Why Apple Should Be Scared

[Piggie]

I suppose I expect Apple will do what Apple always does.

Just sit nicely and quietly in one area of the market, Feeling they are the only ones doing it right, aiming for those who want something "Special" and not wanting to go for the mass market.

They have not done this with the iPhone, preferring to aim only for the very high end of the phone market.

And they do the same with their iMac's, Macbooks and Mac Pro's.

I think they feel it's their safe area. Make expensive things, make them have nice build quality and make them easy to use, using established medium end hardware that's safe and established and good enough to get the jobs done.

They are happy to let others take the mass market, and the low to medium end of the price ranges.

I don't see why they would change this way of thinking now.

 

[Uofmtiger]

I think there are two parts of the market. Those that want their tablet to be a media consuming device and those that think it should be a laptop replacement.

Unfortunately, they have so many limitations compared to a laptop for creating... smaller screen size being the one that can't compete no matter what they do.

I have a highly spec'd laptop with 18 inch screen, HDMI, bluray, tons of hard drive space, and enough RAM to run Photoshop. It beats the specs on the iPad without a problem. However, that laptop that used to occupy my lap most of the time is now tucked under the couch and hasn't been touched in weeks. My main use for it is when I go on trips and want to use it's large hard drive to store photos and edit photos.

I think a lot of specs just don't transfer to how a tablet wil be used. I do think specs like battery life are much more important on a tablet. In other words, it is not just about specs...it is about usable specs.

One other thing that is being mentioned is that the tech savvy would prefer the features of the Android. The real geeks just jailbreak the iPad and make it do what they want.

That being said, there will be a market for the Android. They have a lot of people that are happy with their phones, so I would expect to see some of them go with the android device. Also, I am sure some will just look at the specs side by side and get the one with HDMI even if they would never use it.

 

[Carouser]

For Apple Consumer Electronics stock holders it is. Honeycomb based tablets will kick Apples teeth in if they do not deliver a knockout iOS5 update.

Nobody outside of nerdland has any idea about tablets other than the iPad. If Apple doesn't do as well as shareholders expect it will have nothing to do with iOS 5 vs Honeycomb. People aren't going to say "Baww OS 5 isn't good enough so I'll buy a honeycomb device instead". The market doesn't work like that at all (cue some apologetics about 'the masses' and marketing and Apple being complacent - it's all irrelevant; Apple is poised to continue dominating).

 

[Tunster]

Here's what Fortune is saying, about Androids Superiority over the Very Limited iPad.

"Why Android Honeycomb should have Apple scared"

" it's not until you actually see Honeycomb up close and play with it on a device like Motorola's Xoom that you realize just how limited the iPad experience remains "

http://is.gd/o9ayFV

I really don't understand the warning and scare-mongering for Apple. Everything is subjective in comparison to each device. We know Apple got out there first and delivered an outstanding product which is still very immature in terms of its concept. We all know Microsoft tried and failed to promote the type of device.

Apple knows how to capture the imaginations of the general public. It isn't just the design, but the marketing that goes along with it.

Why is the iPad limited? Can someone tell me. Apart from the iOS restrictions we know about, I know...

• it doesn't limit me to browse the web (okay, okay - flash is missing but I'm not missing it)
• the iPad can stream (to Apple TVs and other devices through other software and jailbreak) and be streamed to from PCs/MACs
• it can play video/music/podcast with no problems
• it can allow me to group apps in folders to organise my iPad
• read documents (with low cost apps) and upload/download using dropbox

Why do people think we need more control for the sake of less stability in Android's OS? More options confuse people (I know loads of standard consumers who can't work their way round Android as there are too many options). Why do we need 1080p connectivity when more people are getting N-Capable / Gigabit routers?

I like the iPads simplicity and lack of input ports/options.

On a final note, Apple do keep an eye on competition; but they don't compete on the same level as they have their own vision for products. Most companies like to steal or copy others ideas just to make their own work rather than influencing themselves with the customer to what they want.

The iPad 2 will build on Apple's success. The original iPad will become cheaper after the version 2 release and make the Xoom seem like a bulky and over-spec'd device. Where Apple's supreme marketing team could sell anything compared with a geeky device that does not appeal to the general public. That geeky product gets left behind because the company expects people to understand it. No advertising / or very little makes it worthless in retrospect.

Everyone has a choice at the end of the day. We all knew the wave of Androids was coming. The mass of devices is the only way it can compete as 1-on-1 comparisons will most likely make the iPad the winner everytime.

 

[Dr Kevorkian94]

We all know it's limitations, apple isn't scared because they said from the beiggining it's not supposed to be a full fledged tablet computer. Using this aspect of tabletry as a marketing scheme does not affect us here, but the main consumer yes. The only thing is other companies can't combine the ease of use with the functionality as apple does. The limitation will be overcome just not in the way we all expect. Apple knows what they are doing and it has shown time and again.

 

[gwangung]

Widgets may not be a huge huge huge thing, but functionality is needed even for the average Joe. Average people can understand widgets if they are explained to them.

If you need to do that, you've lost, particularly if there are systems with 80% of the functionality, but 20% of the need to explain.

 

[gatearray]

For Apple Consumer Electronics stock holders it is. Honeycomb based tablets will kick Apples teeth in if they do not deliver a knockout iOS5 update.

LOL. You must be living in a fantasy world where the "mass market" thinks just like you.

iPad - 15 million sold to all types of regular folks
Galaxy Tab - 1 million sold (if that) to Apple hating tech nerds

Do you honestly think the Xoom will significantly change this ratio? Those same million tech nerds will buy a Xoom, and then what?

 

[Piggie]

LOL. You must be living in a fantasy world where the "mass market" thinks just like you.

iPad - 15 million sold to all types of regular folks
Galaxy Tab - 1 million sold (if that) to Apple hating tech nerds

Do you honestly think the Xoom will significantly change this ratio? Those same million tech nerds will buy a Xoom, and then what?

I doubt the Xoom will on it's own change this.
It's the 20+ other makers also making similar tablets that will do it in time.

 

[Androidpwns]

LOL. You must be living in a fantasy world where the "mass market" thinks just like you.

You're kidding right? Point taken regarding the mass market, but android 3.0 is will prove to be a serious challenge vs io4/5...

If I was to use language like that, a Mod would PM me saying I was trolling... nice switch

 

[maflynn]

LOL. You must be living in a fantasy world where the "mass market" thinks just like you.

iPad - 15 million sold to all types of regular folks
Galaxy Tab - 1 million sold (if that) to Apple hating tech nerds

Do you honestly think the Xoom will significantly change this ratio? Those same million tech nerds will buy a Xoom, and then what?

No but like the android phones, the android tablets in total will exceed what apple sells.

 

[thesmoth]

I think there are two parts of the market. Those that want their tablet to be a media consuming device and those that think it should be a laptop replacement.

Unfortunately, they have so many limitations compared to a laptop for creating... smaller screen size being the one that can't compete no matter what they do.

I have a highly spec'd laptop with 18 inch screen, HDMI, bluray, tons of hard drive space, and enough RAM to run Photoshop. It beats the specs on the iPad without a problem. However, that laptop that used to occupy my lap most of the time is now tucked under the couch and hasn't been touched in weeks. My main use for it is when I go on trips and want to use it's large hard drive to store photos and edit photos.

I think a lot of specs just don't transfer to how a tablet wil be used. I do think specs like battery life are much more important on a tablet. In other words, it is not just about specs...it is about usable specs.

This is such an awful argument that just gets regurgitated on these boards without ANY thought from the person posting it.

Why can't we have extra features that make our tablets more useful, productive, and give us the OPTION to make them semi-laptop replacements? It would be very easy for apple to implement a simple filesystem (make a folder on the homescreen, ANYTHING), it would be very easy to do a lot of things. With the super fast dual core CPU/GPU setups coming, why can't we try and properly edit photos and videos?

If you don't want to, just view photos on your iPad and edit them on your laptop, but why the hell can't we have the option? People love the iPad because it's pretty, convenient, and has a fun and nice touch interface. I would rather edit photos by touching my fingers and sliding them around than through a mouse.

 

[thesmoth]

I really don't understand the warning and scare-mongering for Apple. Everything is subjective in comparison to each device. We know Apple got out there first and delivered an outstanding product which is still very immature in terms of its concept. We all know Microsoft tried and failed to promote the type of device.

Apple knows how to capture the imaginations of the general public. It isn't just the design, but the marketing that goes along with it.

Why is the iPad limited? Can someone tell me. Apart from the iOS restrictions we know about, I know...

• it doesn't limit me to browse the web (okay, okay - flash is missing but I'm not missing it)
• the iPad can stream (to Apple TVs and other devices through other software and jailbreak) and be streamed to from PCs/MACs
• it can play video/music/podcast with no problems
• it can allow me to group apps in folders to organise my iPad
• read documents (with low cost apps) and upload/download using dropbox

Why do people think we need more control for the sake of less stability in Android's OS? More options confuse people (I know loads of standard consumers who can't work their way round Android as there are too many options). Why do we need 1080p connectivity when more people are getting N-Capable / Gigabit routers?

I like the iPads simplicity and lack of input ports/options.

On a final note, Apple do keep an eye on competition; but they don't compete on the same level as they have their own vision for products. Most companies like to steal or copy others ideas just to make their own work rather than influencing themselves with the customer to what they want.

The iPad 2 will build on Apple's success. The original iPad will become cheaper after the version 2 release and make the Xoom seem like a bulky and over-spec'd device. Where Apple's supreme marketing team could sell anything compared with a geeky device that does not appeal to the general public. That geeky product gets left behind because the company expects people to understand it. No advertising / or very little makes it worthless in retrospect.

Everyone has a choice at the end of the day. We all knew the wave of Androids was coming. The mass of devices is the only way it can compete as 1-on-1 comparisons will most likely make the iPad the winner everytime.

That was the most pathetic, non-ambitious list of 'functions' i've ever seen. I think you might be happy with a texas instruments graphing calculator.

There are so many weird apple users (probably shareholders trying to keep everything positive to 'protect' their investments) that post on here that will defend ANYTHING apple. "Oh, I love to be able to browse the internet with no flash and to read documents, and even EMAIL." Seriously, just because your use of computers is exceptionally limited and you can't imagine a greater purpose for them, why does that make it OK for apple to cripple their iOS?

Honeycomb is the future and apple will follow. I can guarantee apple had planned updates to iOS very similar to what we're seeing in honeycomb (although obviously in more pretty, simple, and 'apple' way) and have just been waiting to dole them out as they see fit based on the competition.

 

[gatearray]

That was the most pathetic, non-ambitious list of 'functions' i've ever seen. I think you might be happy with a texas instruments graphing calculator.

...

Would an Android enthusiast here on this iPad forum please tell us WTF you plan to do with Honeycomb tablets and/or a filesystem??? It's always the same ambiguous proclamations about being "free" and able to "do what you want" etc. over and over again...

What do you specifically want to do with your mobile OS?

 

[Piggie]

Would an Android enthusiast here on this iPad forum please tell us WTF you plan to do with Honeycomb tablets and/or a filesystem??? It's always the same ambiguous proclamations about being "free" and able to "do what you want" etc. over and over again...

What do you specifically want to do with your mobile OS?

I'm not a Android enthusiast or an anything enthusiast to be honest, but I do know when things work the way they should do.

I think all files should be in one place where the correct apps can access them.

For example, say the iPad has it's video player. Being Apple, for some reason they choose not to support many formats. I do have video's on my iPad and it's all fine.

Then someone on the app store makes a video player which supports the format's Apple's player does, and also some other common formats.
I buy and install this new app. Great.

But hang on, it can't see any of the movies and video clips already on the device. I have to copy them all to this apps storage area.

The same goes for picture apps, and document apps.

It's totally stupid that video apps cannot see all videos, Paint/photo apps can't see all your pictures and document apps can't see your documents.

Could you imagine trying to use a computer this way? No of course not as it would be stupid.

I think this is what people mean when they talk about a file system.
It's way more confusing for Apple's target audience to work out when their new player can't see their current video clips, then to be told you have to go into iTunes and find the apps, then drag the same clips into those players directories also.

 

[MRU]

Would an Android enthusiast here on this iPad forum please tell us WTF you plan to do with Honeycomb tablets and/or a filesystem??? It's always the same ambiguous proclamations about being "free" and able to "do what you want" etc. over and over again...

What do you specifically want to do with your mobile OS?

In my experience they need access to the file system to Hack & customise the OS & hardware with over clocked kernels and unapproved themes and widgets that often break the system resulting in users having to use ADB to slipstream content on the device....

This tinkering gives them great pleasure, just visit XDA forums for proof


The majority of Android users just want a similar experience to the iPad, and as I said previously having tinkered with Honeycomb it still does not address the major problems of Android which is the generally un-unified experience of Applications in the Market. Some which may worknin device A, not in device B, and break device C.

People who sit around debating subjects such as these are not representative of the overall users of either iPads or Android systems. Most Android users are unaware of which version their hardware is running....

 

[Gryzor]

I'm not a Android enthusiast or an anything enthusiast to be honest, but I do know when things work the way they should do.

Yeah right. If you are so unhappy with an iPad or any Apple device for that matter, go get something else. The iPad is not intended to be a portable replacement for your lightweight powerful laptop that you would have like me if you were actually bothered about working with files on the move. It is an ENTERTAINMENT device, not a workhorse.

 

[Piggie]

Yeah right. If you are so unhappy with an iPad or any Apple device for that matter, go get something else. The iPad is not intended to be a portable replacement for your lightweight powerful laptop that you would have like me if you were actually bothered about working with files on the move. It is an ENTERTAINMENT device, not a workhorse.

I have the iPad as it's currently the best product of it's type on the market, as for the future who knows.

Even you can't say that having 4 video players, which may offer different feature you like, and then if you wish to be able to see the same video using all 5 players, you have to have 5 copies of the same video file on the iPad is a sensible scenario?

Or course, any video player should be able to see the same library of video files. Anything else does not make sense.

 

[vrDrew]

One of the most significant business-theory books of the past ten years has been The Paradox of Choice. In this book the authors go to great lengths to explain why an overabundance of "choice" actually makes Americans less happy.

Whenever I read someone blathering on about all the "choices" that the latest Android/Honeycomb etc. release is going to bring them - I'm reminded of this book. And specifically how the blizzard of "options" Android in general offers bewilders and frustrates the vast majority of users.

Just take a look at some of the utter nonsense being "offered" by upcoming Android tablets: 3D video recording. 1080 video playback. A freaking barometer. And thats before we get into the multiple App Stores on offer from competing organizations.

Apple is succesful because it offers a limited number of choices: iPad in wifi or 3G flavors. Ditto with MacBook Air, etc. The differences between the various models are fairly easy for most people to understand. You can figure out what each model is going to do for you, and what you get for your money.

But contrast this with a Tablet with a couple of 3D cameras. How is that going to make most people feel?

The answer is, that putting 3D cameras on a device is going to make most people feel worse about themselves. Sure: James Cameron spent a few hundred million dollars and many thousands of person-years and made a great 3D movie: Avatar. But does anyone in their right mind really think they are going to create anything even vaguely interesting with their blasted 3D Tablet cam? No - they do not. For most people, that stupid 3D camera setup is going to be a permanent reminder of their individual shortcomings. Their lack of skill and/or tools as a 3D filmmaker. And that moronic barometer is going to keep reminding anyone dumb enough to buy one what a sucker they are.

95% of the companies that are rushing to bring out "iPad killers" simply don't understand this basic characteristic of most human beings. Compare an iPad, which pretty much everyone from a 3 year-old to a centenarian (and, from what I've seen, more than a few cats) can start doing amazing things pretty easily. Or these idiotic, feature-riddled, Android tablets that are just going to make people feel like crap.

 

[kdarling]

Android in comparison does allow more customabilty but there is far less of a coherent experience with Android. An app on android Market may work on your device, it may not....

Both the Android Market and the Apple App Store work the same way: as long as the developer has correctly set the device / OS version(s) info, the app should only show up to those devices.

Widgets may work or may hog your resources resulting in you needing to install a task killer.

You don't have to install a task killer. The Android app management section in Settings allows the user to stop a runaway process, just as the (X) on the last-used apps bar in iOS has the same purpose.

Multi tasking works true, but again because of the seemingly inferior quality control of applications, you can often get memory holes which again means you using task killers to recover memory.

Again, no need for task killers. And no, Apple doesn't do quality control of app actions. They don't have time. They only check for violations of copyrights and API rules.

Cheers!

 

[Piggie]

Why don't Car makers, TV makers, Watch makers, Clothing designers, house builders, etc etc, all just make 1 model then?

Might is be that humans are not all robots, we don't all act and think the same and have the same likes, dislikes, needs and wants.

Why would anyone thing that unlike almost any other product on sale to the public there should only be one make, model, size, design of tablet computer.

Perhaps Ford should do as Apple does, and just make 1 car design and leave it at that.

We can then all buy the same cloths, eat the same food, and watch the same TV shows on our identical TV's

Did you see Apples' 1984 Advert a few years ago?

 

[BobVB]

Battery life is one of the main reasons I would never buy anything like an iPhone. Pathetic battery life.
I'm used to having to charge a mobile phone up, at most once a week. The thought of having to charge a phone up once a day like some people seems crazy to me.
A phone I need to work and I don't want to be in trouble if I forget one day to charge the thing.

Now for me the small responsibility of setting any device in its charger at night isn't a big deal. And I have one of those 2.2 amp external batteries that can recharge my iPhone 1.5x in my standard equipment. As long as my phone will last the day I've got no complaints and once again, I've never had my iPhone run out a juice as long as I charged it responsibly.

 

[Piggie]

I still find it amazing that people are defending the fact that they need to charge their phone once a day.

It's amazing to think people accept this.

Years ago people would think you are mad for making a phone that would have to be charged every single day.

We have really gone backwards on this one.

 

[BobVB]

I still find it amazing that people are defending the fact that they need to charge their phone once a day.

If it were only a phone you might have a point. But I have a computer that's always with me that allows me to do 90% of what I used a laptop for at any time, any where. AND it makes phone calls.

It lasts longer than a laptop and does more - I wouldn't expect a laptop replacement to need to be charged less than once a day really, would you?

 

[Cha]

The iPad is not intended to be a portable replacement for your lightweight powerful laptop that you would have like me if you were actually bothered about working with files on the move.

Gryzor... I am not quite too sure that was the point Piggy was trying to get across...

Let me put it this way, before iBooks supported PDFs, you had to download different PDF apps to read them. Say you download 2 of the PDF apps, because one may handle big PDFs better than the other, but the other one is better with rendering the PDFs faster. The way you had to view the PDFs in both apps was to drag and drop the PDFs into both apps in iTunes. It would be nice to allow apps to access a "common" location where they can load the content, instead of transferring multiple copies to different apps.

You can see this in action with photos. All the different photo apps can access a common photo location on the filesystem. Imagine if you had to transfer multiple copies of the photos to ever different image apps you may have. It would be a big pain.

I agree with this limitation with the os, and I would not be surprised that this limitation will be fix eventually...

 

[Carouser]

Let me put it this way, before iBooks supported PDFs, you had to download different PDF apps to read them. Say you download 2 of the PDF apps, because one may handle big PDFs better than the other, but the other one is better with rendering the PDFs faster. The way you had to view the PDFs in both apps was to drag and drop the PDFs into both apps in iTunes. It would be nice to allow apps to access a "common" location where they can load the content, instead of transferring multiple copies to different apps.

Maybe people should be complaining about the terrible .pdf apps then instead of thinking iOS needs a filesystem. Who on Earth is using 5 different video apps, thinking the solution is fundamentally revamping iOS to accommodate that kind of inefficiency?

Just as iOS does away with filesystems, so too it won't be long until we do away with thinking of files as these discrete objects to load up devices with. It's antiquated thinking about how to interact with content.