You Can/Can't Still Use PowerPC Macs in 2020!

[z970]

A little observation, and food for thought ...

It's been 13 pages and counting of fruitless debate and conflict, all based upon differing individual experiences, knowledge, and material, on a subject any one of us has (in practice) very limited power to change. If the goal we've been trying to pursue for all this time is to finally enlighten the opposing view to our own perceived "reality", then I admittedly have yet to see any sign of success, even now.

Surely, our collective time could be more productively spent elsewhere than endlessly attempting to reach an agreeable consensus on whether the so-called "average user" can so much as reasonably use a PowerPC-based Mac in 2020, the result of which would only be seen by preexisting frequenters of this subforum, anyway.

My point being that like any dispute held by any party, a little perspective and humility displayed by both sides (no matter how much more objectively correct one is thought of over the other), is never amiss. ... Lest of course we unwittingly fall into an everlasting vicious cycle of wasteful discourse, in which case nobody wins - which has already held itself true here several times over.

... Just imagine how many societal rifts could have been prevented if only we all held true to that single principle.

 

[TheShortTimer]

My point being that like any dispute held by any party, a little perspective and humility displayed by both sides (no matter how much more objectively correct one is thought of over the other), is never amiss. ... Lest of course we unwittingly fall into an everlasting vicious cycle of wasteful discourse, in which case nobody wins - which has already held itself true here several times over.

Given the seriousness of the current circumstances, I hope that we all make it through this so that we can agree, disagree or at least agree to disagree on this and other topics for years to come.

 

[Dronecatcher]

eBay is incredibly variable. I can't see a single PowerMac G5 under $60 BIN, let alone one that works and that's not including the $100+ shipping charges to get it to me from the states on eBay.ca.

I don't disagree with anything you said - I simply attempted last night to imagine the scenario of an average user taking the advice that a 2009 Mini is better (which we know it is for most uses) and then trotting off to ebay here to find one.
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My point being that like any dispute held by any party, a little perspective and humility displayed by both sides (no matter how much more objectively correct one is thought of over the other), is never amiss.

For me it's not so much a discussion about the topic but an attempt to override someone's attitude - @defjam has repeatedly misquoted me, re-imagined the intent of my comments and accused me of things I certainly haven't done.

 

[AphoticD]

I just setup two 14” iBook G4’s for my kids to go head to head with some old school LAN games.

The iBooks cost me next to nothing and required some TLC to repair, reinstall and configure, but would otherwise just sit on the shelf (or in some landfill). So yes, PowerPC Macs can work, and are still being used in 2020.

I may be using a 2018 Intel Mac for producing income, but for specific purposes, PowerPC still works for me

 

[RogerWilco6502]

I just setup two 14” iBook G4’s for my kids to got head to head with some old school LAN games.

The iBooks cost me next to nothing and required some TLC to repair, reinstall and configure, but would otherwise just sit on the shelf. So yes, PowerPC Macs can work, and are still being used in 2020.

I may be using a 2018 Intel Mac for producing income, but for specific purposes, PowerPC still works for me

I just made a YouTube video that was edited, encoded, and uploaded (but not published) using all PPC Macs.

 

[Amethyst1]

The iBooks [...] required some TLC to repair, reinstall and configure

This would prove too difficult for the average user.

 

[defjam]

How so? You cited the advantage of a 2009 Mini over a non-specified PPC, I merely used ebay as of today to provide a costing and the Mini was more than double the price of a Dual G5 under BIN - for an "average user" that price might have a bearing.

You're attempting to use a single edge case to disprove an average.

With that said can you provide the link to the auction for the dual G5? I'd be interested in its configuration.

 

[Dronecatcher]

With that said can you provide the link to the auction for the dual G5? I'd be interested in its configuration.

Applle PowerMac G5 PC | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Applle PowerMac G5 PC at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[defjam]

Bold emphasis mine.

I feel like we are hit and miss on this.

The point of the addon is to block certain SPECIFIC items. The point of that is to allow the site to function without degradation in performance.

If you're using uMatrix or any other similar addon to simply allow or block the entire damn thing then you're missing the whole point.

On this particular forum with uMatrix I have addthrive.com, googletagemanager.com, quantserve.com and skimresources.com blocked for cookies, media, css, scripts, XHR, frame and other.

MacRumors wants and needs access to scripts on geni.us and ajax.googleapis.com. ytimg.com, which is Yahoo's image domain is also asking to access images. For these, scripts and images is all I've allowed them access to. So, I've blocked all the advertising and analytical garbage while allowing the essential parts that the site needs to function.

The result is that the site functions speedily without a degrade in performance and is not broken because the addon is being used to IMPROVE performance BECAUSE I've made these adjustments.

Again, if you're using this addon to block or unblock everything (like a switch) then that's not how it's supposed to be used.

One final thing that is specific to this forum. In the message body area in the formatting bar there is a preference gear. Click on it so that it's red. The formatting bar runs JS in the background. Red is off. It means you have to use tags for formatting, but on PowerPC Macs having that JS not running makes a huge difference.

Have you ever watched an episode of Peanuts? To an end user your explanation on how to use uMatrix sounds like the adults when they speak to the characters.

Yes, >>> I <<< know how uMatrix is supposed to work. But cookies, media, css, scripts, XHR, frame and other are confusing to the average user. What is addthrive.com, googletagemanager.com, quantserve.com and skimresources.com? These are all foreign domains to users. They're on Facebook and Facbook is what they expect to see. Not a bunch of other domains.

You can argue users should educate themselves a little on these concepts but the reality is they have no clue. That is the reality and no amount of arguing is going to change it.
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Applle PowerMac G5 PC | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Applle PowerMac G5 PC at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!

www.ebay.co.uk

What is the postage on that item (it shows local pickup for me)?

 

[Dronecatcher]

What is the postage on that item (it shows local pickup for me)?

That's correct local pickup only.

 

[defjam]

Either you're making my point for me, or that was sarcasm.

It was sarcasm but had a little bit of truth to it.

Well first, it's not like the thing is hidden. Or is using a search engine also too much for your average user? Next, it's not like uMatrix is the only way of accomplishing a better browsing experience, in fact far from it. Finally, so what?...is there anything that doesn't have a down side?

I think you're making the error in assuming because you know it everyone else knows it. Or wants to know it. The reality is the average person wants to use, not tweak, their computer.

No my solution isn't to expect anybody to just "know more". That makes no sense, you have to get the knowledge somewhere. The benefit seems obvious, I mean - you know more. Are you saying there's no point in trying to learn more about computers?

The point is, and Apple has had this philosophy from day one, is that computers are tools and should work for the user and not the other way around. Apple has spent considerable time and effort to minimize the end users knowledge of computers. Their idea of a computer is something you place on the desk, turn on, and use. An older model Intel provides an experience closer to that than a PPC based system. You may want to learn more, the average user does not.

Look, I don't feel threatened here. I don't see anybody trying to change my mind, nor would it bother me if they did. Do you feel threatened? Because it seems what you're trying to say here is that I should just shut up.

I'm saying that you should acknowledge that you, and most in here, are enthusiasts who enjoy tinkering with their computers and are therefore not the target audience for the advice given by the YouTuber in the first video of the OPs post.
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That's correct local pickup only.

Unless this poor individual who cannot afford anything more than £5 on a computer lives very close to the seller how do you propose they get this computer?
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A little observation, and food for thought ...

It's been 13 pages and counting of fruitless debate and conflict, all based upon differing individual experiences, knowledge, and material, on a subject any one of us has (in practice) very limited power to change. If the goal we've been trying to pursue for all this time is to finally enlighten the opposing view to our own perceived "reality", then I admittedly have yet to see any sign of success, even now.

Surely, our collective time could be more productively spent elsewhere than endlessly attempting to reach an agreeable consensus on whether the so-called "average user" can so much as reasonably use a PowerPC-based Mac in 2020, the result of which would only be seen by preexisting frequenters of this subforum, anyway.

My point being that like any dispute held by any party, a little perspective and humility displayed by both sides (no matter how much more objectively correct one is thought of over the other), is never amiss. ... Lest of course we unwittingly fall into an everlasting vicious cycle of wasteful discourse, in which case nobody wins - which has already held itself true here several times over.

... Just imagine how many societal rifts could have been prevented if only we all held true to that single principle.

I'm not sure what the intent of the OP was. I thought it was about discussing the pros and cons to using a PPC in 2020. I think such a discussion would be reasonable. It seems like his intent was merely to criticize the YouTuber in the first video of his OP. That seems pointless.

 

[Dronecatcher]

Unless this poor individual who cannot afford anything more than £5 on a computer lives very close to the seller how do you propose they get this computer?

Who's extrapolating the potential buyer and what they can afford?
You presented a comparison, a 2009 Mini and an unspecified PPC - I went to ebay and found the lowest priced BIN prices, Dual G5 £30, 2009 Mini £79.99 and made the point, some Joe Average might be swung by that price difference.

 

[defjam]

Who's extrapolating the potential buyer and what they can afford?
You presented a comparison, a 2009 Mini and an unspecified PPC - I went to ebay and found the lowest priced BIN prices, Dual G5 £30, 2009 Mini £79.99 and made the point, some Joe Average might be swung by that price difference.

The problem with your PPC example is that, unless the buyer lives within reasonable distance of the seller, it's not an option for them. Contrast this with the Mini I purchased which included shipping within the price to any where within the states. Furthermore it was just one example. Once that PPC is gone that price is gone. Or is it your assertion dual PowerMac G5 systems can be routinely had for less than half of the price of a Mini (including shipping)? Furthermore I'm not limiting Intel Macs to just the Mini. If you want to compare to a MacBook, MacBook Pro, iMac, etc feel free to do so.

Can we please try and use a little common sense when making comparisons?

 

[Dronecatcher]

I'm not sure what the intent of the OP was. I thought it was about discussing the pros and cons to using a PPC in 2020. I think such a discussion would be reasonable. It seems like his intent was merely to criticize the YouTuber in the first video of his OP. That seems pointless.

This is the second time you've accused me of this and the second time I'm going to ask you for proof with quotes.

 

[defjam]

This is the second time you've accused me of this and the second time I'm going to ask you for proof with quotes.

Perhaps you missed the words:

It seems like...​

If I'm misunderstanding your point then state exactly what it is. Because I haven't seen anything which has resulted in anything but criticism towards people who advocate for the average user a low cost Intel Mac over a PPC system, myself included.

 

[Dronecatcher]

Because I haven't seen anything which has resulted in anything but criticism towards people who advocate for the average user a low cost Intel Mac over a PPC system, myself included.

And again, you said this before and as before I asked you to give quotes where I've said such - thus far you still haven't provided those quotes.
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If I'm misunderstanding your point then state exactly what it is.

My point is I linked 2 videos that people might be interested in as I've done many times before on this forum.

 

[Dronecatcher]

I just made a YouTube video that was edited, encoded, and uploaded (but not published) using all PPC Macs.

Link?

 

[defjam]

My point is I linked 2 videos that people might be interested in as I've done many times before on this forum.

What did you hope to accomplish by posting these videos?

 

[cosmichobo]

I stopped using a G4 Mini as HTPC a few years ago now... but still have my G4 Cube with Harmon Kardon speakers to act as a glorified non-Portable iPod and/or live photo album... So - it's not actually performing a task that is terribly useful, really, but - I can still use it.

And I've been getting a hankering for some classic gaming... Rescue... Escape Velocity... Marathon... so I might dig out my PowerBook G3 to have a play... if it still boots.

 

[Dronecatcher]

What did you hope to accomplish by posting these videos?

Nothing. Stop trying to read into things, I've posted many Linux videos too but I'm not a Linux advocate - I post simply in case anyone is interested.

 

[RogerWilco6502]

Link?

Shot on a Sony DCR-TRV140 Digital8 camcorder, edited on an iBook G3, exported on a Power Mac G4, and uploaded (but not published) on a Mac Mini G4

 

[defjam]

Nothing. Stop trying to read into things, I've posted many Linux videos too but I'm not a Linux advocate - I post simply in case anyone is interested.

You had to have a reason for posting these videos. You are alleging that I am misrepresenting your motives however you're unwilling to state exactly what those motives are. If I am misunderstanding your motives then please clearly state what they are. If you refuse to do so then please stop alleging I'm misrepresenting them.

 

[Dronecatcher]

You had to have a reason for posting these videos. You are alleging that I am misrepresenting your motives however you're unwilling to state exactly what those motives are. If I am misunderstanding your motives then please clearly state what they are. If you refuse to do so then please stop alleging I'm misrepresenting them.

As referenced previously twice in this thread - you've accused me and alledged I've written certain content - I'm still waiting for you to reproduce quotes to substantiate this.
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Shot on a Sony DCR-TRV140 Digital8 camcorder, edited on an iBook G3, exported on a Power Mac G4, and uploaded (but not published) on a Mac Mini G4

Good job I used to have a Sony DCR-TRV140 back in the day which I Firewired up to my then new iMac G4.

 

[defjam]

As referenced previously twice in this thread - you've accused me and alledged I've written certain content - I'm still waiting for you to reproduce quotes to substantiate this.

I made reference to your intent, not anything specific to what you wrote:

I'm not sure what the intent of the OP was...​

Since you have alleged I am misrepresenting what your intent was I asked you to specify exactly what it is because apparently I am misunderstanding it. If you refuse to specify exactly what it is then stop alleging I'm misrepresenting it.

I'm interested in having a discussion about the pros and cons of using a PPC in 2020. If you're not then feel free to ignore such discussion.

 

[Amethyst1]

Good job I used to have a Sony DCR-TRV140 back in the day which I Firewired up to my then new iMac G4.

The really cool thing about these cameras, IMO, is the audio/video input some had, so they could be used as a VCR or to digitalise analog video via FireWire.