months for the bug fix.

for instance Froyo was released in late May, Droid X in June. Moto finally release the 2.2 upgrade on the last day of september. That's 4 months from when Froyo was out. It took over 3 more months for the bug fix. So in a sense I had to 7 months for a stable version of froyo

And Samsung still hasn't pushed 2.2 to my daughter's Vibrant.
 
Some day soon, these other companies will have to do something other than just copy Apple. You would think that they could actually invent a product instead of waiting for Apple. At some point, you have to grow up and stop feeding off momma's nipple.

Most of these announced Android devices will never see the market and those that do will always be 2nd tier. Why would engineers want to work at these companies?

Apple always steals ideas, even Steve Jobs said it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYK24SISaiI
 
They are only copying in broad concept of a tablet, but they also are not copying Apple as well. What they do, and how they do it, particularly for what Apple's device doesn't do, most often falls outside of Apple's design philosophy for the product, and why it sells to so many people.

Anyway, if anybody from these competing companies even read this, I'll feed them one piece of information for which they really should pay me 1 million dollars for.

If they want to compete for all of iPad's target customers, then I think they're entire approach is wrong. Right from the usability screening-process. In all actuality, they could go the right direction before they even design a single part. And now the quote which could net them millions of dollars, if not a billion.

"If you want to take on iPad directly, the easiest folk you can *screen* are not the people you have been screening. Look to the ones still with basic cellphones or lower. Ask them questions on why they aren't upgrading or interested in it. You don't expect much answers there, but what they will tell you will mean everything. If you simply listen, screen enough to figure it out, and understand. They understand the *human* approach better than anybody. You may think this is weird, but you'll understand the approach a lot better than you do now."

Unfortunately, many of these guys aren't OS programmers and they're just riding on someone else's Operating system. An operating system that currently breaks a lot of this mantra, right from the get go. And they really don't have a way to streamline it correctly.
 
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Battery life is one of the main reasons I would never buy anything like an iPhone. Pathetic battery life.
I'm used to having to charge a mobile phone up, at most once a week. The thought of having to charge a phone up once a day like some people seems crazy to me.
A phone I need to work and I don't want to be in trouble if I forget one day to charge the thing.

I have not had a phone that lasts more then a couple of days in years.

Does any smart phone exist that can last a week?

With the iPhone and other smarthphones its really no big deal to charge them up. When I get into work, I plug my phone into the computer via usb cable it charges, or I plug it in over night. Either way, its an easy and unobtrusive task
 
I have not had a phone that lasts more then a couple of days in years.

Does any smart phone exist that can last a week?

With the iPhone and other smarthphones its really no big deal to charge them up. When I get into work, I plug my phone into the computer via usb cable it charges, or I plug it in over night. Either way, its an easy and unobtrusive task

My guess is that they aren't using a smart phone if they go a week without a charge. And even if it isn't a smart phone, there must not be much talk time to get a week out of it. I bet they would be surprised with the iPhone. I get about 4-5 hours of straight 3G browsing. I have absolutely no problem going through a whole day when using data all day. If I didn't use data and just used it as a phone, the battery would last forever. On the weekends when my iPhone usually just sits there, its not uncommon for it to just drop 10-20%. But like you said, I just plug my phone in overnight usually, and keep a second charger at work for those times when it needs a topping off.
 
My regular cell phones would have to be charged each day, if they got much use. The only times they lasted longer was when I wasn't using them hardly at all. And even then, I'd give them maybe 3 days tops. Which is pretty much the same as my iPhone with similar usage patterns. However, most of the time, I use the iPhone a lot, and I haven't really noticed lower battery life in comparison.
 
I have not had a phone that lasts more then a couple of days in years.

Does any smart phone exist that can last a week?

With the iPhone and other smarthphones its really no big deal to charge them up. When I get into work, I plug my phone into the computer via usb cable it charges, or I plug it in over night. Either way, its an easy and unobtrusive task

That's why I don't have a smartphone. Actually for 3 reasons:

1: I have no need for one, after the initial, wow look what is can do period is over.

2: The battery does not last long enough, I LOVE battery life on phones, and I had one I could almost get 2 weeks from between charges.

3: Ringtones on smart phones that play the sound through a speaker are not loud enough. I like the small pizo electric, or whatever it's called speaker on old Nokia's that you can hear a message has come in, if your phone in in the house and you are out in the garden, the high pitched tones from those travel far further than any modern smartphone's speaker can produce.
 
Is this a serious concern?

Nope.

iOS and cool tendy Apple will appeal to some people, and Google/Android/Honeycomb will appeal to other people.

Then we can go the next 5 or 10 years arguing about which one is best.

Just like the Amiga / Atari ST arguments of decades ago ;)
 
Actually that's just your blinded fanboy assessment.

I went from a Nexus One on AT&T from an iPhone 3GS, I then went to a Droid X on VZW. I opted for the platform then the carrier.

I thought we were beyond the idea that people are choosing android because they can't have iOS. More accurately people are choosing android because the device they want is running it. People are choosing the galaxy tab because it fits a need, they're opting for android phones because they want what it offers.

You know not everyone likes the iPhone, iPad, iOS. Different strokes for different folks.

I think Verizon just shot that theory to hell.

What people are choosing the Tab ? How many did they sell ?

Oh, I am not an iPhone user either.
 
Yep. I think even all the posts that obviously miss the point, just can't wrap their heads around that crossroads of technical and liberal arts that has been a mantra at Apple pretty much since the invention of the original Mac, and our first consumer GUI. The market for people who don't care about inner aspects of their devices, or having to learn a larger degree of how to work computers is absolutely huge. Even in this world, that market far exceeds the "tech heads" that litter this forum and much of the companies that want to compete with the iPad.

They grab the smartest, most technically inclined people to make their new *ahem* iPad/iPhone killer. The most university-programmed students, who learned how to speak the technical alien-speak and think of computers in the way they've been programmed to. Of course, the biggest mistake the university programs don't teach, is how to speak to regular people, or to think from a non-computer user's mindset. The only class, perhaps, a technical writing class to write documents for the business leaders, but that also doesn't teach that. You have to break away, on your own, and remember what it is like before all this, and keep your own translations of all the technical jargon you learned. Then apply it on how to relate it to people who don't speak your new found language.

Anyway, the idea is that they make operating systems for the computer savvy, those who already think like computers, and want everything to work that way. You say that for yourself the moment you say, "what I want is something where I can fully control what I want it to do, on a higher technical level" This isn't speaking for the entire industry for which the iPad, or Apple computers try to sell to. They sell to the folks, who generally try to steer clear from computers, because they're daunting to the average user.

We're talking about these average users which avoided smart phones, when they first came out, because they'd rather stick with simpler cell phones because it did only a few functions which was easy to wrap their heads around. Smart phones were daunting.

The iPhone was the first to convincingly bring smart phone capability without looking or seeming complicated to users who feared the complication of smart phones. There was no nerdy stylus to drive them away. No complicated file system screens or understanding how background processes worked in order to understand why the application wouldn't launch. Just general conversation to loads of people still using simple cellphones speak this in volumes. They'd rather have a really limited device over functionality if the functionality brings complications or things to learn with it. The same folk who wouldn't even understand, when seemlessly multitasking, that something is really running in the background and why (for those other devices) is my battery running down faster.

It's actually kind of laughable that any company trying to directly compete with that same market, still doesn't have anybody that actually sees the simple concept. It's like one of those puzzles designed for a dummy, for which the smart one often over thinks the situation and comes up with the wrong conclusion.

Now don't get me wrong, some of these devices may just be a hit with the Tech-savvy person. I'm also convinced they'll carve out a market, this way. However, they wont capture the *big* market. The reason is very much like the video game market, the world is different today. Now top platforms are dictated by the less technical who completely outnumber the technical folks. Like how something like Madden may be one of the top reasons your console sells. They aren't hardcore video gamers, they're just people who like football. A demographic, at least in this country, that vastly outnumbers the gaming crowd. iPad sucessfully brought these folks onto the tablet industry, and as long as the competitors don't appeal to them, they'll never get them.

That seems like the core problem with trying to argue about Android or iOS in this forum. Yes, everyone knows iOS is simplified so that the average Joe can get right into it without any complications, but these forums are full of tech nerds like myself. As tech nerds we want devices to do more. Doing more usually involves things being more complex as an indirect consequence. Multitasking for example. The average Joe is gonna kill their battery life and have no idea why their device is dying so fast. Obviously most of us here know better, we close things we aren't using. The consequence of a simplified device is that the tech savvy groups suffer, with a less capable device.

If we were all happy with the way iOS was, there wouldn't be so many people jailbreaking (i'm not counting the people who jailbreak to steal apps). We want it to do more. Android users also feel the same way, people are installing custom ROMS because they want it to be able to do as much "cool" things as they can on the device.

Do I think Honeycomb will kill the iPad? Of course it won't, thats ridiculous. I do think however that it will do fairly well with certain groups of people. Mainly the tech savvy group. Even within this forum, full of Apple fanboys, there are a good amount of people excited about Honeycomb. Why? Because we're tech nerds :). The fact that there are people are even mentioning Android in this forum shows that.

The Xoom is definitely gonna be too expensive, if you believe the rumor mill. May have to wait it out for a wifi version if it even wants to to think about competing with the iPad.
 
Battery life is one of the main reasons I would never buy anything like an iPhone. Pathetic battery life.
I'm used to having to charge a mobile phone up, at most once a week. The thought of having to charge a phone up once a day like some people seems crazy to me.
A phone I need to work and I don't want to be in trouble if I forget one day to charge the thing.

you really can't remember to plug it in before you go to bed?
 
I think Verizon just shot that theory to hell.

What people are choosing the Tab ? How many did they sell ?

Oh, I am not an iPhone user either.

Although the Galaxy Tab didn't sell very well, the Android OS is still relatively new. OSX for example wasn't always so popular. As it slowly added features (and a lot of good marketing tactics) and some screw ups by the competition, people turned to something else, a Mac. I'm not saying Android is the better OS or anything, but it is a very capable one. One that may one day be able to take significant sales from Apple's iPad. Is Apple worried? Yes, they should be! If they don't worry in this business, they will quickly fall behind. Without new innovations, hype for the product will die down.

So one device didn't sell well. Android as a whole is doing pretty good, seeing that they're going up against the great Apple. Reviews for the device were fairly mediocre, but the great thing about Android is its on multiple devices, you can always shop around. I myself am looking for a tablet with a little more memory and power so I can output 1080p to my big screen. I'm still waiting.

Also, I don't own a single Android device.
 
That's why I don't have a smartphone. Actually for 3 reasons:

1: I have no need for one, after the initial, wow look what is can do period is over.

2: The battery does not last long enough, I LOVE battery life on phones, and I had one I could almost get 2 weeks from between charges.

3: Ringtones on smart phones that play the sound through a speaker are not loud enough. I like the small pizo electric, or whatever it's called speaker on old Nokia's that you can hear a message has come in, if your phone in in the house and you are out in the garden, the high pitched tones from those travel far further than any modern smartphone's speaker can produce.

yeah, what we really need is louder ringtones :rolleyes:

they are annoying enough as it is
 
you really can't remember to plug it in before you go to bed?

I know right. I never understood what is so difficult to charge ever night. You're asleep why it's charging.

I dumped the iPhone for Verizon because of AT&T. I know many people who have. Android is all flash and no substance. I hate it and can't wait until May when I can get an iPhone.
 
Although the Galaxy Tab didn't sell very well, the Android OS is still relatively new. OSX for example wasn't always so popular. As it slowly added features (and a lot of good marketing tactics) and some screw ups by the competition, people turned to something else, a Mac. I'm not saying Android is the better OS or anything, but it is a very capable one. One that may one day be able to take significant sales from Apple's iPad. Is Apple worried? Yes, they should be! If they don't worry in this business, they will quickly fall behind. Without new innovations, hype for the product will die down.

So one device didn't sell well. Android as a whole is doing pretty good, seeing that they're going up against the great Apple. Reviews for the device were fairly mediocre, but the great thing about Android is its on multiple devices, you can always shop around. I myself am looking for a tablet with a little more memory and power so I can output 1080p to my big screen. I'm still waiting.

Also, I don't own a single Android device.

Worried ? No. Will they continue to 'innovate' ? Of course.

Yes, one device didn't sell well. I ask, how many devices did sell well ? Same thing with smart phones, how does the iPhone compare to individual phones, not Andriod as a whole. (Remember, Android is an OS, not a company. It's owned by a company that gives it away so bots can search your device to feed you ads.)

I recent MR article stated Apple had 4% of the cell phone market share, yet 50% of the profits. So do you think they really care that Android (again an OS, not a company) has say 10% ?

http://www.netgear.com/home/products/hometheater/media-players/default.aspx

Try one of these for steaming 1080P media to your TV.
 
Im not an Android virgin firstly...

Now having played with Honeycomb first hand for the last few days on my Nook Color, whilst I'm impressed with it for Android, I still prefer iOS for it's simplicity. For the fact it 'just works' for the most part.

Android in comparison does allow more customabilty but there is far less of a coherent experience with Android. An app on android Market may work on your device, it may not.... Widgets may work or may hog your resources resulting in you needing to install a task killer. Multi tasking works true, but again because of the seemingly inferior quality control of applications, you can often get memory holes which again means you using task killers to recover memory.

Honeycomb at the moment looks great, but it doesn't address the issues with Android system and marketplace quality which destroy a users experience.

I know many will disagree, but I prefer Apple's iOS experience although it could certainly improve and I'm sure it will....
 
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Worried ? No. Will they continue to 'innovate' ? Of course.

Yes, one device didn't sell well. I ask, how many devices did sell well ? Same thing with smart phones, how does the iPhone compare to individual phones, not Andriod as a whole. (Remember, Android is an OS, not a company. It's owned by a company that gives it away so bots can search your device to feed you ads.)

I recent MR article stated Apple had 4% of the cell phone market share, yet 50% of the profits. So do you think they really care that Android (again an OS, not a company) has say 10% ?

http://www.netgear.com/home/products/hometheater/media-players/default.aspx

Try one of these for steaming 1080P media to your TV.

Those devices to stream videos are too bulky :(, wanted something a bit more portable that can also be used for entertainment and moving with me to friends house and etc. Thats why i'm still waiting. No rush though, its not like a NEED HD movies with me at all times.

I agree, on a per device basis. iPhone kicks some butt (can we curse here? haha). Also, Apple should definitely care about market share. Their profits can only increase if they have higher market share right? Apple is in it to make $$$. Because of this, they're gonna want to stomp out the competition. No matter how big or how small. Thats just the nature of the game. Their profits are huge, but what company doesn't want more profit?

As a consumer I really don't care about all this marketing stuff. I just want a product that does what I want it to. So far neither Apple or Android does :p. I do think however that Android isn't gonna die out any time soon and will be the first to give me a tablet thats perfect for me. I believe this because Apple is usually a bit slow on the updates. BUT I also believe that a year or two after I get my perfect tablet, Apple will do it better. They always do.
 
Worried ? No. Will they continue to 'innovate' ? Of course.

Yes, one device didn't sell well. I ask, how many devices did sell well ? Same thing with smart phones, how does the iPhone compare to individual phones, not Andriod as a whole. (Remember, Android is an OS, not a company. It's owned by a company that gives it away so bots can search your device to feed you ads.)

I recent MR article stated Apple had 4% of the cell phone market share, yet 50% of the profits. So do you think they really care that Android (again an OS, not a company) has say 10% ?

http://www.netgear.com/home/products/hometheater/media-players/default.aspx

Try one of these for steaming 1080P media to your TV.

Oh dear...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kdfc_HDJgXw
 
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