Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by ravenvii, Sep 27, 2010.

  1. ravenvii, Sep 27, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2010

    ravenvii macrumors 604


    Mar 17, 2004
    Melenkurion Skyweir

    ***There's a chart summary of all the game's roles for easy review attached to this post. Thanks goes to Don't panic for the chart!***

    First of all, I just want to say that this game is recommended for players who already played a previous game, or feel that she/he understands how the game plays out fairly well. The rules could get a bit overwhelming if you don't understand the underlying game (which is very simple actually, but might be difficult to grasp if you haven't played before).

    The framework will be the same as the previous advanced games. As a reference, here's links to the previous advanced games:

    Werewolves in MRville!
    Werewolves Returns to MRville!
    The MRville Horror, Part 3
    MRville 4: Evil Never Dies
    MRville V: Bloodlust



    The Werewolf Hunter: The Werewolf Hunter can pick a player to protect every night against werewolf attacks. However, the hunter cannot protect the same player two nights in a row, and cannot protect him/herself. The protection does extend into the daytime, meaning the Hunter can protect a villager from a Kamikaze Werewolf attack. The protection is also effective against an infection. S/he also has an additional ability to instantly kill any player of his choosing. This ability can only be used once during the game, only can be used during the daytime and is only effective against werewolves or villagers. An attack on a vampire will fail, and the Hunter cannot use the ability again, so choose wisely! An instant kill action will reveal the hunter in the narrative. Immune to one werewolf attack or infection. Can be killed if attacked again (or attacked after an failed infection attempt).

    The Vampire Hunter: Same as the Werewolf Hunter, except his protection and insta-kill is effective against only vampires and villagers, not werewolves, and he is immune to one vampire attack.

    Seer: Can scan any ALIVE player and find out what their abilities are (if any), and their alignment (good or evil).

    Undertaker: Has powers of the Seer, but only on DEAD players.

    Sorcerer: One-time power to resurrect any player at any time during the daytime.

    Priest: Can pray to the Gods for answers to any question. Requires 3 villagers to agree to participate in the ritual. This can only be done during the daytime. If ritual fails to complete by nightfall, it must be restarted the next day. Can ask the Gods any yes or no question. Any other question will result in the Priest's death. There can only be one successful prayer. This is all done in the open (not via PM). Has the protection of the Gods - cannot be attacked or infected. Will lose the protection after three days.

    The Secret Society: Villagers who can PM each other. No other special powers. Starts with 3 villagers. Can optionally recruit 2 more. Recruitment is a instant ability and can only be done during the daytime. If a werewolf is recruited, or a member of the Society is infected, the werewolf will have an option to murder all the members of the Society in one night. This will take place of a normal nightly killing. If a vampire or goth is recruited, the entire Society will be murdered upon the vampires' activation. This is, of course, unless the werewolf or vampire is lynched first. Note that the Secret Society is not considered "special" in the context of the game.

    Villagers: Same as before.


    The Werewolves: Werewolves can PM each other. They pick one villager to eat per night. There are three kinds of werewolves;

    a) The Alpha Werewolf can at any time during daytime, pick one villager to infect. This will convert the villager into a normal werewolf (no special abilities) and join the werewolves' team. The infection is effective against specials such as the Seer and the Undertaker, and the specials retain their powers after being infected. The infection is not effective against the Werewolf Hunter, however, nor against anyone the Werewolf Hunter is protecting. The Alpha Werewolf only has one chance at an infection - there are no second chances after a failed infection.

    b) The Kamikaze Werewolf has the ability to pick any one villager to kill during his lynching. In other words, if he is voted to be hanged, he will take one villager with him - unless the villager is being protected by a Werewolf Hunter.

    c) The normal Werewolf has no powers. This type results from an successful infection by the Alpha Werewolf.

    Vampire: There will be one vampire. At first he is weak and in need of blood. Each night he would drink the blood of a villager of his choosing. If the villager is a special (any type of special, including a werewolf), the vampire gets immunity for the night and day. This will wear off unless the vampire drinks the blood of another special. However, if the vampire drinks the blood of a goth, the goth will convert into a vampire, and they will enter into attack mode. They will, as a team, pick from whom to kill. Based on the vampire's strong psychic tendencies, he will also be aware of who the goths has scanned.

    Goths: There are two Goths Like the vampire, the Goths scans players to find the vampire. Once the Goth finds the vampire, he/she will convert into a vampire. Will take the reigns if the original vampire dies. Once the Vampire and a Goth discovers each other, they will be activated. The second Goth, however, remains dormant until he/she scans one of the Vampires. Since the Goths are only humans, they do not have the psychic abilities of the vampire, and does not know who the other Goth scans.

    Note that the vampire(s) are NOT on the werewolves' side, so they will NOT know who the werewolves are, nor will the werewolves know who the vampire(s) is/are. They, like the Hunters, are immune to one attack. The Vampires, however, are completely immune to infection by the Alpha Werewolf. This does not apply to the Goth until s/he has been converted.


    a) Villagers can NOT PM any other player regarding the game.

    b) Werewolves CAN PM each other and Vampires CAN PM each other.

    c) Players can NOT post confidential communication (this includes communication between a Special and the host; the wolves; or any player and the host). This includes copy and paste and screenshots. Players can post information given to them by the host in their own words, they just can't copy and paste, or post a screenshot.

    d) Players can edit their posts during the game is in progress, however if you edit your post, you MUST give an explanation of why/what you edited.

    e) Dead players can NOT participate in the game - this includes providing information, encouragement, tips or otherwise. This has been an issue in the previous game, so I'm going to be more strict with this. Dead players are eligible to ONE post following his death. This one post follows the same rules as before - cannot influence the game, and so forth. Posts consisting of little more than an image is DISCOURAGED in the forums at large, so please avoid this.

    f) Voting for lynching will close as soon as majority is reached.

    g) Voting can only take place in the daytime. Any votes made during the night will not be counted.

    h) For clarity, when you vote, bold the name of the player you're voting for. This alleviates confusion and makes it easier for me to count the votes. You can also play with this - "I really like Bob, he's a great guy" counts as a vote for Bob You can jokingly vote by not bolding the name - it will not be counted.

    i) You can retract and change your vote at any time up to the close of the vote.

    j) The game will begin at NIGHTTIME with actions by the GOOD GUYS only.

    k) There will be a TIME LIMIT for Specials to send in their PMs. The time limit will be 18 hours after the posting of the lynching (NOT after the voting closes) on weekdays, and 24 hours if any of the 18 hours falls on a Saturday or Sunday. There is a 72-hour TIME LIMIT for the lynching vote. If time limit is reached, the person with the most votes will be lynched. In case of a tie, the person who reached the number of votes first, will be lynched.

    l) Specials CAN pre-emptively send in their actions during the daytime for the following night. Specials are allowed to change pre-emptive actions unless it has already been resolved.

    m) Turn order during the night:

    Seer and Undertaker scans;
    Hunters protect;
    Vampire/Goth scans (or attacks);
    Werewolves attacks.

    If the vampires and werewolves pick the same player to kill, then only one person will die that night.

    Note also that instant actions can only take place in daytime.


    1: iBookG4user
    2: stonyc - killed by werewolves
    3: philbeeney
    4: appleguy123 - lynched, villager
    5: Don't panic - lynched, vampire
    6: NathanMuir - killed by a werewolf
    7: iBlue - lynched, villager
    8: Rodimus Prime - lynched, werewolf
    9: mscriv - put on a pedestal by the werewolves
    10: jav6454 - killed by kamikaze werewolf
    11: chrmjenkins - killed by werewolves
    12: lbro - lynched, villager
    13: Cboss - lynched, werewolf
    14: Mexbearpig


    Day One:
    Rodimus Prime: 3 (jav6454, iBlue, lbro)
    lbro: 4 (NathanMuir, Rodimus Prime, philbeeney, Cboss)
    NathanMuir: 1 (iBookG4user)
    stonyc: 1 (appleguy123)
    iBookG4user: 1 (Don't panic)
    appleguy123: 1 (stonyc)
    Mexbearpig: 1 (chrmjenkins)

    No votes: 2 (mscriv, Mexbearpig)

    Day Two:
    appleguy123: 6 (jav6454, Rodimus Prime, NathanMuir, iBookG4user, mscriv, CBoss)
    philbeeney: 4 (iBlue, Don't panic, appleguy123, stonyc)
    iBlue: 2 (philbeeney, Mexbearpig)

    Day Three:
    philbeeney: 4 (NathanMuir, mscriv, Don't panic, Cboss)
    iBlue: 6 (jav6454, Mexbearpig, Rodimus Prime, philbeeney, stonyc, iBookG4user)

    Day Four:
    philbeeney: 2 (Cboss, Don't panic)
    Don't panic: 3 (Rodimus Prime, iBookG4user, philbeeney)
    NathanMuir: 1 (jav6454)
    jav6454: 1 (NathanMuir)
    iBookG4user: 1 (Mexbearpig)

    No votes: 1 (mscriv)

    Day Five:
    Rodimus Prime: 4 (jav6454, NathanMuir, philbeeney, Mexbearpig)

    No votes: 3 (iBookG4user, Rodimus Prime, Cboss)

    Attached Files:

  2. Melrose Suspended


    Dec 12, 2007
    Sure, yeah, sign me up.

    Can you add a new rule that says Rodimus can't rally Big Dumb Villagers to his side and kill me right off the bat? :p
  3. 184550 Guest

    May 8, 2008
  4. stonyc macrumors 65816


    Feb 15, 2005
  5. jav6454 macrumors P6


    Nov 14, 2007
    1 Geostationary Tower Plaza
    Yes, I will be in for this one.

    To weigh in for this new debacle. I say we make the Infection one-hit thing and that won't miss no matter who it is (except the vampires & WW Hunter, duh). Just look at the new villager powers, a Judge, a Spy, a Secret Society, and above all, the TimeKeeper and to top it off, the Priest, which finally makes a nice comeback to its name.

    I say we limit the Villager brotherhood to 1 extra new member. That is a coalition of 4 villagers, more than the wolves (3 max). However, if people want to make it 2 new entires then I say we balance things by making it 3 wolves (Alpha, Suicidal, Regular) and let the Goths most definitely know who they scanned last (something along a scented path only vampires/goths can smell). Also, if the brotherhood gets it wrong and they pick a wolf, well, then we know the wolves will have inside info and practically have nice voting power over the village. For this matter, I say the wolf or vampire that gets in the brotherhood gets to murder all the members after the 4th/5th turn of having entered. Turns being counted as the Days passed.

    As per betrayal, I say we don't have it. An Infection is basically you are turned into a wolf and you LOOSE your will to the Alpha Wolf. Period. If you betray your new character (no matter where it leads) role I say you are struck down by a lightning by the gods. In real life, there would be ways to deal with betrayal. Same goes for a villager trying to go rogue. If he/she does go rogue, I say the villagers do a double lynching, the traitor and the suspect.

    As per notifications. I say the public in general is aware of the failure of Infections and the failure of any of the Hunter's One-hit KO. Now, the reason SHOULD be kept private obviously.

    The TimeKeeper special should be able to keep a WW victory from happening. Example, last game Don't Panic was murdered and thus allowed a WW victory, I say, that if the Time Keeper is still around, he is PM'd saying "now or never" so that he can turn back time. Also, his power should be any time, not day or night inclusive.

    The Spy, if he/she is going to be neutral, I say we make him toss a coin to determine his/her fate after Night 4.

    The Priest is a good idea, but I think we should limit him/her in the beginning. Example, what fun is it for the wolves to find out that the Priest outs him/herself on Day 1, uses his/her abilities to find the Alpha Wolf? That's no fun and just ruins it. I see we let the Priest activate his powers after Night 3, or that it requires 6 villagers. However, I think we should put a twist on this. I say for a successful prayer, we need 6 true villagers (in other words, villagers or Good Specials). If there are any Bad Specials, the prayer is corrupted and won't go thru; however, there is a repeat to this until the prayer is ability is used. I should also note, that if half + plus 1 (in other words, 4) villagers required are bad specials (any combination of wolves or vamps), then the gods respond by smiting a true, non-special villager and the Priest looses his ability.

    No Judge, I am against the idea.

    Am I missing something?
  6. appleguy123 macrumors 604


    Apr 1, 2009
    15 minutes in the future
    I'm in. Hope I get to be a good character this time.

    Can the judge be killed by werewolves, infect or lynched?
    I don't like the timewarden idea. The games go on long enough already, and it will be too obvious if the Timewarden has been infected.
  7. King Mook Mook macrumors 6502

    I believe the Judge would change each day, according to the rules by ravenvii. I think that it would be elected by the popular vote each day, yes? So, I could be Judge one night (even if I was a vampire), and you (regardless of what your character is) could be Judge the next. So, your question in that context doesn't make much sense, as the way ravenvii made the rules no one player is the Judge the entire time: it swaps over each time (at the Villagers' discretion).
  8. jav6454 macrumors P6


    Nov 14, 2007
    1 Geostationary Tower Plaza
    Did some writing above, please read... has interesting thoughts.
  9. 184550 Guest

    May 8, 2008
    My thoughts on the new roles:
    I think that this role is fine as described.

    I think that this position should be specifically barred from out right leaking information and declaring their role (as the spy). The player would of course be able to give hints/ nudges in the right direction but would not be able to outright say 'X is a werewolf.' or 'I'm the spy.'

    I personally think that the potential for five members is too big. I'd say one recruit max.

    Personally, I don't like this role.

    I think that this role could be very useful given that it'll (hopefully) limit the amount of time necessary to lynch someone. As we saw in the last complex game, sometimes the wait times are simply unacceptable due to player neglect or inactivity.

    I'd say that the time period for a person to be the 'Judge' would be limited to a two day cycle (two voting times/ days). Also, a player could not be the Judge consecutively (back to back). I think that a Judge should be elected every two days for a two day tenure (duh).
  10. iBookG4user macrumors 604


    Jun 27, 2006
    Seattle, WA
    I'm in and the new rules sound like it will be more ineresting :)
  11. philbeeney macrumors 6502


    Jul 24, 2004
    Brampton, ON
    I'm in. I'll edit my post once I've read the new rules.
  12. -aggie- macrumors P6


    Jun 19, 2009
    Where bunnies are welcome.
    I'm in.

    The priest role is confusing. More details on how this praying takes place? Can they ask if someone is a WW? Is the answer announced in the thread?
  13. stonyc macrumors 65816


    Feb 15, 2005
    If we're going to add all these roles, I would prefer a larger player base... 25+ perhaps? It could get to the point where half the players have some role in the game... another concern I have is hold-ups due to a special not PMing their action. We've seen delays like these already and games have dragged on even without such delays (voting deadlocks, etc.).

    Some other thoughts...

    Brotherhood: Start it at 2 villagers with the possibility to add 1 more.

    Timewarden: I don't like this role, sorry.

    Spy: I don't like this role either... this person may as well be a mortal Ravenvii. Privy to every special action? I think that's too much power in one single player... they can pretty much swing the game either way.

    Priest: Could be interesting.

    Re: Making the Vampires more powerful... instead of making their pre-activation action a "scan", it could be "drink". The Goth would still "scan" until their activation. If the Vampire "drinks" the blood of a Villager, nothing happens. If the Vampire "drinks" the blood of a Goth, the Goth becomes a Vampire beginning the next night. If the Vampire "drinks" the blood of a Special, they will "leech" that Special's power and can make one-time use of it until their next "drink" replaces their previously leeched power (they would have to "drink" every round). Effectively, it could look like this:

    Night 1: Vampire "drinks" blood of WW Hunter, is told that they now have the option of one of the Hunter's three abilities: 1) insta-kill, 2) attack immunity, 3) protection. Vampire PMs Ravenvii and chooses attack immunity (a passive skill).
    Day 2: Someone is lynched.
    Night 2: WWs attack Vampire, attack fails (this would leave the Vampire's naturally attack immunity intact). Vampire "drinks" blood from next victim who is the Seer.
    Day 3: Someone is lynched.
    Night 3: Vampire uses "scan" from Seer.

    I would suggest putting a check on this ability by making it so that if the Goth finds the Vampire, or the Vampire finds a Goth, the "drink" ability is now lost because now with a fellow Vampire, the Vampires turn their attention to killing instead of drinking blood. Another way you could put a check on this ability (because "drink" now becomes effectively a Seer "scan"), would be to instead begin the game with a pre-determined pool of abilities from which the Vampire could randomly draw from, so that other player roles are not revealed to the Vampire.
  14. Don't panic macrumors 603

    Don't panic

    Jan 30, 2004
    having a drink at Milliways
    i am in as well.
    will give some opinion on rules soon.

    Succinct and concise as usual, of course ;)
  15. ravenvii thread starter macrumors 604


    Mar 17, 2004
    Melenkurion Skyweir
    Basically, the priest (in the thread) posts "I pray to the gods (that'd be me, by the way ;))! Is -aggie- a werewolf?" then three villagers join in, "I join the prayer" or whatnot. Then I post the answer "yes -aggie- is a werewolf."

    You can only ask yes/no questions. "Who are the werewolves?" won't get an answer from me, even if three people join - the prayer basically fails.

    Actually, all the new roles do not require nighttime PMs. Nice, eh? ;)

    That seems to be the consensus. That is what will happen.

    Actually, the spy only knows the actions, not who did them. But I agree, it needs work/comment. It was one of the more popular roles discussed in the previous game, so I put it up there so people would discuss it.

    Holy crap, that idea is ******* crazy! Awesome.
  16. stonyc macrumors 65816


    Feb 15, 2005
    I see what you did there. :cool:

    EDIT: Oh, last night in my example should have been Night 3, fixing.

    Re: The Spy... what would the actions that are reported to the Spy look like?

    I really like the idea of the Brotherhood though.
  17. chrmjenkins macrumors 603


    Oct 29, 2007
    In. I like stonyc's idea for the vamp.

    Some logistics questions: Can the Priest change his prayer before 3 villagers have signed on? For instance, he asks if Bob is a WW and 2 people have already joined the prayer. Bob is the infectious and infects Priest. Can he go back on his prayer even though 2 villagers have agreed?

    So the Spy would basically get the information dump you provide end of game without specific names for the originating specials? (for example: werewolves eat Julie). I had an idea similar to this (called it prescient or something like that), where a person learns the targets of all special actions, but not the originator. So, they'd get a dump of names each night and try and sort out who was doing what over time. As given, I think this role has an even higher infection advantage for the werewolves than the seer. That's why I propose toning it down a bit maybe.

    I like this idea. Do/should they have any sort of immunity?

    This sounds like a double-duty priest from the old game (with the exception they must resurrect the most recent player). It's an advantage for the villagers because they're pretty much useless if infected (except for trust issues).

    I see this inspiring a lot of infighting as people disagree with how the judge is doing things.

    I see no problem with this.

    I am generally against giving the specials that sort of information because it forces them to guess and strategize more.

    They pretty much already do this anyway.

    I don't think this will happen in practice. For the record, my proposition was song and dance.
  18. lbro macrumors 6502a


    Jan 22, 2009
    Lets say players x and y are werewolves. x infects player z and player z gets a pm telling him who the other two werewolves are. The timekeeper decides to turn back time, so player z becomes uninfected. But player z still knows that x and y are werewolves. How is that going to work?
  19. abijnk macrumors 68040


    Oct 15, 2007
    Los Angeles, CA
    I'm in. See comments on rules below.

    I like this.

    This has been mentioned in some form or fashion a couple of times now. I don't think its a good idea, personally.

    I'm pretty sure this was my idea, so of course I like it. :D


    I don't like this idea. I think it would just be too much drama.

    Everyone getting an individual vote works well enough here. An idea that would be better would be to figure out a way to promote involvement. The only problem with voting is that it takes too long to get to a full majority, if we could figure out a way around this I think it would help the game a lot. My idea is to have a majority lock and a long time limit. So we start the voting with a 48 hour time limit. If we hit majority during that time, the voting closes and that person is lynched, just like in all the previous games. The difference would be if we hit that 48 hour (or other time) limit, then the person with most votes gets lynched, or, in the case of a tie, the first person to hit the tying number of votes gets lynched (just like the live games).

    I think the instant abilities are fine as they have been in the past games.

    I don't really like any of this...

    No, no and hell no.

    I agree, but I don't know how...
  20. jav6454 macrumors P6


    Nov 14, 2007
    1 Geostationary Tower Plaza
    I think up to this point, the consensus is everyone is against the Judge and the TimeKeeper, so I say we scrap those roles.

    As per the Vampire/Goths, I like stonyc's idea best.

    Moreover, betrayals, big no on having betrayals. Like I said, an infection means you loose your will to the Alpha Wolf.

    I see everyone agrees the Brotherhood should be bounded to 3-4 villagers MAX.

    I am still of the idea, that the Priest prayer can be turned against us. Also, it must be limited on the first few days to allow game development. It is not fun to out yourself as a Priest, rally the required votes and find out who the Alpha Wolf is on DAY 1. That will create more in-game fighting and quite possibly nasty things. It is against the spirit of the game and doesn't make the game develop as much as it should.

    Like I proposed earlier, there should be a limit until when the Priest is activated. I'd say Day 3, go ahead. Also, just like the Infection has a failure chance, this ability should have a failure chance. In this case, a curse from the gods in which a true villager dies.
  21. iBlue macrumors Core


    Mar 17, 2005
    London, England
    Oh wow! I might sit the first one out but these are interesting tweak possibilities.

    • I love stonyc's idea for the vampires.
    • The Priest prayer thing is brilliant and fine as you described.
    • The Brotherhood is great as well. I think 3 or 4 should be the max.
    • The Spy is interesting but only if it's played out how chrmjenkins described - actions but not the names.
    • HELL NO to the parliamentary thing, turning back time and all the other information sharing stuff.

    Now, like a broken record I want to bring up maybe two Seers. Even if they are not aware of the other, reducing their scan efficiency.
  22. chrmjenkins macrumors 603


    Oct 29, 2007
    I'm actually a little confused upon ravenvii's clarification in response to stonyc. He seems to be suggesting that only the 'actions' are known. I'm not sure if that means attaching the originator to the action (WWs eat Bob) or simply the target of the action.

    What I'm proposing is the latter. At the end of each night, the spy (or whatever we call him) gets a list of all of the targets of actions. No actions or originators, just a list of names. That's why I was calling it prescient because the person is effectively getting a clairvoyant view of who is being targeted but knows nothing more than that.

    This person would have little to no power in the beginning, but as the game progresses, they'll have more and more to go on. Based on a player's relative frequency or infrequency of being in the list, people can make a guess as to who they may be (or who they may not be given the names that always seem to be absent from the list).
  23. iBlue macrumors Core


    Mar 17, 2005
    London, England

    I thought he meant it the way you've put it, which is what I'd prefer. Actions and who they were taken against but not the originator of the actions.
  24. -aggie- macrumors P6


    Jun 19, 2009
    Where bunnies are welcome.
    I'd like a "Can't eat or vote off -aggie- on the first day" rule. All in favor? The ayes have it. Make it so ravenvii.

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