Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Why does Walmart not like Apple Pay?

Newtons Apple said:
I am pretty sure that I read that obama had mandated his banking zar to require chipped cards in 2015. I believe that to be so.
Click to expand...

A lot of you guys are mixing everything up.
The mandate in 2015 is for banks/credit card issuers, to include the chip technology (not necessarily contactless) on the cards. There is no mandate on the merchants to update their terminals for that; merchants can keep using the magnetic stripe, but they will now have to pay for the cost of the fraud (instead of the bank).

Now regarding NFC vs Apple Pay. Apple Pay requires NFC to work, but NFC doesn't mean Apple Pay will work; Apple Pay has both technical and contractual aspects to it. Technically, most NFC terminals should be able to handle Apple Pay, but for multiple reasons large retailers like Walmart, which control a lot more of their payment process than small shops can opt out of Apple Pay if this goes against their interest.
For small shops, then NFC support is usually equal to Apple Pay support, as there would be no benefit for them to opt out.
Finally, remember that Apple Pay is a wallet; and if the card you stored is not a type of card usually accepted by the merchant, using Apple Pay won't magically make it work.
 
Walmart has nothing against Apple pay. None of these retailers "refuse" to accept Apple pay, it's all marketing nonsense. Walmart has no financial incentive to upgrade all of their POS devices to support NFC simply because Apple Pay is being released. All retailers will eventually be on board, just like how everyone eventually started accepting credit/debit cards.

To say they are against Apple pay or refuse in some weird way is disingenuous. It is simply not cost effective for them to overhaul their entire POS system for this sole reason.
 
mailboxbetacoin said:
Now regarding NFC vs Apple Pay. Apple Pay requires NFC to work, but NFC doesn't mean Apple Pay will work; Apple Pay has both technical and contractual aspects to it. Technically, most NFC terminals should be able to handle Apple Pay, but for multiple reasons large retailers like Walmart, which control a lot more of their payment process than small shops can opt out of Apple Pay if this goes against their interest.
Click to expand...

This is incorrect. If the merchant has NFC enabled then Apple Pay will work. End of story. Either Walmart has NFC-capable POS terminals, but the NFC is disabled on them or their terminals do not support NFC. It's not just Apple Pay that doesn't work; no contactless payment method will work.

Anyone running NFC has no ability to not accept Apple Pay. The terminal can't even see that the payment is Apple Pay, they just see what looks like a credit card number, which they send on to their payment processor.
 
mailboxbetacoin said:
A lot of you guys are mixing everything up.
The mandate in 2015 is for banks/credit card issuers, to include the chip technology (not necessarily contactless) on the cards. There is no mandate on the merchants to update their terminals for that; merchants can keep using the magnetic stripe, but they will now have to pay for the cost of the fraud (instead of the bank).

Now regarding NFC vs Apple Pay. Apple Pay requires NFC to work, but NFC doesn't mean Apple Pay will work; Apple Pay has both technical and contractual aspects to it. Technically, most NFC terminals should be able to handle Apple Pay, but for multiple reasons large retailers like Walmart, which control a lot more of their payment process than small shops can opt out of Apple Pay if this goes against their interest.
For small shops, then NFC support is usually equal to Apple Pay support, as there would be no benefit for them to opt out.
Finally, remember that Apple Pay is a wallet; and if the card you stored is not a type of card usually accepted by the merchant, using Apple Pay won't magically make it work.
Click to expand...
I just used Apple Pay at a mom and pop car repair place. They definitely did not sign up for Apple Pay. It works fine wherever NFC is taken. The car place had a First Data terminal with a PIN pad that took Contactless and chip and PIN
 
But I wonder when Canada supports Apple Pay, will the NFC terminals in Walmart and Home Depot work with Apple Pay if it's still not accepted in the US?
 
yg17 said:
Um check your quote tags. I never said that. I wouldn't defend WalMart in a million years.
Click to expand...

Sorry, fixed it. I think I meant to reply to something you said to and decided to not bother (I like my Toyota by the way and it's a very fun car :p ). Well I guess I kinda bothered now ;).
 
mailboxbetacoin said:
A lot of you guys are mixing everything up.
The mandate in 2015 is for banks/credit card issuers, to include the chip technology (not necessarily contactless) on the cards. There is no mandate on the merchants to update their terminals for that; merchants can keep using the magnetic stripe, but they will now have to pay for the cost of the fraud (instead of the bank).

Now regarding NFC vs Apple Pay. Apple Pay requires NFC to work, but NFC doesn't mean Apple Pay will work; Apple Pay has both technical and contractual aspects to it. Technically, most NFC terminals should be able to handle Apple Pay, but for multiple reasons large retailers like Walmart, which control a lot more of their payment process than small shops can opt out of Apple Pay if this goes against their interest.
For small shops, then NFC support is usually equal to Apple Pay support, as there would be no benefit for them to opt out.
Finally, remember that Apple Pay is a wallet; and if the card you stored is not a type of card usually accepted by the merchant, using Apple Pay won't magically make it work.
Click to expand...

I never said there was any mandate for any of the retailers. It is the banks that must convert to chipped cards. I a have decided to not use the system anyway so it really does not matter to me.
 
naturalstar said:
Now Target on the other hand... yeah, they need to get onboard for in-store, though I do love my 5% instant discount every time I shop there!
Click to expand...

Best case for them is to directly support their Redcard's in Apple Pay and maybe even find a way to tie the cartwheel stuff to it. That would be a huge win win for both Apple and Target.

Theoretically Apple Pay should be able to support store branded cards if both companies worked together. Something like Apple Pay would shine with store branded cards. We all will probably carry around a Visa or AmEx for the next few years anyway. What we want to get rid of are some of the cards that only get us benefits at the store that issued them.
 
Look at Texas, Wyoming and Arkansas on this map, the walmart family is only getting richer and richer. Dont think they need Apple pay as much as Apple needs them.


15bqu1.png
 
Last edited:
dontwalkhand said:
I'm hoping that Apple Pay will win out due to the inconvenience of Chip & PIN. At Walmart, processing a Chip & PIN transaction no joke took about 30 seconds, before I was able to remove my card.

Apple Pay, tap and go.
Click to expand...

Realistically I don't think it's going to be possible for Apple Pay to overtake Chip+PIN. When the liability shift takes place next year EVERYBODY is going be issued a new card in the US. Apply Pay cannot overtake Chip+PIN until it's accessible to everyone, and the iPhone requirement makes that a non-starter. Hopefully it'll take off and be available at a significant number of retailers, but a replacement C&P it is not.
 
CoilTap said:
As an aside, I love when Target asks me if I'd like to "open a new Redcard account and save 5% today" when my total is like $8.00. Yes, I'd really like to save $0.40 in exchange for a hard pull on my credit. Great deal.
Click to expand...

I thought the same thing for a long time until I found out about the Redcard Debit option. They link it to your checking account so there's no credit pull, interest rates, etc. 5% isn't a huge deal, but there are a couple other fringe benefits that help make it worthwhile if you shop at Target fairly regularly.
 
cornerexit said:
Same. I loathe the place and their business practices, especially the way they treat employees and small businesses they run out of town. They don't get my $ unless I have no alternative. In that one time a year I feel dirty and take a shower aftewards. The place is a ********.
Click to expand...

Yep buy more local oh im in cdn, in usa is walmart is called local?
 
Trius said:
Walmart has nothing against Apple pay. None of these retailers "refuse" to accept Apple pay, it's all marketing nonsense. Walmart has no financial incentive to upgrade all of their POS devices to support NFC simply because Apple Pay is being released. All retailers will eventually be on board, just like how everyone eventually started accepting credit/debit cards.

To say they are against Apple pay or refuse in some weird way is disingenuous. It is simply not cost effective for them to overhaul their entire POS system for this sole reason.
Click to expand...

Hmm?

Walmart said verbatim they would not be supporting ApplePay. There POS system in a lot of location (the ones near me) already support NFC, they just aren't turned on.
 
Trius said:
Walmart has nothing against Apple pay. None of these retailers "refuse" to accept Apple pay, it's all marketing nonsense. Walmart has no financial incentive to upgrade all of their POS devices to support NFC simply because Apple Pay is being released. All retailers will eventually be on board, just like how everyone eventually started accepting credit/debit cards.

To say they are against Apple pay or refuse in some weird way is disingenuous. It is simply not cost effective for them to overhaul their entire POS system for this sole reason.
Click to expand...

You couldn't actually be more wrong on this issue.

Walmart is part of a group of merchants called Merchant Customer Exchange that are trying to overthrow Visa and Mastercard and return customers to paying directly from their bank account (like with a cheque).

They do not want paying by credit card to become easier, they want their alternative launching next year to be the fastest option.

Furthermore, there are debit card routing considerations with contactless.

In sum, yes, Walmart and other large merchants are actively fighting to make sure contactless does NOT catch on. Many retailers have contactless capable readers with the function turned off (Target, Barnes and Noble, Lowes, Old Navy) while others used to have the function on but have switched it off after launch (ULTA, Best Buy, 7-Eleven).
 
Squid7085 said:
Best case for them is to directly support their Redcard's in Apple Pay and maybe even find a way to tie the cartwheel stuff to it. That would be a huge win win for both Apple and Target.

Theoretically Apple Pay should be able to support store branded cards if both companies worked together. Something like Apple Pay would shine with store branded cards. We all will probably carry around a Visa or AmEx for the next few years anyway. What we want to get rid of are some of the cards that only get us benefits at the store that issued them.
Click to expand...

Exactly!

It's the store cards that I would love to not have to worry about. I don't carry them with me always and sure enough, every once in a while, I'll stop into a store and realize I left that store card at home. If it's in my phone, I don't have to worry about missing out on rewards points and discounts for buying with my store card. This is important to me as I like to play the rewards/coupon/discount game!
 
dontwalkhand said:
Walmart came out and said its because they lose the tracking ability, however how can that be? Couldn't they just track the purchase by the device account number instead? I think that the device account doesn't change anyway, just the dynamic CVV. So they shouldn't even lose that advantage.



I personally think it might be Walmart being cheap
Click to expand...


I don't shop at Walmart. It's not a big deal to me. I don't want them tracking my purchases anyway.
 
cymolia said:
Look at Texas, Wyoming and Arkansas on this map, the walmart family is only getting richer and richer. Dont think they need Apple pay as much as Apple needs them.


Image
Click to expand...

Isn't Walmart having issues with falling sales? I know a lot of people who go out of there way to avoid shopping Walmart. I've gone from shopping there weekly to twice a month. I have no problem adding "Can't use my preferred method of payment" to the reasons not to go Walmart.
 
CoilTap said:
This is incorrect. If the merchant has NFC enabled then Apple Pay will work. End of story. Either Walmart has NFC-capable POS terminals, but the NFC is disabled on them or their terminals do not support NFC. It's not just Apple Pay that doesn't work; no contactless payment method will work.

Anyone running NFC has no ability to not accept Apple Pay. The terminal can't even see that the payment is Apple Pay, they just see what looks like a credit card number, which they send on to their payment processor.
Click to expand...

It's funny how you keep marking my messages as "incorrect" in different threads, even though I can guarantee you that they are indeed correct. Again, no, if a merchant has NFC enabled, there is a good chance of Apple Pay working, but not a guarantee. End of story.

----------
dontwalkhand said:
I just used Apple Pay at a mom and pop car repair place. They definitely did not sign up for Apple Pay. It works fine wherever NFC is taken. The car place had a First Data terminal with a PIN pad that took Contactless and chip and PIN
Click to expand...

Maybe reread my post. I did state the exact same thing, it will work in most merchants with NFC enabled, but maybe not the large ones that have incentives to disable it.
 
mailboxbetacoin said:
It's funny how you keep marking my messages as "incorrect" in different threads, even though I can guarantee you that they are indeed correct. Again, no, if a merchant has NFC enabled, there is a good chance of Apple Pay working, but not a guarantee. End of story.

----------





Maybe reread my post. I did state the exact same thing, it will work in most merchants with NFC enabled, but maybe not the large ones that have incentives to disable it.
Click to expand...


Does Apple Pay require NFC? Can I make an Apple Pay payment using Passbook?
 
Newtons Apple said:
I am pretty sure that I read that obama had mandated his banking zar to require chipped cards in 2015. I believe that to be so.
Click to expand...

The President signed an order requiring the GOVEMENT to issue Chip and PIN cards and to update their systems to accept them. It also includes improvements in data security and notifications about breaches. His order does not apply to non-government entities.
 
mailboxbetacoin said:
It's funny how you keep marking my messages as "incorrect" in different threads, even though I can guarantee you that they are indeed correct. Again, no, if a merchant has NFC enabled, there is a good chance of Apple Pay working, but not a guarantee. End of story.

----------



Maybe reread my post. I did state the exact same thing, it will work in most merchants with NFC enabled, but maybe not the large ones that have incentives to disable it.
Click to expand...

I keep marking it incorrect because you are, in fact, completely in correct. If NFC works, Apple Pay works. It's not going to change no matter how many times you incorrectly repeat yourself. Actual end of story.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back